Paul Coutts

[sitwell]

Ten likes

I'm really pleased for us that it seems to be working out now, but however good it gets, history won't be re written by a handful of posters waiting to be proved right.

He's been utterly gash under 2 managers. He's playing well now. Credit to both Wilder and Coutts. But he cannot be absolved of blame for his lack of input up to this season, however much Adkins (in some people's eyes) becomes resposible for world hunger and the like.

UTB

Proper pissing you off that you didn't see a player in Coutts isn't it.

 

[BushBlade]

You are of course referring to the minority of Clough's signings that haven't been binned to the back of beyond.

I'm not discussing whether or not Clough was a good manager. It's been done to death.

 

[alcoblade]

Proper pissing you off that you didn't see a player in Coutts isn't it.

No, others will notice ive praised him numerous times this season. You're the king of taking a position and sticking to it. No doubt the broken clock reference resonated, as it was specifically you I had in mind.

Steven Quinn anyone?

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[alcoblade]

I'm not discussing whether or not Clough was a good manager. It's been done to death.

But If you want to make reference to how good Clough's signings have been under he right management, you might allow me to point out that the right management binned most of them.

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[DronnieSoul]

Coutts was slaughtered for lack of effort but he was played out wide which was obvious that he was not fit enough to play. Now he is central his quality shines and regular matches has improved his fitness. I knew there was a player in there and really pleased to see him flourish despite what the slashers say. Good times ahead..

 

[alcoblade]

Coutts was slaughtered for lack of effort but he was played out wide which was obvious that he was not fit enough to play. Now he is central his quality shines and regular matches has improved his fitness. I knew there was a player in there and really pleased to see him flourish despite what the slashers say. Good times ahead..

Do you really think there are people paying good money to watch us in the third division, hoping that Coutts doesn't play well (and thus the team fails) so that that can be proved right?

As a real weakness is midfield creativity, I'm desperate for Coutts to prove his worth there. Anyone who isn't, if they exist, isn't a real fan.

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[DronnieSoul]

Do you really think there are people paying good money to watch us in the third division, hoping that Coutts doesn't play well (and thus the team fails) so that that can be proved right?

As a real weakness is midfield creativity, I'm desperate for Coutts to prove his worth there. Anyone who isn't, if they exist, isn't a real fan.

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They exist....

 

[wizadry]

I think CW is far more similar to Clough in his man management style than Adkins was. It probably shouldn't be surprising that some of Clough's signings have responded well to Wilder.

Now whilst i think it's a bit early to determine the differences between the two I think we can both agree to not go through all that shite again with Cloughy?

 

[alcoblade]

They exist....

I'm sure people exist who won't publicly accept that they are wrong. I sincerely doubt people turn up to support and inwardly hope their team fails.

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[Grizzly blade]

There are "fans" that predict doom and gloom....I have on occasion with good reason.
Some of those want to be right so badly....so they can say "told yer" that they will play down any success, however major or minor and look forward to the next pitfall.

Sadly, these folk must lead a very miserable existence. And an existence that isn't exclusive to football either.

 

[wizadry]

No, others will notice ive praised him numerous times this season. You're the king of taking a position and sticking to it. No doubt the broken clock reference resonated, as it was specifically you I had in mind.

Steven Quinn anyone?

UTB

Keep your balanced posts coming, I appreciate them. Anyone with any footballing nous can see Coutts has something, it's just that he has mugged us as fans and the club off by giving unprofessional performance game after game in the last couple of seasons, he was very disrespectful to the fans and the club, if people can't see that then i fear for their footballing brain.

Coutts has a long way to go to even start repaying the faith being shown to him by some quarters, lets hope he keeps it up then some people can say I told you so.

 

[alcoblade]

There are "fans" that predict doom and gloom....I have on occasion with good reason.
Some of those want to be right so badly....so they can say "told yer" that they will play down any success, however major or minor and look forward to the next pitfall.

Sadly, these folk must lead a very miserable existence. And an existence that isn't exclusive to football either.

I predicted that Coutts hadn't got it in him to be a good footballer, based on attitude, stamina and physicality, never ability. I've acknowledged that he's been good, overall, this season. But I don't think any of us should be changing opinion on a well earned reputation after a few games, should we? I argue against such short termism on many topics.

If Coutts is good for a sustained period (several months), and the signs are good, I'll be delighted to tell you all I was wrong.

That prediction aside, it's never been a big concern of mine about how good a player Coutts might be able to become. I've been utterly pissed off at the awful player he's actually been, as it played out, throughout the last 20 months.

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[BushBlade]

But If you want to make reference to how good Clough's signings have been under he right management, you might allow me to point out that the right management binned most of them.

UTB

Why? I've just said they've responded to Wilder better than they did Adkins. I haven't commented on whether they're good signings or not, or made any comment about Clough's ability.
He signed some shit, I don't disagree.

 

[Grizzly blade]

The argument about Clough has been banded about that ALL of his signings were shit.

I think it's the opposite, most were decent players but we never saw the best of them as we got rid of the manager.
Is that the fault of the player? New manager? Or the board.

I got a little hacked off that it was implied all those players were simply shite. It was obvious IMHO that there was more to it, as has now been proved with one or two. Clough brought players in to do jobs for a set period of time, with a plan for the future based on what he had coming through the academy, what players contracts would run out at other clubs and so on.

At least Wilder is doing the job. We should be glad of that and move on.

 

[alcoblade]

Why? I've just said they've responded to Wilder better than they did Adkins. I haven't commented on whether they're good signings or not, or made any comment about Clough's ability.
He signed some shit, I don't disagree.

Fair enough if I got the wrong end of the stick here, sorry.

You might gather that I'm totally pissed off with the financial damage inflicted by Clough, due to his scattergun approach to signings and contracts. Any hint of him being let off the hook, with some Clough fans actually absolving him of any blame and passing it on to the next sucker, can't go unchallenged.

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[alcoblade]

The argument about Clough has been banded about that ALL of his signings were shit.

I think it's the opposite, most were decent players but we never saw the best of them as we got rid of the manager.
Is that the fault of the player? New manager? Or the board.

I got a little hacked off that it was implied all those players were simply shite. It was obvious IMHO that there was more to it, as has now been proved with one or two. Clough brought players in to do jobs for a set period of time, with a plan for the future based on what he had coming through the academy, what players contracts would run out at other clubs and so on.

At least Wilder is doing the job. We should be glad of that and move on.

I, and others, may be guilty of being blasé with writing off his signings as a group.

Some players might actually come good, but as a rule the suggestion that we were overloaded with poor players holds true. Given lots of time to dissect the ins and outs of all the signings, we might have generalised less. Given the overall picture, and the fortunes taken out of the club for such little return by these players and the manager, I wouldn't (generally) shed many tears for the group.

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[Tyler Durden]

Fair enough if I got the wrong end of the stick here, sorry.

You might gather that I'm totally pissed off with the financial damage inflicted by Clough, due to his scattergun approach to signings and contracts. Any hint of him being let off the hook, with some Clough fans actually absolving him of any blame and passing it on to the next sucker, can't go unchallenged.

UTB

The Cult Of Clough will never accept that their man made a single mistake or acknowledge the corrosive effect that his tenure had in the long term.

 

[Grizzly blade]

The Cult Of Clough will never accept that their man made a single mistake or acknowledge the corrosive effect that his tenure had in the long term.

There speaks a man with clear insider knowledge of the contracts and costs at the club! Or perhaps perpetuating a myth banded by the board to justify their bad decision in sacking him and hiring coco the fucking clown to replace him. (On more money than Clough and with a larger salary budget!)

Why do folk like you think that fans having a different opinion to your ill informed and sensationalist one, makes those people cult members, apologists or whatever? Perhaps if the club had allowed all parties to give their own side of the story (instead of demanding they keep quiet as part of their pay off) we might have a balanced view to understand the whole picture which led to the failures. Doesn't stop them having a word in quiet and out of the public eye though does it.

Anyway, we can all sit back and watch this corrosive manager make Burton into a mid table championship side. Something many of us would give a bollock to be in three years time we are so far off that mark.

 

[alcoblade]

There speaks a man with clear insider knowledge of the contracts and costs at the club! Or perhaps perpetuating a myth banded by the board to justify their bad decision in sacking him and hiring coco the fucking clown to replace him. (On more money than Clough and with a larger salary budget!)

Why do folk like you think that fans having a different opinion to your ill informed and sensationalist one, makes those people cult members, apologists or whatever? Perhaps if the club had allowed all parties to give their own side of the story (instead of demanding they keep quiet as part of their pay off) we might have a balanced view to understand the whole picture which led to the failures. Doesn't stop them having a word in quiet and out of the public eye though does it.

Anyway, we can all sit back and watch this corrosive manager make Burton into a mid table championship side. Something many of us would give a bollock to be in three years time we are so far off that mark.

He didn't make Burton into a Chamionship side, and he wasn't making us into one either.

Funnily enough, at the time I and some others argued that his style would be more suited to keeping us in the Chamionship than it was to getting us there in the first place.

I'd have allowed him until Christmas to reinforce the philosophy of giving managers more time, but there was scant evidence that we were progressing.

What followed doesn't alter what preceded.

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[Grizzly blade]

He didn't make Burton into a Chamionship side, and he wasn't making us into one either.

Funnily enough, at the time I and some others argued that his style would be more suited to keeping us in the Chamionship than it was to getting us there in the first place.

I'd have allowed him until Christmas to reinforce the philosophy of giving managers more time, but there was scant evidence that we were progressing.

What followed doesn't alter what preceded.

UTB

Hmmm....of course he had nothing to do with their rise from non league....had nothing to do with making the club and preparing it for league football...nothing to do with the creation of the academy...Fact is while we have been in a steady decline for ten years, Burton have been the opposite and he started that ball rolling.

I would suggest that it is looking very much like he IS making Burton into a mid table side...seeing as that is where they are in their first ever season that high in the leagues. He got them over the line after JFH left so I'm not sure how he doesn't qualify for some credit.
JFH is about to be shown the door at QPR...and be shown as yet another coach not capable of doing the full job of football management. Funny that when we replaced Clough we hired one too, a bloody training ground coach.

 

[Tyler Durden]

There speaks a man with clear insider knowledge of the contracts and costs at the club! Or perhaps perpetuating a myth banded by the board to justify their bad decision in sacking him and hiring coco the fucking clown to replace him. (On more money than Clough and with a larger salary budget!)

Why do folk like you think that fans having a different opinion to your ill informed and sensationalist one, makes those people cult members, apologists or whatever? Perhaps if the club had allowed all parties to give their own side of the story (instead of demanding they keep quiet as part of their pay off) we might have a balanced view to understand the whole picture which led to the failures. Doesn't stop them having a word in quiet and out of the public eye though does it.

Anyway, we can all sit back and watch this corrosive manager make Burton into a mid table championship side. Something many of us would give a bollock to be in three years time we are so far off that mark.

My view is perfectly balanced. It's based on cause-and-effect.
When the manager who takes over from Clough has a squad list of 43 to begin with, it's not difficult to see why either of them got sacked. Playing fast and loose with the clubs finances to zero effect will get you there.

You'd have to be ridiculously blinkered and ahistorical to conclude that the clubs problems began with Nigel Adkins. He failed to clean up the mess, but the greater blame always lies with he who caused it in the first place.

And yes, I too look forward to seeing how Brians son can build on the strong foundations set by Jimmy Floyd Hasselbaink at Burton. It does nothing to absolve him of the shit he left behind here however.

 

[alcoblade]

Hmmm....of course he had nothing to do with their rise from non league....had nothing to do with making the club and preparing it for league football...nothing to do with the creation of the academy...Fact is while we have been in a steady decline for ten years, Burton have been the opposite and he started that ball rolling.

I would suggest that it is looking very much like he IS making Burton into a mid table side...seeing as that is where they are in their first ever season that high in the leagues. He got them over the line after JFH left so I'm not sure how he doesn't qualify for some credit.
JFH is about to be shown the door at QPR...and be shown as yet another coach not capable of doing the full job of football management. Funny that when we replaced Clough we hired one too, a bloody training ground coach.

We replaced Clough with a man who had achieved 4 times as many promotions in half the amount of time. Both failed, one in half the time with a fraction of ability to make the required changes. All decisions too short term.


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[Ricky]

Clough's in his element trying to keep Burton in the Championship but he wasn't suited to the job here, fucked up badly and thoroughly deserved the sack for many reasons and what happened with Adkins doesn't change that.

 

[wizadry]

I look forward to the day when Clough JNRs name is not mentioned on here. I'm sick to the back teeth of the twat and what he left us with, he's history as far as we are concerned.

 

[sitwell]

My view is perfectly balanced. It's based on cause-and-effect.
When the manager who takes over from Clough has a squad list of 43 to begin with, it's not difficult to see why either of them got sacked. Playing fast and loose with the clubs finances to zero effect will get you there.

You'd have to be ridiculously blinkered and ahistorical to conclude that the clubs problems began with Nigel Adkins. He failed to clean up the mess, but the greater blame always lies with he who caused it in the first place.

And yes, I too look forward to seeing how Brians son can build on the strong foundations set by Jimmy Floyd Hasselbaink at Burton. It does nothing to absolve him of the shit he left behind here however.

The 43 is a myth you love to perpetuate ,this includes loans ,juniors, players on the way out ,in other words bollocks. We will never know what would have become of the players Nigel had here under his management because we ridiculously sacked him halfway through the job ,you cant get away from the fact that his time here was littered with much more excitement and achievement than any other manager over the past 10 years ,and a season of consolidation had us in the play offs after a season where he raised us from the bottom of the table and hopeless to halfway ,never mind the cup runs.
Whats Jimmy Floyd Hassailbanks Dad called ? No I don't know either so what has Nigel Cloughs Dads name got to do with anything ? Its a bit fucking sad resorting to that really.
Incidentally whos fault was QPRs 6-0 home defeat last night ? Cloughs ?

 

[Slim Man]

Clough and Adkins failed here. Clough spent a lot and left us with loads of shit. Adkins spent quite a bit and left us with some shit.

Don't care about either of them, but for the record Clough only got them promoted because JFH had built up an unassailable lead - which if the season was 1 game longer Clough would have fucked up.

Clough is perfectly good at playing backs to the wall, escape relegation style football. Promotion football? Not so much

 

[Tyler Durden]

The 43 is a myth you love to perpetuate ,this includes loans ,juniors, players on the way out ,in other words bollocks. We will never know what would have become of the players Nigel had here under his management because we ridiculously sacked him halfway through the job ,you cant get away from the fact that his time here was littered with much more excitement and achievement than any other manager over the past 10 years ,and a season of consolidation had us in the play offs after a season where he raised us from the bottom of the table and hopeless to halfway ,never mind the cup runs.
Whats Jimmy Floyd Hassailbanks Dad called ? No I don't know either so what has Nigel Cloughs Dads name got to do with anything ? Its a bit fucking sad resorting to that really.
Incidentally whos fault was QPRs 6-0 home defeat last night ? Cloughs ?

We will never know what would have become of the players Nigel had here under his management because we ridiculously sacked him halfway through the job

Probably because giving him another season would've meant not being able to afford to run the floodlights....

cant get away from the fact that his time here was littered with much more excitement and achievement than any other manager over the past 10 years

Won more games and scored more goals under Danny Wilson actually, and got further towards promotion. He never played for draws at home to Crewe and Fleetwood......and lost.

Whats Jimmy Floyd Hassailbanks Dad called ? No I don't know either so what has Nigel Cloughs Dads name got to do with anything ?

Well it's pretty important if you happen to be Nigel Clough. Having a famous surname gets you far in professional football even if you are shite at being a manager, just look at Darren Ferguson for proof.

 

[Tyler Durden]

I look forward to the day when Clough JNRs name is not mentioned on here. I'm sick to the back teeth of the twat and what he left us with, he's history as far as we are concerned.

I wish I hadn't brought it up either to be honest. It's a very depressing subject and he's a very depressing man.

 

[Grizzly blade]

The 43 is a myth you love to perpetuate ,this includes loans ,juniors, players on the way out ,in other words bollocks. We will never know what would have become of the players Nigel had here under his management because we ridiculously sacked him halfway through the job ,you cant get away from the fact that his time here was littered with much more excitement and achievement than any other manager over the past 10 years ,and a season of consolidation had us in the play offs after a season where he raised us from the bottom of the table and hopeless to halfway ,never mind the cup runs.
Whats Jimmy Floyd Hassailbanks Dad called ? No I don't know either so what has Nigel Cloughs Dads name got to do with anything ? Its a bit fucking sad resorting to that really.
Incidentally whos fault was QPRs 6-0 home defeat last night ? Cloughs ?

Precisely....another sound bite to get fans to lay blame elsewhere.
goes with spending a fortune on players....complete crap.

 

[Lane Ender]

I wish I hadn't brought it up either to be honest. It's a very depressing subject and he's a very depressing man.

His second season was mind numbing.
Having said that I was shocked when he got the bullet got it in my mind Mcabe would give him until Xmas at least.