Updates from Clough

[sheffielder]

Clough has been pig-headed. Not strong, or authoritative, or principled.!

Now is not the time for such negativity.

 

[LoughboroBlade]

Collins was only injured for part of the season. Cough made it clear he wasn't picking him initially because he had been dropped due to poor form and heavy defeats.

Got to love the logic of the argument that the fact Port Vale played Collins immediately after loaning him is evidence that he was somehow never injured and Clough's a liar, rather than the scenario that nobody would loan Collins till he was fit enough to play.

 

[Northern Rivers Blade]

Now is not the time for such negativity.

I remember posters on here whingeing that Wilson and Weir were too soft and the players were walking all over them. Now posters are saying Clough is too hard on players and should back down. Wonder if it's the same posters ...

 

[Going up]

I remember posters on here whingeing that Wilson and Weir were too soft and the players were walking all over them. Now posters are saying Clough is too hard on players and should back down. Wonder if it's the same posters ...

Yes and it's remarkable that he is so hard on them that they all want to come back for more. Davies, Davies, Brayford, Coutts, Freeman, even Bennett would have came.

I would say it is the complete opposite as the players know that they have a manager in Nigel that will protect them and support them through their injuries just as he is now with Fynn, Done, McE and TK. His support of Barks at Derby was, I would say unprecedented in the modern game.

The fact that he will call them out for not performing to their ability is just a manager doing his job and should not be confused with his overwhelming goodwill with the players.

 

[Lord Bos of Eckington.]

Got to love the logic of the argument that the fact Port Vale played Collins immediately after loaning him is evidence that he was somehow never injured and Clough's a liar, rather than the scenario that nobody would loan Collins till he was fit enough to play.

IMO Collins has had a strain and no doubt not match fit . If he his to come back into the fold , he is better getting game time with someone else , before being brought back ,if required.

Let him warm up and drop clangers with PortVale than with us , whilst he gets up to fitness and speed . Recall him when we are in the play offs , if his performances are good enough.

Maybe method in the Clough madness.

Don't think Clough was a liar , but maybe a bit of spin on it . Things can change overnight , and the continual injuries to Kennedy and playing Basham and Brayford out of position , which has weakened the team line up as not helped.

UTB

 

[William Henry Foulkes]

Now is not the time for such negativity.

Best viewed in context

 

[Cyprus Blade]

Don't think Clough was a liar, but maybe a bit of spin on it .

This reminded me of Alan Clark's "economical with the actualite" in the arms to iraq affair and the following "clarification" in the 1986 SpyCatcher affair.

"Robert Armstrong, the UK Cabinet Secretary, was questioned by Malcolm Turnbull, and described a letter thus

• Q: So that letter contains a lie, does it not?
• A: It contains a misleading impression in that respect.
• Q: Which you knew to be misleading at the time you made it?
• A: Of course.
• Q: So it contains a lie?
• A: It is a misleading impression, it does not contain a lie, I don't think.
• Q: What is the difference between a misleading impression and a lie?
• A: You are as good at English as I am.
• Q: I am just trying to understand.
• A: A lie is a straight untruth.
• Q: What is a misleading impression - a sort of bent untruth?
• A: As one person said, it is perhaps being economical with the truth."

 

[Lord Bos of Eckington.]

This reminded me of Alan Clark's "economical with the actualite" in the arms to iraq affair and the following "clarification" in the 1986 SpyCatcher affair.

"Robert Armstrong, the UK Cabinet Secretary, was questioned by Malcolm Turnbull, and described a letter thus

• Q: So that letter contains a lie, does it not?
• A: It contains a misleading impression in that respect.
• Q: Which you knew to be misleading at the time you made it?
• A: Of course.
• Q: So it contains a lie?
• A: It is a misleading impression, it does not contain a lie, I don't think.
• Q: What is the difference between a misleading impression and a lie?
• A: You are as good at English as I am.
• Q: I am just trying to understand.
• A: A lie is a straight untruth.
• Q: What is a misleading impression - a sort of bent untruth?
• A: As one person said, it is perhaps being economical with the truth."

Like it Cyprus . True today as then .

Its like learning Russian in 13 weeks and being sent to Berlin , trade mission . Now theres a story.

UTB

 

[Davie Blade]

Clough has been pig-headed. Not strong, or authoritative, or principled.

Jim Phipps has threatened Clough with the sack if he doesn't pick Collins?!

I guess some may call going 36 games without a CB that's been totally proven as a 3 seasons regular, principled.

I call it fecking stupid.

and it's hardly the only example is it.

 

[Lord Bos of Eckington.]

I guess some may call going 36 games without a CB that's been totally proven as a 3 seasons regular, principled.

I call it fecking stupid.

and it's hardly the only example is it.

If it does cost us promotion , i am sure questions will be asked at board level , if not already.

Could put it down to incompetence , i am am very much pro Clough . It cannot be naivety surely . Yes fecking stupid .

UTB

 

[William Henry Foulkes]

I guess some may call going 36 games without a CB that's been totally proven as a 3 seasons regular, principled.

I call it fecking stupid.

and it's hardly the only example is it.

We don't know all the facts and most probably never will. As posted elsewhere management use their judgment for optimal solutions with finite resources.

Clough might have made a pig's ear or a silk purse out of the CH s.ituation. From the outside with limited information - and added speculation and imagination - it's difficult, or even impossible, to say which.

 

[sheffielder]

We don't know all the facts and most probably never will. As posted elsewhere management use their judgment for optimal solutions with finite resources.

Clough might have made a pig's ear or a silk purse out of the CH s.ituation. From the outside with limited information - and added speculation and imagination - it's difficult, or even impossible, to say which.

You can put a ribbon on it, but it's still bad. Not one of our centrenbacks has ever been a 1st choice in his career. He played pre-season with Collins and Butler, so someone explain what the fuck happened. I don't rate either very highly by the way but are you saying you wouldn't play either right now?

 

[William Henry Foulkes]

You can put a ribbon on it, but it's still bad. Not one of our centrenbacks has ever been a 1st choice in his career. He played pre-season with Collins and Butler, so someone explain what the fuck happened. I don't rate either very highly by the way but are you saying you wouldn't play either right now?

I'm saying that - for reasons unknown - the cure might be worse than the disease.

Or it might've been a monumental cock up by management.

I do think the question of CHs should be asked by the media though, so we can (possibly) have better information.

I'd speculate that it's a mixture of:
Player/s challenging authority of management
TK being unavailable much more than anticipated
HM2 not living up to expectations - or being (badly) misjudged
Targets being unavailable
Finite resources being allocated on forwards and small (goalscoring) Scottish midfielders, amongst others who were prioritised
McEveley not really being up to it in there
Others

Some, none, or all of this may be true, but without better information it's all just speculation.

 

[bladesmanluke]

Got to love the logic of the argument that the fact Port Vale played Collins immediately after loaning him is evidence that he was somehow never injured and Clough's a liar, rather than the scenario that nobody would loan Collins till he was fit enough to play.

Yep, nothing to do with Neil himself telling many of us in person that he hadn't been injured and didn't know why he was frozen out. Just the Port Vale thing.. Absolutely

 

[LoughboroBlade]

Yep, nothing to do with Neil himself telling many of us in person that he hadn't been injured and didn't know why he was frozen out. Just the Port Vale thing.. Absolutely

What did he tell you exactly? And which bits from Clough's interview below from early March before Vale came in for him are you saying Clough is lying about?

Incidentally, after scoring an own goal on his debut, Collins had to exit the next game and missed the following one with a groin injury.

Pre-January, Collins was simply left out despite being fit. Clough did not need to fabricate some story about an injury to explain Collins's absence - he just simply said that others were ahead of him now. Is there a reason why you think he suddenly had to cobble together a story for Feb/Mar, particularly given Clough ideally wanted him loaned out?

“Neill has returned to training so he’ll have 4-5 training sessions this week, with a view to playing for the U21s next week,” Clough said.

“We have no objection to putting him in the team if we think he is worthy of a place, and if he is looking better than before he was injured.

“We have to be careful because when he played before, we let in five goals at Swindon and three at Chesterfield, and we haven’t conceded three goals since then.

“We haven’t seen much of him because he’s been out for three months and training with the kids, so it’s a big ask for him to come into the first team, with 12 games of the season to go, when he’s missed to much football.”

 

[Worksop_Blade]

Yes and it's remarkable that he is so hard on them that they all want to come back for more. Davies, Davies, Brayford, Coutts, Freeman, even Bennett would have come.

Well I for one am so grateful to Nigel for being able to attract such absolute quality to the lane. I bet Derby, Cardiff and Blackpool are still mourning the loss of such regulars from their starting line ups.

Also I look forward to him exploiting the untapped goldmine that is the Derby reserve squad, for more midfielders and fullbacks who will happily play centre half for uncle Nige.

 

[Going up]

Well I for one am so grateful to Nigel for being able to attract such absolute quality to the lane. I bet Derby, Cardiff and Blackpool are still mourning the loss of such regulars from their starting line ups.

Also I look forward to him exploiting the untapped goldmine that is the Derby reserve squad, for more midfielders and fullbacks who will happily play centre half for uncle Nige.

All of them were in the matchday squad regularly and the Beard was rated as the number 1 Right Back in the League under Nigel.

S Davies has helped our front line enormously and without Ben Davies' goals early on this season when few of our players were finding form, we would not be in the playoffs.

I certainly wouldn't mind grabbing Buxton or Bryson this summer that's for sure and I seem to remember that Derby are in a League above us and doing quite well.;-)

 

[Worksop_Blade]

All of them were in the matchday squad regularly and the Beard was rated as the number 1 Right Back in the League under Nigel.

S Davies has helped our front line enormously and without Ben Davies' goals early on this season when few of our players were finding form, we would not be in the playoffs.

I certainly wouldn't mind grabbing Buxton or Bryson this summer that's for sure and I seem to remember that Derby are in a League above us and doing quite well.;-)

You want to sign more rejects from the league above to underperform and struggle to adjust to the dogfight that is League One, like we have repeatedly done over the last 5 years?

Are you taking the piss? No I've got it, you're on the board aren't you?

 

[Grappler]

All of them were in the matchday squad regularly and the Beard was rated as the number 1 Right Back in the League under Nigel.

S Davies has helped our front line enormously and without Ben Davies' goals early on this season when few of our players were finding form, we would not be in the playoffs.

I certainly wouldn't mind grabbing Buxton or Bryson this summer that's for sure and I seem to remember that Derby are in a League above us and doing quite well.;-)

Totally agree, we have missed a big, physical presence up front, he has the height and build to knock opposition defenders about and the strength to hold up the ball. Before he arrived, I remember the difference O'Grady made when he played at the lane, when the teams lined up to shake hands he looked like the ex-soldier type of P.E. teacher, stood next to the 3rd year lads, man stood with boys. He chased a ball into the corner post, Kop end, two big defenders crowded him and he shouldered both out of the way and came out with the ball. Teams need at least one forward like that.