Expectations

[metalblade]

Looks to me like some of the fans think we are much better than we actually are, next seasons League one will be stronger than last season. I expect Wolves and Peterbrough to be strong and maybe Bristol too with O'Driscol. We on the other hand have a team which at the moment will be lucky to score a goal a game, has no pace or athleticism whatsoever and a half decent defence on paper but which has the habit of giving away soft goals at crucial times.

On the positive side we have a manager who the more you read about the better he sounds, but endorsements from others in the game don't change the fact that he is inexperienced and unproven. The length of time it has taken the board to get their man (or was he their 3rd or 4th choice for the job) means we are 2 months behind in our team building compared to most of the division.
Talking of the board of directors this is the main area of concern at the club (nothing changes) We still have a owner with no interest who is happy to leave the day to day running to his hand picked "yes men" and previous failures. No matter how good or bad Weir turns out to be he is going to have a very difficult job, especially so if the board keeps to form and sells of any decent players that remain at the club from under him. To me thoughts of promotion under such circumstances are wildly optimistic and just a dream, lets hope he can keep the dream alive and the season doesn't become a nightmare.

 

[Grecian2000]

Fuck it I'm clapping. League Title with >100 points

But you'd be saying that if we'd appointed wee Jimmy Krankie!

 

[Grecian2000]

Whether he sells to replace or reinvigorates certain players will be down to him ,

And there's the rub. If you're right and it is down to him, then my confidence will be high and I think we can go up.
If he finds it isn't, then I fear neither of Bergs options will be realised and we'll be discussing another new manager this time next year (because I don't think he's the sort of bloke to put up with board bullshit speak for very long).

 

[Guesty]

Regardless of the talent Weir might bring to the role I think Promotion is a pipe dream. To my mind one automatic spot is practically already lost to Wolves and I imagine Peterborough and Bristol City will likewise prove too strong. Our own squad is currently mid table at best and as I keep pointing out with have very limited scope for improvement, we may even have to start the season with a weaker squad than we have now.

Darren, you've been demanding and expecting easy promotion from this league now for all three seasons we've been here, how is that working out so far?

 

[Bladesman]

DW????
Same initials as the departed manager..... spooky.
Lets hope he lasts a bit longer.
Maybe he could use the former DW's old tracksuit with DW on.

Lets be honest that is the main reason the club wanted him.

 

[Eskimo]

It is an interesting appointment. I'd like to think strategically driven; a new manager with the vision and talent to create a young adventurous team playing open attacking football etc etc. I'd like to think that and that we'll all give him time to do it too, but I doubt it. I rather think the board got lucky with an appointment that for the short term will get the fans of their backs. Any other appointment from the list would have solicited apathy at best or derision. So how long will he get? What if we are 16th at Christmas? or at the end of October even?

When Wilson was appointed I hoped that he would slowly put a decent squad together and would be given time to do it but he had the benefit and handicap of a large unsustainable playing budget and as soon as we hit top the expectations lifted and everone clamoured for new/improved talent and more expenditure. Last season the expectation was the same with a a smaller, but still relatively large playing budget. Our new man has fewer resources and even less experience. Good luck to him - I hope we give him time to show what he might be capable of.

 

[Sothall_Blade]

It is an interesting appointment. I'd like to think strategically driven; a new manager with the vision and talent to create a young adventurous team playing open attacking football etc etc..

I'm interested to know why everybody thinks that Weir will want to create an "adventurous team playing open attacking football"?
I sincerely hope he does put attacking and entertainment first but as a dour, rugged defender I expect him to create a team in his own image as many managers do.
His main managerial mentors are Moyes and Smith and I don't remember either of them getting plaudits for their exciting, attacking Everton teams. (It's difficult to tell with Rangers as they only have one true opponent).
What have people seen or read that makes them think Weir will be more Gaurdiola than Mourhino?

 

[Silent Blade]

I don't think losing both would affect our chances of getting out of this division tbh.

I think it will. To have a good team, it is important that we have good players and then the next important thing is to have a good manager, not vice-versa

 

[Jim Chimmerney]

I think it will. To have a good team, it is important that we have good players and then the next important thing is to have a good manager, not vice-versa

I agree and of course would hate to see yet more young home grown players leave. All I'm saying though is that if the inevitable sales are to happen, I think we could cope with losing both, in this division, given what we already have in reserve not to mention potential replacements for this level.

 

[Eskimo]

I'm interested to know why everybody thinks that Weir will want to create an "adventurous team playing open attacking football"?
..........................................................
What have people seen or read that makes them think Weir will be more Gaurdiola than Mourhino?

I go on to say - but I doubt it

 

[Pinchy]

I bet the fans at Molyneux don't think promotion Is a formality! To surrender a promotion place to Wolves, or anyone else, before a ball is kicked, fails completely to recognise the vicissitudes of football life.

 

[sitwell]

Vicissitudes ,whos he play for ?

 

[Pinchy]

I think it will. To have a good team, it is important that we have good players and then the next important thing is to have a good manager, not vice-versa

I've seen plenty of good young centre-backs at League One level. I would sell Maguire tomorrow if it gave DW substantial funds to rebuild the team as a whole.

 

[Pinchy]

Vicissitudes ,whos he play for ?

AEK Athens. It's actually Vic Issitudes. He's half Cockney; half Cypriot.

 

[Darren]

Regardless of the talent Weir might bring to the role I think Promotion is a pipe dream. To my mind one automatic spot is practically already lost to Wolves and I imagine Peterborough and Bristol City will likewise prove too strong. Our own squad is currently mid table at best and as I keep pointing out with have very limited scope for improvement, we may even have to start the season with a weaker squad than we have now.

Darren, you've been demanding and expecting easy promotion from this league now for all three seasons we've been here, how is that working out so far?

Every moment I live I have to stop myself jumping in front of a bus.....

I don't think there's anything wrong with my expectations. I think there is a lot wrong with the club. Things have come to a sorry pass if we expect mid table consolidation in the third division.

 

[Guesty]

Every moment I live I have to stop myself jumping in front of a bus.....

I don't think there's anything wrong with my expectations. I think there is a lot wrong with the club. Things have come to a sorry pass if we expect mid table consolidation in the third division.

Surely it's worse though when you set United these lofty expectations that they then fail to reach?

Also, I'm afraid that sorry pass has indeed been come to. We've tried the 'straight back up' route twice (plus immediately post Premiership relegation) and each time it has left us in a worse position than we started.

 

[Darren]

Surely it's worse though when you set United these lofty expectations that they then fail to reach?

Also, I'm afraid that sorry pass has indeed been come to. We've tried the 'straight back up' route twice (plus immediately post Premiership relegation) and each time it has left us in a worse position than we started.

Not really, I've come to the age where I feel fairly zen about most things in life.

It's a reasonable realistic aim for a club of United's size and resources to have promotion as the aim every year they are in the third division. I don't think that is a "lofty" expectation. I think every season of the 7 seasons we have been in the 3rd division promotion was expected at the start of the season (even in the season we ended up relegated) and we were one of the bookies' favourites to go up.

 

[Guesty]

Just because people expect promotions doesn't mean they're likely. And the 'you never see a broke bookie' adage doesn't apply to the third tier because it takes far less money down for them to shift their odds and loads of people would lump money on a team like United to get promoted. We've been heavy favourites to go up twice (I think) and we've failed both times.

 

[Darren]

Just because people expect promotions doesn't mean they're likely. And the 'you never see a broke bookie' adage doesn't apply to the third tier because it takes far less money down for them to shift their odds and loads of people would lump money on a team like United to get promoted. We've been heavy favourites to go up twice (I think) and we've failed both times.

Blimey, I never thought we would get to the stage where promotion from the third division was considered by our fans to be a "lofty" unrealistic expectation...

 

[Guesty]

And yet you've been watching us for so many more years!

The point is we're getting to be like 'piss the league' Wednesday. People like yourself predicted we'd go up as champions our first year in the third (anything else is a failure, or words to that effect, were muttered). We failed. Last season people said the same. We failed, and by a greater margin. Now we have to slash our wage budget and trust in a rookie manager. We're also on a hell of a downward slide - Blackwell's first full season is the only season since relegation from the Premiership in which we've finished higher than the previous season.

Maybe everything will go our way this season and Wolves somehow fail to invested any of their millions in parachute payments wisely and manage to not win the League at a cantor. Maybe we will go up, I'm not ruling it out. But whilst 'unrealistic' is perhaps a touch overstated I'd still certainly rate it 'unlikely'.

 

[JohnDenver]

It's a reasonable realistic aim for a club of United's size and resources to have promotion as the aim every year they are in the third division.

Hmmm...

Last season we weren't good enough. The players we pay most are our biggest failures, and they are now those whom we can now least afford to pay-off. We also have to cut our expenditure again.

What Weir has to do is sell our best youngsters to raise cash, make men of our lesser youngsters, and either revive our underperformers or move them on. That and strengthen from a transfer market which began negotiations weeks before he was recruited.

If he gets us up he'll have done the most remarkable job since Bassett.

 

[Patrick Suffaux]

I don't expect us to go up next season, nor will I be criticising the new manager if we don't do it. I'm not writing us off either.

He will be working with a young squad by the looks of things and will be building something from scratch. Top 6 is a reasonable expectation given this and the massively reduced budget. The club is now hopefully taking a different approach which involves developing something long term with patience a must. This applies to the supporters as well, not that I expect much patience from our loyal following.

 

[GRUMPY BLADE]

Every moment I live I have to stop myself jumping in front of a bus.....

I don't think there's anything wrong with my expectations. I think there is a lot wrong with the club. Things have come to a sorry pass if we expect mid table consolidation in the third division.

I think we are at a point in time where the crap team if it is not seen to be improving [assumes DW is unable to shift Collins, Doyle and has to play them] it can not be blamed on the new manager but them being here firmly planted at the feet of his predecessor.

If that does mean mid table consolidation in the third division then I'm willing to put up with it for the long term gain.

They won't be here next season.

 

[Sothall_Blade]

I think we are at a point in time where the crap team if it is not seen to be improving [assumes DW is unable to shift Collins, Doyle and has to play them] it can not be blamed on the new manager but them being here firmly planted at the feet of his predecessor.

If that does mean mid table consolidation in the third division then I'm willing to put up with it for the long term gain.

They won't be here next season.

Why do people keep lumping Collins in with the "crap" underachievers. He's been one of our better, most consistent players for the last two seasons.

 

[Guesty]

Why do people keep lumping Collins in with the "crap" underachievers. He's been one of our better, most consistent players for the last two seasons.

The problem with Collins is that you have to replace him for the last two months the season when he invariably falls apart. Overall though I agree, one of the players of the season until his form fell away late on. The problem is, when it does and he plays badly we're all swiftly reminded of how dismal he was in the relegation year and it takes many months of good form for his reputation to recover again.

I'll certainly not be upset if we line up with Collins in the side at the start of next season.

 

[Sirius]

Every moment I live I have to stop myself jumping in front of a bus.....

I don't think there's anything wrong with my expectations. I think there is a lot wrong with the club. Things have come to a sorry pass if we expect mid table consolidation in the third division.

Darren. Have you morphed into Len

 

[Darren]

And yet you've been watching us for so many more years!

The point is we're getting to be like 'piss the league' Wednesday. People like yourself predicted we'd go up as champions our first year in the third (anything else is a failure, or words to that effect, were muttered). We failed. Last season people said the same. We failed, and by a greater margin. Now we have to slash our wage budget and trust in a rookie manager. We're also on a hell of a downward slide - Blackwell's first full season is the only season since relegation from the Premiership in which we've finished higher than the previous season.

Maybe everything will go our way this season and Wolves somehow fail to invested any of their millions in parachute payments wisely and manage to not win the League at a cantor. Maybe we will go up, I'm not ruling it out. But whilst 'unrealistic' is perhaps a touch overstated I'd still certainly rate it 'unlikely'.

These things go in cycles. Yes, we have been on a downward spiral since 2007, but ultimately things will change and we will be on an upward sprial again. That's the nature of life and football. In my lifetime, the cycles have been as follows

1966-69 down
1969-75 up
1975-81 down
1981-86 up
1986-88 down
1988-93 up
1993-00 down
2000-2007 up
2007 to date down

So those cycles last from 2 to 7 years with the average being 5 years. Incidentally our average league position in my lifetime is 30th - i.e. upper mid table in the second tier, which is probably the "natural" (given our resources) position we will grvitate around. Sometimes we will do a bit worse than that (like now) and sometimes a bit better (like from 2000-2007), but that will tend to be the average.

As I say, you have to be zen and await the return of the better times

 

[Bergen Blade]

These things go in cycles. Yes, we have been on a downward spiral since 2007, but ultimately things will change and we will be on an upward sprial again. That's the nature of life and football. In my lifetime, the cycles have been as follows

1966-69 down
1969-75 up
1975-81 down
1981-86 up
1986-88 down
1988-93 up
1993-00 down
2000-2007 up
2007 to date down

So those cycles last from 2 to 7 years with the average being 5 years. Incidentally our average league position in my lifetime is 30th - i.e. upper mid table in the second tier, which is probably the "natural" (given our resources) position we will grvitate around. Sometimes we will do a bit worse than that (like now) and sometimes a bit better (like from 2000-2007), but that will tend to be the average.

As I say, you have to be zen and await the return of the better times

Times don't change automatically though. We could settle in this division if we don't change our strategy.

Statements from the board indicate we're looking for a new approach though, and this poll also suggests fans may be a little more patient when it comes to immediate success (providing we're showing signs of progressing).

I think the expectation/pressure to "bounce back", win promotion at the earliest attempt, has made our last few managers go for short terms solutions with the way they've recruited, selected teams and chosen their playing style and tactics.

I think Weir could benefit from being allowed to think a bit further ahead. We shouldn't be looking for one glorious season in the sun, one season in the English Second Division; we should have higher ambitions than that, but gradual progress is the main thing.

 

[Darren]

Times don't change automatically though. We could settle in this division if we don't change our strategy.

Statements from the board indicate we're looking for a new approach though, and this poll also suggests fans may be a little more patient when it comes to immediate success (providing we're showing signs of progressing).

I think the expectation/pressure to "bounce back", win promotion at the earliest attempt, has made our last few managers go for short terms solutions with the way they've recruited, selected teams and chosen their playing style and tactics.

I think Weir could benefit from being allowed to think a bit further ahead. We shouldn't be looking for one glorious season in the sun, one season in the English Second Division; we should have higher ambitions than that, but gradual progress is the main thing.

The simple point is that, however much in the shit we are, Sheffield United can afford to pay better wages that the vast majority of the teams in the 3rd Division; that should translate into better players and hence promotion. Obviously, if you get a hopeless manager who fails to make best used of his players, that needn't be the case, but given that we can afford to pay a manager more than the vast majority of teams in the 3rd Division, you should also get a better manager and... you get the picture.

 

[Guesty]

As I say, you have to be zen and await the return of the better times

I get the Zen argument, it doesn't seem to chime with your bullish, and to my mind very unlikely, predictions each year.