SUFC Accounts

[1danewhitehouse]

Look what Clough did with what he inherited in his first season.

Despite most of us thinking he was a good choice as manager , he more or less demotivated the side. I hear of cliques in the dressing room when he was here but he didn't sort it. In comparison to the short time Wilder has been here, Adkins was an abject failure.

He defended Hammond week in week out, despite his legs having gone. Unseen work etc. we went from a stubborn man in Clough to some waffle merchant quoting management guru books whilst it seemed some players did what they wanted while he went on about geese. There was virtually no team spirit on the pitch and he never got to grips with it. Now we have Wilder with a much less impressive cv who's shaken things up at all levels.

For me Adkins tenure is up there with the worst. The wrong fit argument doesn't work for me. When the crunch came, he wasn't up to it.

I agree he wasn't up to the task at hand and that he failed. I just think the difficulty of the circumstances he inherited is often overlooked. Wilder has been a revelation but the circumstances he inhereited were far more favourable. Being able to clear out the deadwood in one go on arrival meant he could put together a team of his choosing.

I take your point about what Clough did with what he inherited. Some managers are better at having an impact on what they inherit. Others are good at building successful teams. Clough was good at the former. Wilder has proven he is good at the latter. Adkins failed at the former and never got a chance at the latter.

 

[Sean Thornton]

I agree he wasn't up to the task at hand and that he failed. I just think the difficulty of the circumstances he inherited is often overlooked. Wilder has been a revelation but the circumstances he inhereited were far more favourable. Being able to clear out the deadwood in one go on arrival meant he could put together a team of his choosing.

I take your point about what Clough did with what he inherited. Some managers are better at having an impact on what they inherit. Others are good at building successful teams. Clough was good at the former. Wilder has proven he is good at the latter. Adkins failed at the former and never got a chance at the latter.

Clough deserved a second season though Dane. Adkins, IMO, didn't. Thank God.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

I've not said worst ever but he's up there. Look at the pile of shite Adams got. It wasn't so much the manner of his interviews but the utter bollocks he talked. In any event that's a side issue. He failed in getting the team to perform - despite the motivational bluster - because he was out of his depth. If he underestimated the size of the job that's down to him. He clearly failed as far as the dressing room was concerned as can be seen somewhat by Wilders successes there.

Agreed. He failed regarding the dressing room. But with so little room for manoeuvre in terms of overhaul, it was always going to be difficult. I suspect his most bizarre actions (making McEveley captain, signing Hammond and Woolford) were attempts to address the dressing room issues because they sure as hell can't have been pure football decisions.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

Clough deserved a second season though Dane. Adkins, IMO, didn't. Thank God.

Wilder's success is proving that statement to be correct in hindsight. My fear was when we sacked Adkins, the new guy would struggle to hit the ground running and the cycle would be repeated over and over. I thought we needed continuity but to Wilder's credit, he's done what this club seems to demand which is to bring instant success. Long may it continue.

 

[UnitedBlade]

Wilder's success is proving that statement to be correct in hindsight. My fear was when we sacked Adkins, the new guy would struggle to hit the ground running and the cycle would be repeated over and over. I thought we needed continuity but to Wilder's credit, he's done what this club seems to demand which is to bring instant success. Long may it continue.

That was my worry and after 4 games it wasn't going well.

After 27 games he has accumulated more points than any other manager in our entire history (I think).

He's ahead of Porterfield after 27 games and I can't believe anyone else competes.

It counts for nothing if the job isn't done I know but what a platform he's given us.

 

[Maidenhead]

Thing is, that is exactly what has happened. We have sold players (proven positive effect on pitch in results and league position) to sustain a contextually positive financial position yet kept the academy (what effect has this had in young players developed to turn it on for us?)



There's no disagreeing Wilder is the catalyst in our success. More by luck than design though. Long may he stay.

That'll all depend on how much is invested into playing staff next year mind.

pommpey

So a successful appointment is luck whilst a bad one is crap judgement and shit management?

I'm blumin glad I never had to work for you

 

[South Bucks]

Thing is, Sean, everyone gets all chubby about 'the new manager'. It all goes the same way:

1. Please make it happen McCabe
2. Yay! Fucking quality! The Blades are going up!
3. Why are we not signing any fucker?
4. Shit start to season. Stay positive.
5. Fuck me. 0-3 to Fleetwood at home in front of 19k
6. Clueless. Fuck's sake. Playoffs, maybe
7. JTW, maybe?
8. Fuck's sake 0-1 to Shrewsbury.
9. Hurray! JTW!
10. What? We've sold our only two good players?
11. "There was nothing we could do. We tore up their contracts and packed their bags. How much? Oh, erm ... look at that plane!"
12. Fuck's sake 1-4 to some other shit team and fourteenth
13. Playoffs - no way
14. Two late signings. One 36 year old midfielder OOC and a full back from Boston Utd. On loan.
15. Late burst. Might make playoffs with snookers.
16. Fail to make playoffs. Finish eigth.
17. Sacked
18. See 1.

I really liked Pompey’s 1) to 18) list, it’s so Sheff United almost every season, but it strikes me there’s an underlying issue each season independent of whoever is manager and that is long term player recruitment.

Pompey’s right we have a tendency to sell a couple of our best players, sometimes understandable, but where it all goes wrong I feel is what we do next. I can just imagine there is a discussion at BDTBL of shall we :

1. Bring in a couple of thirty something championship journey men on low transfer fees but high wages who’s legs have nearly gone but played well earlier in their career, or,
   
   
2. Bring in say 4 young up and coming players for modest fees with potential and who have shown real promise at our league or below. Two or three of them come good eventually, release the others. Bit like the Deane and Agana era.

I can imagine what it’s like, the bean counters and suits at BDTBL all want a) cos like running a corner shop they don’t want to take risks and want instant results so want the safe option. The manager knows b) is a risk and might be better in the long run but knows a) might work short term and keep him in a job a while longer.

The thing I think the club has not been good at in recent years is we have forgotten to succeed at our level you must speculate to accumulate but to do it in a calculated way where you do your homework and choose targets where its heads you win or tails you didn’t lose much and can move them on anyway. The goal being gradual progressive improvement each season.

I’ve seen some of our fans saying “we should be targeting young naturally talented prospects like him” a few times and I agree, not the journeymen. Unfortunately I feel our academy has not brought on enough good players or they get sold on rather quickly which has not helped either.

The fact we have been worse than average at recruitment/development over the longer term for a club of our size almost transcends what any manager does in 12 months in my view and is the bigger elephant standing quietly in the corner of the room. However Madkins would probably have struggled with ten Messi’s.

 

[Woodwardfan]

Sharp?
Baptiste?


Edgar was so-so.

Hammond was poor but we still tended to do better when he played than when he didn’t


Woolford was crap.


I don’t think anyone will argue that Adkins did a particularly good job last season. I would argue that he did a similarly poor job to what most other managers would have done in the difficult circumstances inherited. If he spoke to the press like Chris Wilder does, the fans might have been more patient with him and allowed him a fair crack at getting us up but hey ho, at least we’ve “dropped on” following his sacking.

Sharp wasn't very good last season in a poor team, 6/10 maybe. Understandable

It's hard to play well in a team which included some half-hearted non-tryers. For example, I'll never forgive Coutts for last season having seen what he can do when he tries. I honestly thought he had physical restrictions which hampered his training and his stamina. As it turns out he can play in his way for 90 minutes.

Evans was the same under Adams and Blackwell.

Look what Clough did with what he inherited in his first season.

Despite most of us thinking he was a good choice as manager , he more or less demotivated the side. I hear of cliques in the dressing room when he was here but he didn't sort it. In comparison to the short time Wilder has been here, Adkins was an abject failure.

He defended Hammond week in week out, despite his legs having gone. Unseen work etc. we went from a stubborn man in Clough to some waffle merchant quoting management guru books whilst it seemed some players did what they wanted while he went on about geese. There was virtually no team spirit on the pitch and he never got to grips with it. Now we have Wilder with a much less impressive cv who's shaken things up at all levels.

For me Adkins tenure is up there with the worst. The wrong fit argument doesn't work for me. When the crunch came, he wasn't up to it.

Sean you do know a bit about football then.

But what do we know? I put a big bet on us to be promoted as soon as I heard of Adkins appointment. As the season unfolded I knew full well, probably by October actually. Sobering. But, I would have appointed him too.

 

[BushBlade]

I really liked Pompey’s 1) to 18) list, it’s so Sheff United almost every season, but it strikes me there’s an underlying issue each season independent of whoever is manager and that is long term player recruitment.

Pompey’s right we have a tendency to sell a couple of our best players, sometimes understandable, but where it all goes wrong I feel is what we do next. I can just imagine there is a discussion at BDTBL of shall we :

1. Bring in a couple of thirty something championship journey men on low transfer fees but high wages who’s legs have nearly gone but played well earlier in their career, or,
   
   
2. Bring in say 4 young up and coming players for modest fees with potential and who have shown real promise at our league or below. Two or three of them come good eventually, release the others. Bit like the Deane and Agana era.

I can imagine what it’s like, the bean counters and suits at BDTBL all want a) cos like running a corner shop they don’t want to take risks and want instant results so want the safe option. The manager knows b) is a risk and might be better in the long run but knows a) might work short term and keep him in a job a while longer.

The thing I think the club has not been good at in recent years is we have forgotten to succeed at our level you must speculate to accumulate but to do it in a calculated way where you do your homework and choose targets where its heads you win or tails you didn’t lose much and can move them on anyway. The goal being gradual progressive improvement each season.

I’ve seen some of our fans saying “we should be targeting young naturally talented prospects like him” a few times and I agree, not the journeymen. Unfortunately I feel our academy has not brought on enough good players or they get sold on rather quickly which has not helped either.

The fact we have been worse than average at recruitment/development over the longer term for a club of our size almost transcends what any manager does in 12 months in my view and is the bigger elephant standing quietly in the corner of the room. However Madkins would probably have struggled with ten Messi’s.

I agree. The balance of the type of players we've signed has been too much in favour of players with little resale value so too much money is 'spent' and not enough invested.

I think that's changing now due to CW's input, bringing in Paul Mitchell who seems a very thorough and dedicated scout, and looking to bring more players in on an upward trajectory, not the ones on a downward slope that we've tended to sign in the past.

 

[Woodwardfan]

Clough deserved a second season though Dane. Adkins, IMO, didn't. Thank God.

Clough had half a season and then a second season and it was a shambles.

 

[Woodwardfan]

I agree. The balance of the type of players we've signed has been too much in favour of players with little resale value so too much money is 'spent' and not enough invested.

I think that's changing now due to CW's input, bringing in Paul Mitchell who seems a very thorough and dedicated scout, and looking to bring more players in on an upward trajectory, not the ones on a downward slope that we've tended to sign in the past.

Scouts matter OK?!!

 

[Sean Thornton]

Clough had half a season and then a second season and it was a shambles.

The half season was good enough to earn him a second. My point was not that the second season was good, but that Adkins didnt deserve a second season irrespective of what he inherited.

 

[Esablade]

The factor that hasn't been mentioned in this little scenario so far, is that before Princey came along and chucked some cash at it, McCabe was going on about the club living within its means, standing on its own two feet previously..

IMO, Princey coming along enabled the culture of high wages/expensive managers to continue....I guess there's a certain arrogance at the club also.

We'll see whether it pays off in the long run and whether he's got the cash to back to the next level if we're promoted.

 

[JohnDenver]

The factor that hasn't been mentioned in this little scenario so far, is that before Princey came along and chucked some cash at it, McCabe was going on about the club living within its means, standing on its own two feet previously..

IMO, Princey coming along enabled the culture of high wages/expensive managers to continue....I guess there's a certain arrogance at the club also.

We'll see whether it pays off in the long run and whether he's got the cash to back to the next level if we're promoted.

If Princey hadn't come along we might be in the bottom division as that's where Weir and the living within our means masterplan was taking us. I'm grateful to the daft bugger for chucking cash at it.

If we go up this year the cost of competing again next year will be huge. No idea if Princey is that daft....

 

[Esablade]

If Princey hadn't come along we might be in the bottom division as that's where Weir and the living within our means masterplan was taking us. I'm grateful to the daft bugger for chucking cash at it.

If we go up this year the cost of competing again next year will be huge. No idea if Princey is that daft....

Do you reckon?

It's all so much speculation, but IMO, the club needed gutting and rebuilding to get out of this league ( similar to what's happening this season)

Weir would've been gone whatever, clearly out of his depth....we'd have done better with some 'grafter' L1 manager than McCabe/Princey being star-struck by 'name managers'...

All easy in hindsight though eh?

UTB!

 

[JohnDenver]

Do you reckon?

It's all so much speculation, but IMO, the club needed gutting and rebuilding to get out of this league ( similar to what's happening this season)

Weir would've been gone whatever, clearly out of his depth....we'd have done better with some 'grafter' L1 manager than McCabe/Princey being star-struck by 'name managers'...

All easy in hindsight though eh?

UTB!

Sure, I'm just looking at it from the point of view that Clough's first season was exemplary and only possible with the Prince's cash. Obviously things went south after that, but the mistakes were managerial even if the board always take ultimate responsibility.

 

[northsomersetblade]

Sammon Woolford Hammond. Without whom we might have been playing Rotherham.

Fuck me. For a minute I though I read Gentile, Rossi and Tardelli

 

[Sean Thornton]

Fuck me. For a minute I though I read Gentile, Rossi and Tardelli

You can get Tosser, Genital and with a u instead of an i, Turd. So it loses nothing in translation.

 

[northsomersetblade]

Billy Sharp is our Roger Wylde.

I'll get me coat

 

[pommpey]

So a successful appointment is luck whilst a bad one is crap judgement and shit management?

I'm blumin glad I never had to work for you

How many shots have we had at making a successful appointment? How many managers have been here since the last fleeting brush with the top flight? How many have made a pigs arse of it? How many have mysteriously been sacked? Do you know why Blackwell went? What about Wilson?

I am still unconvinced we won't sell players, right up until the last seconds of 31 Jan 2017. I am unconvinced Wilder will be here next year. McCabe is an unpredictable catalyst in an equally unpredictable situation. I felt better with Bassett and his situation with the board back then than I do with Wilder and McCabe right now.

I don't trust McCabe any further than I could throw him.

pommpey

 

[Bert]

I am still unconvinced we won't sell players, right up until the last seconds of 31 Jan 2017

Ten days to go.

 

[northsomersetblade]

How many shots have we had at making a successful appointment? How many managers have been here since the last fleeting brush with the top flight? How many have made a pigs arse of it? How many have mysteriously been sacked? Do you know why Blackwell went? What about Wilson?

I am still unconvinced we won't sell players, right up until the last seconds of 31 Jan 2017. I am unconvinced Wilder will be here next year. McCabe is an unpredictable catalyst in an equally unpredictable situation. I felt better with Bassett and his situation with the board back then than I do with Wilder and McCabe right now.

I don't trust McCabe any further than I could throw him.

pommpey

I think even McNumbnuts realises he's stumbled onto the golden goose....he will fuck with him at his peril...

 

[1danewhitehouse]

Sharp wasn't very good last season in a poor team, 6/10 maybe. Understandable

It's hard to play well in a team which included some half-hearted non-tryers. For example, I'll never forgive Coutts for last season having seen what he can do when he tries. I honestly thought he had physical restrictions which hampered his training and his stamina. As it turns out he can play in his way for 90 minutes.

Evans was the same under Adams and Blackwell.



Sean you do know a bit about football then.

But what do we know? I put a big bet on us to be promoted as soon as I heard of Adkins appointment. As the season unfolded I knew full well, probably by October actually. Sobering. But, I would have appointed him too.

6/10 for Sharp? Scoring 21? goals in a team that was pretty poor. I'd say that's a good effort.

 

[Woodwardfan]

6/10 for Sharp? Scoring 21? goals in a team that was pretty poor. I'd say that's a good effort.

Fair point Dane. To this day we have not found Sharp an effective front partner and that bothers me. It's not just about goals by one man it's a team game. At least this season Wilder has got midfielders and defenders threatening goals all the time and it's less of an issue. Last season Billy was isolated and therefore played a role which he can't really do that well.

I hope Lavery is our present day Andy Keogh who I reckon might be Sharp's last really effective striker partner. This season I rate Sharp an 8/10 at this stage which is a good number. If he forges an effective partnership with Lavery or Clarke then we'll have cracked it. Of course it doesn't matter that much in the easier games but it will against the best teams and even the negative teams when they 'park the bus'.

 

[Bladesman]

I think even McNumbnuts realises he's stumbled onto the golden goose....he will fuck with him at his peril...

If Wilder gets messed around by McCabe he will probably walk. I don't think he will tolerate any McCabe bullshit.

 

[pommpey]

Ten days to go.

Pommpey has his fingers crossed.

Pommpey is happy with this team, a bit disappointed if we didn't strengthen especially for Sharp (because that is where our points are coming from) and if he is crocked we might regret not making a purchase.

If we don't sell, pommpey might just start believing.

pommpey

 

[Bert]

If we don't sell, pommpey might just start believing.

Highly unlikely.

Eighty minutes of domination today, playing a very attractive passing game which wouldn't be possible without the aid of a first class surface.

 

[pommpey]

Highly unlikely.

Eighty minutes of domination today, playing a very attractive passing game which wouldn't be possible without the aid of a first class surface.

Pommpey believes he has seen Sheffield United dominate for the whole ninety minutes and beat the opposition on playing surfaces no better than he used to play on at Herdings Park.

We drew today, giving up a one nil lead to be trailing 2-1 on the Desso pitch.

Sorry ... what was Bert's point again?

pommpey

 

[Bert]

Pommpey believes he has seen Sheffield United dominate for the whole ninety minutes

Which game was that which you believe you saw?

 

[Bartyblade]

Pommpey believes he has seen Sheffield United dominate for the whole ninety minutes and beat the opposition on playing surfaces no better than he used to play on at Herdings Park.

We drew today, giving up a one nil lead to be trailing 2-1 on the Desso pitch.

Sorry ... what was Bert's point again?

pommpey

You might have seen them dominate - but you've NEVER seen any Blades side pass the ball around like we're doing this season!!!!