Didzy racially abused [Off topic messages removed]

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FMBlade1 said:
What can actually be done to stop this?

Shaming/punishing people may make us feel better about ourselves but I doubt it will do any good to the guilty party and these things happen again and again.

Voting for a different political party/person won't make a real difference.

Regulating social media doesn't stop people having racist thoughts.

Education is the key imho.

Easy for me to say I know, but I would rather send people on an educational trip to Auschwitz to change their perspective and maybe meet the people they have abused.

If that won't work nothing will :(
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Rather than your inference that shaming/punishing has minimal benefit, surely it's the exposure that they imagine might not happen to them? Rather than allowing this cruelty to remain in the shadows, expose those who support this evil, let the world see what exists so that should anyone imagine that racism is a peripheral activity it will be clear that racism is still an active belief for some people.

I agree, education is vital. By all means allow people to visit concentration camps, but in addition let the school curriculum become widened, let kids know what it means to be an imperial power, show them that in order to create incredible wealth it means that there are those who've created that wealth, who've suffered, even died because the colour of their skin, means they are viewed as worthless and beneath consideration.

In my view legislation rarely changes opinions that are entrenched, but even if it has a slight benefit better this than nothing at all.
 

PokerBlade said:
Companies like Twitter could be doing a lot more, particularly when it comes to having filters for certain words. The problem when it comes to legislation is that by giving sites legal responsibilities you'd probably kill all social media stone dead. If you take a site like this, where the admins have had to take half an hour out of their working life to fix a thread, being legally responsible for someone posting something abusive would end it. Even if they could do it, the legal risks alone would make this site not worth running. All it would take is one overly-litigious person to try to take them to court and it'd be goodbye S24SU.

The best thing, and the way things seem to be going (Youtube and Reddit have just removed a lot of far-right and other questionable content) is that we continue to make promoting racism flat-out bad for business. That kind of pressure will have them change in a day.
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Yes, I appreciate that Social Media would be killed stone dead - except the Social media companies would adapt. The scale of the problem is off the Richter scale with the amount of servers that run these sites now - it isn't controllable by people - it's impossible to control by people - Twitter couldn't throw enough people at the problem, it simply isn't feasible.

People keep saying they want change - it's the top level rules that need changing - anything other than that will have zero effect.

I do appreciate the knock on effects - If Twitter is made responsible for content posted, the big boys in Silicon Valley WOULD find a solution.............or go out of business. I believe they know how to solve the problem, they don't want to as they have a supa dupa business model making zillions of dollars that is at present held off shore and isn't being repatriated for corporation tax reasons - now that's an issue for another day!

It is solvable - the big American Corps need to be made to resolve the problem. At this moment in time, no seperate Country is brave enough - but as is usual with things like this, momentum is building.

UTB
 
Racism that was evident inside grounds seems to have moved more online.

The comfort to be taken from this is that it's easier to out these people and a few instances make the headlines now, where as 20 plus years ago these comments were rife during a game and zero was done about it.

I'm a large advocate that education and experience of living/working with people of other colours is the best tool for changing attitudes.

Racism will always exist to some degree so we have to have laws but a sensible productive approach is needed as with all crimes.

Further hate and political motivated anger and bias will never improve this issue that exists across the planet.

You can be disgusted by something but a more measured intelligent approach is required to this rather than anger and preaching. We've seen how recent weeks have created as much division as unity.

An educated apolitical approach is paramount to make real progress imho.
 
Tarqs said:
Seems that Didsy has kept this to himself, or people close to him considering the lack of a story in mainstream media. They need chelsea looking into this as it's clearly a chelsea fan considering the content.
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You say that pal but there was a group of neo-nazis walking up onto Mam Tor with a “white lives matters” banner a few weeks back and flashing KKK hand gestures, plastered all over social media. Sadly this type of stuff is closer to home than we all think.

I don’t think it’s a coincidence that Didzy and Billy were the first to lead the players to take the knee that he’s been on the receiving end of this. ☹️☹️☹️
 
Fulwood Blade said:
Yes, I appreciate that Social Media would be killed stone dead - except the Social media companies would adapt. The scale of the problem is off the Richter scale with the amount of servers that run these sites now - it isn't controllable by people - it's impossible to control by people - Twitter couldn't throw enough people at the problem, it simply isn't feasible.

People keep saying they want change - it's the top level rules that need changing - anything other than that will have zero effect.

I do appreciate the knock on effects - If Twitter is made responsible for content posted, the big boys in Silicon Valley WOULD find a solution.............or go out of business. I believe they know how to solve the problem, they don't want to as they have a supa dupa business model making zillions of dollars that is at present held off shore and isn't being repatriated for corporation tax reasons - now that's an issue for another day!

It is solvable - the big American Corps need to be made to resolve the problem. At this moment in time, no seperate Country is brave enough - but as is usual with things like this, momentum is building.

UTB
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I guess it comes down to what policies would be proposed but I'd have three concerns, one is that I think when it comes to "find a solution or go out of business" the latter is the most likely. The second is that if I'm wrong what happens is that the internet goes from being full of forums like this one to only giants like Facebook or Twitter having the public space. And I'm not a huge fan of that thought. The third possibility is that sites get hosted in countries where the laws are less strict and either everyone flouts the law by going there anyway or we go down the Great Firewall route like China.

It's also worth looking into what Reddit and Youtube have just done. Reddit have removed hundreds of questionable groups, and Youtube have deleted some far-right channels like Stefan Molyneux and Richard Spencer. They've done this because that type of content has become increasingly bad for business thanks to recent public pressures. I'm uncharacteristically optimistic here, but I think progress is being made. We'll see if it lasts.
 
itsinyerblood said:
Rather than your inference that shaming/punishing has minimal benefit, surely it's the exposure that they imagine might not happen to them? Rather than allowing this cruelty to remain in the shadows, expose those who support this evil, let the world see what exists so that should anyone imagine that racism is a peripheral activity it will be clear that racism is still an active belief for some people.

I agree, education is vital. By all means allow people to visit concentration camps, but in addition let the school curriculum become widened, let kids know what it means to be an imperial power, show them that in order to create incredible wealth it means that there are those who've created that wealth, who've suffered, even died because the colour of their skin, means they are viewed as worthless and beneath consideration.

In my view legislation rarely changes opinions that are entrenched, but even if it has a slight benefit better this than nothing at all.
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Nowhere, anywhere was I implying nothing should be done.

The statistics and studies show that significant progress has been made over the past 20 years. No room for complacency of course.

School curriculum need to change a lot. Why should kids who have no interest in science for example be forced to memorize the equation for photosynthesis rather than life skills and values? That leads to a whole other topic.

Social media, and cameras etc don't show a rising trend, they reveal what was already there.
 
Chelsea have always had a quite nasty racist element in the fan base as anyone old enough to have been there 30-40 years ago will attest to but we have it there too, all clubs almost certainly do. Education is the key as others have said but it also needs our own to make uncomfortable decisions some times too. We have to call it out and report it when we see and hear it even in our own fans. Hand on heart how many of us have heard stuff on the terraces and in the stands and have either through indifference or maybe even fear of the personal consequences turned a blind eye. I have. We have to change too and even if we don’t do racist things ourselves also make the decision to stand up and be counted.
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.
 
Yellarbellyblade said:
Chelsea have always had a quite nasty racist element in the fan base as anyone old enough to have been there 30-40 years ago will attest to but we have it there too, all clubs almost certainly do. Education is the key as others have said but it also needs our own to make uncomfortable decisions some times too. We have to call it out and report it when we see and hear it even in our own fans. Hand on heart how many of us have heard stuff on the terraces and in the stands and have either through indifference or maybe even fear of the personal consequences turned a blind eye. I have. We have to change too and even if we don’t do racist things ourselves also make the decision to stand up and be counted.
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.
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On that point on the terraces, I can't understand why for the life of me PL clubs can't afford/don't pay for proper cameras/audio surveillance in the stands.
 
A lot of these problems could easily be solved by all social media sites insisting on people using their real verifiable names and ideally a photo of the person. Personally I have a rule that I never post anything I wouldn’t be prepared to say to someone’s face. This way it would be the poster on the hook and not the site which seems a lot fairer to me.

I could of course be entirely wrong 🥺 UTB
 
TCsLoveChild said:
A lot of these problems could easily be solved by all social media sites insisting on people using their real verifiable names and ideally a photo of the person. Personally I have a rule that I never post anything I wouldn’t be prepared to say to someone’s face. This way it would be the poster on the hook and not the site which seems a lot fairer to me.

I could of course be entirely wrong 🥺 UTB
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Not meaning to sound difficult, but I don't think it is as easy as it sounds.

A lot of journalists/activists need anonymity through social media channels in various places around the world for their own protection where they reveal injustice.

Giving their private details to social media companies (which can be hacked etc) then misused by corrupt regimes is something to be fearful of.
 
The easiest way to stop racism is make DNA testing mandatory. When 95% of the country suddenly find out what’s in their bloodline, no matter how white they think they look in the mirror, it will force them to engage their brains before opening their big gobs. ✌️
 

BanderSerge said:
The easiest way to stop racism is make DNA testing mandatory. When 95% of the country suddenly find out what’s in their bloodline, no matter how white they think they look in the mirror, it will force them to engage their brains before opening their big gobs. ✌
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Most of them haven't got any brains - that's the problem!
 
FMBlade1 said:
Not meaning to sound difficult, but I don't think it is as easy as it sounds.

A lot of journalists/activists need anonymity through social media channels in various places around the world for their own protection where they reveal injustice.

Giving their private details to social media companies (which can be hacked etc) then misused by corrupt regimes is something to be fearful of.
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Yeah, imagine if the admin on here had to verify and store our personal data to that level. Huge security risk, huge personal liability, S24SU would be dead. Then there's just the principle that we've all had fall outs on this type of forum, do you want your name attached knowing some of the morons associated with football on matchdays?
 
blades95 said:
Until AI is strong enough to correctly identify problematic comments (and even then you will get people moaning about training bias) real people have to do it, and it's not easy on them mentally:

www.theverge.com

The secret lives of Facebook moderators in America

"I’m fucked up."
www.theverge.com www.theverge.com
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Don't need AI or a real person to catch the language used in that post though. That can be done overnight.
There is a fine and important line to be drawn between freedom of expression and censorship though. That is a big issue outside the scope of what we are talking about here. Most hate speech falls outside of that though and could be auto filtered in lots of cases, especially this one.
 
Yellarbellyblade said:
Chelsea have always had a quite nasty racist element in the fan base as anyone old enough to have been there 30-40 years ago will attest to but we have it there too, all clubs almost certainly do. Education is the key as others have said but it also needs our own to make uncomfortable decisions some times too. We have to call it out and report it when we see and hear it even in our own fans. Hand on heart how many of us have heard stuff on the terraces and in the stands and have either through indifference or maybe even fear of the personal consequences turned a blind eye. I have. We have to change too and even if we don’t do racist things ourselves also make the decision to stand up and be counted.
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.
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I don't know if the Chelsea thing is a rumour-become-fact. It was stated in one post and has been picked up as truth.

I personally haven't heard anything in a ground in years. If people do, they should report it asap.
 
Greasy Chap Butty said:
Don't need AI or a real person to catch the language used in that post though. That can be done overnight.
There is a fine and important line to be drawn between freedom of expression and censorship though. That is a big issue outside the scope of what we are talking about here. Most hate speech falls outside of that though and could be auto filtered in lots of cases, especially this one.
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Again, they could be doing much more than they are. The best way is to have filters that flag up questionable content and then require some kind of appeal if you feel the AI's got it wrong. But YouTube have that kind of policy and it's really been hurting some content creators. I follow a guy called Thunderf00t on YouTube (horrible politics but I love his debunking videos) and in this past week he's had a video debunking a conspiracy about wearing masks deleted three times because the AI picks up on the topics mentioned and says "This is corona misinformation". Others have their videos removed or demonitised because when they talk about far-right personalities they get flagged as being far-right.

The amount of info that goes through these platforms is unfathomably huge. It's no small task to figure out how to manage it. I'm with people that Twitter don't do enough but what "enough" even looks like is hard to say.
 
PokerBlade said:
Again, they could be doing much more than they are. The best way is to have filters that flag up questionable content and then require some kind of appeal if you feel the AI's got it wrong. But YouTube have that kind of policy and it's really been hurting some content creators. I follow a guy called Thunderf00t on YouTube (horrible politics but I love his debunking videos) and in this past week he's had a video debunking a conspiracy about wearing masks deleted three times because the AI picks up on the topics mentioned and says "This is corona misinformation". Others have their videos removed or demonitised because when they talk about far-right personalities they get flagged as being far-right.

The amount of info that goes through these platforms is unfathomably huge. It's no small task to figure out how to manage it. I'm with people that Twitter don't do enough but what "enough" even looks like is hard to say.
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Exactly. Spilling from stopping hate speech into censorship is difficult.and has its own issues. Stopping the extremes of hate speech isn't so hard though.
 
Why is anyone shocked, its a horrible world at the moment and seems to be getting worse. You only had to see the responses on here to Black Lives Matter, taking the knee etc to see that racism is alive and well on this forum
 
blades95 said:
People are all for name and shame until it's something that doesn't affect them.
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Yes, I’m not sure what the pig fan is getting at to be honest. Why wouldn’t you name and shame someone who called you a [TERM REMOVED] for christ sake. If its someone of employment age, they should lose their job if they can be identified.
 
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Black lives matter...... Fot Internet trolls.....

I'm sorry but this country has gone backwards.... Don't tell me it hasn't... I'm not buying it.

This is 2020... Apparently..... Feels more like 1820....

Just what the feck is going off....?
 
Foxy said:
Perhaps amongst some visitors, I can't control their views, but it's absolutely, as previously pointed out, not going to be alive and well here and is zero tolerance.
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Absolutely but there were some unpleasant replies to some of the threads related to race before they were closed down. However I have no wish to start stirring up politics when you have asked for it not be on the forum.
 
BanderSerge said:
The easiest way to stop racism is make DNA testing mandatory. When 95% of the country suddenly find out what’s in their bloodline, no matter how white they think they look in the mirror, it will force them to engage their brains before opening their big gobs. ✌
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I can't remember the programme, but there was an hilarious TV moment where some BNP-type halfwit was told he had Roma ancestry.

Prejudice, meet Fact.
 
"He" seems to be a Chelsea fan if you do a Google for the name... one of the few search listings is that Instagram account commenting on a picture of Mason Mount with "leave my club you shite useless donkey."
 

Linz said:
"He" seems to be a Chelsea fan if you do a Google for the name... one of the few search listings is that Instagram account commenting on a picture of Mason Mount with "leave my club you shite useless donkey."
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I hope he's a season ticket holder.
 
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