Tick tock.....Is today the day?

[Balham]

riselikeasalmon the interest on loans made by major shareholders are normally done at LIBOR+ rather than Bank of England base+. In effect, I think that has made the interest due to McCabe over the past few years somewhere between 5% and 9%.

 

[riselikeasalmon]

riselikeasalmon the interest on loans made by major shareholders are normally done at LIBOR+ rather than Bank of England base+. In effect, I think that has made the interest due to McCabe over the past few years somewhere between 5% and 9%.

Noted, thanks, overnight LIBOR is not that much different from base, or would it be on 3m libor or some other measure?

Either way, the point is, is 3% over unreasonable on commercial terms, I don't think so and I'd rather owe the money to McCabe than the banks.

I don't disagree that spending the money we have and yet finding ourselves in the position we are is ridiculous, but I do disagree that McCabe is only involved in SUFC for the money.

 

[Kev Gee]

Apart from (in hindsight) Kyle Walker, who have we sold to the first offer made - James Beattie to Stoke.

You really think he will come off richer by being chairman of United ? Can't think of one chairman of a Chamionshipship club or below who has become better off by running a football(I am sure someone will think of one ) Ken Bates did quite nicely out of Chelsea. Bought for £1 in the 80s & sold for £Millions. Im Sure Milan at the Pigs has always done ok too.

 

[Balham]

Noted, thanks, overnight LIBOR is not that much different from base, or would it be on 3m libor or some other measure?

Either way, the point is, is 3% over unreasonable on commercial terms, I don't think so and I'd rather owe the money to McCabe than the banks.

I don't disagree that spending the money we have and yet finding ourselves in the position we are is ridiculous, but I do disagree that McCabe is only involved in SUFC for the money.

No - given the likelihood of getting the initial loan sum back in its entirety, LIBOR +3% is commercially fine.

I agree completely too that McCabe isn't in it for the money. However, he has to take a share of the blame as either he's made some terrible decisions (appointing Bryan Robson and Trevor Birch) or he's allowed other to do so (see the football decisions under Terry Robinson's watch). The plans to make us a global force were admirable but too much was undertaken too quickly without the foundations in place.

 

[Grecian2000]

Thankyou Bartman this is exactly what I'm trying to get across and some thick sh**s on here don't understand! If you're not positive, don't turn up next year.

You did well to hide that little gem inside a huge quote Willy. I think you missed "so called fans" out of there somewhere though.

Anyway, aside from that bollocks, at last we have a thread with some interesting points.

I actually think "broken" is a pretty good description of our current state (not entirely unmendable, but certainly not in a state any of us would wish for).
Without coming across as "massive", I would say that seeing Sheffield United in the third tier is not where we should be (I know all about not having a divine right etc. so don't bother with it please). If we can't, at least, maintain a 2nd tier prescence then we are underperforming as a club.

I think most of the "blame" lies with previous decisions not least of which was the unbelievable offer of long and expensive contracts to too old or not good enough players two summers ago (thanks a bundle Hoofy). To put Morgan, Cresswell, Monty and Quinn on improved three year deals was simply ridiculous and is the decision that is hamstringing us at the moment. There were plenty of people at the time who expressed surprise and unhappiness with the decision so it's not just hindsight either.

As SEB explains we are now in a position where we are under league rules regarding how much we can shell on wages, but I can't help thinking this is the sort of "excuse" McCabe has been waiting for. His heart might (and it is only a "might" for me) be in the right place but his decisions have been almost universally shit for a long time now!

This summer is drifting by and we aren't exciting anyone with our preperations are we?

 

[Darren]

Noted, thanks, overnight LIBOR is not that much different from base, or would it be on 3m libor or some other measure?

Either way, the point is, is 3% over unreasonable on commercial terms, I don't think so and I'd rather owe the money to McCabe than the banks.

I don't disagree that spending the money we have and yet finding ourselves in the position we are is ridiculous, but I do disagree that McCabe is only involved in SUFC for the money.

To be frank, anyone who thinks that McCabe got involved with SUFC to make money wants their head looking at.

Football clubs (outside the elite) are essentially rich people's toys. No-one with enough sense to make a lot of money would possibly see them as a route to make more money. It's something to spend your dosh on once you have made it - like fast cars, big yachts and trophy wives/husbands.

 

[bartman]

I think the sale of BT was a case of we couldn't afford his £40k per week wages and Stoke were the only team would would pay a large fee and take over the contract.

As for bates.he fell lucky with a Russian but the fact is that they stand out as they are exceptions

 

[Worksop_Blade]

Reality check number one!

Rant, tell him to fuck off, moan about the money he puts in. All pointless, irrelevant and showing bollocks understanding of how things are now.

Signings are NOT down to McCabe and his money. He is not allowed to simply put his hands in his pockets get the wedge out and sign players. The club generates X amount of income and can spent 65% of that income on players salaries. Last season that figure was nearer 110% of income. Chairman top-ups are no longer allowed. Serious reductions are needed, high earners need to go, but go where? All clubs at this level are in the same boat, so none of them can afford those salaries. Good enough to go up a level? One or two possibly, but they would still need to take a pay cut.

Decisions made in the last 5 years are now coming home to roost. Poor choices have consequences and here they are. Fact is we will probably sign 1 or 2 and the squad will be supplemented with Tonne, Chappell, Whitehouse, Philliskirk etc.

Now if you want to have a moan about missed opportunities to increase club income knowing this was coming, fire away!

I've said this on another post and I'll say it again. Scarborough Group could sponsor the training kit or one of the stands for say 2 years and the fee could be £15m. Thats £7.5million in extra revenue per year that the League can't touch, Chairman top ups are alive and well, there just done a little more intelligently.

Case in Point MCFC play at the Etihad Stadium. Etihad paid £350million for a 10 year deal, Sheik Mansour is pally pally with the airline with rumours rife that he stumped up the £350m to get around the upcoming Financial Fair Play rules.

 

[Balham]

Ah but that way, Worksop_Blade, Scarborough would have to write off the investment. Currently, McCabe is loaning the funds to the Club.

 

[Worksop_Blade]

Ah but that way, Worksop_Blade, Scarborough would have to write off the investment. Currently, McCabe is loaning the funds to the Club.

That's true, the way they are currently doing it makes any future sale of the club unlikely. Would you want to buy a 3rd division football club for over £50million? No me neither.

 

[Isiah]

To be frank, anyone who thinks that McCabe got involved with SUFC to make money wants their head looking at.

Football clubs (outside the elite) are essentially rich people's toys. No-one with enough sense to make a lot of money would possibly see them as a route to make more money. It's something to spend your dosh on once you have made it - like fast cars, big yachts and trophy wives/husbands.

I don't believe Mr Mc saw himself getting involved with a football club, but rather with international property development opportunities using SUFC as a front. The potential for mega profits - until the property market collapsed - was his real motivation and as such he paid little or no attention to the way that SUFC was being run, since in his world at that time it was small change. Add in the management expertise of Mr T Robinson and the rest is history.

 

[Darren]

I don't believe Mr Mc saw himself getting involved with a football club, but rather with international property development opportunities using SUFC as a front. The potential for mega profits - until the property market collapsed - was his real motivation and as such he paid little or no attention to the way that SUFC was being run, since in his world at that time it was small change. Add in the management expertise of Mr T Robinson and the rest is history.

I am not quite sure how owning SUFC would help him with international property development. Perhaps you would care to explain.

It seems to me that if all he wanted to do was make money there were far easier and less stressful ways of going about it.

 

[HoodedClaw]

I've said this on another post and I'll say it again. Scarborough Group could sponsor the training kit or one of the stands for say 2 years and the fee could be £15m. Thats £7.5million in extra revenue per year that the League can't touch, Chairman top ups are alive and well, there just done a little more intelligently.

From what I understand its not quite that simple. UEFA have put mechanism's in place to try to stop exactly this. Its known as "Income Transactions With Related Parties Above Fair Value" part of it states "If the estimated fair value is different to the recorded value then the relevant income must be adjusted accordingly, bearing in mind, however, that no upward adjustments can be made to relevant income."

Sponsorship is one of the listed examples of Clubs needing to demonstrate fair value.

I'am intrigued how the PL clubs are going to get round this when it eventually is enforced, particularly as Platini doesn't particularly like the English and certainly doesnt like the PL.

No doubt brown envelopes stuffed with cash will exchange hands at somepoint

 

[Eskimo]

I'm most worried about the hangover effect I think. At this time last year, after the trauma of relegation. I ws looking forward to the new season, new style of play, new blood being introduced and had no real expectations of promotion; I was quite relaxed. If someone had have told me it was going to be one of the most traumatic experiences in more than 45 years watching United, some great performances culminationg in a cliff hanging disappointment as bad as 2006/7 , Tevez and all that I would not have bought it. And I'm still not over it. I have no quarrels with McCabe or Wilson or the team for that matter. I just want to hear something positive soon to kick start me, and I suspect others, into life.

 

[Bladesman]

I'm most worried about the hangover effect I think. At this time last year, after the trauma of relegation. I ws looking forward to the new season, new style of play, new blood being introduced and had no real expectations of promotion; I was quite relaxed. If someone had have told me it was going to be one of the most traumatic experiences in more than 45 years watching United, some great performances culminationg in a cliff hanging disappointment as bad as 2006/7 , Tevez and all that I would not have bought it. And I'm still not over it. I have no quarrels with McCabe or Wilson or the team for that matter. I just want to hear something positive soon to kick start me, and I suspect others, into life.

There are no positives at the moment.

A decent signing wouldn't go a miss.

 

[riselikeasalmon]

I am not quite sure how owning SUFC would help him with international property development. Perhaps you would care to explain.

It seems to me that if all he wanted to do was make money there were far easier and less stressful ways of going about it.

He should have set up an international property development company.