Either build the team around Hamer or sell him

[Rodley]

I'm also starting to wonder whether contrary to popular opinion Wilder had Hamer in exactly the right place.

Well he won the Championship POTY in that position.

 

[Rodley]

If he's still here at the end of the window, he's a player who just needs licence to do as he wants and not to be stifled into something that doesn't get the best out of him as a more maverick, almost old-school free role/trequartista like a Le Tissier or Del Piero of days gone by.

I don't see why O'Hare couldn't come from a wider position instead in a 4231 or with the 4222 which gives some protection and licence to roam for both O'Hare and Hamer. Again points to what happens in transition and knowing who should be covering where because there will have to be some element of defending involved, besides just hacking a lump out of the bloke with the ball.

I think Barry’s signing means it’s unlikely that we play Hamer or COH out wide, unless you switch him to right wing but he (Barry) is too one footed IMHO to cut inside. For me he’s better than Barry out there.

 

[Kozzy_is_my_Dad]

I don’t see us accommodating Hamer.

I see us building a team with him at its core or offloading him.

So how?

I don’t think we can play a conventional 4-3-3.

Him and O’Hare in front of one defensive midfielder just asks for us to cough up possession and for the DM to be outnumbered. Hamer is a risk/reward player and as such, he does turnover possession a fair bit.

4-2-2-2:
One of Selles’ prior formations. You play Peck and Soumaré deeper and have two tens in O’Hare and Hamer behind Campbell and Barry who both have scope to roam out wide and prove space for O’Hare and Hamer to break through the lines. Brooks misses out.

4-2-1-3:
Again you have two deeper lying midfielders in Peck and Soumaré and Hamer has a relatively free role in the 10. You then have Barry and Brooks as conventional wingers and Campbell down the middle. O’Hare misses out.

4-3-3a:
Soumaré take the base of the midfield and Peck and O’Hare take the slightly wider roles. Hamer and Barry take the wider roles, unsure which as both probably prefer left, with Campbell in the middle.

4-3-3b:
Soumaré take the base of the midfield and Peck and O’Hare take the slightly wider roles. In front you have Brooks and Barry as conventional wingers. Life without Hamer begins.

What I don’t see that I perhaps naively thought we might is O’Hare and Hamer as 8s and Peck as a 6. This was just simply far too ill disciplined against a relatively average Bristol City team. Would Soumaré instead of Peck make a difference? If he’s going to be regularly outnumbered then I’d say no, even if he is marginally more a conventional defensive midfielder than Peck.

So, where does Ruben go next? Answers on a postcard to S2 4SU!

I bloody love you Champers, as always. Great post.

4-2-2-2 or 4-2-1-3 get my vote.

You can't expose Hamer and leave him hung out to dry, it harms him and us. Coventry can't believe we don't use him as a CDM, which I wanted to see, but then again they raved about him in that position - and here's the key thing - whilst generally being a worse side than us, at the time.

Give him free reign to roam, to bring others in to the game. Just don't ask him to track back, to be responsible for covering the back four, or to do ridiculous lung busting sprints akin to the world's most resilient, athletic wingers.

 

[MayorOJC]

Coventry have already shown how to use him in a midfield 3. His best season was 22-23, in a midfield 3 with Sheaf and Kelly. Sheaf and Kelly as the defensive midfielders, Hamer with a free attacking role. We need to move O'Hare wide or further back.

 

[Berkshire Blade]

You are assuming a significant bid is likely for him. His physical limitations mean I wouldn't sign him in the premier league

 

[Thrice]

4-2-3-1 might be what Selles has planned all along, but it wasn't possible for the first game because there simply was no other DM available besides Peck. Soumare had just arrived, so he probably simply wasn't ready to start the game.

 

[Revolution]

You are assuming a significant bid is likely for him. His physical limitations mean I wouldn't sign him in the premier league

If he goes it will be to the Eredivise.

 

[Brownieblade]

4-2-3-1 might be what Selles has planned all along, but it wasn't possible for the first game because there simply was no other DM available besides Peck. Soumare had just arrived, so he probably simply wasn't ready to start the game.

Can’t see any reason he can’t play alongside a DM and be the Norwood stating all the play

 

[Houston_Blade]

No one's buying , not at a price that would get our money back anyway.

Championship player of the season , my arse.
Far too lazy , a luxury player with a daft temper & impetuous way of tackling.
Occasional pieces of pure class aren't frequent enough to counterbalance.

No PL side would touch him if they'd any sense.

Oh dear, comfortably our best player and match winner in many games last season. In true Blades fan fashion though he:

Dunt runaround enuf

So he’s lazy and we should get rid

 

[Varkanoid]

I don’t see us accommodating Hamer.

I see us building a team with him at its core

if we do and he gets injured we are screwed.

 

[Panini]

Can’t see any reason he can’t play alongside a DM and be the Norwood stating all the play

He's picked over 50 cards in his last 4 seasons, mostly from shirt pulling, back chat and kicking the ball away.

Put him in a role that needs him to tackle and that number is only going up.

 

[thehet]

Championship player of the season who hasn’t been picked up by the PL…make it make sense…

 

[Pedro's Winger]

Given our inability to acquire players despite selling we'd be inviting relegation if we sold Hamer.
We already looked a potential bottom three team on Saturday.

 

[Snowflake]

I don’t see us accommodating Hamer.

I see us building a team with him at its core or offloading him.

So how?

I don’t think we can play a conventional 4-3-3.

Him and O’Hare in front of one defensive midfielder just asks for us to cough up possession and for the DM to be outnumbered. Hamer is a risk/reward player and as such, he does turnover possession a fair bit.

4-2-2-2:
One of Selles’ prior formations. You play Peck and Soumaré deeper and have two tens in O’Hare and Hamer behind Campbell and Barry who both have scope to roam out wide and prove space for O’Hare and Hamer to break through the lines. Brooks misses out.

4-2-1-3:
Again you have two deeper lying midfielders in Peck and Soumaré and Hamer has a relatively free role in the 10. You then have Barry and Brooks as conventional wingers and Campbell down the middle. O’Hare misses out.

4-3-3a:
Soumaré take the base of the midfield and Peck and O’Hare take the slightly wider roles. Hamer and Barry take the wider roles, unsure which as both probably prefer left, with Campbell in the middle.

4-3-3b:
Soumaré take the base of the midfield and Peck and O’Hare take the slightly wider roles. In front you have Brooks and Barry as conventional wingers. Life without Hamer begins.

What I don’t see that I perhaps naively thought we might is O’Hare and Hamer as 8s and Peck as a 6. This was just simply far too ill disciplined against a relatively average Bristol City team. Would Soumaré instead of Peck make a difference? If he’s going to be regularly outnumbered then I’d say no, even if he is marginally more a conventional defensive midfielder than Peck.

So, where does Ruben go next? Answers on a postcard to S2 4SU!

Set up as if you have only 10 players and leave Hamer to go/play wherever he wants other than the back 4.

 

[Brownieblade]

He's picked over 50 cards in his last 4 seasons, mostly from shirt pulling, back chat and kicking the ball away.

Put him in a role that needs him to tackle and that number is only going up.

IMO the role of sitting in cm on the defensive side is not about great tackling it’s about covering the space and ground, you don’t need to run 30 yards and do perfect slide tackle, you need to get over there and make sure the attack is stalled if not stopped

Maybe I’m being cynical but I wouldn’t mind a few cynical fouls stopping counter attacks than nothing stopping them

 

[Bladesince59]

He's off

 

[dexter101]

I don't think we are going to see Selles suddenly move away from the 4-3-3 he is trying to implement and clearly thinks there is the players to do it.

With Soumare coming in, it might be a bit more horses for courses as we can play:

Soumare with Peck and Hamer/O'hare

or

Soumare with Hamer and O'hare

I don't want us to have to rely on Hamer to produce moments of magic like he did last year. If that is our plan and he gets injured... then what.

It might be that with more time learning the roles, patterns of play and a bit of confidence, we can go with Hamer and O'Hare, but in the short term, alternating seems to make sense.

 

[DronnieBlade]

I don’t see us accommodating Hamer.

I see us building a team with him at its core or offloading him.

So how?

I don’t think we can play a conventional 4-3-3.

Him and O’Hare in front of one defensive midfielder just asks for us to cough up possession and for the DM to be outnumbered. Hamer is a risk/reward player and as such, he does turnover possession a fair bit.

4-2-2-2:
One of Selles’ prior formations. You play Peck and Soumaré deeper and have two tens in O’Hare and Hamer behind Campbell and Barry who both have scope to roam out wide and prove space for O’Hare and Hamer to break through the lines. Brooks misses out.

4-2-1-3:
Again you have two deeper lying midfielders in Peck and Soumaré and Hamer has a relatively free role in the 10. You then have Barry and Brooks as conventional wingers and Campbell down the middle. O’Hare misses out.

4-3-3a:
Soumaré take the base of the midfield and Peck and O’Hare take the slightly wider roles. Hamer and Barry take the wider roles, unsure which as both probably prefer left, with Campbell in the middle.

4-3-3b:
Soumaré take the base of the midfield and Peck and O’Hare take the slightly wider roles. In front you have Brooks and Barry as conventional wingers. Life without Hamer begins.

What I don’t see that I perhaps naively thought we might is O’Hare and Hamer as 8s and Peck as a 6. This was just simply far too ill disciplined against a relatively average Bristol City team. Would Soumaré instead of Peck make a difference? If he’s going to be regularly outnumbered then I’d say no, even if he is marginally more a conventional defensive midfielder than Peck.

So, where does Ruben go next? Answers on a postcard to S2 4SU!

For the last time. And the same applied to Sandra Burger who is a DEEP LYING PLAYMAKER - always has been always will be.

Gus is a deep lying playmaker. Not a CM. not a DCM. Not a LM. Not a RM.

You have to understand the difference cos it is exactly that. Different !!

UTB

 

[Fjortoft's Aeroplane]

I know this is perhaps a controversial opinion, but I actually think we did ok with him playing where he played last season (Championship Player of the season). O'Hare was also pretty good in his position until Wilder became obsessed with shoehorning Brewster in at every opportunity. Still I'd be up for trying him as AM - but he's not going to press.

 

[Fjortoft's Aeroplane]

Coventry have already shown how to use him in a midfield 3. His best season was 22-23, in a midfield 3 with Sheaf and Kelly. Sheaf and Kelly as the defensive midfielders, Hamer with a free attacking role. We need to move O'Hare wide or further back.

Hamer was part of Coventry's double pivot and not the attacking midfielder. The attacking midfielder was... Callum O'Hare and Kasey Palmer when O'hare wa injured.

 

[Champagneblade]

1 game. 1 fucking game.

Does he not get a chance to adapt either?

It’s a question that may well have been testing while the window is open. That’s the origin of my question, not so mix a knee jerk reaction to Saturday.

I reckon 16-20m and the Board will consider.

 

[loyalblade95]

If I had to choose the lineup for Saturday, I would go with this.

----------------Cooper
Seriki-Bindon-Robbo-Burrows
----Peck---Soumare---Hamer
O'Hare------Campbell------Barry

Would hope that Selles gets the 2 new players he was alluding to in time to play against Coventry, and that at least one of them is a CB.

Use O'Hare and Barry as inside forwards rather than traditional wingers (as Barry played inside forward against BCFC).

O'Hare might not be the quickest, but he makes up for it with his directness and trickery.

Soumare to shield the back 4, hopefully with the discipline required of a CDM.

Peck and Hamer to play as the 2 CM's, though I would tell Hamer to concentrate more on joining the attack, while Peck can hang back and help Soumare (like he did with Souza last season) when needed.

 

[Northyorksblade]

He certainly isn't disciplined enough to be tackling people or he will have 10 yellows before Christmas.

November I reckon

 

[brownblade]

Coventry have already shown how to use him in a midfield 3. His best season was 22-23, in a midfield 3 with Sheaf and Kelly. Sheaf and Kelly as the defensive midfielders, Hamer with a free attacking role. We need to move O'Hare wide or further back.

I think he played in a few different Coventry formations. Though can't recall which most often. But he was in the same team as O'Hare and it worked well.

In an earlier comment, I wasn't suggesting Hamer should never drop deep or defend - but the more he is deep, the higher the risk.

 

[bonobo]

Hamers key assets seem to me to be in the final third. Double figures assists and goals last season and a role in many other goals. I am sure like any player he enjoys a free central role, but I feel left right or centre in attakingbrole he will contribute in the same way. If he is a better player in a deep midfield role, it is going be something worth seeing. But the issue for me with him there, his passing r

 

[Keen Blade]

Coventry have already shown how to use him in a midfield 3. His best season was 22-23, in a midfield 3 with Sheaf and Kelly. Sheaf and Kelly as the defensive midfielders, Hamer with a free attacking role. We need to move O'Hare wide or further back.

It's the old Hamer /O'Hare conundrum

 

[Keen Blade]

Championship player of the season who hasn’t been picked up by the PL…make it make sense…

I have already - wrong physique , wrong attitude , would never lose a bit of weight and get himself fit enough , would get even more yellows.

PL teams carry nobody , no matter how sublimely skilled - they're all athletes first - it's a given.

 

[Frank the tank]

He could always adopt a more professional attitude ,optimize his physical conditioning so that he can do the basic requirements of his job
Who knows he might even get better at the things he is good at

 

[MiserableBlader]

I don’t see us accommodating Hamer.

I see us building a team with him at its core or offloading him.

So how?

I don’t think we can play a conventional 4-3-3.

Him and O’Hare in front of one defensive midfielder just asks for us to cough up possession and for the DM to be outnumbered. Hamer is a risk/reward player and as such, he does turnover possession a fair bit.

4-2-2-2:
One of Selles’ prior formations. You play Peck and Soumaré deeper and have two tens in O’Hare and Hamer behind Campbell and Barry who both have scope to roam out wide and prove space for O’Hare and Hamer to break through the lines. Brooks misses out.

4-2-1-3:
Again you have two deeper lying midfielders in Peck and Soumaré and Hamer has a relatively free role in the 10. You then have Barry and Brooks as conventional wingers and Campbell down the middle. O’Hare misses out.

4-3-3a:
Soumaré take the base of the midfield and Peck and O’Hare take the slightly wider roles. Hamer and Barry take the wider roles, unsure which as both probably prefer left, with Campbell in the middle.

4-3-3b:
Soumaré take the base of the midfield and Peck and O’Hare take the slightly wider roles. In front you have Brooks and Barry as conventional wingers. Life without Hamer begins.

What I don’t see that I perhaps naively thought we might is O’Hare and Hamer as 8s and Peck as a 6. This was just simply far too ill disciplined against a relatively average Bristol City team. Would Soumaré instead of Peck make a difference? If he’s going to be regularly outnumbered then I’d say no, even if he is marginally more a conventional defensive midfielder than Peck.

So, where does Ruben go next? Answers on a postcard to S2 4SU!

You have not included the best formation we could have had last season - if we had had a good manager
The formation that won the FaCup
The formation that beat Man City again, 4-1 in Portugal
3-4-3
Cooper
Sooty Anel Robinson
Seriki Peck/Arblaster Vini Burrows
HAMER Campbell Jesus/Brooks

THAT DOES NOT REQUIRE BUILDING AROUND HAMER.

That team would have destroyed the division last season
Although not available all the time.

If you want to know how it works to best effect - watch the winner at Millwall

Robinson to Hamer simple tap in for Brewster.

We could still look to emulate that with replacements if they ever arrive.

Then if needed a more solid 3-5-2 could use HAMER in his other ideal position - no 10.
AGAIN - no mods needed for HAMER
Basically the McGoldrick roll not the Duffy roll.
(Which is obviously feasible at this level)

 

[Rufus Smalls]

Looked like a passenger anyway Saturday. Sell him . Don’t think system will suit

He still didn’t look quite fit either.