Hold your nerve Prince..

[Geordie Blade]

Toxic? By saying the manager is poor?

Which is a proven fact that can be backed up statistically?

I’m intrigued as to how you can statistically prove that Heckingbottom is poor. He has the highest win percentage of any Sheffield United manager with >20 games.

You’re fully entitled to the opinion that he is poor, but I’d love to see your statistical proof.

 

[AWetFlannel]

Well Luton are doing better than us.

Not by much.

They are on the crest of a wave, full of confidence and momentum. Well run and massively overachieving. Pressure off.

After embarrassing ourselves in the PL during relegation, we've come back up with a point to prove. A club that shouldn't be out of our depth in the top division, pressure on. Unsettled behind the scenes, lost our best players, awful preparation, awful transfer window, injuries.

 

[Tezza1889]

Prince needs to do one, he's nowhere near the country, let alone the club, he couldn't give a flying fuck about us.

What do we expect when the top bloke at the club is in America all the time...

Only Chansiri is a bigger embarrassment, and he's now told the fans to pay for everything..

Two teams, one city and not one owner that gives a fuck between us.

(ps, we hit the jackpot when chancer got dem pigs didn't we though)

 

[JJ Sefton]

Outrun, Outfight, Outplay.

So central to our apparent ethos it's written into the shirts. But none of those has happened on the pitch, certainly in the last two games.

The ordering of the words is not coincidental.

 

[Charlieblade]

Until recently I was of the opinion that the current players could do enough to stay up.

The truth is, we do not have a first XI capable of out fighting or outplaying Premier league teams, and we do not have the depth or the quality of players at this level.

On paper, the best XI should have enough quality, but the TEN incoming players are all struggling. Buying players like Hamer and Archer makes sense, given our budget. Players with recent Prem experience like Tom Davies from Everton, and Thomas from Leicester, are always going to be a gamble.

Add in players from foreign leagues with lower levels of quality and experience, and it looks like we will struggle to adapt them, even if they show potential. All signings show promise, but collectively, we don’t seem able to match Premier league teams.

Blaming management and/or the owner is the easy way out. This is a decent Championship team, assembled on a very small PL budget. We have got what we paid for, and the only way forward is for PH to go back to basics and strengthen what we have got from the back.
Make the defence impregnable first. Everything else comes after that.

There are no PL quality proven managers available. Hecky stays.

 

[Sirius]

We all know what will happen, now. Prince has no choice to but make a change here.

Yep. A change in ownership of the Blades. He owns other clubs that he can play with

 

[DSB-91]

I’m not saying this season is great, but do you really think we are worse than the Adkins season?? We are up against top teams here. Back then, we were being outplayed and outfought by Southend, Scunthorpe, Burton etc. week in week out.

I agree we were insipid during most of the League One years. I don’t think anyone who was about then can argue it was anything but an awful era for the club.

But I genuinely don’t remember thinking we didn’t look like we belonged on the same pitch as any opposition. I also don’t really remember feeling we’d just given up like we did in the Newcastle game.

I don’t know, maybe it’s recency bias on my part, but I think it’s different. Obviously we’re playing against opposition that’s far superior to us. But at times it looks like we’re beating ourselves as much as just getting outclassed.

We’re nowhere near as good as the teams we’re facing but is it unrealistic to expect an organised defence and some ability to keep possession? To be fair, maybe with the players and investment we have, it is.

 

[Chimpan-A]

It's been a rough week, on and off the pitch.

You and the rest of the club top brass fucked Hecky up for the first four games.

Late September and October is a brutal run of fixtures, November and December look far more favourable. Give him til Christmas. You owe him that.

You can sing the title and first line of this to the tune of that “Dry your eyes, mate” song by The Streets. In fact the rest of it fits in well with the rest of the song, if delivered in a Mike Skinner voice.

 

[Champagneblade]

Prince needs to do one, he's nowhere near the country, let alone the club, he couldn't give a flying fuck about us.

What do we expect when the top bloke at the club is in America all the time...

Only Chansiri is a bigger embarrassment, and he's now told the fans to pay for everything..

Two teams, one city and not one owner that gives a fuck between us.

(ps, we hit the jackpot when chancer got dem pigs didn't we though)

Interested to know how you are expecting him to 'do one'. The club is up for sale and he is open to offers. Not sure what else he can do. He can't make someone buy the club.

As to not caring, he remortgaged some of his own property in order to ensure he could keep the squad together.

He never intended to be sole owner until McCabe tried to pull the wool over his eyes and The Prince was not as naive as KM seemed to think. He didn't pitch to be sole owner, it happened by means of defending himself.

So his crime is that he isn't richer. He's put his own belongings on the line at times so I don't see where the not caring comes from.

It's very simple. He's not rich enough to sustain a Premier League team on his own. That's nobody's fault. It's just fact.

 

[Sheffsteel]

Blaming management and/or the owner is the easy way out. This is a decent Championship team, assembled on a very small PL budget. We have got what we paid for, and the only way forward is for PH to go back to basics and strengthen what we have got from the back.
Make the defence impregnable first. Everything else comes after that.

There are no PL quality proven managers available. Hecky stays.

Agree blaming the manager or owner is often a cliche, the easy way out.

You say this is a decent Championship team, where as the stats and performances show we're being outclassed and stinking the place out.
Any neutral person or statistician would predict there's a realistic chance we break the Derby low points record.
Several PL teams in the past have spent far less than us and done alot better.

For example Blackpool spent nothing and ended up relegated on 39 points
P 38 W 10 D 9 L 19 = 39 points

More recently Norwich spent about 5 million and ended up on 21 points
P 39 W 5 D 6 L27 = 21 points, however they did play open attacking entertaining football.

We're approaching games like a league 1 side, putting most players into defence and hoping to score from a set piece, our best weapon is probably the JR long throw in.
Think it would be highly negligent to just accept relegation (with a possibility of breaking Derbys lowest points record) at this early stage.
Can understand the "no PL quality managers are available" comment but that won't last for ever.
It's a sliding scale, the more desperate our performances (and I say judge us on performances not results), then we become more desperate.
Don't want us to stink the place out and become an embarrassment when opposition teams don't even need to try.
A season where we're not just losing, but not even competitive takes a long time to turn around and we could struggle next season with that losing mentality.

 

[DSB-91]

Interested to know how you are expecting him to 'do one'. The club is up for sale and he is open to offers. Not sure what else he can do. He can't make someone buy the club.

As to not caring, he remortgaged some of his own property in order to ensure he could keep the squad together.

He never intended to be sole owner until McCabe tried to pull the wool over his eyes and The Prince was not as naive as KM seemed to think. He didn't pitch to be sole owner, it happened by means of defending himself.

So his crime is that he isn't richer. He's put his own belongings on the line at times so I don't see where the not caring comes from.

It's very simple. He's not rich enough to sustain a Premier League team on his own. That's nobody's fault. It's just fact.

The more I think about it, the more I think there’s no easy culprit we can blame our current situation on.

The Prince has, in my opinion, been a good owner. Not saying everything’s been perfect but I think overall, he’s done more good than bad.

But he clearly has limited resources and we’re now in a league awash with money. We’ve tried to bring players in, with mixed results, but clearly we’re looking for value and can’t go out and make big name signings. The Prince is trying to make the most of a limited amount he’s either able or willing to spend.

People can say he needs to sell or that the asking price is deterring investors. But maybe United just aren’t that attractive a proposition? For whatever reason, clearly Sheffield teams aren’t very appealing to big investors. Us and Wednesday either get people with limited resources looking for a cheaper way in to English football, or out and out conmen and chancers.

Meanwhile, Hecky’s having to try and make it work with a team that’s been thrown together last minute, made up of Championship veterans and unknowns who may or may not be any good at this level. The last couple of games have worried me but I don’t know if Wilder, or any one else we can realistically get, would be able to do much better.

I do think performances have been dismal the last two games though and if that carries on, I think Hecky will be fair game for criticism. We have to be realistic about this side but I think we can demand they at least show a minimum level of organisation and fight.

 

[Selly]

A question for those advocating for a change in manager (if not now then after the Man U game)

Who would you get in to replace him that will get more out of this squad?

Do you want to be one of this clubs that turns to the likes of Allardyce, Warnock to try and get a turnaround?

Who do you think will want to manage us, given we are likely to spend the sum total of £0 in January?

Who is the best manager placed to get us out of the Championship (in the right direction) next year if relegation does happen?

 

[Charlieblade]

R

Agree blaming the manager or owner is often a cliche, the easy way out.

You say this is a decent Championship team, where as the stats and performances show we're being outclassed and stinking the place out.
Any neutral person or statistician would predict there's a realistic chance we break the Derby low points record.
Several PL teams in the past have spent far less than us and done alot better.

For example Blackpool spent nothing and ended up relegated on 39 points
P 38 W 10 D 9 L 19 = 39 points

More recently Norwich spent about 5 million and ended up on 21 points
P 39 W 5 D 6 L27 = 21 points, however they did play open attacking entertaining football.

We're approaching games like a league 1 side, putting most players into defence and hoping to score from a set piece, our best weapon is probably the JR long throw in.
Think it would be highly negligent to just accept relegation (with a possibility of breaking Derbys lowest points record) at this early stage.
Can understand the "no PL quality managers are available" comment but that won't last for ever.
It's a sliding scale, the more desperate our performances (and I say judge us on performances not results), then we become more desperate.
Don't want us to stink the place out and become an embarrassment when opposition teams don't even need to try.
A season where we're not just losing, but not even competitive takes a long time to turn around and we could struggle next season with that losing mentality.

reluctantly, I do not accept relegation as inevitable

 

[FlamingLip]

Who is the best manager placed to get us out of the Championship (in the right direction) next year if relegation does happen?

I said at the beginning of season Hecky's position ought to be safe regardless.

However, we're in a rut, demonstrated we can completely collapse and a few are increasingly convinced we're more likely to beat Derby's abysmal record than look capable of any challenge to stay up.

If we exit in such a manner, Hecky's own esteem may be shot to bits. Look at what such a turgid run did to Wilder. Would he still be the best option to build for next season?

 

[Bennyand the Blades]

In order to bring in fresh faces, which we all know we needed, the club sold two of it's top players, This after moving on at least three of the dressing rooms biggest personalities.
Now we know The club needed the money to bring in the fresh faces, but I think that losing the old guard has altered the whole structure in the dressing room...
Yes the manager should be able to control that normally But just take a good look at what else has been going on around him.
I think he's been Delt a recipe for disaster and the least we can do is back him and let him get on with the almost impossible job of trying to fix it.

 

[Bell4]

We all know what will happen, now. Prince has no choice to but make a change here.

Why hasn’t he got a choice ?

 

[Nah den]

I feel sorry for Hecky with the hand he's been dealt. But it looks like the players have lost confidence and belief. As harsh as it would be on him I think it's time for a change. We need a motivator of men, try and get some sort of new manager bounce, pick up a result or two and build from there. We're currently sleep walking to a timid relegation. Harsh on Hecky but this is a results business and we look miles off picking any up at the moment. Who a new manager would be I don't know but we should be looking.

 

[Champagneblade]

I feel sorry for Hecky with the hand he's been dealt. But it looks like the players have lost confidence and belief. As harsh as it would be on him I think it's time for a change. We need a motivator of men, try and get some sort of new manager bounce, pick up a result or two and build from there. We're currently sleep walking to a timid relegation. Harsh on Hecky but this is a results business and we look miles off picking any up at the moment. Who a new manager would be I don't know but we should be looking.

What I don't get is the acceptance of all the things that make the job such a challenge but then the desire to disregard these things because it is 'a results business'.

We don't have the investment needed. We've not managed to upgrade the squad really. We've written off two games we could have got points in. Anyways, it's a results based business so he has to go...

To those advocating change, I say this - show me your plan. Not Hail Mary punt, but plan.

At the moment Hecky has proven adept at giving youth a chance. He's given more debuts to young lads than any prior manager. For a club short on cash, surely this is the strategy we're aligned on.

So if we are now going to either throw the long term strategy out of the window or find a manager more aligned and more capable than Hecky who is aligned to that strategy, I'm all ears. In the meantime, sacking a bloke because you don't have the backbone to stomach a few expected losses and the lack of confidence that goes with them seems like half a plan or no plan at all.

Remember when Bassett got us up? We had 4 points from 16 games and then we ended up finishing 13th. It seems a few on here would have had him gone before the clocks changed! Hold the line. Be patient!

 

[Nah den]

What I don't get is the acceptance of all the things that make the job such a challenge but then the desire to disregard these things because it is 'a results business'.

We don't have the investment needed. We've not managed to upgrade the squad really. We've written off two games we could have got points in. Anyways, it's a results based business so he has to go...

To those advocating change, I say this - show me your plan. Not Hail Mary punt, but plan.

At the moment Hecky has proven adept at giving youth a chance. He's given more debuts to young lads than any prior manager. For a club short on cash, surely this is the strategy we're aligned on.

So if we are now going to either throw the long term strategy out of the window or find a manager more aligned and more capable than Hecky who is aligned to that strategy, I'm all ears. In the meantime, sacking a bloke because you don't have the backbone to stomach a few expected losses and the lack of confidence that goes with them seems like half a plan or no plan at all.

Remember when Bassett got us up? We had 4 points from 16 games and then we ended up finishing 13th. It seems a few on here would have had him gone before the clocks changed! Hold the line. Be patient!

I don't have to show you my plan for my points to be valid. I'm not a football club chairman. However I can see the way things are heading. Devoid of threat, devoid of resilience, devoid of confidence. There's another thread analysing the stats compared to Wilder relegation season and so far this is worse. The players need to hear a new voice. The club needs a lift. Watch Hecky's post match interviews, he sounds like a broken man. But, he gives youth a chance so keep him? Because no one else would be able to do that?

 

[Chazzer]

We all seem to be discounting the fighting displays against Man City, Everton and Spurs a few weeks ago. The confidence from those displays evaporated during the 0-8 (not helped by the injustice of two of their first three goals) but let's get some injured players back (Baldock in particular, also Brewster) and get a settled team and we will start scoring goals again. A win at Fulham would see all our confidence flowing back.

 

[Champagneblade]

I don't have to show you my plan for my points to be valid. I'm not a football club chairman. However I can see the way things are heading. Devoid of threat, devoid of resilience, devoid of confidence. There's another thread analysing the stats compared to Wilder relegation season and so far this is worse. The players need to hear a new voice. The club needs a lift. Watch Hecky's post match interviews, he sounds like a broken man. But, he gives youth a chance so keep him? Because no one else would be able to do that?

I'm not suggesting your points are invalid, but if your plan is to get rid of a manager then the rest of that plan is having an adequate replacement coming in.

So you get rid of Hecky, who then comes in?

At which point, unless someone like Potter was genuinely interested, who has limited blemishes on his record, then I'd imagine there will be plenty of detractors to any suggestions.

Similarly, it was time for Warnock to move on apparently. If we knew that Robson was the replacement I don't know anyone who would have waived goodbye to Neil!

Getting rid of the manager is a double-edged sword. It's only a good move if the bloke coming in is better and in my experience of Sheffield United, we've made more bad appointments than good!

 

[Nah den]

I'm not suggesting your points are invalid, but if your plan is to get rid of a manager then the rest of that plan is having an adequate replacement coming in.

So you get rid of Hecky, who then comes in?

At which point, unless someone like Potter was genuinely interested, who has limited blemishes on his record, then I'd imagine there will be plenty of detractors to any suggestions.

Similarly, it was time for Warnock to move on apparently. If we knew that Robson was the replacement I don't know anyone who would have waived goodbye to Neil!

I don't know who we'd get in, I don't know who fits the bill in terms of being able to motivate and re-energise the team and the club (and fans for that matter, atmosphere has been flat recently), but it's needed. If that person doesn't exist then fair enough, getting another Robson in is pointless. Hopefully the people paid to look at these things are doing that though. The alternative, as it is currently, is another terrible season that people just want over, including the players probably. If we can get something out of Fulham then maybe that's something we can build on, but it's a massive 'if' at the moment.

 

[Bennyand the Blades]

I think one of thing most bring in a new manager pusher seem to have forgot is,
The extra funds that would be needed. by any new managers to bring in his own players.
Players he would be unable to bring in untill Christmas anyway ......

 

[Bladezz]

I think one of thing most bring in a new manager pusher seem to have forgot is,
The extra funds that would be needed. by any new managers to bring in his own players.
Players he would be unable to bring in untill Christmas anyway ......

Maybe we have enough in the team to stay up?

 

[Bennyand the Blades]

I think we have....

 

[vas borbokis]

Hecky has been unbelievably badly treated by the jokes above him but at the same time we simply can't shrug our shoulders and accept relegation. It's easier to stay in the league than get back in it imo

Clearly it isn't.

 

[Berkshire Blade]

Clearly it isn't.

As crap as we have been it's not impossible we are out of the relegation zone on Saturday. It's a lot easier!

 

[Bell4]

Clearly it isn't.

Agree

But I’m afraid that like Norwich and WBA we will be watered down every time we drop

 

[Grappler]

Until recently I was of the opinion that the current players could do enough to stay up.

The truth is, we do not have a first XI capable of out fighting or outplaying Premier league teams, and we do not have the depth or the quality of players at this level.

On paper, the best XI should have enough quality, but the TEN incoming players are all struggling. Buying players like Hamer and Archer makes sense, given our budget. Players with recent Prem experience like Tom Davies from Everton, and Thomas from Leicester, are always going to be a gamble.

Add in players from foreign leagues with lower levels of quality and experience, and it looks like we will struggle to adapt them, even if they show potential. All signings show promise, but collectively, we don’t seem able to match Premier league teams.

Blaming management and/or the owner is the easy way out. This is a decent Championship team, assembled on a very small PL budget. We have got what we paid for, and the only way forward is for PH to go back to basics and strengthen what we have got from the back.
Make the defence impregnable first. Everything else comes after that.

There are no PL quality proven managers available. Hecky stays.

"...Make the defence impregnable first. Everything else comes after that...."

I remember someone else who had that same philosophy........

 

[Klaatu Barada Nikto]

Until recently I was of the opinion that the current players could do enough to stay up.

The truth is, we do not have a first XI capable of out fighting or outplaying Premier league teams, and we do not have the depth or the quality of players at this level.

On paper, the best XI should have enough quality, but the TEN incoming players are all struggling. Buying players like Hamer and Archer makes sense, given our budget. Players with recent Prem experience like Tom Davies from Everton, and Thomas from Leicester, are always going to be a gamble.

Add in players from foreign leagues with lower levels of quality and experience, and it looks like we will struggle to adapt them, even if they show potential. All signings show promise, but collectively, we don’t seem able to match Premier league teams.

Blaming management and/or the owner is the easy way out. This is a decent Championship team, assembled on a very small PL budget. We have got what we paid for, and the only way forward is for PH to go back to basics and strengthen what we have got from the back.
Make the defence impregnable first. Everything else comes after that.

There are no PL quality proven managers available. Hecky stays.

I think the squad is good enough to stay up, but I agree we have to strengthen the defence first. I just don't see how you can fit McAtee and Hamer, AND two forwards into the formation as it's currently set up. If we we're going to keep the formation, then one of those has to drop to the bench, with Souza and /Norwood/davies/slimane as the other sitting midfielder.