The Leasehold of Bramall Lane

[blade too long]

To spend money on something we won't fill? Rather than players to try to get us to the next level?

and if we get to the prem we get in another 4000 at by then 600 a seat season ticket
an extra 3 m a year income , to buy players with

its tin pot thinking in the past thats kept us in the lower levels

 

[Bladepicker]

Not to the capacity they think they need. Like White Hart Lane it's surrounded by housing etc. They won't sell out much at the new stadium it's too big but that's not the point that's under discussion.
I never mentioned Man. City because I don't know much about their move. I never said never about BL either.

Fair enough. I still say they are one bad season away from not needing a new ground as they dont sell out in tier 2. Therefore if there was not the massive financial incentive they would not be moving.

 

[Sean Thornton]

They may have a big demand for the London derbies and the big North West clubs but they're the only pl club that has to advertise games in the Standard.

According to the latest reports the costs of the stadium are being paid by the taxpayer (the equivalent costs at the Etihad being paid by Man City) and are almost as much as the rent West Ham are paying. I understand they also get to keep the costs of the Boleyn Ground disposal.

Sorry, you've touched a nerve here. It's scandalous.

I agree but that wasn't the point. There average last year was a couple of hundred below capacity without looking at any restrictions. A good season at the new stadium will see the average increase to nearer 40k I'd guess because of the rigmarole they have in getting tickets even via the membership scheme.

We don't need to either move nor increase capacity.

 

[Barney]

I think we need to get out of division 3 before we discuss re-developments in the Premier League.

 

[Lord Bos of Eckington.]

I reckon we will redevelop the kop immediately we return to the championship
its financial sense

A feasibility study and plans for full planning permission , was going to increase the kop capacity with a complete cantelever design ( no post supports ) , with a increas in exec boxes . Problem was , we got relegated , and it has been put on the back burner . The time will come again.

UTB

 

[Kev Gee]

2007 wants its thread back.....

 

[Sean Thornton]

and if we get to the prem we get in another 4000 at by then 600 a seat season ticket
an extra 3 m a year income , to buy players with

its tin pot thinking in the past thats kept us in the lower levels

£3 million? Okay.

 

[bricktop]

So nobody wants to even hazard a guess about how much Sheffield United are paying the Scarborough Property Group for the lease of the ground and training facilities? Indeed even questioning this means the more loony of the clapper are getting their knickers in a twist that anyone could even ask questions of their favourite property group?

 

[bricktop]

2007 wants its thread back.....

2011 also wants its humour one liner back.........

 

[metalblade]

Tell you what should by some miracle we got an extended stay in the Premiership we would be off to a new ground quicker than you can say "Terry Curan's a twat" and our biggest Blade would be laughing all the way to the bank to count his pension fund.

 

[Sean Thornton]

So nobody wants to even hazard a guess about how much Sheffield United are paying the Scarborough Property Group for the lease of the ground and training facilities? Indeed even questioning this means the more loony of the clapper are getting their knickers in a twist that anyone could even ask questions of their favourite property group?

The inconvenient truth is that while the football club owning the ground would undoubtedly provide the fan base with some comfort and succour, the harsh reality that some refuse to see is that the people in overall control of the property assets today were in overall control of the property assets before they were transferred. May be hard to grasp hard to accept and even harder to challenge although shouting " clapper" clearly provides some sustenance

 

[bricktop]

The inconvenient truth is that while the football club would undoubtedly provide the fan base with some comfort and succour, the harsh reality that some refuse to see is that the people in overall control of the property assets today were in overall control of the property assets before they were transferred. May be hard to grasp hard to accept and even harder to challenge although shouting " clapper" clearly provides some sustenance

A bit like Rotherham United with Millmoor and Ken Booth. All was fine and dandy when was together as one, but when he sold the football club but retained the freehold of Millmoor then things suddenly appeared very differently.

So Sean Thornton would you like to guess how much the club is paying Scarborough Property Group for the lease?

 

[Sean Thornton]

Seeing a hazarding a guess is the way to go can anyone say - and be honest - about the value of the land the stadium stands on and any possible development value?

Taking into account of course it's an S2 postcode and not S10 or S17.

 

[Sean Thornton]

A bit like Rotherham United with Millmoor and Ken Booth. All was fine and dandy when was together as one, but when he sold the football club but retained the freehold of Millmoor then things suddenly appeared very differently.

So Sean Thornton would you like to guess how much the club is paying Scarborough Property Group for the lease?

What's Ken done with the multi millions he's got from non football ownership? Are you suggesting in that particular case the Millers are now worse of than if they'd stayed in thrall to that old despot?

All I can suggest is look at the accounts for clues. Because I'm not party to that information and I'd suspect that neither are many on football forums.

If pointing out the bleeding obvious that the McCabe family owned it then just like they owned it now makes me a clapper then so be it.

 

[bricktop]

Seeing a hazarding a guess is the way to go can anyone say - and be honest - about the value of the land the stadium stands on and any possible development value?

Taking into account of course it's an S2 postcode and not S10 or S17.

i would just be very interested to know in how much McCabes property empire is making out of its ownership of Bramall Lane and Shirecliffe.

I'm no expert, but I very much doubt McCabe will be charging a Peppercorn rent

 

[Sean Thornton]

i would just be very interested to know in how much McCabes property empire is making out of its ownership of Bramall Lane and Shirecliffe.

I'm no expert, but I very much doubt McCabe will be charging a Peppercorn rent

I'm not suggesting he is. In fact the negative to this is not who actually owns the freehold but as the 2013 accounts stated the Prince was willing to invest in the player transfers and development side of the club the club had to reach break even point itself and I read that as him saying he wouldn't shore up losses. We've posted losses since and any rent paid increases those losses. As of now, that's the issue rather than who holds the deeds. I'd expect a loss in the 2015 accounts and rents paid/charged in those accounts add to the problem

 

[BushBlade]

I agree but that wasn't the point. There average last year was a couple of hundred below capacity without looking at any restrictions. A good season at the new stadium will see the average increase to nearer 40k I'd guess because of the rigmarole they have in getting tickets even via the membership scheme.

We don't need to either move nor increase capacity.

Post #29

 

[GRUMPY BLADE]

From the June '13 accounts:

"The fine facilities at the Club’s disposal, namely the Stadium at Bramall Lane and Academy at Shirecliffe, are retained by the Group following the sale of 50% of our interest in SUFC. Naturally the Club will continue to have the use of these Group assets through long term lease agreements with the aim to see reunification of the assets once the Club re-achieve Premier League status."

So by the time we get back to the Prem TV money will be around £450m/year and the ground which we have to buy back will be valued at?

£450m anyone?

 

[Sean Thornton]

Post #29

What about it?

 

[bricktop]

I'm not suggesting he is. In fact the negative to this is not who actually owns the freehold but as the 2013 accounts stated the Prince was willing to invest in the player transfers and development side of the club the club had to reach break even point itself and I read that as him saying he wouldn't shore up losses. We've posted losses since and any rent paid increases those losses. As of now, that's the issue rather than who holds the deeds. I'd expect a loss in the 2015 accounts and rents paid/charged in those accounts add to the problem

So that reads to me as McCabe is effectively hamstringing the club due to the rent being charged to his Scarborough Property Group.

It explains a lot, and makes pretty sombre reading and gives a lot of explanation to why we are unable to attract players of the required substance and quality to take us out of this division.

 

[Sean Thornton]

So by the time we get back to the Prem TV money will be around £450m/year and the ground which we have to buy back will be valued at?

£450m anyone?

Market value? Whatever the then owner will pay?

 

[BushBlade]

What about it?

I'm agreeing with you. It makes no sense to redevelop the ground while we're in the championship.

 

[Sean Thornton]

So that reads to me as McCabe is effectively hamstringing the club due to the rent being charged to his Scarborough Property Group.

It explains a lot, and makes pretty sombre reading and gives a lot of explanation to why we are unable to attract players of the required substance and quality to take us out of this division.

I think it's certainly more important now as opposed to the freehold question because it's likely to be having an impact on player budget this season. And let's be honest, it's a huge leap of faith to believe we are breaking even at the moment.

The rent may well be replacing interest payments on loans but it's still an ongoing expense.

 

[Sean Thornton]

I'm agreeing with you. It makes no sense to redevelop the ground while we're in the championship.

Sorry I missed the point totally!

 

[Rodley]

Put it this way, BL is not worth a huge amount of money as a development site. I would have thought McCabe chucks in that amount to SUFC himself every three years to keep us going.

People actively looking for new things to moan about again here...

 

[CopenhagenBlade]

So that reads to me as McCabe is effectively hamstringing the club due to the rent being charged to his Scarborough Property Group.

It explains a lot, and makes pretty sombre reading and gives a lot of explanation to why we are unable to attract players of the required substance and quality to take us out of this division.

How much of his money should McCabe give the club before you are happy? Should he just carry on until there is nothing left?
He is a business man who has already invested/lost a lot of his money to keep this club afloat. What indication have you that he is about to run off and destroy the club?
We probably can't attract the players because we are in the 3rd division and are restricted by FFP.
Yes he makes mistakes, but it is easy for the keyboard warriors to criticize in hindsight. K Mc has to make decision in the present, which is not quite so easy...try it.

 

[Jonboy60]

W



West Ham are moving because they can't redevelop the Boleyn to meet their needs. They have a membership scheme because of the demand they have. The Olympic may well not be the answer but they need a bigger ground. We didn't even need McCabes Kop expansion plans.

They wouldn't have needed a bigger ground if the cheating cunts had gone down.Yes it still pisses me off even now. The cockney twats. The other halfs family come from Dagenham/ Barking, and I'm still giving em fuckin grief over it. Cocks.

 

[Sean Thornton]

How much of his money should McCabe give the club before you are happy? Should he just carry on until there is nothing left?
He is a business man who has already invested/lost a lot of his money to keep this club afloat. What indication have you that he is about to run off and destroy the club?
We probably can't attract the players because we are in the 3rd division and are restricted by FFP.
Yes he makes mistakes, but it is easy for the keyboard warriors to criticize in hindsight. K Mc has to make decision in the present, which is not quite so easy...try it.

I've pointed out the scenario as I see it CB but am not anti McCabe. The opposite in fact. He's lost millions that he may recoup only with a Euromillions jackpot and he's still here. Thank God.
The freehold question is meaningless, which was the point I was making.

 

[bricktop]

How much of his money should McCabe give the club before you are happy? Should he just carry on until there is nothing left?
He is a business man who has already invested/lost a lot of his money to keep this club afloat. What indication have you that he is about to run off and destroy the club?
We probably can't attract the players because we are in the 3rd division and are restricted by FFP.
Yes he makes mistakes, but it is easy for the keyboard warriors to criticize in hindsight. K Mc has to make decision in the present, which is not quite so easy...try it.

Who was it who made all the stupid half brained decisions such as Blades Realty, Chengdu Blades, our global network and all that stuff that has loaded debt on to the club?

 

[CopenhagenBlade]

I've pointed out the scenario as I see it CB but am not anti McCabe. The opposite in fact. He's lost millions that he may recoup only with a Euromillions jackpot and he's still here. Thank God.
The freehold question is meaningless, which was the point I was making.

My comment wasn't directed at you