Port Vale match report

[Fulwood Blade]

For all those saying Basham's red card wasn't then either look at this jpg image or go and freeze frame the sky video clip from the game.

Yes, it was 50-50 - most of these challenges normally are, but one always ends up being late - Basham was late - he takes Brown's leg out smack on the calf - as clear a red card as you would want to see - how the ref and lines men saw it is beyond me as you can only see it in slow mo.

UTB

 

[Deadbat]

United have tried to overturn it but it has been upheld.

I think some refs would have gone yellow and some would have gone red. Watching the replay it seemed harsh but the above picture is enough evidence to suggest why it maybe was red.

It was two committed players but sadly Basham got the man and was high. Brown's reaction was disappointing but then he did it many times for us and led to red cards aplenty for opponents. He is a cynical, niggly so and so who can make refs decisions harder by his antics but we loved it when he did it for us.

As with Harris, stupid to leave his feet in the way he did though. It was a challenge that could have led to what it did and helped lead to us losing the game.

 

[finlaytheblade]

Have you seen it on the video from another post?

Both Basham and Brown lunged in - the difference with Basham, and you can see it very clearly if you freeze frame the action, is that Bashams FULL weight of his right boot makes contact with Browns leg above the ankle - whilst I was thoroughly pissed off with the challenge at the time, the replay shows the ref got it spot on correct.

UTB

cant agree fulwood apart from the ref not getting a clear view from his position both players stretched for the ball and it was hobsons choice who came off worse.If you remember from his blades days he was a real wind up merchant (cheat if you like
but most blades loved him) yesterday he came back to bite us on the bum and ime not surprised he,s even done things like that in premier league .Basham is not the most gifted of players but he is a genuine pro something brown never has been once a cheat always a cheat'.

 

[Fulwood Blade]

cant agree fulwood apart from the ref not getting a clear view from his position both players stretched for the ball and it was hobsons choice who came off worse.If you remember from his blades days he was a real wind up merchant (cheat if you like
but most blades loved him) yesterday he came back to bite us on the bum and ime not surprised he,s even done things like that in premier league .Basham is not the most gifted of players but he is a genuine pro something brown never has been once a cheat always a cheat'.

All I would like you to do, is say the still from the video clip (above) is incorrect - the saying is the camera never lies, and it doesn't appear to in this case - perhaps you think there are mitigating circumstances? Brown being a wind up merchant - agree totally - also agree that the ref couldn't possibly have clearly seen the challenge, his view was covered. Brown milked it? possibly and if that was the case then he and his PV mates got a win bonus.

The refs play by different rules and hobsons choice is not answer - tell that to Coventry's Busst who broke his leg and never played again.

I don't actually disagree with challenges like that, but out of the two players who do it and gets it wrong then a red card will probably follow - it how the rules are now, and it ultimately cost us not 1 point, but probably 3 points. If I was Clough I would lay the blame on no points at Bashams door, in the same way that Higdon doing a similar rash challenge v Chezzer also resulted in zero points.

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[Woodwardfan]

I will answer your questions, especially after the day we had yesterday.

The time is 12.30pm on Saturday afternoon and I have just rolled in from PV.

Got back to Sheffield at 11.30pm and abandoned the car at Crookes - couldn't get back up above the snow line to Fulwood, but walked to my nippers at Broomhill - thanks to the LACK of fucking gritter lorries between PV and Sheffield - now that is the first fucking disgrace. To all of you rear wheeled drive BMW drivers - idiots - it is you lot that cause most of the trouble in the white stuff, and especially to the Maserati driver at the top of the A38 who had only had his car 1 month - unlucky...that's what you get with rear wheel drive in snow!

Anyway your questions - answered from a continued supporter and I suppose a committed optimist, as I refuse to be a pessimist - life is just too short for gall half empty.
1) Automatic - no, think that is obvious. Have posted before and will post it again for all the ones who INSIST Basham and Mceverly at centre half - they will never EVER be good enough - nice and skilful both of them, but our CORE strength is sadly lacking in abundance. If they were good enough to be centre halves they would have been discovered before now. Playoffs - definitely. We will get better.

2) Yes to money and as above 2 x centre halves please. I reckon Doyle is an issue - plays great in a 5 man, is useless in a 4 and to play 2 up from any teams must really play 4 in midfield. Having said that think Doyle ahs been very very good, so it's a dilemma.

3) Difficult to say - rumour has it that agents are not allowing their stars to drop down - the 1st division is now massively away from the Championship in terms of money/fees etc - possibly due to FFP. My opinion is we may have to gamble on loans.

4) Play Offs - think this time we would win - the playoffs is a "CUP" scenario, and Clough appears to be able to win these battles, so would at last hope to win in one. As my nipper has said, eventually we will win one.

5) This forum has it's fair share of pessimists - normally very vocal after a LOSS - ie: PV. I didn't think we were too bad at PV - what concerns me the most is our centre halves -we are just not ruthless, uncompromising and to be blunt - fucking hard - we should have tough, bit, strong centre halves and let the fancy dans up front play the football. We actually need 2 x Chirs Morgans.

Again on the cynics - it is a free forum/board to discuss what is wrong, yet YOUR opening gambit is to have yet ANOTHER pop at the board.

To finish, yes the squad is lacking in talent in certain areas, for me Baxter is lazy, and Scougal is just on continued borrowed time creating nothing and scoring none. We need to play 5 to accommodate Doyle which means we are short up top, but having said that COG was absolutely magnificent yesterday, but he needs Mcnuts with him.

We just need to keep trying, but it is difficult for us all - including Clough and glad to see you still have faith in him.

UTB

How about 3-5-2 with your man Basham in midfield? Ideal for our current squad.

How about Collins and Butler as a central defensive pairing in a back 4 if we have to have that.?

Do you think Clough knows where he is at the moment? Isn't he behaving strangely and even at this stage of the season do you think he has any idea what his best team is?

Would you give him more money to spend in January? You have been one of Clough's staunchest supporters but I sense a change of tone recently. Would you give him another year if we go and lose in the play-off lottery, if we qualify which should not be taken for granted.

Do you hope tomorrow's game is called off like I do. I'm up to here with them at present.

 

[Bergen Blade]

For all those saying Basham's red card wasn't then either look at this jpg image or go and freeze frame the sky video clip from the game.

Yes, it was 50-50 - most of these challenges normally are, but one always ends up being late - Basham was late - he takes Brown's leg out smack on the calf - as clear a red card as you would want to see - how the ref and lines men saw it is beyond me as you can only see it in slow mo.

UTB

Players who roll around three times are very rarely in pain.

This is when Brown makes contact with the ball, Basham is not THAT late is he?

 

[mark hones]

Brown should have been sent off for simulation. He went for a 50/50 tackle, lost it so took the easy option of feigning injury and got just what he wanted.

Terrible refereeing, disgusting reaction by their players, and after seeing Danes career ended by a complete cunt in a Port Vale shirt, it makes it even more sickening watching one of them acting injured in that way.

 

[Tynemouth Blade]

For all those saying Basham's red card wasn't then either look at this jpg image or go and freeze frame the sky video clip from the game.

Yes, it was 50-50 - most of these challenges normally are, but one always ends up being late - Basham was late - he takes Brown's leg out smack on the calf - as clear a red card as you would want to see - how the ref and lines men saw it is beyond me as you can only see it in slow mo.

UTB

Having just watched the highlights I would say that the Basham red card incident looks like a typical Michael Brown tackle!
The sending off changed our game plan, yes, but starting with our better striker on the bench against Port Vale was criminal!

 

[Sirius]

Of course they do. The Prince, that mouthpiece bloke, Mr Foreign-Mission-airmiles, and McCabe-Changing -Investments they'll all be chinking their glasses today not giving one fat fuck about how many united fans trudged home in the blizzard last night after seeing their excuse for a team put in yet another shit performance against Port fucking Vale. Think about it. As the season calendar rolls by, we'd like to believe that they'd look at next week with trepidation when Sheffield United appears for what should be a 'tough match' and 'we won't win that one'. Instead, even the less prolific clubs must be thinking, 'fuck's sake. what has happened to them? They are shit now and we should beat them easily'.

To the more optimistic out there who still offer 'this season isn't over - there's a long way to go' please answer me these questions:

1. Given recent form, are you still confident we will even make the playoffs? What about automatic?
2. Do you really believe the statement that 'money will be made available in the JTW'? If so, what target players do you think we are looking at?
3. Do you think this 'money' (if it materialises) will pay for permanent signings, or loaness, undicloseds (or in other words, 'no clubbers') and 'Google-stars'?
4. If we make the playoffs, given past 'luck' (or lack of ability to deliver) do you feel confident we will negotiate all three matches without catastrophic disappointment?
5. Given the questions above, do you think it still unreasonable that cynics do not share your belief that this season is the one we will emerge from Division One by at least the playoffs?

I'm still behind Clough. I still think he is a good manager, laboured with a disgracefully short-of-talent squad and this board is buttfucking the club and its supporters.

pommpey

Pomps if the club are happy to trawl the lower levels of the Scottish League for players, it's not surprising that we seek to but fail to attain even that standard.
Whichever players we have, IMO it is no goo chopping and changing. Tinker men unwelcome. FFS pick your best eleven and stick with it. Beyond belief that Nigel is dipping into a random chocolate box. All the best Pomps

 

[Fulwood Blade]

Players who roll around three times are very rarely in pain.

This is when Brown makes contact with the ball, Basham is not THAT late is he?

View attachment 10067

yes you are correct and what is also in the rules as we are told numerous and multiple times on MOTD and other media is that if you take the ball THEN the player then referees still take the appropriate action. The still I posted shows that the carry through took Brown out, hence the red card. The rules now are interpreted differently to before, whether we all agree or not, that is how it is - yes the game has gone more mamby pamby, but they are what referees work to. How man times do you see on MOTD super slo mo where a player takes the ball and then takes the man and subsequently gets booked or sent off. Considering the ref gets one quick look at it, they seem to do, on the whole, a good job.

Rules are interpreted differently to the days of chopper harris or bite yer legs hunter, or to a lesser extent Trevor Hockey.

As for Brown rolling round three times - it is what a lot of players do and no doubt his actions contributed to the action the ref took.

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[Fulwood Blade]

Having just watched the highlights I would say that the Basham red card incident looks like a typical Michael Brown tackle!
The sending off changed our game plan, yes, but starting with our better striker on the bench against Port Vale was criminal!

Fore sure it change our game plan - and in the 2 games we have had a dismissal (PV and Chezzer) we would IMO, gone on to win both games.

PV as per Orient/Walsall/Notts/Chezzer/Fleetwood have all done us for different reasons.

Clough seemed clear he wanted to play COG/Mcnuts at home but at the first opportunity away, he again plays 4-5-1.

Perhaps we will have different approach to home and away.

The 4-51 at PV, even with 10 worked very well - if the standards set by COG at PV are what we are to expect on a regular basis, then 4-5-1 away seems appropriate and the philosophy might be - win at home (hopefully) and keep it tight and don't lose away.

Gawd knows what NC thinks!

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[Slugger]

Can't help thinking that if Basham had of stayed on the ground with a couple of rolls after the tackle it would've been a yellow card each.

 

[super_pig]

you can always tell if a player is genuinely injured.. they don't move

 

[ShockingBadBuy]

Though there are some players who go down, stay still, and you never worry about them because you've seen them do it a hundred times. I never worried about Rob Hulse, eg, who'd go down as if he'd had his back broken at least once a game.

Until that one time when it really was a horrible one. He was no Champions League striker, Hulsey, but among all the factors that combined to send us down that season, I still think losing him for the run-in was the single most significant one. How many of us would have had a fiver on Hulsey getting us the one extra goal we eventually needed to stay up ?

 

[dronny_blade]

My view as I've only just got over the horrific 7 hour journey home
- we are lightweight and easy to play against
- their goal, see above
- scougall currently offers very little
- basham, harsh sending off
- defo penalty
- COG tireless performance
- mcgahey, oh deary me, yes out of position, no excuse for not being able to pass a ball 5 yard to a Blade
- we need a right back, a strong ball winning, successful passer of the ball in midfield, I'd love another centre forward but is there any point with our current system
- despite the above I'm not sure we really deserved to lose
- apologies for stating anything obvious