I know very little about Jimmy hagan but...

[Silent Blade]

Not legally. Under the counter payments were rife, and many people moved for that reason. A player was also eligible for a signing on fee (though it wasn't much).

Hagan was earning more money via a legitimate route. He trained as a chartered surveyor and was effectively part time at the Lane.

Dont think he ever played in every game for for us in one season. Usually about 25 to 35 per games a season

 

[FTPE]

Excuse my ignorance, but is there anything of significance named after Sir Jimmy at Bramall Lane? It seems odd that the two statues outside the ground are of Joe Shaw (another great servant to the club) and Derek Dooley.

There was quite a cool looking (but very small)statue in the old ticket office, but I'm not sure where that has gone. As for named areas?there's a bar or suit named after currie, and one called 1889 but other than that I don't know

 

[Silent Blade]

Dont think he ever played in every game for for us in one season. Usually about 25 to 35 per games a season

Just looked up his league appearances per season for us

38-39, 28 (joined Blades from Derby and his debut for us was in Nov 1938)
46-47, 33
47-48, 29
48-49, 40
49-50, 26
50-51, 36
51-52, 26
52-53, 37
53-54, 25
54-55, 28
55-56, 22
56-57, 27
57-58, 4

In his 11 full seasons he played over 30 appearances only 4 times. Were his absences from some of the matches due to his "business interests"?

 

[GRUMPY BLADE]

Think is, there are now grown men to whom the Deane and Agana partrnership is ancient history :-(

Even worse, we have teenage fans who have no memory of the Triple Assault season.....

Even worse; we've got kids now who haven't got a hero.

 

[Lane Ender]

Even worse; we've got kids now who haven't got a hero.

Of course they have Micheal Higdon

 

[SUFC Handsworth]

Just looked up his league appearances per season for us

38-39, 28 (joined Blades from Derby and his debut for us was in Nov 1938)
46-47, 33
47-48, 29
48-49, 40
49-50, 26
50-51, 36
51-52, 26
52-53, 37
53-54, 25
54-55, 28
55-56, 22
56-57, 27
57-58, 4

In his 11 full seasons he played over 30 appearances only 4 times. Were his absences from some of the matches due to his "business interests"?

He probably missed his best years due to the war as far as total appearances per season - would he have been early mid 20s in those years?

 

[Sothall_Blade]

In February 1951 Wendy tried to sign him for £32,500 which would have broken the British transfer fee even though Hagan was 33 at the time. Hagan rejected the move and Wendy got relegation a few months later. They were a yo yo club in the 1950s. In 1950 they pipped the Blades by 0.08 goal average to get promoted, relegated in 1951, champions in 1952, relegated in 1955, Champions in 1956, relegated in 1958 and champions in 1959

I've heard the story of "How we tried to sell Hagan to Wednesday" countless times but I've never heard the part about him being 33!
That puts a whole new complexion on the proposed sale, doesn't it?
Possibly receiving a British record transfer fee for a 33 year old, who only averaged 30 games a season.
Who can blame United's Board for accepting that offer?

I suppose a modern day equivalent would be Everton offering £86M for Steven Gerrard.
Gerrard would turn it down for the same reasons that Hagan did but you couldn't blame Liverpool for snapping their hands off.

The question is, if United had sold Hagan for £32,500 in 1951, would they have re-invested the money in other players.
If we had added 4 or 5 quality players to the team at that time, could we have gone on to establish ourselves in the First Division?
Or even win a major trophy? With Hagan we finished 13th in 1955 before slipping back down.

 

[Blackheath Blade]

Excuse my ignorance, but is there anything of significance named after Sir Jimmy at Bramall Lane? It seems odd that the two statues outside the ground are of Joe Shaw (another great servant to the club) and Derek Dooley.

We also have a statue on display of Michael Higdon on the pitch every other Saturday.

 

[Kenilworth]

We also have a statue on display of Michael Higdon on the pitch every other Saturday.

Is it life size?

 

[madeinsheffield]

Is it life size?

Larger than life!

 

[SUFC Handsworth]

The question is, if United had sold Hagan for £32,500 in 1951, would they have re-invested the money in other players.
If we had added 4 or 5 quality players to the team at that time, could we have gone on to establish ourselves in the First Division?
Or even win a major trophy? With Hagan we finished 13th in 1955 before slipping back down.

Think the last 40 years have proved selling the family silver simply hasn't worked.

 

[Trigger Blade]

I seem to recall that Jimmy Hagan's son used to post on VP or BU, no idea if he's on here these days.....

 

[Sothall_Blade]

Think the last 40 years have proved selling the family silver simply hasn't worked.

Only because we've sold the family silver and replaced it with plastic instead of gold
It seems to me that no Second Division club in the country would turn down a British record fee for a 33 year old at any time in history.
The likes of Southampton would take the windfall, re-invest it and come back stronger.
We probably wouldn't have (or haven't done for 40 years) and that's been the cause of our demise.

 

[Silent Blade]

He probably missed his best years due to the war as far as total appearances per season - would he have been early mid 20s in those years?

Born in January 1918

 

[Sirius]

I seem to recall that Jimmy Hagan's son used to post on VP or BU, no idea if he's on here these days.....

He is a regular poster on. Blades reunited

 

[FTPE]

VP?
BU?
Blades reunited?

 

[Tynemouth Blade]

My Dad, God bless him (he's not dead, but God bless him!) always talks about when he was an apprentice at Bramall Lane and was sent to train with Hagan.
It was in the early 1950's and Hagan used to train alone at the back of the Kop where there used to be some tennis courts and my Dad said his skills were tremendous and the bloke was a true gentleman taking the time to give advice to a 16 year old player.

 

[Woodwardfan]

Think the last 40 years have proved selling the family silver simply hasn't worked.

Think the last 40 years have proved selling the family silver simply hasn't worked.

A bit longer than that ,1967 United sold Mick Jones to Leeds. Only because Hagan said "no" did it not start so much earlier.

 

[Sirius]

A bit longer than that ,1967 United sold Mick Jones to Leeds. Only because Hagan said "no" did it not start so much earlier.

Alex Forbes to. Arsenal. Jim. Isley to. Spurs didn't go down well either. Both. We're crowd favourites and were missed..

 

[Kentblade]

I was there too and could'nt believe Hagan had been sent off. IMO he was the best player I have seen in a Blade's shirt. Regarding the Wendy offer, I am told that Hagan, who was a strong minded man told the Board to do one, adding that he wouldn't dare walk down the Moor had the transfer gone through.
Broomhill Blade's book the Jimmy Hagan story is a great read.
Hagan took free kicks that were very accurate. He knew how far ten yards was and was quick to point out to the ref when an opponent encroached.
On one occasion he pointed out that a player was much closer to the ball than ten yards. The ref took no notice and told Jimmy to get on with it, whereupon the Master blasted the ball very accurately at the transgressor hitting him in the nuts.

That game was v West Brom and their player was Ray Barlow who went down like a sack of spuds.Was the left half for the Brom on that day.
Can see and recall it as if it was yesterday.

 

[SUFC Handsworth]

A bit longer than that ,1967 United sold Mick Jones to Leeds. Only because Hagan said "no" did it not start so much earlier.

Lol thought the same on the way home from work, getting more towards 50 years!

It does make you wonder with some of these 4th rate boards if we'd built teams around the better players instead of flogging um off. Put Jones and Birchenall in the early 70s team and it could well have been Sheffield United rather than Leeds that were competing for all those titles and cups. Kept Deane, Fjortoft, Tiler, Ward and Hutchison in 97-98 and we'd have been promoted and reached the cup final. Kept all the home grown players of recent times - Jags, Walker, Naughton, Lowton, Maguire, Quinn, Sharp - and we'd certainly not be in the third tier now.

 

[Woodwardfan]

Lol thought the same on the way home from work, getting more towards 50 years!

It does make you wonder with some of these 4th rate boards if we'd built teams around the better players instead of flogging um off. Put Jones and Birchenall in the early 70s team and it could well have been Sheffield United rather than Leeds that were competing for all those titles and cups. Kept Deane, Fjortoft, Tiler, Ward and Hutchison in 97-98 and we'd have been promoted and reached the cup final. Kept all the home grown players of recent times - Jags, Walker, Naughton, Lowton, Maguire, Quinn, Sharp - and we'd certainly not be in the third tier now.

To inspire teams to win and players to stay we need the right manager.

Perhaps the prince will break the mould, given time.

 

[Silent Blade]

Put Jones and Birchenall in the early 70s team

Although Birchenall had a good scoring record against Wendy, my dad thought we got very good money from Chelsea for him (John Harris wasnt as upset when Birch left as he was when Jones left). Birchenall's autobiography is still the best I have read by an ex Blade though!

 

[Lord Bos of Eckington.]

Although Birchenall had a good scoring record against Wendy, my dad thought we got very good money from Chelsea for him (John Harris wasnt as upset when Birch left as he was when Jones left). Birchenall's autobiography is still the best I have read by an ex Blade though!

Silent Blade . Yes the Birchenall autobiography is good . I was a ball boy at the lane , and helped make the tea at half time. Totally irrelevant but The Birch ( Sherman) liked his tea strong with 3no sugars.

Mr Harris who was a true gentleman , used to have his tea on a silver service.

Happy days and happy times.

UTB

 

[Shalalalafenoughty]

In the course of my work I used to bump into a solicitor from Wakefield and talk sport with him. He was mainly a rugby league man but in his younger days he'd been a regular at Leeds Road to watch Huddersfield. When he realised I was a Unitedite he said he vividly recalled going to a Huddersfield v United match in the fifties when he was about twelve which United won 4-2 and the game was totally dominated by what he described as a "genius" in our midfield who he said completely ran the game. He couldn't remember the player's name, however. I said I was sure it would be Hagan but I'd look it up.

Denis Clarebrough's book revealed that we'd won there 4-1 in November, 1956. The footnote simply says: "Hagan outstanding."

Roger Barnard's book quoted this report on the game from journalist, Dave Pardon: "Four minutes after kick-off, the Huddersfield centre-half Ken Quested's face bore a puzzled, baffled look as, with three of his colleagues, he was beaten by the greatest piece of ball-play I have seen. Jimmy Hagan beat four successive tackles without moving the ball outside a two-foot radius, put a gentle 30-yard crossfield pass to Waldock, and stood applauding Howitt's volleyed goal. Hagan was on form. He went through the first half with a fantastic display - an exhibition which put the crowd on his side, and cheering every time he put boot to ball. That was often enough to turn the Huddersfield defence into a shambles."

It's worth bearing in mind he was thirty-eight at the time.

 

[Woodwardfan]

In the course of my work I used to bump into a solicitor from Wakefield and talk sport with him. He was mainly a rugby league man but in his younger days he'd been a regular at Leeds Road to watch Huddersfield. When he realised I was a Unitedite he said he vividly recalled going to a Huddersfield v United match in the fifties when he was about twelve which United won 4-2 and the game was totally dominated by what he described as a "genius" in our midfield who he said completely ran the game. He couldn't remember the player's name, however. I said I was sure it would be Hagan but I'd look it up.

Denis Clarebrough's book revealed that we'd won there 4-1 in November, 1956. The footnote simply says: "Hagan outstanding."

Roger Barnard's book quoted this report on the game from journalist, Dave Pardon: "Four minutes after kick-off, the Huddersfield centre-half Ken Quested's face bore a puzzled, baffled look as, with three of his colleagues, he was beaten by the greatest piece of ball-play I have seen. Jimmy Hagan beat four successive taclkes without moving the ball outside a two-foot radius, put a genle 30-yard crossfield pass to Waldock, and sttod applauding Howitt's volleyed goal

Bobby Howitt 1955-58. I remember him more than Hagan for some reason. Upright player in midfield, No.10 I seem to recall. Hagan I remember as No.8, Ringstead 7.

We used to stand to the left of the Kop goal right at the front at the railings. I remember Howitt taking and scoring a penalty into the Kop and continuing his run right in front to us., rather an extrovert celebration for those days!

 

[Silent Blade]

Bobby Howitt 1955-58. I remember him more than Hagan for some reason. Upright player in midfield, No.10 I seem to recall. Hagan I remember as No.8, Ringstead 7.

We used to stand to the left of the Kop goal right at the front at the railings. I remember Howitt taking and scoring a penalty into the Kop and continuing his run right in front to us., rather an extrovert celebration for those days!

Bobby Howitt was Stoke's captain when 46 year old Stanley Matthews returned to Stoke in 1961

[img class="http://i.thisis.co.uk/275563/article/images/3555876/2069609.jpg| kalooga_12288" alt=" " src="http://i.thisis.co.uk/275563/article/images/3555876/2069609-large.jpg">

 

[finlaytheblade]

I remember going to the old forge ground(which was behind the owlerton dog track gone now i think) to see a charity match
late fifties hagan had retired but turned out. Once or twice the pitch was invaded by young boys of which i was one it was all good natured and jimmy i recall was very graciouse in trying to usher us off the pitch.I had made a point of getting up close to him as he was my dads idol and was always telling me what a great player he was.He lost some of his best years due to the war and so never broke some records which his brilliance deserved.

 

[Hodgyman]

I am also too young to remember Hagan but was fortunate to be a young lad when Currie and Woodward ruled. Currie was my hero and could indeed "do magic" but to my Dad, he was never as good as Hagan. I don't know anyone of my fathers generation that saw both play who doesn't say that Hagan was the best. My Dad still goes dewy eyed at the memory of "wonderful, wonderful Jimmy Hagan". My Grandfather, who saw Gillespie, Dodds, Dunne et al, all the way through to Currie also said that Hagan was the best. He must have been some player and clearly a principled man to boot. So far removed from today's bunch!

I too was at Joe Shaw's testimonial (what a legend he was) and saw Jimmy Hagan play and then understood what my dad and my uncles (all regulars at the lane for years) said about him being the best player to ever play for United, past, present and future. A particular memory from that game was when Jimmy "plucked" the ball, travelling at some pace, from waist height by an outstretched leg. It seemed as if he trapped the ball between his toes and shin and brought it down in one rapid movement. I do not remember anyone else doing that feat of brilliant ball control since. I was also astounded by the quality of the free kick he scored with too. Not bad for a man in his 50s who was the manager of WBA then

 

[FTPE]

A few things I don't understand (hopefully due to age rather than ignorance)

- what were the "other games" he was scoring in during the war? Wikipedia doesn't describe them as league or cup games.

- what kind of team was the "war time" England team that he played for 16 times and scored 11 goals?

- I know he didn't get going with us until he was around 28, and I can see that he didn't make many appearances each season... But his goal scoring record isn't as amazing as I expected to be.

Can anyone shoot me down, or clear any of that up?