Requirements for staying up

[alcoblade]

I will make constructive comments based on what I see if I think parts of their game needs work. As I have done with both Ched and Walker.

Out of interest, which part of Ched's game doesn't need work?



UTB

 

[lenners]

It's irrelevant in terms of the player's ability and form which is what we were discussing. The pros and cons of the finance is a different matter, not something which should be used to beat the player with.

Of course it matters. The performances of Lowton, for example, are judged differently from a £3m pound player.
And you can be very sure that McCabe and co will be judging him on the basis he's cost us between £4m and £5m all told.

 

[Jim Chimmerney]

Out of interest, which part of Ched's game doesn't need work?



UTB

People laughed when Blackwell said Ched was a 'development' player and one for the future. Speed has said already that he has a lot to learn and most on here have said the same thing. OK he's played international football which people will say precludes him from criticism on the experience front but he's 21 and only started 50 league games in his career.

I admit to have expected better things last season but for several reasons it didn't happen but he now has a chance, with a different manager and coach who obviously want to play a different way, to kick start his career. Despite what people have said, I think he's already shown up more under Speed than he did under Blackwell so why not just see how things go over the next 10-15 games. With a bit of luck he could have 3 or 4 goals in the last 2 games and what a difference that would have made.

 

[MunXy]

well personally i believe the one and indeed only requirement for staying up is.......*drum roll*...scoring more points than at least 3 other teams in our division
as for ched causing us to go down, what utter bullshit, a striker hitting the post will not cause us to go down, 3 strikers being unable to score a goal between them might but only if the back four defend so badly as to allow (lets face it) a 3rd teir team to put 4 past us at home. c'mon against qpr, i believe our worst home defeat in god knows how long was at least against one of the promotion favourites and an inform team, ffs even scunny fans wouldnt bet against them going down.
our defence last night was woeful on the whole BUT as i said in shout box last night what the team even now lacks is a little belief and confidence.
If we can cultivate that in my opinion we WILL climb the table and win promotion, after all we do have the best and most loyal fans in the country (probably)

MunXy

 

[Jim Chimmerney]

Of course it matters. The performances of Lowton, for example, are judged differently from a £3m pound player.
And you can be very sure that McCabe and co will be judging him on the basis he's cost us between £4m and £5m all told.

So from a playing point of view, you basically give a player who cost nothing plenty of leeway yet don't afford the same luxury to a player who cost a decent fee despite being a similar age when the player himself has no control over the fee ? The fact is, we paid well over the odds for Ched purely because he came from a Premiership club. That's not his fault nor should it affect the way we judge his ability IMO.

 

[alcoblade]

People laughed when Blackwell said Ched was a 'development' player and one for the future. Speed has said already that he has a lot to learn and most on here have said the same thing. OK he's played international football which people will say precludes him from criticism on the experience front but he's 21 and only started 50 league games in his career.

I admit to have expected better things last season but for several reasons it didn't happen but he now has a chance, with a different manager and coach who obviously want to play a different way, to kick start his career. Despite what people have said, I think he's already shown up more under Speed than he did under Blackwell so why not just see how things go over the next 10-15 games. With a bit of luck he could have 3 or 4 goals in the last 2 games and what a difference that would have made.

I just don't get it. Why another 10 - 15 games? Why not try someone else who outscored Ched by 4 - 1 last season in a poor side and who's sat on our bench right now? The job isn't to let Ched prove himself, it's to better Sheffield United.

UTB

 

[alcoblade]

So from a playing point of view, you basically give a player who cost nothing plenty of leeway yet don't afford the same luxury to a player who cost a decent fee despite being a similar age when the player himself has no control over the fee ? The fact is, we paid well over the odds for Ched purely because he came from a Premiership club. That's not his fault nor should it affect the way we judge his ability IMO.

But you seem happy not to judge him on 5 goals in 42 appearances - surely even more of a sticky wicket to defend?

UTB

 

[Jim Chimmerney]

I just don't get it. Why another 10 - 15 games?

Because we are now playing football on the deck and trying to create chances for the strikers, something that didn't happen last season.

 

[Jim Chimmerney]

But you seem happy not to judge him on 5 goals in 42 appearances - surely even more of a sticky wicket to defend?

UTB

He was disappointing last season as I have said elsewhere but so were the whole team. This season is a different story and there's no doubt he has a better chance of succeeding and has already been more involved and had more chances under Speed. Some will not be able to look further than his overall record for us, fair enough, all I'm doing is expressing my opinion that he's worth a few more games under this regime playing this style before we write him off.

 

[alcoblade]

He was disappointing last season as I have said elsewhere but so were the whole team. This season is a different story and there's no doubt he has a better chance of succeeding and has already been more involved and had more chances under Speed. Some will not be able to look further than his overall record for us, fair enough, all I'm doing is expressing my opinion that he's worth a few more games under this regime playing this style before we write him off.

15 games takes us half way through this season. Far too forgiving for me given that, as I said, his probable replacement outscored him by 400% last season in a poorer team. I'm tired of excuse after excuse for him. Though we created little last season, we also learned that Evans is incapable of creating anything for himself - so we know we need to now put it on a plate for him at the very least.


UTB

 

[Jim Chimmerney]

15 games takes us half way through this season. Far too forgiving for me given that, as I said, his probable replacement outscored him by 400% last season in a poorer team. I'm tired of excuse after excuse for him. Though we created little last season, we also learned that Evans is incapable of creating anything for himself - so we know we need to now put it on a plate for him at the very least.


UTB

If he's presented with 2 or 3 decent chances every game and doesn't take them he won't make 15 games and I've no problem with that. I believe that if he's presented with 2 to 3 decent chances in the next few games he'll start taking them and if that's the case, we no longer have a problem

I'm not saying stick with him regardless, I'm saying that I think he'll come good playing the way we are now so shouldn't be dropped just yet.

 

[Trigger Blade]

You were probably one of the people that was saying we were going to get relegated last season when we had that really bad run around October/November.

Of course he did, but he really peaked in our promotion season.

We won at Cardiff and had a 12 point lead over Leeds, who had 4 games left to play and len was still convinced we wouldn't make it

 

[Highbury_Blade]

Of course he did, but he really peaked in our promotion season.

We won at Cardiff and had a 12 point lead over Leeds, who had 4 games left to play and len was still convinced we wouldn't make it

TBH Neither was i!

 

[Nick Jansky]

I'm wondering if he's another Billy Sharp or Clive Mendonca who is a decent player, but somehow can't do it for us. I wish Ched all the best, and hope he goes somewhere else & scores a hatful of goals, but there does come a point at which patience starts to give, and he's not really done it. A club in our position can't pay that much for a development player. If we can get him out & free up some of the wage bill, I would. We all wanted him to succeed here, but I think its time to say he hasn't. And I think a move would be good for him as well.

 

[lenners]

So from a playing point of view, you basically give a player who cost nothing plenty of leeway yet don't afford the same luxury to a player who cost a decent fee despite being a similar age when the player himself has no control over the fee ? The fact is, we paid well over the odds for Ched purely because he came from a Premiership club. That's not his fault nor should it affect the way we judge his ability IMO.

Darn right you do. It's the same in every walk of life. Get paid shedloads more than other people in the same profession and more is expected of you.
Feeling sorry for a bloke who'll be on around £15,000 a week (please don't let it be more) and has done sod all for it is ridiculous.
He would have been more than happy to press for what he thought he was worth when it came to the transfer.

 

[raul]

It might not be fair Fleety, but life isn't is it? He's taking the big salary that comes with the big rep, he has to deliver. It's not as black and white as goals scored daft as it sounds - he's played exclusively in a poor side after all - but the back up contributions in terms of all round play are equally disappointing.

Sorry Ched, you need to start producing now. Your employers need you to.

 

[SteelCity Blade]

Sorry Ched, you need to start producing now. Your employers need you to.

As much as I see great potential in the lad and as much as I'm prepared to defend him.....I have to agree with you. He needs to start giving us a return on the investment now. Like you said its not being harsh on him, its simply a cold hard fact that we need him to produce and we cant wait forever.

I genuinely think he will, but "when" is the issue. Ive said before that based on our supporters opinion we havent really got serious alternatives to Ched, so our only choice is to persist with him at the moment but that wont go on forever.

I just want him to prove the majority wrong and the minority (including me) right.

 

[Guesty]

I think the majority want to be proved wrong, Steel!

 

[super_pig]

as someone else posted .. he needs his own song.. pronto.. get onto it lads. immediately (i shit you not btw)

 

[raul]

He had one. About scoring goals and taking us to the Premiership. Don't hear it very often these days.

 

[super_pig]

heh.. i've never heard it at all