The enigma that is Paul Coutts

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Cerberus Blade said:
You know what fellas? Coutts is a very good player. I think sometimes it's easy to criticise for what a player can't do. Coutts isn't an aggressive ball winning midfielder - never will be - so don't even dream of it. But he's a very composed player and does a very good job for us in that midfield. We are much worse off without him and we saw a big change in our fortunes when he came back into the team this season. Let's try and appreciate him for what he is - not what he isn't.
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He wasn't anything in previous seasons. He's been bloody awful, though the signs of what he was capable of, or not, were always there. But who cares, it's gone.

It's looking much better this season - partly because he's got no choice but to work his arse off for Wilder, and partly because the energy of the entire team has been upped enormously, allowing him (and requiring of him) the luxury of playing the more composed game without others being overrun.

UTB
 
HermitageBlade said:
Coutts was fantastic again last night but I've always been a big fan. He reads the game well, has a fantastic touch and is always available for the pass. I really do enjoy watching him play, unfortunately I think it took him a bit of time to settle and last season under Madkins I don't think anyone could flourish. My one frustration is that he should have a pop at goal more often as he does seem to find himself in some fantastic positions on the edge of the area just simply from holding his position when others are charging into the box. He's a player that will get better and better as the season goes on and I wouldn't be surprised to see him getting more and more plaudits.
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He has demonstrated on a number of occasions now he is fit that he is not slow either, so we can dispense with that myth, I hope.
 
wizadry said:
Well I've read through this thread and thought we'd signed League ones' Zinedine Zidane. Obviously the non goal scoring, can't tackle, won't sprint back, no assists and without the head but Zidane. :)
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I'm sorry mate, you need to watch the last few weeks again and I will tell you why.
1. He does tackle, and has in fact made many tackles in the games he has played. It's even recorded on video, and available to watch again on that there Bladesplayer!
2. He does sprint back....and has showed that in every game I have seen him....even taking a booking for the team when players were breaking into the back four.....again can be seen on Bladesplayer.

Granted he's not scored....and technically (though I think the stat is bollocks anyway) no assists but I guarantee if he plays every game this season he will score, and he will get a fully counting assist.

But anyway....for league one he may well actually be the equivalent of Zidane...if there ever could be such a thing. In fact as someone has said about Sharp....I could also say this...every other side in this league would bite our hands off to have the Coutts we have seen for the last month or so.
 
Grizzly blade said:
I'm sorry mate, you need to watch the last few weeks again and I will tell you why.
1. He does tackle, and has in fact made many tackles in the games he has played. It's even recorded on video, and available to watch again on that there Bladesplayer!
2. He does sprint back....and has showed that in every game I have seen him....even taking a booking for the team when players were breaking into the back four.....again can be seen on Bladesplayer.

Granted he's not scored....and technically (though I think the stat is bollocks anyway) no assists but I guarantee if he plays every game this season he will score, and he will get a fully counting assist.

But anyway....for league one he may well actually be the equivalent of Zidane...if there ever could be such a thing. In fact as someone has said about Sharp....I could also say this...every other side in this league would bite our hands off to have the Coutts we have seen for the last month or so.
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I don't need to watch them back as I watched the games sober, plus I haven't really got time to do it.

He might make a tackle but he doesn't go out of his way to make one, he often lets the players just run past him with the ball just like he did at Scunthorpe and another game(can't remember who it was) and they scored from both of them, people overlook these things because we're winning so they don't like to be seen as critics where as I don't give a fuck. If something deserves criticism or praise I'll say it no matter whether we win or lose.

As for him picking a booking up, have you not thought that was due to him being out of position or not able to tackle the player in the first place ultimately leading to the player not getting past him in the first place?

As for him scoring I'll wait with baited breath, what I will say is he needs to shoot more because he gets into good positions and he does have a good strike on him, lets hope for all our sakes he scores soon, then hopefully his confidence will rise and he'll score more.

Oh, and Coutts can't head-butt fuck all like Zidane. :)
 
For me Coutts is Neutral, Vanilla, so Average

He hasnt quite managed to find that hole Jamie Hoyland used to disappear into, but he is getting there

Next game just watch what drive and energy go through centre midfield to attack ..... fuck all

Certainly a 3rd division player in a 3rd division team ... thats all
 
wizadry said:
I don't need to watch them back as I watched the games sober, plus I haven't really got time to do it.

He might make a tackle but he doesn't go out of his way to make one, he often lets the players just run past him with the ball just like he did at Scunthorpe and another game(can't remember who it was) and they scored from both of them, people overlook these things because we're winning so they don't like to be seen as critics where as I don't give a fuck. If something deserves criticism or praise I'll say it no matter whether we win or lose.

As for him picking a booking up, have you not thought that was due to him being out of position or not able to tackle the player in the first place ultimately leading to the player not getting past him in the first place?

As for him scoring I'll wait with baited breath, what I will say is he needs to shoot more because he gets into good positions and he does have a good strike on him, lets hope for all our sakes he scores soon, then hopefully his confidence will rise and he'll score more.

Oh, and Coutts can't head-butt fuck all like Zidane. :)
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Thought that you might mention Scunny....so I was ready for this answer.
Coutts is forced over to our right to close down the overload Scunny had down our right side. Holmes had been on that side of the pitch moments earlier and involved, and then moved into the space on the right. They opened out, and as the ball is passed, Coutts immediately sprints to try and close the player down. Now, here's the interesting bit.
As he closes him down he has two options, either sprint into the space Holmes eventually runs into to shoot, or close the man and get tight.
He chose the latter, Holmes waited for the right moment and knocked the ball just far enough to allow him to burst beyond Coutts reach. Coutts then has to either pull him down, or let him go...he chose the latter I believe because he was already on a yellow...and Holmes was still 25 yards from goal with a lot to do.

If he had run into the space, Holmes could have gone back inside, passed the ball back where it came...who knows. But Coutts did what he is told to do by the manager....close the man. He was also coming at him from the side, meaning Holmes had the advantage of being able to do what he did. The issue for us, is why we were giving the lad so much space....it was our left side, and that is Flecks side of the pitch....where was he?
And you ignore the fact Holmes is a good player, and Very quick too.
In those circumstances Coutts was neither out of position, didn't let his player run past him and did nothing wrong. The kid hit it well, hit the target and on another 7 times out of 10 the keeper saves it. Sorted.


All this boils down to, is you want Coutts to be The midfield enforcer, The general dictating play, being at both ends of the pitch whenever he's needed, the box to box goalscorer....if he was that player he would be in the premier league. We have other players and systems designed to accommodate those missing parts to his game as well as opponents that don't need to have world class players to be beaten.
 
Pinchy said:
He has demonstrated on a number of occasions now he is fit that he is not slow either, so we can dispense with that myth, I hope.
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Unfortunately I do believe that part of the problem for some fans with Coutts is that he was signed by Clough. The twisted logic being that to admit he's a good player somehow goes against their core belief that Clough wasted millions and was the devil incarnate. I got the same impression that their was a collective sigh of relief when Brayford went because if he had started to become the player we knew he could be as he regained fitness their argument again would have fallen down. It seems more about point scoring than seeing what's in front of you.
 
Grizzly blade said:
Thought that you might mention Scunny....so I was ready for this answer.
Coutts is forced over to our right to close down the overload Scunny had down our right side. Holmes had been on that side of the pitch moments earlier and involved, and then moved into the space on the right. They opened out, and as the ball is passed, Coutts immediately sprints to try and close the player down. Now, here's the interesting bit.
As he closes him down he has two options, either sprint into the space Holmes eventually runs into to shoot, or close the man and get tight.
He chose the latter, Holmes waited for the right moment and knocked the ball just far enough to allow him to burst beyond Coutts reach. Coutts then has to either pull him down, or let him go...he chose the latter I believe because he was already on a yellow...and Holmes was still 25 yards from goal with a lot to do.

If he had run into the space, Holmes could have gone back inside, passed the ball back where it came...who knows. But Coutts did what he is told to do by the manager....close the man. He was also coming at him from the side, meaning Holmes had the advantage of being able to do what he did. The issue for us, is why we were giving the lad so much space....it was our left side, and that is Flecks side of the pitch....where was he?
And you ignore the fact Holmes is a good player, and Very quick too.
In those circumstances Coutts was neither out of position, didn't let his player run past him and did nothing wrong. The kid hit it well, hit the target and on another 7 times out of 10 the keeper saves it. Sorted.


All this boils down to, is you want Coutts to be The midfield enforcer, The general dictating play, being at both ends of the pitch whenever he's needed, the box to box goalscorer....if he was that player he would be in the premier league. We have other players and systems designed to accommodate those missing parts to his game as well as opponents that don't need to have world class players to be beaten.
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Good post and observations mate.

I really hope as the games go on he gets more confident as they go on, what I do disagree with his people saying he's getting better and better when for me, putting their goal aside, he was poor against Scunny, I thought he reverted to the lazy twat he was last season on a number of occasions in that game, good for us though that he changed back to the player he can be in the second half on Tuesday.

I don't expect him to be the enforcer all the time, we normally play with three in midfield so I expect them to get some understanding that when one of the three goes or two for that matter then the other one sits, this shouldn't be hard for pro footballers and they have been showing they can do it over recent games, lets hope this continues. I don't on the other hand want Coutts to just sit there playing shitty balls that mean nothing, he's better than that.
 
Also noted that in the second Scunny goal, Fleck chases down the ball, and Scougall follows.
The defence is slow to push out and this leaves the space that Holnes drifted into. Fault of many, not one man.

Scougall and Fleck didn't need to press when we were down to 10 men...if one went the other should sit....in this case it should have been Scougs. But Fleck was doing the job of a forward, while Billy was occupying the full back and Done the player out on our left touch line.
Defence doesn't clear our 18 yard area, despite the ball going back to their own half and centre backs.
So, the back line and Scougs get criticism for positional sense, while Coutts gets it for if anything not hving enough in the tank to full on sprint to get there sooner.

Team game folks....win as a team, lose as one. But what is pleasing is we are cutting out the individual errors that have been costing us goals for two seasons.
 
Fulwood Blade said:
I see there is still some criticism of Coutts - that why he is a 3rd tier player.

In this team, he is the player that links everything together - keeps things moving.

It isn't going to suit everyone - but at least CW is getting the best out of him, and if Wilder WANTS a link player then he is the best there is.

I think we saw last night also why BASHAM is normally in the team - thought we missed him a lot.

Someone said after P'boro - we should be thankful for the 3 points - same last night, thankful for 3 points in a midfield that struggled all night.

3 points, we move on.

PLEASE REVERT TO 3-5-2 or 3-4-1-2..............Please !!!!!! - we look so much better.

UTB
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I share the sentiment but think we can only do that if we get a third centre half fit. Hoping Jake Wright will be available so we can get back to our best formation.
 
derekacorah said:
That first paragraph could have been said about Michael Doyle for his whole spell at the club apart from the last line and he is lauded by some. The 2nd paragraph however cannot be said about Michael Doyle.
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You really think Doyle didn’t tackle, win loose balls or track back? I’m somewhat flabbergasted by that statement. Few laud him though, they just appreciate that he brought something to the team that we have often missed. Most agreed his was a position we should be looking to upgrade.
 

1danewhitehouse said:
You really think Doyle didn’t tackle, win loose balls or track back? I’m somewhat flabbergasted by that statement. Few laud him though, they just appreciate that he brought something to the team that we have often missed. Most agreed his was a position we should be looking to upgrade.
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I think we all admit Michael Doyle has found his level, otherwise another club from our division would have picked him up.
 
1danewhitehouse said:
You really think Doyle didn’t tackle, win loose balls or track back? I’m somewhat flabbergasted by that statement. Few laud him though, they just appreciate that he brought something to the team that we have often missed. Most agreed his was a position we should be looking to upgrade.
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He tried to tackle but mostly failed, he won loose balls then passed back to the opposition. What he did do an awful lot was look busy and fool people into thinking he was doing something by pointing a lot, oh and did a cockney walk at West Ham that apparently erased his past sins against football. He was synonymous with the decline of this club and a terrible captain. Apart from that he was great.
 
derekacorah said:
He tried to tackle but mostly failed, he won loose balls then passed back to the opposition. What he did do an awful lot was look busy and fool people into thinking he was doing something by pointing a lot, oh and did a cockney walk at West Ham that apparently erased his past sins against football. He was synonymous with the decline of this club and a terrible captain. Apart from that he was great.
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He certainly has his faults but I can’t agree that he wasn’t a tackler. He didn’t even give it away that much compared to the likes of Monty. But he didn’t have any creativity about him. Could only play simple passes, couldn’t take a man on, didn’t have the pace to get box to box etc. He was ok as a holding midfielder breaking up play if he had good players to benefit from that and create (Coady, McDonald etc.) but he was getting on and it was right to release him when we did.
 
Seems like this thread should be on about 1000 replies by now...
 
1danewhitehouse said:
He certainly has his faults but I can’t agree that he wasn’t a tackler. He didn’t even give it away that much compared to the likes of Monty. But he didn’t have any creativity about him. Could only play simple passes, couldn’t take a man on, didn’t have the pace to get box to box etc. He was ok as a holding midfielder breaking up play if he had good players to benefit from that and create (Coady, McDonald etc.) but he was getting on and it was right to release him when we did.
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As ever with anyone who defends Doyle at all I disagree. The things he should have been good at are the things you stated he was good at. What people seemed to forget after he did the cockney walk was that he couldn't actually break up play or play a 5 yard pass or run or shoot. He always flattered to deceive and nothing more.
 
derekacorah said:
As ever with anyone who defends Doyle at all I disagree. The things he should have been good at are the things you stated he was good at. What people seemed to forget after he did the cockney walk was that he couldn't actually break up play or play a 5 yard pass or run or shoot. He always flattered to deceive and nothing more.
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Think we'll have to agree to disagree here. He wasn't mobile enough to do it in a 2 in those last 2 seasons but when played in a 3, think he still did a decent job. That's been the case for many of our central midfielders over recent years.
 
1danewhitehouse said:
I share the sentiment but think we can only do that if we get a third centre half fit. Hoping Jake Wright will be available so we can get back to our best formation.
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yes, point taken - rumours have it that Wright is fit for Fleetwood - i'll be bloody cross going all that way and seeing us lose playing 4-4-2.:(

UTB
 
Fulwood Blade said:
yes, point taken - rumours have it that Wright is fit for Fleetwood - i'll be bloody cross going all that way and seeing us lose playing 4-4-2.:(

UTB
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Im surprised he didn't try Brown ,first time Ive seen him in the flesh the other night ,he is bigger than Landell. About time we started bullying teams a bit ,something we've desperately missed for a few years now.
 
sitwell said:
Im surprised he didn't try Brown ,first time Ive seen him in the flesh the other night ,he is bigger than Landell. About time we started bullying teams a bit ,something we've desperately missed for a few years now.
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Yes, Reece Brown might be the answer - I see a lot of Bassett/Warnock in CW ie: taking players and making something out of them that others can't - perhaps he sees something in Brown.

I have gone bonkers in the past about our lack of centre halves - I just think they define a team. I like Wright though - he looks cool under pressure, sees what he wants to do early and just does it - mainly simple, easy and quick passes. He is slow and could actually add very slow, but you can get away with lack of pace by reading a game and being clever with it.

The danger is that Brown might be another Hussey.

UTB
 
Fulwood Blade said:
Yes, Reece Brown might be the answer - I see a lot of Bassett/Warnock in CW ie: taking players and making something out of them that others can't - perhaps he sees something in Brown.

I have gone bonkers in the past about our lack of centre halves - I just think they define a team. I like Wright though - he looks cool under pressure, sees what he wants to do early and just does it - mainly simple, easy and quick passes. He is slow and could actually add very slow, but you can get away with lack of pace by reading a game and being clever with it.

The danger is that Brown might be another Hussey.

UTB
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Everybody has written Hussey off on the back of 3 bad games ,I think he will come good ,maybe as a half back ,but when Knill and Wilder have had him for a few months it will click ,same with Clarke.
 
Enigma indeed :)

At least we can all agree that the (many) resident experts that had Coutts down as dogshit (I'll come on to that), have painfully got this wrong.

Dress it up how you want. You couldn't spot a baller from 12 inches.
Hilarious thread. Embarrassing for many.

Not meaning to rub anyone up. Just serves as a reminder that it's not what you know that gets you in to trouble.

It's what you know for sure, that just ain't so ;)

I defy anyone (Messi et al) to look good alongside DH, the worst player to wear the shirt in over 20 years.

There it is !!!!!!!

UTB
 
DronnieBlade said:
Enigma indeed :)

At least we can all agree that the (many) resident experts that had Coutts down as dogshit (I'll come on to that), have painfully got this wrong.

Dress it up how you want. You couldn't spot a baller from 12 inches.
Hilarious thread. Embarrassing for many.

Not meaning to rub anyone up. Just serves as a reminder that it's not what you know that gets you in to trouble.

It's what you know for sure, that just ain't so ;)

I defy anyone (Messi et al) to look good alongside DH, the worst player to wear the shirt in over 20 years.

There it is !!!!!!!

UTB
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Looking at the first few pages of this thread it seems the majority were saying he's a good player who's just wasn't doing it and didn't have the right players around him
 

LJBlade said:
Looking at the first few pages of this thread it seems the majority were saying he's a good player who's just wasn't doing it and didn't have the right players around him
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Agreed.

Disagree it's the majority though. And to give balance, this is worthy of mention.

But there are also loads that did not. Quite the opposite in fact.

Glad he's doing it for us. Would be sickening to see him doing it elsewhere, as many desired.

Maybe it's the Tufty magic dust. As simple as that.

UTB
 
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