How far can Non League Nigel take us?

[bricktop]

So far i have been very impressed with the work he has done. He has tore apart a squad what was full of dross, and turned a side round who was undoubtedly the worst i have seen in all my years into a solid side who look exciting going forward. He has got rid of a few players who needed bombing out of the club. Westlake, Brandy, Cuvelier, Williams, and McMahon, and transformed a couple more who needed bombing out in to confident exciting players fo watch. Flynn and Murphy. He has also brought in 3 players who have been excellent. Harris, Brayford and Scougall who is one of the best signings we have made for a long time.

I have recently bought and read an excellent book about Clough snr. (Nobody ever says thankyou by Jonathon Wilson). This has been a fascinating read that i have enjoyed as it is a very objective biography of one of the most intriguing and charasmatic characters in football, and i have noticed a lot of similarities between father and son.

The biggest question i have now in my own mind is that Clough junior about to embark on a journey similar to the ones his father took Derby and Forest on? There are a lot of similarities between Brians early days at both these clubs and what Nigel has done here so far. I think at the minute we have hit upon what will be the best manager this club has had for at least a generation and i will be disappointed if this time in 18 months we are not back in Championship, and longer term have not pushed on.

 

[Silent Blade]

Andy Garner = Peter Taylor
Michael Doyle = Jon McGovern
Gary Crosby = Jimmy Gordon

 

[bricktop]

Can you see any resemblences Silent?

 

[PeterNdlovu081]

Still very early days yet.

Things can go from good to bad in football very quickly i.e. Danny Wilson.

 

[itsinyerblood]

So far i have been very impressed with the work he has done. He has tore apart a squad what was full of dross, and turned a side round who was undoubtedly the worst i have seen in all my years into a solid side who look exciting going forward. He has got rid of a few players who needed bombing out of the club. Westlake, Brandy, Cuvelier, Williams, and McMahon, and transformed a couple more who needed bombing out in to confident exciting players fo watch. Flynn and Murphy. He has also brought in 3 players who have been excellent. Harris, Brayford and Scougall who is one of the best signings we have made for a long time.

I have recently bought and read an excellent book about Clough snr. (Nobody ever says thankyou by Jonathon Wilson). This has been a fascinating read that i have enjoyed as it is a very objective biography of one of the most intriguing and charasmatic characters in football, and i have noticed a lot of similarities between father and son.

The biggest question i have now in my own mind is that Clough junior about to embark on a journey similar to the ones his father took Derby and Forest on? There are a lot of similarities between Brians early days at both these clubs and what Nigel has done here so far. I think at the minute we have hit upon what will be the best manager this club has had for at least a generation and i will be disappointed if this time in 18 months we are not back in Championship, and longer term have not pushed on.

Interesting post brownie, and I'm sure your thoughts are in line with everyone on here. I'm no different to most posters, I think that what's happened since Clough was appointed is a sign of things to come. What is it, less than six months since he took control? And to reflect your comments, he's acted decisively in both moving players out, and bringing quality in. I think it's his judgement of a player I like. I can recall too many players being brought into this club by previous managers, who were unworthy of the shirt and didn't disappoint that view. We've had more than our fair share of substandard dross over the years, and the players, be they loans or signings, that Clough has brought in so far have all been either decent or superb additions to the squad. Plus, as you've touched upon, his eye for what a player may have to offer seems excellent, and I'm not just thinking of Flynn and Murphy, but also Howard too. He now looks like a first rate keeper and not just a someone who might get a game.

Good post mate UTB

 

[Silent Blade]

Can you see any resemblences Silent?

Some ways. I think they share a lot in how football should be played. Brian rarely criticises refs (the only times I remember when he got angry with refs were in European matches especially when Derby lost the European Cup semis 1st leg at Juventus in 1973) and doesnt show too much emotion in the dugout. Nigel is quite the opposite. Nigel is probably less of a dictator and doesnt appear brash in interviews

 

[Silent Blade]

And to reflect your comments, he's acted decisively in both moving players out, and bringing quality in. I think it's his judgement of a player I like. I can recall too many players being brought into this club by previous managers, who were unworthy of the shirt and didn't disappoint that view. We've had more than our fair share of substandard dross over the years, and the players, be they loans or signings, that Clough has brought in so far have all been either decent or superb additions to the squad. Plus, as you've touched upon, his eye for what a player may have to offer seems excellent, and I'm not just thinking of Flynn and Murphy, but also Howard too. He now looks like a first rate keeper and not just a someone who might get a game.

Yes that is another similarity

 

[Damski]

Good thread. Mid table Championship seems to be his level. Maybe he can take us further, but right now, that's a great target for the next few years.

 

[SwitchBLADE Smiles]

World Cup Qualification... SORT IT AHT KEV!

 

[Lane Ender]

Let Nigel get us out of this horrendous division that's what we brought him here for.
So far he's brought pride and respectability back to this club and next season he,'ll bring the league 1 title.
Isn't that enough to think about for the time being

 

[Bergen Blade]

You can agree or disagree with certain tactical moves, but there always seems to be a specific thought behind them.

At MK Dons he did small tweaks like putting Flynn (who was getting bullied by Lewington) on the left hand side in the second half, and then also switching Coady and Scougall to try to make the latter compensate for a less mobile right hand side in Baxter/Davies.

At the end he switched to 5-4-1, and interestingly let the youngster Kennedy go into the middle position (where you'd expect to see the most experienced centre half, i.e. Collins), but I'm sure Clough had his reasons for that as well.

 

[PeterNdlovu081]

He's come a long way.

 

[Bladesman]

World Cup?

 

[Borbokisfreekick]

Good thread. Mid table Championship seems to be his level. Maybe he can take us further, but right now, that's a great target for the next few years.

Good O.P.

With backing,Cloughy is more than capable of taking us into the Premier League. He was a mid table Championship manager because that's what the budget at Derby had allowed him. He obviously built a good team at derby this season (they're 3rd) but wasn't given the time this season....which is our gain.

He's shown so far that he is a shrewd tactician - has a plan A, B and C; has a great eye for a player; is great in pre and post match interviews; has passion; has strong morals - i.e. quickly recognized bad eggs i.e. McMahon, King, Brandy (even though I think he's worth a 2nd chance), Williams, and shipped them out.

He will take us far, and the only thing that would stop him would be a lack of investment, lack of backing or a break down in the relationship with the fans...and I don't see any of those happening anytime soon.

 

[UnitedBlade]

Andy Garner = Peter Taylor
Michael Doyle = Jon McGovern
Gary Crosby = Jimmy Gordon

Please tell me we have someone who = John Robertson. One of the greatest players of modern times. Not bad for a fat lad on the wing. Now that would be something if we unearthed a player like him.

 

[bornablade]

I cannot praise NC enough. How far can he take us? IMO he can take us as far as this club wants to go. The owners, the rest of the board, Nige and his management team, all the players and us (the fans), if we all pull in the same direction, keep our feet firmly on the floor and each support the other and remain UNITED then I think we could see something at BDTBL the likes most of us have never seen before.

It's not going to be a walk in the park. There will be setbacks but let's all remain together. I haven't felt as optimistic as a Blade for years.

His greatest achievement so far? Scougall? Brayford? Maybe Flynn and Murphy?

To me it's getting us to believe and trust him.
Look back a few weeks ago. Most of us were up in arms about Doyle getting sent off. 'Hope Cloughie dunt bring him straight back and give him the armband.' 'Needs to be treated same way as Brandy'. etc etc.

Well Doyle came back in, he was given the armband and we've all accepted it. Reason is because we trust your judgement Nige.

At last (how many years have we waited for this) we've appointed someone that we can all relate to.

 

[Silent Blade]

Please tell me we have someone who = John Robertson. One of the greatest players of modern times. Not bad for a fat lad on the wing. Now that would be something if we unearthed a player like him.

Scot John Robertson was an overweight player who loved fags that Brian inherited at Forest. Murphy is a Scot too and is right footed like Robertson but not overweight. Murphy had hardly any confidence for a long time and Nigel did very well to make Murphy belief in himself more so Murphy = Robertson? What about finding out who is our Archie Gemmill, John O'Hare, Kevin Hector etc. Oh what about Harry Maguire = Roy McFarland or Larry Lloyd?

 

[itsinyerblood]

Scot John Robertson was an overweight player who loved fags that Brian inherited at Forest. Murphy is a Scot too and is right footed like Robertson but not overweight. Murphy had hardly any confidence for a long time and Nigel did very well to make Murphy belief in himself more so Murphy = Robertson? What about finding out who is our Archie Gemmill, John O'Hare, Kevin Hector etc. Oh what about Harry Maguire = Roy McFarland or Larry Lloyd?

Or could Maguire morph into the equivalent of Harold Lloyd?

 

[bornablade]

Expectations from Forest fans gave Trevor Francis a huge weight on his shoulders with the £million fee. Could be said that the stick Ched will receive from opposing fans will put a huge weight on his shoulders come October.

 

[BladeFisher]

Expectations from Forest fans gave Trevor Francis a huge weight on his shoulders with the £million fee. Could be said that the stick Ched will receive from opposing fans will put a huge weight on his shoulders come October.

Has he agreed to come back? Apparently he is going to be squad number 2 if he does.

 

[Ollessendro]

I think it is easy to get carried away by recent results (we've had some shockers since Clough was in charge) but the transformation in the way we play has been incredible. Under the latter stages of Blackwell's reign, the disasterous tenure of Adams, all of Wilson's time in charge and also under Weir we looked slow, immobile, pedestrian, not athletic and lacking ideas. Clough has transformed that completely by brining in Brayford and Scougall and getting the best out of Flynn and Murphy, plus using the intelligence of Baxter and Coady. All of a sudden we are a counter attacking team. Soaking up pressure and hitting teams on the break with pace and power. What a refreshing change! This has been miraculous. Watching us pass the ball from side to side against Wear with no penetration whatsoever and then seeing us attack and cut open Villa, Fulham, Forest etc only a few months later is incredible.

Cloughy is slowly winning me over. He seems to have the tactical nous, but it is still early days. He has got us very solid and hitting teams on the break, however I wonder what might happen when the onus is on us to break teams down. It will be intgeresting to see what he does against Charlton on Sundi, as they are a counter attacking side. They will set up defensively and hit us on the break. They have pace and will look to catch us out. Next season (when we are hopefully pushing for automatic promotion) teams will park the bus, like they did in Wilson's first season. So Clough will be forced to change tactics and attack teams. He has adopted different tactics and outfoxed some highly rated and experienced managers so far though, so hopefully he will be able to continue to do that.

Early days suggest that Clough and SUFC are a good match. He is a no nonsense, no bullshit, serrious footballing man. He is old school in his principles and morals and has his feet on the ground. I think his simple nature has helped him to start to win the fans over.

How far can he take us? It's difficult to say. He did well at Burton, but then his CV looks fairly average at Derby. But they did not back him and we should be able to. His signings at SUFC have made a big difference. Brayford is awesome and so much better than McMahon. Scougall is very impressive too. Harris and Davies are good additions and he has given confidence and got improvements from Coady, Flynn, Baxter and Murphy .... even Porter!? I'd like to think that if we back him then he can get us out of this godforsaken league quickly and then who knows.

 

[GRUMPY BLADE]

Please tell me we have someone who = John Robertson. One of the greatest players of modern times. Not bad for a fat lad on the wing. Now that would be something if we unearthed a player like him.

Scoogs?

 

[Revolution]

I think it is easy to get carried away by recent results (we've had some shockers since Clough was in charge) but the transformation in the way we play has been incredible. Under the latter stages of Blackwell's reign, the disasterous tenure of Adams, all of Wilson's time in charge and also under Weir we looked slow, immobile, pedestrian, not athletic and lacking ideas.

All of Wilson's time in charge? Really? Even in 2011-2?

That team scored 92 goals. Hate to think how many it would have got had it not lacked ideas.

 

[Zanzibar]

All of Wilson's time in charge? Really? Even in 2011-2?

That team scored 92 goals. Hate to think how many it would have got had it not lacked ideas.

It did score 92 goals and deservedly so.
It was the best attacking force I've seen at Bramall Lane...possibly ever.
Wilson gave them their head and they were supreme goalscorers, highlighted by the season after when Wilson ran out of ideas when players were not there.
He was helped by the single best period of forward play ever in a United shirt by Ched who was inspirational for most of the season.
Oh, for another display like that.

 

[Grecian2000]

The biggest question i have now in my own mind is that Clough junior about to embark on a journey similar to the ones his father took Derby and Forest on?

Maybe similar but not the same. A different ball game now, and teams like Derby/Forest (and indeed US) haven't got the financial clout to climb the divisions AND win the top title.
Best we can hope for (other than the ultimate dream of the top four/five clubs fucking off to play in a TV league where they only play other super rich clubs once a month) is to be top of the "second string" of top flight clubs and that would be a tremendous acheivement (and a good few years away).

I'm loving his work at the moment, especially after he started with that very worrying "two fullbacks in midfield" formation early doors. Getting rid of McMahon at the first opportunity was guaranteed to bring me round though.

 

[Ollessendro]

All of Wilson's time in charge? Really? Even in 2011-2?

That team scored 92 goals. Hate to think how many it would have got had it not lacked ideas.

Sorry, I was careless with my words. I was thinking more of a lack of pace and athleticism.

The team in Wilson's first season was a strong one. Solid defence, attacking flair in the form of Lowton, Quinn and Williamson, experience of Creswell, K Mac's ability to grab the game by the horns and Ched being on fire. It was more the pace, power and athleticism that I was thinking of.

It did score 92 goals and deservedly so.
It was the best attacking force I've seen at Bramall Lane...possibly ever.
Wilson gave them their head and they were supreme goalscorers, highlighted by the season after when Wilson ran out of ideas when players were not there.
He was helped by the single best period of forward play ever in a United shirt by Ched who was inspirational for most of the season.
Oh, for another display like that.

How long have you been supporting United?! Whilst that team was good, they were flattered by some terrible opposition. Were you around to see us get promoted to the Premier League with HM Ships, Webber/Kabba, Tongue, Quinn, Ifill etc tearing teams apart? The 2011/12 team does not have a patch on the promotion team of 2005/6.

I can only think that you started watching United a few seasons ago if you thik Ched is the best SUFC striker ever.

 

[ZoneManWilf]

Great pic from the Clough Snr's Brighton days I think

 

[grafikhaus]

His greatest achievement so far? Scougall? Brayford? Maybe Flynn and Murphy?

Only time will tell. Clough Snr. made his share of pivotal (though seemingly unlikely) signings. Dave Mackay. Our own Willie Carlin.

Best we can hope for (other than the ultimate dream of the top four/five clubs fucking off to play in a TV league where they only play other super rich clubs once a month) is to be top of the "second string" of top flight clubs and that would be a tremendous acheivement (and a good few years away).

Not so long ago we were playing Stoke, Southampton, Swansea etc. in the lower leagues.

 

[Eskimo]

I like what Clough is doing but I think expectations, circumstances, confidence and luck each have a huge part to play, are largely out of the control of the manager and can cloud the picture when judging success.

You could say that Wilson was lucky to inherit Ched, who came good and was unlucky to lose him and his replacement Hoskins in quick order, then 9-8 on penalties. At Wembley. The following year, we still made the playoffs

When Clough was appointed the expectations were low but the financial circumstances had changed since the start of the season and so the possibility of buying the likes of Scougall were there. Confidence was at rock bottom and the team overall were underperforming. The club has invested in further signings and cancelled contracts which is a luxury few managers in this league would enjoy. Now he has got them playing and that's great.

I dont know either that the players he has shipped out were necessarily bad eggs either. Mc Mahon to Blackpool seemed to me to be a pragmatic deal - we needed a left back and Brayford was coming in. Williams wasn't good enough and neither was Westlake probably and discarded for that reason. But I liked Brandy and think that Taylor had strengths too. Clough has been lucky that Scougill has come good and fitted in so quickly.

I don't think Wilson was a poor manager at all and I don't know yet if Clough is a good un but the signs so far are good.
Please stop comparing him with his dad though. I think it should be a no no on here like Sheffield fans and Brammall Lane.
I mean its a bit daft isn't it and just panders to the populist press who would rather write about Brian than Nigel or Sheffield United. I don't give a shit about what Brian Clough did or didn't do.

 

[Grecian2000]

Not so long ago we were playing Stoke, Southampton, Swansea etc. in the lower leagues.

I was talking about being "top" of the none mega rich boys, not just getting up there and playing them (I can see us doing that in three or four years, Nurse pass me BTL's drugs again).