Strong league/Weak league

[tomtheblade]

Championship this season: Strong or weak division?

What does everyone think?

To elaborate: I hear this description a lot, but I honestly am never sure what people mean by it. Sometimes I think it's judged by how good the teams at the top are, therefore last year was a strong division because of the quality shown by Newcastle and Brighton. But this doesn't indicate a strong division, it just shows the top teams are better than the ones immediately below them.

A strong division is surely one in which every team is as good as possible, which would mean it's fairly even with teams beating each other or drawing a lot, and no-one running away with it. The trouble in this case is how you would tell it was all equally strong teams and not equally weak teams.

Perhaps it's not useful to evaluate a league's strength internally, you have to do it by comparing to other leagues. Therefore we could say that last years championship was fairly strong, with the 3 promoted sides currently comfortably midtable or above, and the relegated sides in or around the playoffs or auto spots in the league below.

However, going by this method, we won't know how strong the current year is until next year. But that's no fun, so we have to think of other ways in which we can judge. One way would be looking at results from Carabao/FA cups and seeing how Champ teams fare against other sides, except for the fact that we know how much sides from both leagues change for cup games, making them not always the best indicators of relative teams strength.

The other way I've thought of is the more ambiguous method of just watching a lot of championship games and judging not by results, but simply by the level of play of the teams involved. Does the match that finishes 2-2 between two midtable sides involve intricate passing moves, stalwart defending and individual moments of brilliance? Or were all the goals results of both teams hopelessly hoofing it up and hoping it goes in off someone's backside?

TL;DR version:
Is the 2017/18 Championship a strong division in terms of quality? If so, why, or why not? And how do we judge what constitutes 'strong'?

 

[ForgeBlade]

Pre-season it was better than la liga. Now it's the weakest it's been for years. We know this as the sages at porktalk have told us it's true.

 

[Stretch]

Quite simple really.

When we win it's a weak league, when the Pig's win it's a strong league.

I know this is true because 900,000 brainwashed idiots from Chapletown told me so.

 

[Ricky]

I still think it's a strong division in terms of squad quality. What's surprised me a bit is how so many teams fail to get the best out of their players. It shows us not to underestimate how much we've got going for us. We're a genuine team. I'm not sure too many others are.

 

[Digger]

I still think it's a strong division in terms of squad quality. What's surprised me a bit is how so many teams fail to get the best out of their players. It shows us not to underestimate how much we've got going for us. We're a genuine team. I'm not sure too many others are.

I see players from the opposition that look better than we have individually but they don't seem to gel somehow.
Credit to Sir Christopher

 

[tomtheblade]

I still think it's a strong division in terms of squad quality. What's surprised me a bit is how so many teams fail to get the best out of their players. It shows us not to underestimate how much we've got going for us. We're a genuine team. I'm not sure too many others are.

Yeah I would agree with this. I think consistency is key, and there are many teams in the Championship who have a strong side with skillful individuals, but struggle to consistently turn out good performances, either separately or as a collective, week in week out. I think this is where, so far, we have an advantage.

 

[1066blade]

We lose to QPR, shitty Forest then hammer them 4-0 ?

 

[1066blade]

We lose at home to Norwich, a week after shity Millwall hammered them 4-0 ?

You tell me guys.

 

[3-GBlade]

Wendy win = La Liga/ Serie A

United win = La Unibonda

 

[PokerBlade]

When we were in the Prem it was every week you'd read a name on the opposition team shit and think, shit, I wish we could afford a player like that. It's not that bad in the Championship, of course, but there's more than a few teams where you look at players in their squads and have to wonder just how good we'd be if Wilder could get hold of one or two. Thing is, as we showed in League One, one or two outstanding players don't compensate for a poor squad and poor tactics. Adkins had by far the best striker in the division in Sharp and that was nowhere near enough to make up for the rest of the dross in the team. Even Clough had players like Brayford, Freeman, Coutts, who all in retrospect are capable of Championship football (at the very least two of those strolled to a hundred points in a Blades shirt).

It was clear last season that along with a few quality players you also need a group of utterly dependable, hard working, teammates around them. It's the players like Basham and Wright that might not have stolen the headlines very often but were an almost guaranteed 7/10 performance every week. If we've had an edge so far in this division it's come from that consistent base to build upon. Fortunately, we might be starting to see some Championship stars of our own emerge to go with them. I imagine plenty have watched us and been a bit envious of JOC and Fleck.

And the other thing is, we're going out to win games, even if it means getting caught out. We've lost more games than anyone else in the top six but only Wolves have as many wins. So many teams in situations like the Leeds or Wednesday games, where it was brought back level away from home, would've gone more defensive and been happy to hold on to a point. Not us. We make attacking subs and when we go a goal up in games like today we try to kill it off with another goal.

I think I've only seen two poor performances. One was Bolton away, the other QPR. The Bolton game we rested a few and they made it a miserable affair, the QPR game a bizarre gift of a goal and a couple of golden chances missed were the only difference.

Consistency is the key in this division right now. Our performances in general are good enough. The only question is whether we can sustain this standard.

 

[Melbourne Blade]

It's not that's its strong or weak I'd more describe it as having a lot of "big" clubs who have simply become stale. Eg your Ipswich, Birmingham, wolves, qpr, Leeds etc. Clubs coming up can prove to be a difficult challenge as they may be fresh hungry and offer something a little different. Unfortunately a lot of the bigger clubs think throwing money at big players will guarantee success which we know is bullshit.

 

[SwissBlade]

Not sure if its Strong or Weak, but its a tough league. One thing Wednesday fans said last season was that it was tough. Everyone beats everyone, not sure its like La Liga as they apparently stated, but its a tough division and one thing is clear is that if you get a decent run together you will be up there. Considering the pigs have been shit this season, 2 wins has put them within 2 points of 6th from 16th last weekend, it shows how tight it is.

Results this last week show that anyone can beat anyone. There isn't so far a dominant side (we're 2nd having already lost 5).

The other thing in our favour is that we always play to win, there is no consolidating for a draw in this side. Might mean that sometimes we lose when we could scrape a draw but generally we are an attacking side. Three of those defeats have been 1-0 and one defeat by a goal (2-1 to forest). Only Cardiff has been by 2 goals. Each of those games, perhaps except Cardiff (and possibly Boro where we were a little overawed and not match sharp) we were the dominant side for much of the game.

Since Barnsley we've gathered confidence and some big wins have shown that we are not only able to compete, but dominate games. That's a big plus. Much of the time sides can't handle us. All these things give us an edge.

We play with the handbrake off as Wilder says.

 

[sheffielder]

I say this with as much respect as I can, but not many teams play with heart or any desire. Hull was just another team unable to keep up with us. In the last 20 minutes their legs were gone. When the pigs equalised but there were still 20 minutes to go. It's relentless and what we have over many teams is experience of winning games consistently which we have taken on from last year.

What is becoming clear is that we need someone to compete properly with Coutts and Fleck and then this league is for the taking. Premier League giants who have young players not getting game on loan in the premier league will be looking at us in January.

 

[SwissBlade]

I say this with as much respect as I can, but not many teams play with heart or any desire. Hull was just another team unable to keep up with us. In the last 20 minutes their legs were gone. When the pigs equalised but there were still 20 minutes to go. It's relentless and what we have over many teams is experience of winning games consistently which we have taken on from last year.

What is becoming clear is that we need someone to compete properly with Coutts and Fleck and then this league is for the taking. Premier League giants who have young players not getting game on loan in the premier league will be looking at us in January.

And Duffy for that matter, but arguably Brooks is the man to play that role

 

[Carlton Blade]

Teams look much more capable of breaking against us than last year. Keepers are much better. I think the league is as strong as it always is. It's just some of the teams who were expected to be good based solely on reputation have either disappointed (Boro, Villa, Fulham) or are in fact an utter mess (Sunderland, Hull, Birmingham).

 

[alcoblade]

I still think it's a strong division in terms of squad quality. What's surprised me a bit is how so many teams fail to get the best out of their players. It shows us not to underestimate how much we've got going for us. We're a genuine team. I'm not sure too many others are.

Or are these players nearly as good as the inflated salaries and fees suggest?

I suspect not.

 

[Punk Blade]

I think as players’ fitness, and coaching techniques and facilities keep improving, the standard at every level on the pyramid will keep going up. The quality of players in the Championship is creeping up (I was shocked Hull signed Grosicki when they were destined for relegation, I have no idea what he’s still doing there), but the number of teams full of talented individuals led by experienced managers underperforming to the extent they are is staggering.

We have been fantastic so far and I can’t praise the players and the management enough, but a small part of where we are must be down to the poor effort and mismanagement elsewhere. Or are we really that good?

 

[JimPhipps]

Championship this season: Strong or weak division?

Perhaps it's not useful to evaluate a league's strength internally, you have to do it by comparing to other leagues. Therefore we could say that last years championship was fairly strong, with the 3 promoted sides currently comfortably midtable or above, and the relegated sides in or around the playoffs or auto spots in the league below.

This method (which works like the scoring of strikes in bowling), though perhaps less fun and more slow to develop a clear picture, has the value of not being subject to the subjectivity and self-aggrandizement of the beholder. Deluded Wendies will always be put in their place by this method.

 

[sheffielder]

And Duffy for that matter, but arguably Brooks is the man to play that role

Brooks is a second striker. For me I wouldn't play him in the Duffy role, well at least not yet.

 

[8lade]

The only people this really matters to (once again) are Wednesday fans and if they were at the top I don't think they'd care either. It's their justification for not being top of the league and why they haven't found the cure for cancer yet. Wilder's approach seems to be, 'is it a hard league or an easy league? I don't know let's just smash it.'

 

[Ldn_Rd_Blades]

Clough was on the tv Friday night saying this season is a lot stronger than last. That could be because he's getting tonked every week though.

The players, albeit vastly overpriced players, are good.

Go me it's the fashion for this's sterile, build from the back, keep possession at all cost football that we were subjected to by weir, Clough and Adkins.

They're all at it and it's shit. Thank god for tuftyball.

 

[SteveBlade]

It's full of players who made a few appearances for shit Premier League teams and were let go by said shit Premier League teams and bought for millions by Championship clubs because they played for shit Premier League teams

 

[Captain]

Strong league when you look at some of the squads, Villa, Borough and Derby, full of big name players......trouble is their in the twilight of the career taking big money and taking the piss.....we have a squad of players who respect the team they play for respect the manager and respect the badge of Sheffield United and it’s supporters.

 

[Bellypork]

I'm cloven-hooved, but I don't think it's a weak league. It's just that the teams which you would expect to be up at the top, namely the parachute clubs, aren't. At least not yet.

There are strong similarities between the Blades this season, and the Owls two seasons ago. The difference is that that season the parachute clubs were at the top from the off, and stayed there all season.

I'll say of United what I said of Wednesday two years ago, when some Owls fans had got the league won. Let's wait until the second half of the season to make a value judgement. Energy levels fall, the pressure starts to mount due to raised expectations, you're playing opponents for the second time so they're more wise to you, and you're less underestimated.

Wilder needs backing in Jan.

 

[blade too long]

the top 2 teams look very strong
the rest have weaknesses

 

[Ldn_Rd_Blades]

I'm cloven-hooved, but I don't think it's a weak league. It's just that the teams which you would expect to be up at the top, namely the parachute clubs, aren't. At least not yet.

There are strong similarities between the Blades this season, and the Owls two seasons ago. The difference is that that season the parachute clubs were at the top from the off, and stayed there all season.

I'll say of United what I said of Wednesday two years ago, when some Owls fans had got the league won. Let's wait until the second half of the season to make a value judgement. Energy levels fall, the pressure starts to mount due to raised expectations, you're playing opponents for the second time so they're more wise to you, and you're less underestimated.

Wilder needs backing in Jan.

Wednesday were 9th after 16 games that season.

 

[metalblade]

Same as it has always been a close league, any team with a little bit extra will do well. I think the speed of thought is a level up from league one ( I think we took 4 games to get up to speed) better quality players but I think the tactics and management have at times been poor. The latest tactic against us seems to be sit back and try to break quickly by knocking long balls over our 3 centre backs, seen as much kick and run this season as I did last, I expected better in La Liga. From what I have seen so far we have as much chance as anyone for a top two spot, Wolves obviously will be favourites having spent around £40m, Villa and a few more have spent big but so far it isn't showing the top 4 teams are where they are on merit the rest are still off the pace.

 

[McGrath]

I think it's strong.

No team is getting an easy ride. Take your foot off the peddle and you get beat.

 

[grafikhaus]

It's not that's its strong or weak I'd more describe it as having a lot of "big" clubs who have simply become stale. Eg your Ipswich, Birmingham, wolves, qpr, Leeds etc. Clubs coming up can prove to be a difficult challenge as they may be fresh hungry and offer something a little different. Unfortunately a lot of the bigger clubs think throwing money at big players will guarantee success which we know is bullshit.

Good point(s), but I think it all pivots on how good the manager is in terms of tactics, motivation, fitness etc. That's why younger managers tend to enthuse their teams better - Eddie Howe, Wagner, Klopp, Wilder etc. As in every profession, you get stale and set in your ways which is why Pulis, McCarthy, Allardyce etc. have had their day. A good/bad manager is far more influential than individual players. That's why Coutts looks a very good player for Wilder and looked poor under Badkins. It's no coincidence that Leon Clarke is having the best spell of his career, and why idiot fans (Wolves, Wendy etc.) keep whining 'Why didn't he do it for us?' The answer is staring them in the face.

 

[Bellypork]

Wednesday were 9th after 16 games that season.

I meant more the style of play, lack of pressure, being underestimated and an unknown quantity. Carlos changed tack once it mattered.

Wednesday didn't have the start that the Blades have had, but there again they'd signed 15 players and were still signing them after the season began.