Collins and maguire back at lane

[AlienBlade]

Robertson is a left back, Bruce is definitely a centre half. Rosenior is a right back. Paul McShane, a full international, has not been mentioned.

My opinion is that Maguire is excellent at our level.

Bruce has played DCM in all the games I've seen, (for example the QPR game... last one I could find him starting)

Line up was

McGregor (GK)
Dawson CB
Davies CB
Odubajo RB
Robertson LB
Bruce (CM) (who was then subbed for a Striker in that game) but I cant say I follow Hull with any detail so he may well be normally a CB?

I can understand why he wasnt a regular in the Prem (not that I think he was good enough for the Prem) but to go to the point I was also making, Magiure (now in a team in the Championship) with many players being sold on from a CB position

leaving...

Davies (who has a whole 2 U21 caps more than Maguire...) his last one being 8 years ago....
Dawson (who has at least played for the A team... albeit 4 times...
Hayden (who they loaned in at the start of the season from Arsenal and has played more than Maguire despite 2 years younger)
Bruce (if you want to count him (2 caps for Northern Ireland, 2 years ago)

which means that in this season he is behind "Internationals" who have amassed just 6 full caps between them, Bruce was that confident in Maguire... he brought a younger model on loan.... unlike the inference which was being made by Sitwell that the CB is awash with internationals

but as I said to Slug, it's all opinions, I have mine, I don't think he would benefit us... I think he was too inconsistant, and granted being in the lower league he got away with it, we dont want to be just "getting away with it"

Ok then we all agree hes shit ,now lets explain 2.5 million pounds they paid for him ,on the back of a couple of games on Sky I wonder ?

people have been signed for far greater sums on far less "scounting" wasnt one person signed on the basis of some you tube videos once (not sure if he cost anything) but happens all the time... a club has a finite number of scouts... Hull would have wanted to see how well he did against teams who were in Hull's league... so which would you send a scout too... Blades vs Hartlepool in the JPT... or Aston Villa vs Blades in the FA Cup....

granted this might not have been the full reason for him signing for Liverpool....

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...skills-video-impressed-Liverpools-owners.html

is my thoughts that scouts pick and choose games to watch so outlandish? or is it because you dont agree with my view on Maguire that is clouding your view on this?

 

[Balham Blade]

Alex Bruce is definitely a CB AlienBlade ; Steve Bruce plays a 3-5-2 at 'Umberside Jungle Cats.

Maguire is a very good defender at our level but lacks pace. If he plays with a quick centre half (Davies) then he'd be fine but Collins and Maguire are too similar in my view.

 

[Slim Man]

I too have watched him play week in week out... (well before he left for pastures new.. including youth games) so i guess we have the same basis on which to form an opinion...

In the youth cup for example he actually carried a very poor Kennedy....

Kyle walker only played a handful of games... maguire played i think in over 100...

Charlie Austin... he did his job and score goals. But whether i would hold him as premiership class i am not sure... especially after just 1 season.. Austin also had suiters... Maguire doesnt appear to have any.

Not that i pay much attention to FIFA games.. but i would think they put a lot of research in to their ratings... there are 6 current league 1 players ar CB with a better rating than Maguire (although some of them i wouldnt rate as the best in this league... ala Reda Johnson) but its all about opinions

The simple is only a relegation bound player wanted maguire... bruce wont play him in the championship (so cant rate him that highly.. as he is playing the highly rated right back who is only 21... so age wont be an issue for Bruce...

And its not just becuase he left us. I didnt rate him whilst he played for us. He was too inconsistant.

At least we agree that he isnt premiership class...

Barmy that you don't think Maguire would be comfortably the best centre half in this division. No others would go for anything above what Harry went for, currently.

He's being kept out by Davies and Dawson, two experienced premier league defenders.
Last season James Chester too who this season went to WBA for £8mil.

In one of his only starts for Hull in the FA Cup he played away at Arsenal and was voted 2nd in the MOM poll behind match winner Alexis Sanchez...

As for the FIFA ratings... Well... they forgot to include Marc McNulty, James Wallace and Louis Reed in the game so I wouldn't say they pay that much attention to any league below the premiership.

Bizzare.
Our current crop of paraplegics at CH would make Harry look like Beckenbauer.

 

[AlienBlade]

Barmy that you don't think Maguire would be comfortably the best centre half in this division. No others would go for anything above what Harry went for, currently.

He's being kept out by Davies and Dawson, two experienced premier league defenders.
Last season James Chester too who this season went to WBA for £8mil.

In one of his only starts for Hull in the FA Cup he played away at Arsenal and was voted 2nd in the MOM poll behind match winner Alexis Sanchez...

As for the FIFA ratings... Well... they forgot to include Marc McNulty, James Wallace and Louis Reed in the game so I wouldn't say they pay that much attention to any league below the premiership.

Bizzare.
Our current crop of paraplegics at CH would make Harry look like Beckenbauer.

I was using the Fifa ratings as a little tongue in cheek tbh (if you didnt pick up on that)... which is akin for me as saying how a player is on Football Manager....

and just becuase our current crop of centre backs would make Harry look better doesnt make Harry any good... what's that quote "in the land of the blind the one eye'd man is king"

and the fact that he was 2nd in the MOM poll in an FA CUP match kinda proves the point doesnt it? i.e. he can only seem to perform in those types of games... if we was consistant... he would be featuring (the lad they brought in from Arsenal is a 20 year old CB) so if he can played 6 times... means that Bruce wasnt happy with Maguire and has pushed him further down the line by getting in a younger model despite having Davies, Dawson and Bruce there too... if he can push his way in to a championship side with these three in it... makes you wonder why Harry can't)

From a personal Point of View I rate Jame O'Conner higher than Maguire... who was an established Championship CB.... Possibly evan Craig Morgan (Wales International) or Wigans other CB Leon Barnett (also subject to a £2.5m deal in his career) and thats off the top of my head who would be a better player than Harry in League 1.

but its all about opions, whether you agree with mine, is neither here nor there...

 

[AlienBlade]

Alex Bruce is definitely a CB AlienBlade ; Steve Bruce plays a 3-5-2 at 'Umberside Jungle Cats.

Maguire is a very good defender at our level but lacks pace. If he plays with a quick centre half (Davies) then he'd be fine but Collins and Maguire are too similar in my view.

as I said I dont really follow Hull, so I am more than happy to stand corrected (I just always had it in my head he was a midfielder as when he "burst onto the scene I though he was playing in a different position to his dad. but anyway... I did include him in the assessment (but even Bruce seems to have been usurped by this 20 year old from Arsenal...

with regards to Harry, for me he had 2 strengths (if you can call them that) he won a lot in the air... (hardly suprising considering his height) and he had a powerful enough kick that he could boot a 70 yard diagonal ball (not always came off but it was there)

as you say he was slow so when he "burst" out of defence he often left our defence exposed as he was slow to get back. he was often caught on the ball and his positional play was poor in my opinion, (I also think Collins is poor but thought the whole was greater than the two halves when they played together, however never saw either as being above lower championship level)

 

[Bergen Blade]

and the fact that he was 2nd in the MOM poll in an FA CUP match kinda proves the point doesnt it? i.e. he can only seem to perform in those types of games... if we was consistant... he would be featuring (the lad they brought in from Arsenal is a 20 year old CB) so if he can played 6 times... means that Bruce wasnt happy with Maguire and has pushed him further down the line by getting in a younger model despite having Davies, Dawson and Bruce there too... if he can push his way in to a championship side with these three in it... makes you wonder why Harry can't)

Isaac Hayden is primarily a defensive midfielder.

http://paininthearsenal.com/2015/09...iche-at-arsenal-for-isaac-hayden-to-fit-into/

 

[Slim Man]

I was using the Fifa ratings as a little tongue in cheek tbh (if you didnt pick up on that)... which is akin for me as saying how a player is on Football Manager....

and just becuase our current crop of centre backs would make Harry look better doesnt make Harry any good... what's that quote "in the land of the blind the one eye'd man is king"

and the fact that he was 2nd in the MOM poll in an FA CUP match kinda proves the point doesnt it? i.e. he can only seem to perform in those types of games... if we was consistant... he would be featuring (the lad they brought in from Arsenal is a 20 year old CB) so if he can played 6 times... means that Bruce wasnt happy with Maguire and has pushed him further down the line by getting in a younger model despite having Davies, Dawson and Bruce there too... if he can push his way in to a championship side with these three in it... makes you wonder why Harry can't)

From a personal Point of View I rate Jame O'Conner higher than Maguire... who was an established Championship CB.... Possibly evan Craig Morgan (Wales International) or Wigans other CB Leon Barnett (also subject to a £2.5m deal in his career) and thats off the top of my head who would be a better player than Harry in League 1.

but its all about opions, whether you agree with mine, is neither here nor there...

I was taking an interest and started to understand your argument until yo suggested that Leon Barnett and James O'Connor are better centre halves than Harry Maguire.

O'Connor was only ever a right back in the championship, and went to CB at Walsall where he's not even the best centre half there.
Leon Barnett is like a younger Claude Davis.

Craig Morgan I might be able to understand, but I wouldn't say he's better. Theres a reason he dropped back into League One.

 

[AlienBlade]

Isaac Hayden is primarily a defensive midfielder.

http://paininthearsenal.com/2015/09...iche-at-arsenal-for-isaac-hayden-to-fit-into/

if as mentioned Steve Bruce plays a 3-5-2 (in defence of Alex Bruce being a defender)

with Dawson and Davies the two of the three CB's then who's been the other player that is playing at CB when Alex Bruce hasnt (Bruce has only played 2 league games out of 10) as it's not been Maguire, as from what I can see there are only 4 CB at the club... if we are counting Bruce but discounting Hayden?

becuase you would think an actual CB should be better in his natural position than someone else who isnt a natural CB playing there is...

 

[AlienBlade]

I was taking an interest and started to understand your argument until yo suggested that Leon Barnett and James O'Connor are better centre halves than Harry Maguire.

O'Connor was only ever a right back in the championship, and went to CB at Walsall where he's not even the best centre half there.
Leon Barnett is like a younger Claude Davis.

Craig Morgan I might be able to understand, but I wouldn't say he's better. Theres a reason he dropped back into League One.

Re: Morgan Could it have had nothing to do with the ridiculous amount of money he was offered by Wigan? Also is there no reason why Maguire is not playing regular Championship football...

To use the "international" badge as a badge of worth (Sitwell did)... Claude Davis was/is an international captain... so if we can use the International card... (I could say we paid £3m for him... and Hull only paid £2.5m for Harry... which must mean he was better.. (and yes that's very tongue in cheek as it shows transfer fees have no bearance on quality....)

TBH also rated Davis more than I do Maguire, yes he had bombscare moments but he was a better player than Harry IMO (but that's another thread entirely) not saying he was world class, just better...

IF he was as good as people make out he would have had offers from more than just Wigan last season when Hull had more than enough cover(and if there were more offers than Wigan, why did he choose them if he felt he was better) the fact he didnt shows for me other managers also dont rate him as championship standard...

as I have said, it's all about opinions, I personally dont think he would be the best defender in this league... you do... the only way we would know is if he dropped down to league one again... (which isn't completely out of the question)

 

[Bergen Blade]

if as mentioned Steve Bruce plays a 3-5-2 (in defence of Alex Bruce being a defender)

with Dawson and Davies the two of the three CB's then who's been the other player that is playing at CB when Alex Bruce hasnt (Bruce has only played 2 league games out of 10) as it's not been Maguire, as from what I can see there are only 4 CB at the club... if we are counting Bruce but discounting Hayden?

becuase you would think an actual CB should be better in his natural position than someone else who isnt a natural CB playing there is...

Hull have used a back four most of this season. Davies and Dawson are their first choice centre half pairing. They've switched to 3-5-2 on a couple of occasions.