Micky Adams - A few thoughts

[bricktop]

I thought he deserved that win yesterday.

He's come in to a club that is a mess, and is still a mess with pretty much both hands tied behind his back, and all he has been able to do is permanently sign players that pretty much aren't wanted elsewhere (it's hard to think of anyone else we could have brought in as a permanent player other than Collins and Doyle as crap as they are with the lack of financial clout mixed in with the urgent need to make permanent signings during the transfer window?), and use the loan market. A lot of the players he inherited aren't pretty much up to scratch and with one or two bad apples in the side as well.

I think he has struggled initially because he hadn't realised what a big job the manager of this club is, and mess the club was in. It still is a big job as there is still a lot of work to be done at the club to get us moving in the right direction, but yesterday was a huge step as he showed that as a manager he has all the tools to do the job. We looked tactically solid, and the players had belief and passion instilled in them.

As enjoyable as yesterday was, we are still heading for relegation and really need to string together a series of good results, and with this squad of players it will still be difficult to get these results, and the biggest suprise will be if we do stay up. If we go down we still need to stick with Micky Adams as he won't be the biggest factor in getting relegation, it will be the mess that he has inherited. What he needs is time and patience. I don't really think that a quick fix is on the cards and the only way we can start moving is if Micky Adams is allowed to wheel and deal in the summer and bring in a good set of promising lower league players and using them as well as the promising set of kids we have got coming through to knit together a new team of players who want to be at the club, and who can work together to give us a side where the sum total is more than the individual component parts.

I don't think we will stay up, and i don't think we will bounce straight back up next season, but in two or three years i can see us really starting to make progress back up the leagues if we let Micky Adams rebuild the club from top to bottom. It would be a huge mistake to sack another manager as the new man will come in and face exactly the same problems as Adams has. Yesterday gave me a good look at what a Micky Adams side can play like, and to be honest i liked what i saw, but it is daft to expect us to play like that every week at the moment, but with his own squad of players i think that we can build an exciting young side full of players we own, and that is where we still to play like that most weeks and then make turn the downward slump in to a move onwards and upwards.

At the minute we need to take the relegation and instead of a throwing the blame around, and getting on people backs, we need to take a step back, deal with it, and use it as a chance to rebuild the club, rebuild the side and get moving in the right direction, and i have an inkling that we have a manager in place who can be a big part of that progress.

 

[puppet]

I thought he deserved that win yesterday.

He's come in to a club that is a mess, and is still a mess with pretty much both hands tied behind his back, and all he has been able to do is permanently sign players that pretty much aren't wanted elsewhere (it's hard to think of anyone else we could have brought in as a permanent player other than Collins and Doyle as crap as they are with the lack of financial clout mixed in with the urgent need to make permanent signings during the transfer window?), and use the loan market. A lot of the players he inherited aren't pretty much up to scratch and with one or two bad apples in the side as well.

I think he has struggled initially because he hadn't realised what a big job the manager of this club is, and mess the club was in. It still is a big job as there is still a lot of work to be done at the club to get us moving in the right direction, but yesterday was a huge step as he showed that as a manager he has all the tools to do the job. We looked tactically solid, and the players had belief and passion instilled in them.

As enjoyable as yesterday was, we are still heading for relegation and really need to string together a series of good results, and with this squad of players it will still be difficult to get these results, and the biggest suprise will be if we do stay up. If we go down we still need to stick with Micky Adams as he won't be the biggest factor in getting relegation, it will be the mess that he has inherited. What he needs is time and patience. I don't really think that a quick fix is on the cards and the only way we can start moving is if Micky Adams is allowed to wheel and deal in the summer and bring in a good set of promising lower league players and using them as well as the promising set of kids we have got coming through to knit together a new team of players who want to be at the club, and who can work together to give us a side where the sum total is more than the individual component parts.

I don't think we will stay up, and i don't think we will bounce straight back up next season, but in two or three years i can see us really starting to make progress back up the leagues if we let Micky Adams rebuild the club from top to bottom. It would be a huge mistake to sack another manager as the new man will come in and face exactly the same problems as Adams has. Yesterday gave me a good look at what a Micky Adams side can play like, and to be honest i liked what i saw, but it is daft to expect us to play like that every week at the moment, but with his own squad of players i think that we can build an exciting young side full of players we own, and that is where we still to play like that most weeks and then make turn the downward slump in to a move onwards and upwards.

At the minute we need to take the relegation and instead of a throwing the blame around, and getting on people backs, we need to take a step back, deal with it, and use it as a chance to rebuild the club, rebuild the side and get moving in the right direction, and i have an inkling that we have a manager in place who can be a big part of that progress.

The terrible run of results that dropped us into the relegation mire were down to him.

 

[shorehamview]

The terrible run of results that dropped us into the relegation mire were down to him.

Because before Micky Adams took over we were storming the division, weren't we? Bugger all to do with the mess he's inherited, or the players. I'm not saying he's entirely blameless, but to pin the run of bad results solely on him is rather naive.

 

[SUFC Handsworth]

I thought he deserved that win yesterday.

He's come in to a club that is a mess, and is still a mess with pretty much both hands tied behind his back, and all he has been able to do is permanently sign players that pretty much aren't wanted elsewhere (it's hard to think of anyone else we could have brought in as a permanent player other than Collins and Doyle as crap as they are with the lack of financial clout mixed in with the urgent need to make permanent signings during the transfer window?), and use the loan market. A lot of the players he inherited aren't pretty much up to scratch and with one or two bad apples in the side as well.

I think he has struggled initially because he hadn't realised what a big job the manager of this club is, and mess the club was in. It still is a big job as there is still a lot of work to be done at the club to get us moving in the right direction, but yesterday was a huge step as he showed that as a manager he has all the tools to do the job. We looked tactically solid, and the players had belief and passion instilled in them.

As enjoyable as yesterday was, we are still heading for relegation and really need to string together a series of good results, and with this squad of players it will still be difficult to get these results, and the biggest suprise will be if we do stay up. If we go down we still need to stick with Micky Adams as he won't be the biggest factor in getting relegation, it will be the mess that he has inherited. What he needs is time and patience. I don't really think that a quick fix is on the cards and the only way we can start moving is if Micky Adams is allowed to wheel and deal in the summer and bring in a good set of promising lower league players and using them as well as the promising set of kids we have got coming through to knit together a new team of players who want to be at the club, and who can work together to give us a side where the sum total is more than the individual component parts.

I don't think we will stay up, and i don't think we will bounce straight back up next season, but in two or three years i can see us really starting to make progress back up the leagues if we let Micky Adams rebuild the club from top to bottom. It would be a huge mistake to sack another manager as the new man will come in and face exactly the same problems as Adams has. Yesterday gave me a good look at what a Micky Adams side can play like, and to be honest i liked what i saw, but it is daft to expect us to play like that every week at the moment, but with his own squad of players i think that we can build an exciting young side full of players we own, and that is where we still to play like that most weeks and then make turn the downward slump in to a move onwards and upwards.

At the minute we need to take the relegation and instead of a throwing the blame around, and getting on people backs, we need to take a step back, deal with it, and use it as a chance to rebuild the club, rebuild the side and get moving in the right direction, and i have an inkling that we have a manager in place who can be a big part of that progress.

Couldn't agree more. The vast majority of this season's troubles are down to decision's made at boardroom level over the last few years.

 

[Worksop II]

but in two or three years i can see us really starting to make progress back up the leagues

What are gonna do with McCabe and Birch, lock em in a dungeon ?

 

[bricktop]

To be honest i didn't rate Gary Speed as a manager, i thought he would make an ok coach, and he was still a top player during his time at the club even though he was at the fagend of his career. I don't think he had enough aura about him to make a manager, and he didn't really come across as a leader, and as a manager i thought he was a bit bland and mediocre. I really liked Gary Speed as a player, and he always did come across as a top bloke, but unfortunately sometimes good players and people you like don't necessarily make the best managers.

When Micky Adams came in there was never really going to be a quick fix, and relegation had been on the cards most of the season.

 

[Revolution]

Whilst not denying that there are people who deserve more of the blame than he does for our present predicament, we have seen nothing from Adams that demonstrates that he will be a good manager for us.

Results have been markedly worse since he arrived (and heaven knows that wasn't easy to achieve), team discipline is terrible, defending is poor in general and terrible at set pieces, he seems to have no idea what his best team is, his permanent signings have been dismal at best, the few skillful players we have are not getting much of a look in, and he has his favourites who are playing at the expense of better players.

If it were up to me, I would can him five minutes after the end of the Swansea game irrespective of where we finish.

 

[bricktop]

Whilst not denying that there are people who deserve more of the blame than he does for our present predicament, we have seen nothing from Adams that demonstrates that he will be a good manager for us.

Results have been markedly worse since he arrived (and heaven knows that wasn't easy to achieve), team discipline is terrible, defending is poor in general and terrible at set pieces, he seems to have no idea what his best team is, his permanent signings have been dismal at best, the few skillful players we have are not getting much of a look in, and he has his favourites who are playing at the expense of better players.

If it were up to me, I would can him five minutes after the end of the Swansea game irrespective of where we finish.

And then it would be straight back to square one.

 

[lenners]

Off the top, thinking about yesterday's team...

Simmo, Prem goalkeeper
Lowry, Prem loanee
Mattock, Prem loanee
Quinn, Prem experience
Monty, Prem experience
Vokes, Prem loanee
Riise, Prem loanee
Nozza, Prem loanee
Doyle, fair enough
Lowton, limited experiece
Evans, cost £3m
Boggy, scored 14/15 goals at an average Champ club last season

When you actually honestly consider the resources available to Adams, the notion he's had complete rubbish to manage doesn't stand up.
Man for man, when you step back and think about it, there was no reason why we shouldn't have beaten Leeds yesterday.

---------- Post added at 02:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:04 PM ----------

And then it would be straight back to square one.

The truth is we will be back to square one at the end of the season in any case.
There will be another massive turnover of players and keeping Adams or getting a new manager in won't make much difference.

 

[bricktop]

Out of that team, i can't think of anyone who has been an established first team player in the Premiership. That is why they are with us at the moment.

It is set in stone that there will be another massive turnover in players at the club, so what we need to do is bring in a nucleus of decent young players who we can build in to an established team, rather than padding out a minimal sized squad with loads of loan players.

 

[alcoblade]

Whilst not denying that there are people who deserve more of the blame than he does for our present predicament, we have seen nothing from Adams that demonstrates that he will be a good manager for us.

Results have been markedly worse since he arrived (and heaven knows that wasn't easy to achieve), team discipline is terrible, defending is poor in general and terrible at set pieces, he seems to have no idea what his best team is, his permanent signings have been dismal at best, the few skillful players we have are not getting much of a look in, and he has his favourites who are playing at the expense of better players.

If it were up to me, I would can him five minutes after the end of the Swansea game irrespective of where we finish.

The jury is still out for me. He has a bit to answer for this season, yet has proved he can turn clubs around. I don't see why he couldn't be good for us if he was elsewhere.

I think the club needs to manage its way out of the mess it's got itself into. That needs 2 things to happen;

1.Form a coherent policy, communicate it and stick to it
2.Off load the silly contracts that we've given out and bring about financial stability.

2 if difficult to do and will probably just be a case of letting some of these run out. Until then, we'll remain in turmoil. For this reason, I'd stick with Adams for now. Partly to give him more time to prove his worth, mainly because we might as well let a tainted man absorb the inevitable flack that will come with the ongoing period of turmoil until we're bottomed out.

If we change our manager now, or in the summer, I'd give it a maximum of 6 months before the next man was under the same amount of pressure.

UTB

 

[Revolution]

And then it would be straight back to square one.

Save that we would have got rid of someone who, if he isn't a terrible manager, is doing a damn good impression of one.

There is no evidence that Adams can get the best out of the (few) players we have at our disposal and given his signings so far I have nightmares about the crap he might sign in the close season. I am not in favour of quick changes but as things stand he is in the Heath/Robson mould ie the longer you keep him, the worse it will get.

And what evidence is there that Adams can manage, or will manage, this mythical nucleus of good young players? we have one at the club already but he prefers to spend money on Marcus Bent, for crying out loud.

 

[lenners]

Out of that team, i can't think of anyone who has been an established first team player in the Premiership. That is why they are with us at the moment.

It is set in stone that there will be another massive turnover in players at the club, so what we need to do is bring in a nucleus of decent young players who we can build in to an established team, rather than padding out a minimal sized squad with loads of loan players.

Quinn and the Montster were, as I recall, and Quinn in particular gave a Prem quality performance yesterday.
I'm not saying the turnover of players wouldn't hinder any manager, it would.
But in terms of individual quality of player, they are better than second bottom of the Championship and Adams' results have to be seen in that context.

 

[bricktop]

Going back 20 odd years, i remember United bringing in a manager with a reputation for long ball football, and managing a team of thugs. He brought in some right shit like Darren Carr, Cliff Powell, Peter Hetherston, Martin Pike, and Wally Downes. Our disciplinary record was shit, and we got thumped 5-0 at Leeds and 6-0 at Boro on consecutive weekends, and ended up getting relegated at the end of that season.

Would you have sacked the manager then?

 

[alcoblade]

Off the top, thinking about yesterday's team...

Simmo, Prem goalkeeper
Lowry, Prem loanee
Mattock, Prem loanee
Quinn, Prem experience
Monty, Prem experience
Vokes, Prem loanee
Riise, Prem loanee
Nozza, Prem loanee
Doyle, fair enough
Lowton, limited experiece
Evans, cost £3m
Boggy, scored 14/15 goals at an average Champ club last season

When you actually honestly consider the resources available to Adams, the notion he's had complete rubbish to manage doesn't stand up.
Man for man, when you step back and think about it, there was no reason why we shouldn't have beaten Leeds yesterday.

---------- Post added at 02:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:04 PM ----------



The truth is we will be back to square one at the end of the season in any case.
There will be another massive turnover of players and keeping Adams or getting a new manager in won't make much difference.

Len, you can add the word "prem" to as many playes that you like, it doesn't make them good players. Simmo flaps becaise he flaps. Nos can't pass because he can't pass. You well know that though Evans cost £3M, he's worth nothing like that.

Let's judge Adams on what he's done. The players 2 players he's bought look poor, fair enough. He inherited poor players and a shit team. Brief flirtation with the prem doesn't alter anything. Poor players are poor players.

UTB

 

[Pollingtonblade]

Going back 20 odd years, i remember United bringing in a manager with a reputation for long ball football, and managing a team of thugs. He brought in some right shit like Darren Carr, Cliff Powell, Peter Hetherston, Martin Pike, and Wally Downes. Our disciplinary record was shit, and we got thumped 5-0 at Leeds and 6-0 at Boro on consecutive weekends, and ended up getting relegated at the end of that season.

Would you have sacked the manager then?

Bassett didn't bring Pike in he was already here, and played a huge part in us going up. Agree with most of the rest thought Hetherson wasn't that bad but a bit powder puff.

Onto your general point I agree we need stability and sacking managers every time we have a bad run does no one any favours, as you say we will still go down but should look to be building the nucleus of our own team for next year. Inspired by this post am now going to watch 100 years, 100 goals and re-live our last season in the 3rd Division

 

[CopenhagenBlade]

I think that you are overlooking one vital factor that is self confidence and a bit of luck. MA took over a side that was low on self confidence and desperately unlucky. Now I haven't been to the games but reading the reports and the twitter updates during and after the games that MA has managed we have controlled a lot of games at the start, hit the woodwork, found a keeper in top form and then let in a stupid goal. Once we have gone behind the fragile confidence that we had disappeared and it was game over.
We have proved by the teams that we have beaten that there isn't a team that is that special, apart maybe from QPR. Look where Bristol City are now and Pompey after their bad starts. Get the confidence up and you can beat anyone is this league. I think that after yesterday's game confidence will be up and it wouldn't surprise me to see us go on a bit of a run. The team/squad that we have isn't bad and is certainly good enough for the Championship.

 

[Revolution]

Bassett took us down, but that team was a better one than the one McEwan left us with. As well as the players you mention (Pike was already at the club) he also brought in Agana, Benstead, Webster, and let Todd and Smith play bigger roles before the end of the season. There's half your promotion team.

Anyway, what the hell does something that happened 23 years ago have to do with the fact that Adams has been an almost complete disaster in terms of results?

 

[Pollingtonblade]

Think Brownie is suggesting there are a lot of similarities between the situations that Bassett/Adams took over.

 

[lenners]

Going back 20 odd years, i remember United bringing in a manager with a reputation for long ball football, and managing a team of thugs. He brought in some right shit like Darren Carr, Cliff Powell, Peter Hetherston, Martin Pike, and Wally Downes. Our disciplinary record was shit, and we got thumped 5-0 at Leeds and 6-0 at Boro on consecutive weekends, and ended up getting relegated at the end of that season.

Would you have sacked the manager then?

No, why? Bassett won more games and, as you point out, he really was having to bring in some right bobbins.
Not where Adams has had to shop.

 

[alcoblade]

No, why? Bassett won more games and, as you point out, he really was having to bring in some right bobbins.
Not where Adams has had to shop.

Collins and Doyle? Not exactly Harrods?

UTB

 

[Revolution]

Think Brownie is suggesting there are a lot of similarities between the situations that Bassett/Adams took over.

I realise that, but the situations are only superficially similar in that it's the same club. It's 23 years ago. It's like thinking we should sign Marcus Bent because he scored goals for us 10 years ago...it tells us nothing about whether it's right to keep Adams now.

To put it another way: the Pigs fired Laws and took Irvine on last season. He did not keep them up. They kept him, and things just got worse and worse this season. Given these events, shouldn't we fire Adams too? The answer is that situation tells us nothing as it's a different team. Just like the Bassett situation tells us nothing as it's a different era.

 

[Pollingtonblade]

Who knows what will happen though? We could get relegated and return as champions (I realise that its very unlikely) but history is there for us to compare, it's much like all Blades fans know we will lose play off finals and cup semis, or get relegated when the odds are in our favour

 

[bricktop]

Its subjective. There are differences between then and now but bigger picture is the same.

Adams has got to shop at the same places Bassett shopped at. Other teams reserves, players who haven't made the grade elsewhere, and the lower leagues.

Looking at the 88-89 side.

Graham Benstead - Norwich Reserve
Simon Tracey - Wimbledon Reserve
Tony Agana - Watford Reserve
Alan Roberts - Lincoln City i think
Ian Bryson - Scottish lower league at Kilmarnock
Peter Duffield - Middlesborough reserve
Simon Webster - Huddersfield Town

 

[alcoblade]

Think Brownie is suggesting there are a lot of similarities between the situations that Bassett/Adams took over.

I realise that, but the situations are only superficially similar in that it's the same club. It's 23 years ago. It's like thinking we should sign Marcus Bent because he scored goals for us 10 years ago...it tells us nothing about whether it's right to keep Adams now.

To put it another way: the Pigs fired Laws and took Irvine on last season. He did not keep them up. They kept him, and things just got worse and worse this season. Given these events, shouldn't we fire Adams too? The answer is that situation tells us nothing as it's a different team. Just like the Bassett situation tells us nothing as it's a different era.

I don't follow. All our opinions are formed based on experiences of similar siutations elsewhere. I'm not sure what else you an form opinion on, if it isn't that?

UTB

 

[Pollingtonblade]

Duffield - now he could take a pen

 

[bricktop]

Arr laddie.

Whatever happened to Alan Roberts, i always thought he was a decent little player.

 

[Pollingtonblade]

Allegedly didn't agree with Bassetts strong arm tactics and was bombed out. Also liked a drink.

 

[alcoblade]

Arr laddie.

Whatever happened to Alan Roberts, i always thought he was a decent little player.

I thought he went back to Lincoln. He definitely left moaning about our physical / direct style of play, which was a shame because he looked good for us.

UTB

 

[lenners]

Collins and Doyle? Not exactly Harrods?

UTB

Nope, and as pointed out at the time, they were both highly questionable signings and they're both his responsibility.
But the loanings, definitely Harrods class compared to what Bassett was dealing with.