Flat 3 or not Flat 3

[Overthehills]

Whats any of that got to do with what i said ?

Another poster said playing flat 3 was boring and got us relegated and i pointed out it got us challenging for champions league spots before covid
Then you chimed in with a tottaly irrelevant point about analysis ,as if no one bothered analysing us when we did well and i pointed that out and now youre ranting on about the way we play and the team and squad being the same

Like i said ,what has any of that got to with what i said ?

I just cant stand revisionist bullshit like forgetting one exceptional season so you can moan about one exceptionally shite one

You're have this messed up having of slating everyone elses opinion that differs to your own. In that revolutionary first season, it worked. I've not disregarded that one bit, but the season after we most definitely were found out. Nothing changed... the team, the formation, the tactics..... and they handled us without breaking a sweat.

So whete does your argument sit?... Yes, it worked for a season... but it didn't afterwards. Nowts changed since really and back up with the big boys, playing the same way will probablt see them gobble us up again.

Sooo your point is what?

 

[pommpey]

Whats any of that got to do with what i said ?

Another poster said playing flat 3 was boring and got us relegated and i pointed out it got us challenging for champions league spots before covid
Then you chimed in with a tottaly irrelevant point about analysis ,as if no one bothered analysing us when we did well and i pointed that out and now youre ranting on about the way we play and the team and squad being the same

Like i said ,what has any of that got to with what i said ?

I just cant stand revisionist bullshit like forgetting one exceptional season so you can moan about one exceptionally shite one

The exceptionally shite one came after the exceptional one. It isn't revisionist acknowledging that, simply being factual. First season up we were the new boys in town and oppositions had a problem dealing with Wilderball, based on Norwood hitting wing runners like Stevens and Baldock and them combining with Fleck and O'Connell one side and Basham and Lundstram the other to great effect. Post lockdown that little tactic was dead, moreso in season two and the flat three in the middle were pressed to stop that before it started. Wilder never had an alternative and we suffered. Is that revisionist? We got relegated because of that, not in spite of it. Every time it went out wide the movement was blocked in and we failed to penetrate. Once O'Connell went lame the left side was cancelled out and Lundstrams dummy out fucked the right side. Don't even talk to me about Berge arriving.

You can sit and get wanky all you want about ninth in the PL, but that is a bit contextually bobbar when you look at our failure to stay in the division the following season. The second season was an abject humiliation, worse than any previous relegation before it. And it all came about because the team was too hidebound to play any other way than Wilderball.

pommpey

 

[Blade56]

Can’t wait for this thread to get to 100 pages, maybe my mind works a bit different!!!!

 

[Aston max]

No stay with 3-4-2-1. We've just got promoted playing this way why change it. Its what the players are best suited to. Under PH particularly in the latter half of the season we have changed shape a number of times during games. Thats the best way to do it.

Lets play to our strengths and not wave the white flag before we've kicked a ball in the EPL. Flat 3 formation encourages us to sit too deep. We don't have a marauding JOC anymore. A position sadly we have never replaced. It encourages slow build up play and tippy tappy football down the flanks with Shearer on Match of the Day wondering if we are ever going to cross the ball into the box. The defence was tight but we only scored 39 goals when we finished 9th. By the end of the season we'd been sussed by the rest of the division who just flooded the flanks. The fact we persisted with it for so long the season after was the reason why we went down.

No problem with being cautious with the formation against the likes of Man City but lets try and give a good account of ourselves by doing what we do best.

Fully agree but we will need the 2 central to have some legs and mobility which Norwood now doesn't have (I will think he has 1 more season of coming off the bench or standing in for injuries) I Don't get why hecky hasn't given Coulibaly a game with Doyle unless he sees something in training we don't get to see
Hopefully someone on here will come up with a squad wish list for next season
I am afraid due to health issues I don't see many live games so some on here will have a list of players from the championship side's that they think could make the step up
Over to you guys

 

[Frank the tank]

You're have this messed up having of slating everyone elses opinion that differs to your own.

Sorry what ?

In that revolutionary first season, it worked. I've not disregarded that one bit, but the season after we most definitely were found out. Nothing changed... the team, the formation, the tactics..... and they handled us without breaking a sweat.

My original comment was to another poster who said the flat three was boring and got us relegated totally disregarding tge fact it also got us challenging for a champions league spot
I feel ive been really clear on this and explained it in my last post yet you have ignored that and ranted on about analysis

So whete does your argument sit?... Yes, it worked for a season... but it didn't afterwards. Nowts changed since really and back up with the big boys, playing the same way will probablt see them gobble us up again.

Sooo your point is what?

Further to all this to say we play the same now as we did under wilder shows a huge lack of understanding of tactical nuances
When hecky mentioned playing the sane way he was talking about playing with a back 3 instead of a four which didnt suit the players ,he switched from.a 5-3-2 to a 3-4-2-1 or a 3-4-1-2 regularly and stopped the reliance on overloads out wide and played more through the middle hes barely ever played with a flat 3 in fact playing at one stage with three number 10's so if youre going to start lecturing people about systems and tactics at least get your facts straight

 

[Frank the tank]

The exceptionally shite one came after the exceptional one. It isn't revisionist acknowledging that, simply being factual. First season up we were the new boys in town and oppositions had a problem dealing with Wilderball, based on Norwood hitting wing runners like Stevens and Baldock and them combining with Fleck and O'Connell one side and Basham and Lundstram the other to great effect. Post lockdown that little tactic was dead, moreso in season two and the flat three in the middle were pressed to stop that before it started. Wilder never had an alternative and we suffered. Is that revisionist? We got relegated because of that, not in spite of it. Every time it went out wide the movement was blocked in and we failed to penetrate. Once O'Connell went lame the left side was cancelled out and Lundstrams dummy out fucked the right side. Don't even talk to me about Berge arriving.

You can sit and get wanky all you want about ninth in the PL, but that is a bit contextually bobbar when you look at our failure to stay in the division the following season. The second season was an abject humiliation, worse than any previous relegation before it. And it all came about because the team was too hidebound to play any other way than Wilderball.

pommpey

Fuck me has everyone gone hard of understanding
I never mentioned tge second seadon i was correcting my pet hate of posters on this forum who only mention the shit times and conveniently forget the good

Why do you all have to wallow in fucking misery all the time ?

 

[Overthehills]

Fuck me has everyone gone hard of understanding
I never mentioned tge second seadon i was correcting my pet hate of posters on this forum who only mention the shit times and conveniently forget the good

Why do you all have to wallow in fucking misery all the time ?

Nah... you're just being typically you. Everyone else is wrong because they disagree with you...... Often disrespectful towards the opinions of others, often insulting..... as said, typically you.....

Perhaps if you spoke to others in a better way and didn't belittle them for having opinions that differ to yours.... people may well be more receptive.

 

[Frank the tank]

Like a fucking antenatal class in here

 

[Overthehills]

Like a fucking antenatal class in here

Point proven

 

[Alex Cheeseright]

5-4-1 against 19 teams and 10-0-0 against Man Citeh.

 

[jono_t2000]

5-4-1 against 19 teams and 10-0-0 against Man Citeh.

Should be 18 teams, unless there's a Sheffield United vs Sheffield United fixture next season

 

[Aston max]

5-4-1 against 19 teams and 10-0-0 against Man Citeh.

Still like 3-4-3

 

[pommpey]

Fuck me has everyone gone hard of understanding
I never mentioned tge second seadon i was correcting my pet hate of posters on this forum who only mention the shit times and conveniently forget the good

Why do you all have to wallow in fucking misery all the time ?

So we should all ignore what went wrong and sit in a puddle of piss about the glorious first season in the Premiership without exploring why it worked (up to lockdown) faltered afterwards and was a dismal mistake (which we shouldn't repeat) in season two?

I see.

It's not 'wallowing in misery'. It's 'being a football supporter'. And you don't just have a 'pet hate of posters on this forum who only mention the shit times and conveniently forget the good'. You're just a massive mardy arse when a minor detail in opinion differs from yours and you instantly get personal about it. Live with it - we disagree.

Unless you have the articulation to prove otherwise, you aren't gonna persuade others you are right by being a 'just add water - instant bellend' on here. And this isn't a 'celebrate Sheff United's fleeting successes' forum either. It's General Blades Chat. F&L have just issued a survey. I trust in the needs and wants you asked them for a 'Happy Clappers' section, huh? Might be a bit lonely in there for you ...

pommpey

 

[vas borbokis]

I'm not sure the wilderball system did ever get found out to be honest. It relied on having unusual players like Bash & JOC as overlapping wide CBs and Duffy in a free role ably supported and orchestrated centrally by Coutts/Norwood.
We lost JOC and that crippled the left side attacking threat, and Lunny came in when Duff's fell out with Wilder but then got his lip out so all our wide right threat disappeared as well.
If we could recreate that promotion style we had when we went up last time it may still confuse many in the top flight.
I've never seen any other team play that way tbh.
NDiaye is better than Duffy, Anel is ideally suited to the RCB role. Just need another like JOC on the left and a new Coutts/Norwood type to direct stuff, and Doyle could be that man.
Don't need to be so wedded to it and Hecky has us using more vertical passing than diagonals so could mix it up too.

 

[pommpey]

I'm not sure the wilderball system did ever get found out to be honest. It relied on having unusual players like Bash & JOC as overlapping wide CBs and Duffy in a free role ably supported and orchestrated centrally by Courts/Norwood.
We lost JOC and that crippled the left side attacking threat, and Lunny came in when Duff's fell out with Wilder but then got his lip out so all our wide right threat disappeared as well.
If we could recreate that promotion style we had when we went up last time it may still confuse many in the top flight.
I've never seen any other team play that way tbh.
NDiaye is better than Duffy, Anel is ideally suited to the RCB role. Just need another like JOC on the left and a new Coutts/Norwood type to direct stuff, and Doyle could be that man.
Don't need to be so wedded to it and Hecky has us using more vertical passing than diagonals so could mix it up too.

Lunny lost his dummy when we inexplicably signed Berge who was a right sided defensive midfielder but more suited to Lunny's position. Lunny came for a Penguin and a pasty, Berge for significantly more so by pure economic fact it was clear Berge would get the nod over Lunny. He couldn't replace Norwood or Fleck, could he? Wilder signing him upset the applecart, big style. It was a pointless signing when really we should have been looking to reinforce elsewhere or at least make a bid for Henderson, who was equally responsible for our surprising position in the Prem.

When JOC went lame we had zero point zero replacements. I feel that releasing Stearman was a big mistake - it left us fragile across the back three and we stayed that way until JLT settled and stopped the golden robot shit. Bryan, Ampadu, Stevens and even RND haven't really done what JLT has done although he doesn't get into the crossing zone like JOC used to.

Doyle is the way we can rebuild our side into a PL survivor outfit. Norwood will get ragged next season, even by the upcoming teams and the relegation dogfighters.

pommpey

 

[Colombia Blade]

Flat 3 or no flat 3, whatever we decide we have to get the right players in. People are arguing about whether the flat 3 worked - well one season (with JOC) it did, then the next season it didn't (without JOC). I like Robbo in our current set up, but I don't think he's an overlapping centre back like JOC, Anel or Basham. If they want to play with a flat 3 to be tougher to break down, getting a JOC replacement has to be the top priority. On the other hand, if Hecky's gonna continue with the current formation, then signing Doyle or similar (probably not just one signing) has to be a priority, as does someone to play where McAtee has been playing (again, probably more than one signing)

 

[Alex Cheeseright]

Should be 18 teams, unless there's a Sheffield United vs Sheffield United fixture next season

Good point, missed that.

 

[Tingo Fandango]

I’m surprised few of the posters above have referenced JoC much, his loss was huge & significantly weakened the LHS from back to front. That alone made us far easier to predict & to unpick. If we can get another CB of Anel’s quality, or one close to his but left footed, we really don’t have to make enormous changes. Midfield will need to be more mobile & aggressive, (per Lunny?). It’s about personnel as much as nominal positions.