Is promotion over-rated?

[Topplayersleave]

What does that matter? It's about the quality of players on the pitch and not the number of fans in the stands. Teams like Forest, Pigs and Sunderland with 35k fans turning out week in week out without fail would be where their fans think they should be if it was down to the number of fans.

Why should you think the pigs or Forest should be any higher than us based on attendances when they don't get as many as us.

Sunderland are averaging 30,000 for League One which is tremendous, that's more than they got last season.
But they've turned up for an expected promotion season and will drop like stones if they don't achieve it.
It'll be interesting to see what their attendances are like if they are still in League One six years from now.

 

[madeinsheffield]

If we aren't trying to get promoted, what are we doing?

Every point won is a step closer, yes we'll take the odd battering but I think we could hold our own from what I've seen of the PL, I don't like the conning of the refs that goes on with the falling to the ground with the slightest contact, we're supposed to be playing to the same rules in this division but I think some of our players are too honest (I do think we play things the right way though) and we could end up giving away chances of pens at the other end of the pitch by not going down in that division.

Get up, get the money and enjoy the ride, laugh at the pigs who will fail again this season and the shitstorm that's coming their way because they've banked on it

 

[derryblade]

Is promotion over-rated?

I would love to hear somebody put that question to Wilder. He's said publicly he wants to manage at the highest level, presumably that would be the premiership. It's not a leap of faith to say he wants to see us finish higher than last year and I don't think he would be happy knocking about at the top of the Championship without the owners really having a serious crack at gaining promotion automatically or through the playoffs.

 

[Houston_Blade]

Why should you think the pigs or Forest should be any higher than us based on attendances when they don't get as many as us.

Sunderland are averaging 30,000 for League One which is tremendous, that's more than they got last season.
But they've turned up for an expected promotion season and will drop like stones if they don't achieve it.
It'll be interesting to see what their attendances are like if they are still in League One six years from now.

It’s a shame irony can’t be shown in type. I was referring to the fact that all 3 clubs see themselves as footballing heavyweights and regularly laud the massiveness of their fan base. The reality is different. Sunderland is slightly different but that’s a bit like Norwich to me, I.e. you either go to the football or do nothing.

 

[Topplayersleave]

Bit like sex is over-rated?

Depends what you've got to work with, how engaged and enthusiastic your work mates are, as well as how skilled.

Do you have sex with your work mates ?

 

[tincan]

Surely the PL is just a side show to finance the billionaires. I want to watch my club win every game playing great football. What league that is in secondary. What that team costs is only relevant if the costs for watching them interfere with my ability to watch the team. The elation when the team score a goal cannot be replaced so when we do go up and cannot score a goal ( ala Huddersfield) then that is to be addressed.

 

[N20 Blade]

The irony is that in some cases, the longer you survive, the greater the apathy levels, e.g. WBA. I've a friend who had a season ticket in the PL and grew completely disillusioned with the weekly grind of the PL, and remember they weren't always struggling badly. He's already enjoyed this season much more due to goals, winning and approaching games with optimism. It looks as if Burnley are on the slide, though there are probably three worse sides than them, so they could survive but again, how enjoyable will it be for the rest of their time in the PL, almost inevitable they'll drop soon, same again Newcastle, Huddersfield. The contrast is with Bournemouth, who have not ever been in a true relegation fight AND are great to watch; kudos to Howe, the players and owners. To answer the question, promotion is definitely worth it and not over-rated, with the right infrastructure; we have the requisite manager that's for sure.

 

[Blend-it-like-Harris]

Let's face it - the Premier League is an International League with a handfull of teams dominating and many games predictable and therefore pretty boring to watch. The Championship is a great league to play in and all the games competitive (apart from the odd one-sided affairs here and there) and probably equivalent to the old 1st Division in terms of standard and quality of entertainment. You can't stay there though; you either aim to go up or get relegated to League 1 sooner or later. Prom to the Prem - bring it on as quick as poss before Chris Wilder gets promoted before us, 'cause for sure we won't get promoted with him managing somewhere else.

 

[Topplayersleave]

We'd clap like a bunch of seals at feeding time if we went up, we'd clap even louder if we stayed up and I can't imagine what we'd do if we went up and surprised a few people by outperforming those giants of the game like Watford, Brighton, Bournemouth, Crystal Palace, Huddersfield, Fulham, Burnley

 

[Sheffsteel]

Why should you think the pigs or Forest should be any higher than us based on attendances when they don't get as many as us..

Agree, people probably don’t realise how poor Nottingham Forest’s support has been over the years.
They’ve generally had steady support of 20K to 23K but have never had big support and considering their major successes it’s poor support really.

I’ll give some facts to demonstrate this.

The last season Forest broke 25K average gates was 23 years ago in 1996 when they averaged 25,916 in the top flight.

Last season we averaged almost 26,854. When do you think was the last time Forest averaged more than 26,854?

The answer is 1979, the season when they were reigning champions finishing 2nd in the league that season and going on to win the version of the Champions league.

Wednesday have also had decent support over the years and the occasional massive crowd but they are another club that in the last 50 years have never had regular big crowds.

 

[Sean Thornton]

Agree, people probably don’t realise how poor Nottingham Forest’s support has been over the years.
They’ve generally had steady support of 20K to 23K but have never had big support and considering their major successes it’s poor support really.

I’ll give some facts to demonstrate this.

The last season Forest broke 25K average gates was 23 years ago in 1996 when they averaged 25,916 in the top flight.

Last season we averaged almost 26,854. When do you think was the last time Forest averaged more than 26,854?

The answer is 1979, the season when they were reigning champions finishing 2nd in the league that season and going on to win the version of the Champions league.

Wednesday have also had decent support over the years and the occasional massive crowd but they are another club that in the last 50 years have never had regular big crowds.

Isn't that proving derekacorah s post?

 

[Mumbo]

Hear me out.

Would you rather see your team winning or losing?

We play lovely football and on our day are the best team in the division.

Same could have been said of Fulham.

They sit on a lowly 5 points in the first week of November.

They have an owner far richer than ours.

My concern is that we’d have no idea how to push the boat out enough to be successful. As such we’d be facing a miserable season.

I’m not saying that we wouldn’t have a go in the Wilder sense but those above just have no clue.

Even now, when other owners are splashing the cash, Wilder is self funding with the Brooks sale.

Meanwhile our two owners are dicking around at the High Court.

Now promotion might be the silver bullet that beings it all together but you can imagine as a PL club the added scrutiny and off field problems overshadowing infield efforts.

We just don’t seam to have the wherewithal in the Boardroom to see this through properly.

In answer to your question...
I want to see us winning but unfortunately a consequence of winning is always promotion.

 

[LoughboroBlade]

Fulham have made the mistake of changing their squad too much. They didn’t need to, just one or two signings to improve what they have. They went and signed a whole new first team almost.

Complete overkill and has disrupted the balance of their squad. It showed tonight against Huddersfield.

Not been helped either to be fair by Cairney’s absence. He was arguably their most important player last season.

 

[SW12 to S12 to S18]

Agree, people probably don’t realise how poor Nottingham Forest’s support has been over the years.
They’ve generally had steady support of 20K to 23K but have never had big support and considering their major successes it’s poor support really.

I’ll give some facts to demonstrate this.

The last season Forest broke 25K average gates was 23 years ago in 1996 when they averaged 25,916 in the top flight.

Last season we averaged almost 26,854. When do you think was the last time Forest averaged more than 26,854?

The answer is 1979, the season when they were reigning champions finishing 2nd in the league that season and going on to win the version of the Champions league.

Wednesday have also had decent support over the years and the occasional massive crowd but they are another club that in the last 50 years have never had regular big crowds.

Nottingham doesn’t have a particularly big population so I wouldn’t expect many more than they are getting. Look at County, even in the Premiership or old first division, their crowds were rather poor, I just don’t think Nottingham is a very sporting city.

 

[Davalon]

Do you have sex with your work mates ?

Doesn't everyone?

 

[Topplayersleave]

In answer to your question...
I want to see us winning but unfortunately a consequence of winning is always promotion.

Yes, maybe we could win the Championship title, ask for the Premier league money but stay where we are so that we can keep winning

It would be cheaper, we could keep winning, and we wouldn't have to mix with those plastic Tarquins

 

[SB_90]

Potentially yes. But if Huddersfield can stay up with a squad similar to ours loans & frees then surely we would have a chance. Also november - january not forget where we came from & sack the manager. As for a few years it used to be thing that you effectively got a p45 with your winners medal

But even worse case scenario we've seen some of best players & managers in the world come to Bramall lane & we are 100m + parachute payments better off

 

[itsinyerblood]

Just as a (related) aside, last Saturday's home game for Bournemouth saw them attract just under eleven thousand.

Well done to Howe and his team, especially the Russian benefactor who has piled in millions to ensure they remain a Premiership team.....but with all the variables associated with remaining in the Premiership, surely it's worth us, the pub team, who only recently couldn't seem to escape from Division 1, fighting for the right to be in the Premiership, and then do our very best to stay there. It's not beyond us to get a healthy home attendance in the Prem of between 30-35 thousand per home game, is it?

Wilder has shown that with the right methodology it's possible to compete at whatever level your players are capable of competing. So in answer to the question of whether the Premiership is over-rated, the answer is a very simple one; we have to do our very best to become a Premiership team, we owe it to the players, ourselves, and to the club. It's the best time I can recall to play amongst England's finest teams, so in my opinion we'd let ourselves down if we didn't give this our best shot. The consequence of remaining stagnant is that we'll lose our best players and it wouldn't be long before we returned to Division 1, possibly even Division 2. If you think that's far fetched cast your minds back to our recent past and who we were playing 2-3 years ago.

We've a great manager, a good squad out of which we can select a first team capable of competing with this division's finest, so why anyone feels it necessary to wonder if the Premiership is worth all this effort is baffling to me. We're here for a reason, because we're good enough - what was it a highly rated commentator recently said, "Sheffield United are the Arsenal of the Championship", it's time we (not all of us of course) accepted that we're better than average, so let's see where this season's campaign can take us.

 

[Champagneblade]

Which is probably what Fulham fans said about Slavisa Jokanovic last season - now in line for the sack.


Which is precisely what Martin Samuel says today:

'When your league (European Super League) fails, as it will because it is artificial and boring, in essence non-competitive and the fans will hate it, don't think you can come back to us on the same deal as before.

Junior partners. That is what you will be. Half a vote at the meetings, half the money when we divide the spoils up at the end of the season.

You'll have to take it, because the alternative will be to go back to your empty, meaningless league, or to tour the world like the Harlem Globetrotters playing exhibition matches for Charlie Stillitano against all the other clubs too greedy to know they were on to a good thing.' Link

Occasionally writes some good stuff, does Samuel. But then he goes and ruins it. He thinks FFP should be abolished as it has been a 'self-serving scam':

'It was hijacked from its original course and turned into a means of raising the drawbridge on the rest of football so that owner investment became close to illegal, and nobody could catch those already in front.

So, excuse those who find Manchester City's circumventing of some profoundly unfair and harmful rules the least of the problems with FFP.

Provided owner investment is a gift, not a loan, and does not have to be paid back, what is the issue?' Link

Samuel now sees FFP as 'unfair' and 'punishing the ambitious'. He really needs to make his mind up.



Really?

Manchester City accused of cheating: Club face UEFA and Premier League sanctions as hacked documents claim Sheik Mansour paid sponsor deals himself to satisfy FFP and financial reports are labelled 'web of lies'

It claimed £59.5m of £67.5m deal with Etihad Airways was financed by Mansour (City's owner). Link So, according to Samuel, 'What is the issue?' Oh, and maybe of interest to Mr McCabe...

Now Manchester City want a Chinese club as Premier League giants close in on deal to buy Far East side (taking their global portfolio up to six!)

• Manchester City are in the final stages of adding a Chinese club to their portfolio
• Deal for the side, believed to be in Chengdu, should be confirmed this year

What I find laughable about the last point is how la Liga are now having a moan.

It seems they didn’t have a problem with Fairness when Madrid and Barca were hoovering up Galacticos or when, having overspent, Madrid’s training complex had its land re-zoned before it was sold on for greater value. Nope no issue here Guv!

Still smarting from PSG taking poster boy Neymar they are now crying fair play over Man City!

 

[The Crab]

Do you have sex with your work mates ?

Probably if he's a porn actor

 

[The Crab]

Doesn't everyone?

Well, Christmas party season is coming up.......................

 

[TONY_TONY_AGANA]

In a weird, twisted way I kind of miss going to games and being the underdog, certainly at this level and above. There's an air of expectation around Bramall Lane now and don't get me wrong it's great, because it means we're doing well.

Promotion is not overrated. This is the main reason I go to games...to see us win the league or get promoted. I want other people to take notice of the way Wilder has us playing, it's a breath of fresh air. Imagine reporters and TV channels waxing lyrical about the expansive style of football that little old hoof ball merchants Sheff United have started to implement. I want us to prove people wrong.

But I'll still miss the cries of 'put him in the stands' or 'snap him'.

 

[true99blade]

I’d love to see this core of players go from League 1 to the Premier League.