Merry Christmas Pinchy

[Weasel]

my opinion is yes it was a better era for us as a club ,interlaced with some great displays , but to say it was a non stop parade of skill and entertainment whilst saying the Bassett era was sheer hoofball is not only insulting to a team that did just as well but offensive to those that enjoyed probably just as many good days


the 5-1 home win over cardiff to take us up under harris was matched with a 5-2 AWAY win at Leicester
Under Basset wins like the 5-2 at forest and 4-2 at southampton and the 6-0 over spurs match anything from the earlier era

football success was far more attainable when clubs had 11 v 11 ands no or only 1 sub
we could take advantage of 2 or 3 having an off day
as soon as money started playing its part we as a club floundered
for Bassett to get us back there against far better off clubs was a real achievement

I saw every game Tony Currie played
Yes there were lots of magical moments
but to say it was all wonderful is deluded beyond belief
saw us relegated twice in 8 years which is glossed over 68 and 74

Totally agree.

 

[Pinchy]

Dear me. Ive seen some shit posted in my time...

Then you haven't a fucking clue either.

You should, however admire the shit, as you do the anti-football equivalent.

You Hoofers are a complete laughing stock.

 

[Weasel]

Then you haven't a fucking clue either.

You should, however admire the shit, as you do the anti-football equivalent.

You Hoofers are a complete laughing stock.

Well i will happily accept that put down from your good self then as you seem to constantly talk out of your backside on this forum.

I admire any good football, and i like to see Utd play winning football. For a large part of his tenure, Bassett supplied the latter.

Whats put the sand in your sandwich re Bassett anyway? It comes across as being almost a personal hatred of the man and your views lose credence because of this to me. Did the man fettle with your pet spaniel or something?

Bassett did a great job for Utd when he found the club on its arse and gave many fans me included some fantastic memories.

I wil happily remember the food times and the 'hoofball' which you refer too. Even then whilst it was direct it was for much of the time far from a case of just hoofing the ball down field and they played better football than some gave Utd credit for. You were clearly of the opinion that we were just one dimensional as a team which is totally wrong. If in doubt i suggest that you watch some of the seasons highlights from the Bassett era. Direct style...mostly, Wimbledon hoofball we certainly were not. Perhaps your getting Basset mixed up with Jack Charltons Pig side of the late 70s?

Any enough of me trying to educate the village idiot. Some men you just cant reach.

 

[HillmortonBlade]

If in doubt i suggest that you watch some of the seasons highlights from the Bassett era. Hoofball we certainly were not.

I can't compare the two eras we are discussing, as I was not about in the 60's. But I went to very many matches while Bassett was the manager and I am afraid my recollection was that there was a great deal of long ball played, it was not terribly well crafted football. That's not to say that it was not an exciting time and often entertaining. We had individual players who contributed with great skill and good football. I think however, on balance, our success on limited resources was achieved by the more direct game.

 

[metalblade]

Looks like Pinchy has had a very merry Christmas ....................................................................... nothing worse than an aggressive drunk.

 

[United Aren't Back.]

football being better in the late sixties early seventies is a myth
the better bit was we were in the top flight
the football was as bland as it is now , most of the time
yes Currie lit up the odd game, but to say we played sexy football is a gross distortion of the facts
there were just as many dour games even then

the good bit was just being there, playing with man utd and liverpool
remembering our relegation in 68 our last few home games were bloody abysmal
16 Mar 1968 Sheffield United v Sunderland L 1-2
13 Apr 1968 Sheffield United v Everton L 0-1
15 Apr 1968 Sheffield United v Liverpool D 1-1
23 Apr 1968 Sheffield United v Fulham L 2-3
27 Apr 1968 Sheffield United v West Ham United L 1-2
11 May 1968 Sheffield United v Chelsea L 1-2

my opinion is yes it was a better era for us as a club ,interlaced with some great displays , but to say it was a non stop parade of skill and entertainment whilst saying the Bassett era was sheer hoofball is not only insulting to a team that did just as well but offensive to those that enjoyed probably just as many good days


the 5-1 home win over cardiff to take us up under harris was matched with a 5-2 AWAY win at Leicester
Under Basset wins like the 5-2 at forest and 4-2 at southampton and the 6-0 over spurs match anything from the earlier era

football success was far more attainable when clubs had 11 v 11 ands no or only 1 sub
we could take advantage of 2 or 3 having an off day
as soon as money started playing its part we as a club floundered
for Bassett to get us back there against far better off clubs was a real achievement

I saw every game Tony Currie played
Yes there were lots of magical moments
but to say it was all wonderful is deluded beyond belief
saw us relegated twice in 8 years which is glossed over 68 and 74

76 not 74

 

[Weasel]

I can't compare the two eras we are discussing, as I was not about in the 60's. But I went to very many matches while Bassett was the manager and I am afraid my recollection was that there was a great deal of long ball played, it was not terribly well crafted football. That's not to say that it was not an exciting time and often entertaining. We had individual players who contributed with great skill and good football. I think however, on balance, our success on limited resources was achieved by the more direct game.

For the most part i agree with your post. I also mentioned earlier that i thought we played direct football under DB. We tended to hit the front lads quickly but my memory seemed to be that we got the ball forward to the wingers and played the ball into channels for either Deane/Agana to latch onto or for the wingers Bryson/Bradshaw to get the ball out wide and get the ball crossed.

Whilst direct i never thought it was just a case of just lumping the ball to a big Fashanu type up front who battled, scrapped and bit for the ball up top. We didnt have that type of player until big bad Billy Whitehurst appeared on the scene for a fairly fleeting time. There was more to Utd than that i thought. The much maligned Gannon was another who could pass a ball and thread a pass through to the front lads and i dont recall him being a big brute of a centre half.

I agree Utd were direct at times and could just launch the ball if they werent ar the races on the day and needed an equalizer etc but to say they played hoofball is just plain wrong imo and gives the management team of that time great disservice. If u wanted to see true hoofball then you needed to see the old Wimbledon down at Plough Lane. That was pure hoofball and i think Bassett refined his football style whilst at the Lane.

 

[vorpal blade]

I watched too few games when we were in the first division to know but when I did watch United in the early 1970s, I was constantly disappointed when passing moves broke down, to me the football didn't seem to be of a particularly high standard - as for Currie, my Dad would always ask whether he was going to bother playing that day, so my Dad had him down as wilful & inconsistent to say the least.

Of Bassett, some may say the football was primitive but it was brought about by serious statistical analysis of how many goals a team could score if they could get the ball in the opponents penalty area. As such it was FAR more scientific and thoughtful than mainstream "passing " football known to so many dullard commentators as "the way the game should be played", all that meant was as ever, the team with the best players (i.e. the most expensive team) would generally win everything. Only football geniuses could ever manage a team to buck that trend, Brian Clough being one of them.

The cleverest thing about "the long ball game" was that cheaply assembled teams could compete with the richest sides and WIN. Also, I contend that when you had high quality players like Deane and Agana, it could be very exciting to watch.

I remember discussing football in the 1990s with two Liverpool supporting friends of mine and they pointed out how thrilling the English 1st Division was (especially compared with the dull Italian stuff on every Sunday on channel 4 at the time) because you see a game where two teams were pitting two completely different styles against each other.

For me, its pointless being snobby about Sheffield United under Bassett, intellectually, it was at the time, the cleverest method of playing the game and allowed poor clubs to thrive (most notably Wimbledon and us) and when played well, it was fast and exciting.

It was radical - I've got bags of time for radical thought.

 

[blade too long]

well heres some facts

united under harris after gaining promotion in 71 finished 14th 13th and 10th in the following 3 seasons before leaving the club
united under bassett 20 years later finished 13th 14th and 9th in the first 3 years

which is just about identical, basset 1 place higher overall
the myth we were better footballing wise isnt shown in the trophy cabinet
just in your perception

the year after harris left we finished 6th, but then got relegated

 

[Pinchy]

well heres some facts

united under harris after gaining promotion in 71 finished 14th 13th and 10th in the following 3 seasons before leaving the club
united under bassett 20 years later finished 13th 14th and 9th in the first 3 years

which is just about identical, basset 1 place higher overall
the myth we were better footballing wise isnt shown in the trophy cabinet
just in your perception

the year after harris left we finished 6th, but then got relegated

You win a dinosaur:

 

[Pinchy]

I watched too few games when we were in the first division to know but when I did watch United in the early 1970s, I was constantly disappointed when passing moves broke down, to me the football didn't seem to be of a particularly high standard - as for Currie, my Dad would always ask whether he was going to bother playing that day, so my Dad had him down as wilful & inconsistent to say the least.

Of Bassett, some may say the football was primitive but it was brought about by serious statistical analysis of how many goals a team could score if they could get the ball in the opponents penalty area. As such it was FAR more scientific and thoughtful than mainstream "passing " football known to so many dullard commentators as "the way the game should be played", all that meant was as ever, the team with the best players (i.e. the most expensive team) would generally win everything. Only football geniuses could ever manage a team to buck that trend, Brian Clough being one of them.

The cleverest thing about "the long ball game" was that cheaply assembled teams could compete with the richest sides and WIN. Also, I contend that when you had high quality players like Deane and Agana, it could be very exciting to watch.

I remember discussing football in the 1990s with two Liverpool supporting friends of mine and they pointed out how thrilling the English 1st Division was (especially compared with the dull Italian stuff on every Sunday on channel 4 at the time) because you see a game where two teams were pitting two completely different styles against each other.

For me, its pointless being snobby about Sheffield United under Bassett, intellectually, it was at the time, the cleverest method of playing the game and allowed poor clubs to thrive (most notably Wimbledon and us) and when played well, it was fast and exciting.

It was radical - I've got bags of time for radical thought.

And bags of time for parochial tripe. Only in S2 - the land that time forgot...

 

[blade too long]

You win a dinosaur:

View attachment 21481

you win 3 monkeys

 

[blade too long]

72 73 season under Harris
tell me how much sexy football we watched and thrilled to in this run of games

14 Oct 1972 West Ham United v Sheffield United L 3-1 League Division One
21 Oct 1972 Sheffield United v Everton L 0-1 League Division One
23 Oct 1972 Sheffield United v Charlton Athletic W 1-0 League Cup
28 Oct 1972 Derby County v Sheffield United L 2-1 League Division One
31 Oct 1972 Sheffield United v Arsenal L 1-2 League Cup
04 Nov 1972 Sheffield United v Stoke City D 0-0 League Division One
11 Nov 1972 Leeds United v Sheffield United L 2-1 League Division One
18 Nov 1972 Coventry City v Sheffield United L 3-0 League Division One
25 Nov 1972 Sheffield United v Wolverhampton Wanderers L 1-2 League Division One
09 Dec 1972 Sheffield United v Manchester City D 1-1 League Division One
16 Dec 1972 Sheffield United v Leicester City W 2-0 League Division One
23 Dec 1972 Tottenham Hotspur v Sheffield United L 2-0 League Division One
26 Dec 1972 Sheffield United v Liverpool L 0-3 League Division One
30 Dec 1972 Newcastle United v Sheffield United L 4-1 League Division One
06 Jan 1973 Sheffield United v West Bromwich Albion W 3-0 League Division One
20 Jan 1973 Southampton v Sheffield United D 1-1 League Division One
27 Jan 1973 Sheffield United v Norwich City W 2-0 League Division One
10 Feb 1973 Chelsea v Sheffield United L 4-2 League Division One
17 Feb 1973 Sheffield United v Birmingham City L 0-1 League Division One
24 Feb 1973 Leicester City v Sheffield United D 0-0 League Division One
03 Mar 1973 Arsenal v Sheffield United L 3-2 League Division One
our only 4 wins against charlton leicester west brom and norwich , other yo yo teams

having a misty eyed view of the era that turns a blind eye to how mediocre some of it was, then shamelessly picking on Bassetts efforts is being myopic

 

[Silent Blade]

well heres some facts

united under harris after gaining promotion in 71 finished 14th 13th and 10th in the following 3 seasons before leaving the club
united under bassett 20 years later finished 13th 14th and 9th in the first 3 years

which is just about identical, basset 1 place higher overall
the myth we were better footballing wise isnt shown in the trophy cabinet
just in your perception

the year after harris left we finished 6th, but then got relegated

WE FINISHED 5TH UNDER HARRIS IN 1962

 

[Silent Blade]

72 73 season under Harris
tell me how much sexy football we watched and thrilled to in this run of games

14 Oct 1972 West Ham United v Sheffield United L 3-1 League Division One
21 Oct 1972 Sheffield United v Everton L 0-1 League Division One
23 Oct 1972 Sheffield United v Charlton Athletic W 1-0 League Cup
28 Oct 1972 Derby County v Sheffield United L 2-1 League Division One
31 Oct 1972 Sheffield United v Arsenal L 1-2 League Cup
04 Nov 1972 Sheffield United v Stoke City D 0-0 League Division One
11 Nov 1972 Leeds United v Sheffield United L 2-1 League Division One
18 Nov 1972 Coventry City v Sheffield United L 3-0 League Division One
25 Nov 1972 Sheffield United v Wolverhampton Wanderers L 1-2 League Division One
09 Dec 1972 Sheffield United v Manchester City D 1-1 League Division One
16 Dec 1972 Sheffield United v Leicester City W 2-0 League Division One
23 Dec 1972 Tottenham Hotspur v Sheffield United L 2-0 League Division One
26 Dec 1972 Sheffield United v Liverpool L 0-3 League Division One
30 Dec 1972 Newcastle United v Sheffield United L 4-1 League Division One
06 Jan 1973 Sheffield United v West Bromwich Albion W 3-0 League Division One
20 Jan 1973 Southampton v Sheffield United D 1-1 League Division One
27 Jan 1973 Sheffield United v Norwich City W 2-0 League Division One
10 Feb 1973 Chelsea v Sheffield United L 4-2 League Division One
17 Feb 1973 Sheffield United v Birmingham City L 0-1 League Division One
24 Feb 1973 Leicester City v Sheffield United D 0-0 League Division One
03 Mar 1973 Arsenal v Sheffield United L 3-2 League Division One
our only 4 wins against charlton leicester west brom and norwich , other yo yo teams

having a misty eyed view of the era that turns a blind eye to how mediocre some of it was, then shamelessly picking on Bassetts efforts is being myopic

Great managers do have at least one poor spell. Bassett has had more poor spells

 

[seanbeenstattoo]

John Harris and Harry Bassett presided over the 2 best eras of Blade watching in my lifetime (so far).
Warnock comes in a distant 3rd.

If I were to engage in an abusive personalised arguement over unnatractive and unsuccessful managers/eras I give you Martin Peters,Jimmy Sirrel,David Weir,Adrian Heath,Brian Robson,Micky Adams and Nigel Adkins.
I'd say there was plenty there to get apoplectic over without denigrating the best two in living memory and dropping depth charges all over the gaff.

 

[Bladebri]

02/03 was crap aa well.

Boo are they aa batteries

 

[Bladebri]

We all have memories from past years from the blades, but isn't it the here and now we should be looking forward to.

 

[Pinchy]

72 73 season under Harris
tell me how much sexy football we watched and thrilled to in this run of games

14 Oct 1972 West Ham United v Sheffield United L 3-1 League Division One
21 Oct 1972 Sheffield United v Everton L 0-1 League Division One
23 Oct 1972 Sheffield United v Charlton Athletic W 1-0 League Cup
28 Oct 1972 Derby County v Sheffield United L 2-1 League Division One
31 Oct 1972 Sheffield United v Arsenal L 1-2 League Cup
04 Nov 1972 Sheffield United v Stoke City D 0-0 League Division One
11 Nov 1972 Leeds United v Sheffield United L 2-1 League Division One
18 Nov 1972 Coventry City v Sheffield United L 3-0 League Division One
25 Nov 1972 Sheffield United v Wolverhampton Wanderers L 1-2 League Division One
09 Dec 1972 Sheffield United v Manchester City D 1-1 League Division One
16 Dec 1972 Sheffield United v Leicester City W 2-0 League Division One
23 Dec 1972 Tottenham Hotspur v Sheffield United L 2-0 League Division One
26 Dec 1972 Sheffield United v Liverpool L 0-3 League Division One
30 Dec 1972 Newcastle United v Sheffield United L 4-1 League Division One
06 Jan 1973 Sheffield United v West Bromwich Albion W 3-0 League Division One
20 Jan 1973 Southampton v Sheffield United D 1-1 League Division One
27 Jan 1973 Sheffield United v Norwich City W 2-0 League Division One
10 Feb 1973 Chelsea v Sheffield United L 4-2 League Division One
17 Feb 1973 Sheffield United v Birmingham City L 0-1 League Division One
24 Feb 1973 Leicester City v Sheffield United D 0-0 League Division One
03 Mar 1973 Arsenal v Sheffield United L 3-2 League Division One
our only 4 wins against charlton leicester west brom and norwich , other yo yo teams

having a misty eyed view of the era that turns a blind eye to how mediocre some of it was, then shamelessly picking on Bassetts efforts is being myopic

There really is no need for the statistics. If your preference is for alehouse football, simply say so. It's a bizarre and irrational choice but it is your prerogative. Don't try to clothe it in the same colours as proper football, though. You will just embarrass yourself as you have already.

The great thing about pub football is that it's available at your local park every weekend. Great views and no entrance charge. Fill your boots. Personally, I expect my team and professional football in general to give me a little more aesthetic pleasure than that, but that's me,

I'll have Tony Currie, George Best, Rodney Marsh, Stan Bowles, Jimmy Greaves, Peter Osgood, Alan Hudson, Liam Brady and Archie Gemmill to name but a few. You stick with Vinny Jones, Denis Wise and Wally Downes. Wally Fucking Downes.

 

[United Aren't Back.]

There really is no need for the statistics. If your preference is for alehouse football, simply say so. It's a bizarre and irrational choice but it is your prerogative. Don't try to clothe it in the same colours as proper football, though. You will just embarrass yourself as you have already.

The great thing about pub football is that it's available at your local park every weekend. Great views and no entrance charge. Fill your boots. Personally, I expect my team and professional football in general to give me a little more aesthetic pleasure than that, but that's me,

I'll have Tony Currie, George Best, Rodney Marsh, Stan Bowles, Jimmy Greaves, Peter Osgood, Alan Hudson, Liam Brady and Archie Gemmill to name but a few. You stick with Vinny Jones, Denis Wise and Wally Downes. Wally Fucking Downes.

Chris Wilder. Sending high crosses onto the head of Brian Deane. Paul Stancliffe punts it forward for Agana to score. Great football.

 

[pommpey]

Looks like Pinchy has had a very merry Christmas ....................................................................... nothing worse than an aggressive drunk.

Stock in trade innit? If you disagree, you're a cunt.

Missed in this argument are the progressions in sports science, the fitness and recovery programmes, the tactical data available to managers and their staff and the touchline tactics shown by ... ooh, Chris Wilder even which in my opinion would have our 1970s side gasping for breath as a League Division One side against today's two layers below League Division One side.

Anyone who thinks you can compare Harris's side to Bassett's and Bassett's to Warnock's then Warnock's to Wilder's and those in between needs their bumps felt. All eras have different styles and aspects of football.

But don't let a blowhard like Pinchy tell you any different.

pommpey

 

[Pinchy]

Stock in trade innit? If you disagree, you're a cunt.

Missed in this argument are the progressions in sports science, the fitness and recovery programmes, the tactical data available to managers and their staff and the touchline tactics shown by ... ooh, Chris Wilder even which in my opinion would have our 1970s side gasping for breath as a League Division One side against today's two layers below League Division One side.

Anyone who thinks you can compare Harris's side to Bassett's and Bassett's to Warnock's then Warnock's to Wilder's and those in between needs their bumps felt. All eras have different styles and aspects of football.

But don't let a blowhard like Pinchy tell you any different.

pommpey

No mention of McCabe. Still talks utter bollocks but it's progress nonetheless. Well done. More power to your driveshaft.

 

[pommpey]

No mention of McCabe. Still talks utter bollocks but it's progress nonetheless. Well done. More power to your driveshaft.

Progress is in spite of McCabe, not because.

And you know fuck all about 'power' and 'driveshafts'.

pommpey

 

[boo radley]

There really is no need for the statistics. If your preference is for alehouse football, simply say so. It's a bizarre and irrational choice but it is your prerogative. Don't try to clothe it in the same colours as proper football, though. You will just embarrass yourself as you have already.

The great thing about pub football is that it's available at your local park every weekend. Great views and no entrance charge. Fill your boots. Personally, I expect my team and professional football in general to give me a little more aesthetic pleasure than that, but that's me,

I'll have Tony Currie, George Best, Rodney Marsh, Stan Bowles, Jimmy Greaves, Peter Osgood, Alan Hudson, Liam Brady and Archie Gemmill to name but a few. You stick with Vinny Jones, Denis Wise and Wally Downes. Wally Fucking Downes.

My mate one came in to the pub talking about how well Wally Downs had done to get three Gold medals. It turns out he meant Rowdy Gaines. I'd rather have the swimmer.

 

[JJ Sefton]

My dad saw all the Harris years and all the Bassett years. I remember him saying in 89/90, "I used to watch Currie, how am I supposed to enjoy this?" My cousin told him "If Currie was playing today we couldn't afford him" Eventually my dad ended up enjoying the Bassett years well enough, two promotions, two miraculous survivals, a derby double, and the first FA Cup semi final at 42 since you were 10 will do that. He also said that as good as Harris' team could be, it was also capable of turning in some truly chaotic performances.

So the picture is more mixed than Harris vs Bassett, there's nuance. Of course, if pedalling this false dichotomy gives you a role to play that fills the vacuum that is your daily existence, then you will continue to see black and white where, in reality, there is shade.

Both Bassett and Harris are Blades legends.

 

[boo radley]

Stock in trade innit? If you disagree, you're a cunt.

Missed in this argument are the progressions in sports science, the fitness and recovery programmes, the tactical data available to managers and their staff and the touchline tactics shown by ... ooh, Chris Wilder even which in my opinion would have our 1970s side gasping for breath as a League Division One side against today's two layers below League Division One side.

Anyone who thinks you can compare Harris's side to Bassett's and Bassett's to Warnock's then Warnock's to Wilder's and those in between needs their bumps felt. All eras have different styles and aspects of football.

But don't let a blowhard like Pinchy tell you any different.

pommpey

You forget , the players of today cannot play with mud on their boots

 

[blade too long]

WE FINISHED 5TH UNDER HARRIS IN 1962

no subs then was an even playing field , money didnt dictate where you finished
players got peanuts

 

[blade too long]

Great managers do have at least one poor spell. Bassett has had more poor spells

again a myth
as I posted the 3 seasons after both went up were identical finishes

 

[Pollingtonblade]

There really is no need for the statistics. If your preference is for alehouse football, simply say so. It's a bizarre and irrational choice but it is your prerogative. Don't try to clothe it in the same colours as proper football, though. You will just embarrass yourself as you have already.

The great thing about pub football is that it's available at your local park every weekend. Great views and no entrance charge. Fill your boots. Personally, I expect my team and professional football in general to give me a little more aesthetic pleasure than that, but that's me,

I'll have Tony Currie, George Best, Rodney Marsh, Stan Bowles, Jimmy Greaves, Peter Osgood, Alan Hudson, Liam Brady and Archie Gemmill to name but a few. You stick with Vinny Jones, Denis Wise and Wally Downes. Wally Fucking Downes.

Wally Downes didn't play for us in the successful era we refer to.
As I said in another post those players you mention were of the time, wouldn't have lasted 2 minutes in modern football. 'Diplodocus' Dave recognised this and built a team accordingly.

 

[Silent Blade]

again a myth
as I posted the 3 seasons after both went up were identical finishes

1971 was not Harris' only promotion to the first division