Norwood

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Iceybabey said:
Bogle in midfield?

How do people come up with this stuff 😕?
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When there are no other options, if we don't have Lundstram playing as our box-to-box midfielder then who will? The likelihood is he will leave in January too, so solutions will have to be found fast.
 

tincan said:
For Norwoods ping to return he needs Fleck/Lunny to protect him and buy the time for his passing to work.
The opposition know this and so cut off his options. Our wingbacks are then out of position, and open to the counter. The opposition have players who command 5x the salary of ours so their technical ability gives them a further advantage.
The solution is different tactics, different players or back to the poverty of the championship record breakingly badly.
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Exactly we can't keep playing the same way and expect a different result. However, I felt this way after the Fulham draw and nothing has really changed since with the exception of some very small tweaks. I've just given up with that argument.
 
Sheffsteel said:
Norwood thrives in a team that has plenty of possession with attacking options on the wings.

This season we neither have much possession nor attack as much.
Norwood has always been a big poor defensively.....this season he’s been forced to defend.
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I wouldn't completely agree. We were a promoted team last year and didn't dominate games, the difference was that we were clinical. That doesn't just go for Norwood of course and he had overlapping runs to aim for too, which have now vanished. I just feel yesterday he was so poor on the ball. With heavy touches, very poor deliveries and bad passing. Dominating a game or not, it's not promising that your creative midfielder does that.
 
He is playing very poorly, but then so is Fleck, Ramsdale, Lowe, Brewster, Burke, McBurnie (aside from the Leicester match) and Berge.

Another question would be, who is playing well?
 
Since Berge arrived he's been a shell of his former self. Because, he's not great at the defensive side. He'll stand in the right place but tacking and tracking runners is not his forte. He sat deep so wasn't really a problem but relied on Fleck and Lunny to cover the pitch up and down. Berge doesn't do the ball-winning job. He's great technically but very slow when on the ball. He seems slow to react as well. Fleck has been poor for a long time as well.

Norwood was at full stretch even when playing at his best. Often took a booking to stop counter attacks. When we had decent possession he could dictate play and move the ball around but the wingbacks are withdrawn and CBs much less likely to get forwards. So, whereas before, there was always lots of easy options for passes, there are often none. Not helped by our general lack of movement.

The biggest problem is that he's dreadful under pressure. He had time and space before. Could pick a long pass or switch play because he was so deep. Now, other teams are making a concerted effort to press higher up against us (knowing we don't have the pace to get round the back), pushing the wingbacks back and stopping him picking a pass. He's poor at making himself space or protecting a ball and panics far too easily.

He looks to have lost that extra little bit of pace as well. We're desperate for new midfielders tbh.
 
Backpass Berge is ruining Norwoods reputation and movement in midfield! It’s Berge who’s nowhere near fit and not up to the job Norwood was doing for us last season! Berge needs dropping now and let Norwood ply his trademark with Lundstram,Fleck, Ampadu and Osbourne! 😉
 
Basically when teams press us high up the pitch we lose possession too easily. There’s no outball for anyone and no one to beat a man with the ball at their feet. Teams have also realised that, unless Osborn or Stevens (on form) play at LWB there’s no attacking threat on the left hand side and load up the right.

We can’t switch to 4 at the back as without JOC our central defence is not strong enough.

Potentially I think a Number 10 might help us with an outball. But I do think this season is done and Wilder needs to be rebuild for the PL promotion challenge next year.
 
Not having the options to pass to is a joke of an excuse.
Put the ball in the right areas at least. Beat the first man for a start.

He's too slow and weak as it is but now he's lost his ability to ping, cross or take free kicks, he doesn't get anywhere near my side.
 
Gavlar said:
He is playing very poorly, but then so is Fleck, Ramsdale, Lowe, Brewster, Burke, McBurnie (aside from the Leicester match) and Berge.

Another question would be, who is playing well?
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I think what I'm saying is being misinterpreted a bit. I'm just simply saying that we didn't look too great yesterday but we looked a lot worse with Norwood and without Lundstram. He is great at passing, couldn't do that yesterday or against West Brom. Because of that we sat back and invited pressure, as he couldn't create leading to the defeat.
 
robbiez666 said:
Since Berge arrived he's been a shell of his former self. Because, he's not great at the defensive side. He'll stand in the right place but tacking and tracking runners is not his forte. He sat deep so wasn't really a problem but relied on Fleck and Lunny to cover the pitch up and down. Berge doesn't do the ball-winning job. He's great technically but very slow when on the ball. He seems slow to react as well. Fleck has been poor for a long time as well.

Norwood was at full stretch even when playing at his best. Often took a booking to stop counter attacks. When we had decent possession he could dictate play and move the ball around but the wingbacks are withdrawn and CBs much less likely to get forwards. So, whereas before, there was always lots of easy options for passes, there are often none. Not helped by our general lack of movement.

The biggest problem is that he's dreadful under pressure. He had time and space before. Could pick a long pass or switch play because he was so deep. Now, other teams are making a concerted effort to press higher up against us (knowing we don't have the pace to get round the back), pushing the wingbacks back and stopping him picking a pass. He's poor at making himself space or protecting a ball and panics far too easily.

He looks to have lost that extra little bit of pace as well. We're desperate for new midfielders tbh.
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Well said mate, not that it changes anything but I think if by miracle we were to change shape, I'd make Ampadu a ball winning midfielder and Berge a creative midfielder
 
Gozza said:
I think what I'm saying is being misinterpreted a bit. I'm just simply saying that we didn't look too great yesterday but we looked a lot worse with Norwood and without Lundstram. He is great at passing, couldn't do that yesterday or against West Brom. Because of that we sat back and invited pressure, as he couldn't create leading to the defeat.
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I agree mate.
 
jezw2014 said:
Backpass Berge is ruining Norwoods reputation and movement in midfield! It’s Berge who’s nowhere near fit and not up to the job Norwood was doing for us last season! Berge needs dropping now and let Norwood ply his trademark with Lundstram,Fleck, Ampadu and Osbourne! 😉
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Yeah, obviously Berge has quality but where he's currently playing we aren't seeing it, I don't think he's good enough defensively. I think he needs to play further forward and if that doesn't work, then I have no answer!
 
Rodley said:
Basically when teams press us high up the pitch we lose possession too easily. There’s no outball for anyone and no one to beat a man with the ball at their feet. Teams have also realised that, unless Osborn or Stevens (on form) play at LWB there’s no attacking threat on the left hand side and load up the right.

We can’t switch to 4 at the back as without JOC our central defence is not strong enough.

Potentially I think a Number 10 might help us with an outball. But I do think this season is done and Wilder needs to be rebuild for the PL promotion challenge next year.
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I beg to differ mate, I think we HAVE to play a back 4 without JOC because I know we have 5 defenders but if we ever attack it turns to 3. So if we move to 4 what if we give the full backs more emphasis on defending rather than attacking. Have wingers doing the attacking.
I know we don't really have wingers, Burke used to be a RW and I'm sure Brewster could do a job LW. But that's the price we pay for not having a 'plan B'. Because we don't go forward enough with our L/RWB. If they don't cross a ball in who will? We proved yesterday too our best attacking threat is to put it on McBurnie's head!
 

From the pig end said:
Not having the options to pass to is a joke of an excuse.
Put the ball in the right areas at least. Beat the first man for a start.

He's too slow and weak as it is but now he's lost his ability to ping, cross or take free kicks, he doesn't get anywhere near my side.
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That's our problem mate, he's the only midfielder we have to bring off the bench... If we ever win, just need to hope he gets a lift.
 
Starting to show why nobody else took a punt on him in the PL before
 
guancheblade said:
Starting to show why nobody else took a punt on him in the PL before
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I was begging to think that too, like I said Wilder is a great motivator, like when he showed the players those newspaper articles about how we were going straight back down. Maybe for Norwood he simply said prove them wrong and it worked until lockdown. Just a theory.
However, I think it's more likely that he has even less confidence that everyone else does, which is probably why his passing is so poor. Along with the fact that managers are telling their players to put more pressure on him, now that he has less time he panics.
 
Gozza said:
Well said mate, not that it changes anything but I think if by miracle we were to change shape, I'd make Ampadu a ball winning midfielder and Berge a creative midfielder
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Berge doesnt create and our wingbacks dont trust him to cover hence the runs have stopped and the outlets ,OConnell was also a great outlet for Norwood for a one two when getting closed down. We were so much more fluid without Berge ,we played as unit ,the most unwilder signing ever ,theres a reason for that.
 
So youre saying Berge is a PA signing then.

He seems to be big favourite with CW always 'Zander this, Zander that'
 
Barry Butlin said:
He’s 29 he needs a run in the side with Fleck & Luny, we don’t play well when Berge plays....
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When Fleck started against West Ham though, he looked miles ahead of Norwood did against West Brom and Leicester I think a big difference is pace. Fleck has a burst of it to get out of sticky situation, Norwood doesn't. He relies on his pass to get him out of trouble which hasn't worked this season.
 
sitwell said:
Berge doesnt create and our wingbacks dont trust him to cover hence the runs have stopped and the outlets ,OConnell was also a great outlet for Norwood for a one two when getting closed down. We were so much more fluid without Berge ,we played as unit ,the most unwilder signing ever ,theres a reason for that.
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I did think also that maybe Wilder didn't want him which is why he doesn't suit the system, but Wilder said how badly he wanted him summer 2019 and last January too. I don't know if that was a PR stunt by the club though. Which would explain why we (clubs social media page) post him on our Instagram and YouTube every 2 minutes!
 
bladesince64 said:
So youre saying Berge is a PA signing then.

He seems to be big favourite with CW always 'Zander this, Zander that'
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Is 'PA' the chairman? If so then possibly might be yes. It would explain why he doesn't fit the system.
 
FredZeppelin said:
Sorry pal, but we really didn't (imo!;)).
Leicester started far better than us and they could have been out of sight by half time. It was Men against Boys. The only reason we 'began to look more solid' was that Leicester were nowhere near as good in the second half, which in turn, made it look like we were doing better. We gave the ball away cheaply throughout the whole 90 mins and never looked much of a threat even in spite of that. I, personally thought Lunny was appalling throughout the whole 90, Berge had his worst game for us, and Fleck was indescribably bad. We got exactly what we deserved from the game as a whole. It just didn't look that way because of the lateness of the winner....and the complete ugly twat that scored it made it worse.

UTB
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Agree with everything said here. Spot on analysis.
 
If Berge is going to play in the DCM role he needs to do what Norwood does there and come deep and collect the ball off the keeper and back 3.

He needs to start taking the games we play by the cojones and take the responsibility of getting our game play going.
 
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