Penalty shouts

[Mojo]

Think VAR got these correct, none were pens despite what Dyche and the burnley fans thought.

First one very minimal contact on Rodriguez who is a known cheat.

Handball JOC's arms were by his side and no movement made towards the ball.

Third one Baldock wad holding slightly but not much of a push and barnes was getting nowhere near it anyway.

I thought thats the best game i saw that ref ever have.

 

[PokerBlade]

Think he clearly nicked the ball on the first one but it's a dangerous challenge to make. The handball isn't even close and yet part of me wouldn't be surprised to see a terrible VAR decision give it. The third one is probably the best shout of the lot because there does look like a push. Still, I'd be surprised to see it given.

 

[BettingBlade]

If we’re going by previous VAR checks they certainly weren’t clear and obvious enough to be overturned.

 

[Silent Blade]

O'Connell's handball evens out Ward-Prowse's handball

 

[sufcboy95]

None of them were pens for me but can guarantee if the ref had given them VAR wouldn’t have overturned them

 

[Kenilworth]

O'Connell's handball evens out Ward-Prowse's handball

Rare I disagree with you, Silent, but ward prowse arms were not in a natural position whereas JO’C’s were.
pen for us - not for Burnley IMO

 

[Silent Blade]

Rare I disagree with you, Silent, but ward prowse arms were not in a natural position whereas JO’C’s were.
pen for us - not for Burnley IMO

According to the new rules both are handballs. VAR wouldnt have overruled the both refs had they awarded penalties.

 

[Beans]

According to the new rules both are handballs. VAR wouldnt have overruled the both refs had they awarded penalties.

Politely disagree Silent - the O'Connell one should not have been penalised. From the FA's Laws of the Game, bolded the key bit below.

But in essence:

1) Hand/arm did not make his body unnaturally bigger
2) Hand/arm was not above shoulder level
3) He did not gain possession and then score / create a goalscoring opportunity after the ball touched his arm.

And I'm sure you'll agree he didn't deliberately touch the ball with his hand/arm

HANDLING THE BALL

It is an offence if a player:

• deliberately touches the ball with their hand/arm, including moving the hand/arm towards the ball
• gains possession/control of the ball after it has touched their hand/arm and then:
  • scores in the opponents’ goal
  • creates a goal-scoring opportunity
• scores in the opponents’ goal directly from their hand/arm, even if accidental, including by the goalkeeper

It is usually an offence if a player:

• touches the ball with their hand/arm when:
  • the hand/arm has made their body unnaturally bigger
  • the hand/arm is above/beyond their shoulder level (unless the player deliberately plays the ball which then touches their hand/arm)

The above offences apply even if the ball touches a player’s hand/arm directly from the head or body (including the foot) of another player who is close.

Except for the above offences, it is not usually an offence if the ball touches a player’s hand/arm:

• directly from the player’s own head or body (including the foot)
• directly from the head or body (including the foot) of another player who is close
• if the hand/arm is close to the body and does not make the body unnaturally bigger
• when a player falls and the hand/arm is between the body and the ground to support the body, but not extended laterally or vertically away from the body

 

[Silent Blade]

Politely disagree Silent - the O'Connell one should not have been penalised. From the FA's Laws of the Game, bolded the key bit below.

But in essence:

1) Hand/arm did not make his body unnaturally bigger
2) Hand/arm was not above shoulder level
3) He did not gain possession and then score / create a goalscoring opportunity after the ball touched his arm.

And I'm sure you'll agree he didn't deliberately touch the ball with his hand/arm

HANDLING THE BALL

It is an offence if a player:

• deliberately touches the ball with their hand/arm, including moving the hand/arm towards the ball
• gains possession/control of the ball after it has touched their hand/arm and then:
  • scores in the opponents’ goal
  • creates a goal-scoring opportunity
• scores in the opponents’ goal directly from their hand/arm, even if accidental, including by the goalkeeper

It is usually an offence if a player:

• touches the ball with their hand/arm when:
  • the hand/arm has made their body unnaturally bigger
  • the hand/arm is above/beyond their shoulder level (unless the player deliberately plays the ball which then touches their hand/arm)

The above offences apply even if the ball touches a player’s hand/arm directly from the head or body (including the foot) of another player who is close.

Except for the above offences, it is not usually an offence if the ball touches a player’s hand/arm:

• directly from the player’s own head or body (including the foot)
• directly from the head or body (including the foot) of another player who is close
• if the hand/arm is close to the body and does not make the body unnaturally bigger
• when a player falls and the hand/arm is between the body and the ground to support the body, but not extended laterally or vertically away from the body

His left arm was a few inches away from his body?

 

[Beans]

His left arm was a few inches away from his body?

which makes it a “natural” position surely? Otherwise everyone would defend with their hands in their pockets

 

[Silent Blade]

which makes it a “natural” position surely? Otherwise everyone would defend with their hands in their pockets

VAR wouldnt have overruled the ref if he awarded a penalty for Burnley

 

[Beans]

VAR wouldnt have overruled the ref if he awarded a penalty for Burnley

Well, that I don't know. But the correct decision per the new handball laws is no penalty.

 

[Bladesthorpe]

which makes it a “natural” position surely? Otherwise everyone would defend with their hands in their pockets

Sadly we now have to watch defenders trying to block shots whilst holding both arms behind their backs. Pathetic

 

[Houston_Blade]

I think they were all good refereeing. First one was not a penalty but would have been easy to give on field. VAR correctly upheld the decision but wouldn’t have overruled off he’d given one.

Handball obviously wasn’t seen by the ref and VAR should follow the letter of the law so it was right not to be given.

Barnes can just fuck right off. Not even worth discussing that one. He behaved like a twat all game and got exactly what he deserved out of it.

 

[Silent Blade]

which makes it a “natural” position surely? Otherwise everyone would defend with their hands in their pockets

Hope you stopped laughing when you saw Veltman's handball last night! His arm was nearer to his body than O'Connell's to his body same for Ward-Prowse.

PL VAR is ignoring the new handball rules.

 

[Pittsburg Blade]

And surely if VAR can deny Dele Ali’s handball last weekend, then we can go back in time and have Jagielka’s handball overturned.

 

[Sheffsteel]

O'Connell's handball evens out Ward-Prowse's handball

No it doesn’t.

Under the rules O’Connels wasn’t a penalty as his hands were down by his side where as Ward-Prowse should have been a penalty as his hands were out.

Sean Dyche obviously doesn’t know the penalty rules if he thinks OConnells was a pen. He doesn’t do himself any favours by complaining every time they lose.

Good point about the Chelsea penalty. To be honest I’m finding the rules confusing how different competitions seem to have different rules.

 

[TankersleyBlade]

I'm also finding the difference between attacking / goal scoring handballs and defending ones hard to fathom. Surely the rule should be the same for both.

How can handball (as shown in the rules - thanks Beans) be different at one end of the pitch from the other? Disallowing goals for accidental brushes against attacking players hands or lower arm seems downright stupid to me - no advantage sought or gained in most cases, these goals would have still occurred without the slight touch.

 

[Silent Blade]

Good point about the Chelsea penalty. To be honest I’m finding the rules confusing how different competitions seem to have different rules.

Chelsea got a penalty against Valencia too and the Valencia's player's arm was in the same position as Veltman when he couldn't move his arm away from a bouncing ball.