Tue 19 Feb 7pm U23s

[Deadbat]

Is it fair to describe SUFC Academyblockers?

Not getting into that argument. Just calling the game and what I have seen of this bunch. With Hallam, Semple, Gilmour gone and others on loan..the likes of Ferguson, York, Sheppeard, Broadbent, Greaves are the next lot up. They are miles away on the evidence I have seen. No-one of the current crop are close to even being ready for League 2 let alone Championship but most are 18/19 and very inexperienced.

 

[Ricky]

A thoroughly boring night. We came nowhere near troubling them all game.

It was like men against boys with Coutts stepping in to try and give the boys a chance. He was OK but it was an impossibly frustrating game for him because he had absolutely nothing to play with.

Moore again doing a good job of showing he isn't good enough. Bryan was better than against Barnet but is a long way from being first team standard and will be binned off in the summer. We might have had a few pros playing but that included these two, an isolated Washington and an unfit Wright. I don't think any of them apart from Coutts will be involved again this season whereas at least 3 or 4 of Wednesday's will be for them.

 

[Deadbat]

Not sure why my other player thoughts went?

Anyway...

York - Poor. Sloppy with it and never really showed much as the game passed him by. Often hid behind his man. We had no midfield at all in front of Coutts and no link to midfield and attack.

Broadbent - As above. Biggish lad but quite slow and not that athletic. He did not keep it or win tackles.

Washington- Got a knock early and never really recovered. Had no service at all and then limped off early in the 2nd half.

Greaves - No service. He showed a few touches but again at three giants he never had a kick most of the game with no decent balls to his feet or crosses.

Subs

Oure - He was literally a boy against men. Ran around but achieved nothing and when he did touch it the ball did not stick.

 

[Silent Blade]

Not getting into that argument. Just calling the game and what I have seen of this bunch. With Hallam, Semple, Gilmour gone and others on loan..the likes of Ferguson, York, Sheppeard, Broadbent, Greaves are the next lot up. They are miles away on the evidence I have seen. No-one of the current crop are close to even being ready for League 2 let alone Championship but most are 18/19 and very inexperienced.

I think since our Academy had been downgraded, it will be more difficult to find the next potential first teamer

 

[Ecco1889]

Reminded me of Barnet fa cup match,no fluidity or urgency,no change of pace
Very disappointing performance,Wednesday deserved it tbh

 

[Deadbat]

A thoroughly boring night. We came nowhere near troubling them all game.

It was like men against boys with Coutts stepping in to try and give the boys a chance. He was OK but it was an impossibly frustrating game for him because he had absolutely nothing to play with.

Moore again doing a good job of showing he isn't good enough. Bryan was better than against Barnet but is a long way from being first team standard and will be binned off in the summer. We might have had a few pros playing but that included these two, an isolated Washington and an unfit Wright. I don't think any of them apart from Coutts will be involved again this season whereas at least 3 or 4 of Wednesday's will be for them.

I agree. Coutts was p****d off at lack of movement. I thought the two other lads in midfield were woeful and looked kids playjng in mens football and the two wing backs did not move much either.

Wright looked way off the pace as shown by his awful mistake.

I agree also in Moore. Two long range shots he took forever to get the ball in flight. One he flicked away unconvincing and another hit his post. He would worry me if he played.

Bryan is a long way from a Champ level player and not sure he ever will be. He lad is a football brain and is remarkably one footed and not even that quick. He gets stuck in but has no composure on.the ball. I worry when he the ball goes near him. Like Heneghan looks a punt that has not come off. Peopke may say he could improve but you dong suddenly acquire touch and where to run etc; thats normslly just 'there' or 'not.'

Disappointing night as no-one stood out and as you say outside Coutts (He does not convince me after Forest and Barnet) save for a major injury crisis I doubt I would want any of these playing for us in the near future

 

[WalkelyFan]

I agree with most of the comments here and would only add that Coutts was man marked by their number 10 and did not cope with it very well. Looked slow and lost the ball a time or two I had the feeling they were practising tactics for the Derby as well. Eg they changed to a 4-4-2 at the end of the game - with that giant centre half. . Aarons looked good too. Very much men v boys.

 

[Cerberus Blade]

Quick player thoughts:

Moore - Looked shaky. Dropped a routine through ball. 1st goal went through him. No chance on the 2nd. Took too long to react to long range shots

Ferguson - Ok and one of the better kids for us. Defended ok and kept it simple. Quite quick and athletic. One bad giveaway

Bryan - Not convinced by him at all. Lacks composure and technically poor. His touch is not assured. At fault for the 1st. Did have a few block tackles and our best effort. Won't use his right foot at all. Nowhere near 1st team material for me.

Wright - Made a few of his tackles and interceptions but got done for pace on the 1st goal and wretched error on the 2nd. Too slow to move it on even at this level. Needs to move to a League 1/2 club this summer. Been a great servant but his days are up.

Sheppeard - He showed a few flashes on some runs but no end product. Played right wing back. Looked a bit weak.

Boyes - Left wing back. Not in the game at all and also did not help out defensively. Gave it away a lot.

Coutts- Saw a lot of the ball but all in our half. He showed he can pass but cannot carry the ball and looks very slow. With no movement in front off him he got really annoyed. Lost the ball a lot 2nd half as they pressed him. Hard to assess too much but you would think he would stand out at this level and he did not.

I’ve said recently that Coutts looks slow since his injury. He’s a good technical player but he’s nowhere near ready for the first team. Pity. But that’s how it is.

Sounds like the others are nowhere near as well?

Let’s hope the wise man’s prediction that the Sheffield derby will end with the same score doesn’t come true!

 

[finlaytheblade]

Well some of you butchered that team ! Our team we made up of kids who are very young for a 23 team,some players trying to get some gametime
and some coming back from injury.Pigs had a team full of players trying to impress Bruce ( who was there ) some young players who are far more experienced than the kids we had out there.
Not making excuses but that result is not surprising with the two teams out there.
The days have gone when reserve or 23 players get really stuck in .Academy level is far more entertaining as the amount of local lads playing raises the bar
Which seems to be absent at the next level up due to players using it for game time only.
Pigs had a different mindset trying to impress Bruce.

 

[Cheets]

Harrison Neal, Kean Bryan, are we trying to build a squad of players with their names the wrong way round?

 

[INTAKE BLADE]

Pig's raised their game as it was their cup final

 

[Deadbat]

I think since our Academy had been downgraded, it will be more difficult to find the next potential first teamer

Perhaps but how many come through at even the bigger clubs? You might get one every 4 or 5 years if you are lucky. As we have improved the last few years you would have to be outstanding to even get close. That is the same for anyone

Well some of you butchered that team ! Our team we made up of kids who are very young for a 23 team,some players trying to get some gametime
and some coming back from injury.Pigs had a team full of players trying to impress Bruce ( who was there ) some young players who are far more experienced than the kids we had out there.
Not making excuses but that result is not surprising with the two teams out there.
The days have gone when reserve or 23 players get really stuck in .Academy level is far more entertaining as the amount of local lads playing raises the bar
Which seems to be absent at the next level up due to players using it for game time only.
Pigs had a different mindset trying to impress Bruce.

Our team was not made up of kids. We had Moore, Washington, Wright, Coutts, Bryan. If anything Weds players such as Winnall and Pudil have been out injured more recently than any of the above.

Why were our players not trying to impress? 2 of Weds were loan players also so not even SWFC players. What was our mindset? Our experienced players were poor and our kids poor too. It's not about butchering the team. Many have to do far better if they want progress or in the senior ones case compete for minutes in the 1st team squad.

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

Give me a shout just before you all go to bed & I'll sneak my U23 Blog out while you won't notice it.....

 

[Silent Blade]

Perhaps but how many come through at even the bigger clubs? You might get one every 4 or 5 years if you are lucky. As we have improved the last few years you would have to be outstanding to even get close. That is the same for anyone
.

Maguire was the last good one that came through the Academy pre 16 (Brooks and Ramsdale were from other Academies after they turned 16). How many more good ones since?
From what I have heard , due to the EPPP, Category 1 Academies have been taking our best players in the last few years.

 

[alcoblade]

It’s not something I can get remotely interested in, or worked up about.

My only interest is in if there are any young stars coming through - it’s individual performances that count here.

It doesn’t sound like there is, mind.

 

[United Aren't Back.]

Watched our lads beat top placed Blackburn I think, in January.
It was dreadful, the entire game..

 

[BushBlade]

Maguire was the last good one that came through the Academy pre 16 (Brooks and Ramsdale were from other Academies after they turned 16). How many more good ones since?
From what I have heard , due to the EPPP, Category 1 Academies have been taking our best players in the last few years.

And some will probably end up coming back to us when the Manchester clubs drop them.

EPPP has damaged non PL academies though. We just couldn’t afford a category 1 academy.

I think most of the kids playing last night are still eligible for the u18s so it’s a big step up. You just hope they learn from it, realise how much work they have to do just to play at u23s, never mind first team.

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

I've enjoyed reading people's views of last night's Under 23 game at The Lane. Even Silent Blade 's laughable attempts at sucking people in with his Academy Blocker trolling. I've slept on it & written & published my Blog. Yes, it was a poor result. Yes, it was a disappointing performance. But, there is a sideways look at it. Which I've tried to capture. The Blog also includes my speculation on whether Travis Binnion is fit to undertake our Brexit negotiations and £2.15 a pint. Write this Blog off at your peril........

https://ball-sup.blogspot.com/2019/02/binnion-brexit.html

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

And some will probably end up coming back to us when the Manchester clubs drop them.

EPPP has damaged non PL academies though. We just couldn’t afford a category 1 academy.

I think most of the kids playing last night are still eligible for the u18s so it’s a big step up. You just hope they learn from it, realise how much work they have to do just to play at u23s, never mind first team.

I think Boyes & Broadbent of the starters are still U18. And Dewhurst, Neal, Belehouan from the bench.

 

[Silent Blade]

Even Silent Blade 's laughable attempts at sucking people in with his Academy Blocker trolling

Lol! I just think the term “Academy Blocker” is unfair on SUFC, Chris Wilder and the staff. It is the EPPP that has ruined the Academy system and it is wrong that Category 1 Academies are taking the best players from the below categories.


A genuine question for you (I don’t have the answer)… if we got an u13 player from a club like Mansfield in 2013, I know that we would have to pay compensation to Mansfield if the player makes his first team debut for us a few years later. But what if the player didnt play for our 1st team is released by us this summer , would Mansfield still get nothing if another club signs him?

 

[bladesince64]

Great blog PSB and having coached youngsters ( my only knowledge to call upon) its all about learning the basics of shape and concentration and these only come with game time and experience.

Yet people are watching with their 1st team glasses on and so the expectation levels are all wrong.

The coaching staff obviously see the loan system as the real transition test for the more promising lads coming through and this will benefit
them far more in my opinion.

Its all about progression.

Also Silent, we will still pick up quality lads who get released from other academies ie Brooks, Ramsdale etc as we have quality facilities and a very successful track record.

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

Lol! I just think the term “Academy Blocker” is unfair on SUFC, Chris Wilder and the staff. It is the EPPP that has ruined the Academy system and it is wrong that Category 1 Academies are taking the best players from the below categories.


A genuine question for you (I don’t have the answer)… if we got an u13 player from a club like Mansfield in 2013, I know that we would have to pay compensation to Mansfield if the player makes his first team debut for us a few years later. But what if the player didnt play for our 1st team is released by us this summer , would Mansfield still get nothing if another club signs him?

Silent Blade I know Mate, I have listened to what you (and others) have said. Although I was trying to make a point (in the past), I realise that the phrase can easily imply a lot more criticism than I intended. You will not hear me use it in quite that way again. The original point I was making was more about a Bloated Squad (subsequently addressed a bit in the January Window). As for your compensation question - sorry, I've no idea, I don't pay any attention to that sort of stuff. Favourite Beer Style, you ask - old skool 7.5% or more Double/Imperial IPA.

 

[Silent Blade]

Also Silent, we will still pick up quality lads who get released from other academies ie Brooks, Ramsdale etc as we have quality facilities and a very successful track record.

Agree that we have more success in picking the best of players who were released by other Academies after they turn 16

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

Great blog PSB and having coached youngsters ( my only knowledge to call upon) its all about learning the basics of shape and concentration and these only come with game time and experience.

Yet people are watching with their 1st team glasses on and so the expectation levels are all wrong.

The coaching staff obviously see the loan system as the real transition test for the more promising lads coming through and this will benefit
them far more in my opinion.

Its all about progression.

Also Silent, we will still pick up quality lads who get released from other academies ie Brooks, Ramsdale etc as we have quality facilities and a very successful track record.

I can't guarantee all of these - but last night - "my understanding"

Keenan Ferguson - United's Second Chance Saloon Futures Programme
George Broadbent - ex Manchester United Academy
Reece York - ex Fulham Academy
Harry Sheppeard - Tadcaster
Oliver Greaves - ?just SUFC?
Harry Boyes - ex Manchester City Academy
Marcus Dewhurst - ex Hull City Academy
Jake Bennett - Mickleover Sports
Jean Belehouan - ex Manchester United Academy
Harrison Neal - ?just SUFC?
Simeon Oure - scouted from France

I'm trying to develop my thinking - but it's currently

1. Local lad, in the Academy from a very young age (eg Neal)
2. Brought in as a youngster having been at another Academy (eg Boyes)
3. Scouted from abroad (inc Ireland) & brought in as a youngster (eg Oure & Jordan Doherty)
4. Brought in from non-league junior football (eg Sheppeard)

What we don't really do is pay good money for top Academy products (sort of like we tried with Heneghan). We recruit young. We sweep up. We scout in Ireland & overseas. But, we don't buy. I'm aware the wheels would come off if we did. "Why are we wasting money on unproved youngsters when Jermaine Defoe is available?". But, I believe some Championship, but still Cat 2 Academies (Leeds, Forest) are more willing to pay good transfer money.

 

[grafikhaus]

Agree that we have more success in picking the best of players who were released by other Academies after they turn 16

So less reason for us to have an academy? The days of polishing diamonds have gone due to the new (PL-centric) rules. Why not just cherry-pick others' efforts?

 

[Bill Johnson]

Change of subject but relevant.
I noticed the other evening that the former Greene King managed pub The Grindstone is currently closed for refurb to be relaunched as a Stancil Brewery outlet. Given the shenanigans surrounding the business thought this interesting. It's currently displaying a selection of vomit inducing posters proclaiming that the local population will have a friend for life and will never be left alone again.
As the wife beater once proudly proclaimed.
Reassuringly utter bollocks.

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

So less reason for us to have an academy? The days of polishing diamonds have gone due to the new (PL-centric) rules. Why not just cherry-pick others' efforts?

I know where you're coming from grafikhaus But, I have a Mantra I use with that argument.

No Jordan Hallam. No David Brooks.

What I mean is - to play Development Football, to play Academy Football, you have to field XI players. Any Cherry Picked will need to have 10 others who might not make it. I know the counter is something along the lines of "just Cherry Pick XI" - but I'm not sure that's reasonable. Here's how I imagine the conversation....

Mr Brooks Senior to Travis Binnion - "we're pleased you're having a look at our David. But, he was devastated to be released by Manchester City. We, as a family, don't want to go through that again. We know it's a tough game. Our David will only succeed if he's good enough. But, we need some reassurance about your set up & how it will look after him. I'll level with you, we're worried & we are talking to other Academies & asking them similar questions"

Trav - "no, we don't piss around with all that, we're a cherry picking club, we've got about 15 lads, we only need three blokes to coach them, take it or leave it"

Mr Brooks - rings Leeds United........

 

[Silent Blade]

So less reason for us to have an academy? The days of polishing diamonds have gone due to the new (PL-centric) rules. Why not just cherry-pick others' efforts?

Think our scouting system should concentrate more on 16 years olds who might be released by Category 1 Academies rather than scout the ones from 9 to 15 year olds playing in the Junior Leagues

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

Change of subject but relevant.
I noticed the other evening that the former Greene King managed pub The Grindstone is currently closed for refurb to be relaunched as a Stancil Brewery outlet. Given the shenanigans surrounding the business thought this interesting. It's currently displaying a selection of vomit inducing posters proclaiming that the local population will have a friend for life and will never be left alone again.
As the wife beater once proudly proclaimed.
Reassuringly utter bollocks.

Bill Johnson you have the advantage over me ...... what shenanigans surrounding the Stancill Business?

 

[DazBlade88]

Oliver Greaves was brought in as a 7 year old Ball_Sup (Phil)