Coaching staff

[1889]

It now looks pretty certain that Nigel Clough will be announced as the new manager and he will doubtless insist on bringing his own coaching staff.

I personally think that it's time for clubs to appoint their own fitness and coaching staff as a completely separate entity to the manager, who should be allowed to bring just one assistant. It can't be beneficial to the players when there is no continuity and their whole training regime is completely changed midway through the season whilst they adapt to the new coaches methods. Not only that but, financially the club have the burden of paying off half a dozen people, who could well be doing a better job than the ones who they are replacing them with?

It seems absolute madness to me and I can't imagine it happening in any other industry.

 

[Bath Blade]

It now looks pretty certain that Nigel Clough will be announced as the new manager and he will doubtless insist on bringing his own coaching staff.

I personally think that it's time for clubs to appoint their own fitness and coaching staff as a completely separate entity to the manager, who should be allowed to bring just one assistant. It can't be beneficial to the players when there is no continuity and their whole training regime is completely changed midway through the season whilst they adapt to the new coaches methods. Not only that but, financially the club have the burden of paying off half a dozen people, who could well be doing a better job than the ones who they are replacing them with?

It seems absolute madness to me and I can't imagine it happening in any other industry.

But the buck stops with the manager, and I can't imagine a manager being happy with a situation whereby he may be sacked (and therefore have his reputation tarnished) because the coaching staff he didn't choose aren't good enough.

 

[MCFC]

In the prem it´s getting increasingly rare to find clubs willing to give any manager a say about coaching staff and as for buying players I doubt that any club but a few will give him a free reign.
Personally I think that´s one of the reasons that English managers are almost extinct, Dinosaurs they are..

 

[GRENO]

Definitely agree with the original post regards the coaching staff.

If true not got a problem with the appointment of Clough, because on the whole Derby fans
seem to think he's done a good job. But at the same time they are all critical of his coaching staff
for what ever reason ( could be all ex forest ) mainly clueless and idiots often mentioned.
So surely can't be right for half a dozen of our coaching staff to lose their livelihoods so he can
surround himself with his yes men.

 

[sheffielder]

Definitely agree with the original post regards the coaching staff.

If true not got a problem with the appointment of Clough, because on the whole Derby fans
seem to think he's done a good job. But at the same time they are all critical of his coaching staff
for what ever reason ( could be all ex forest ) mainly clueless and idiots often mentioned.
So surely can't be right for half a dozen of our coaching staff to lose their livelihoods so he can
surround himself with his yes men.

If we brought in someone who had on the whole ex Wednesday players I am sure they would be the first pepole we blamed. The Derby fans only allowed Clough because of his dad, the other staff are just pure Forest in their eyes.

 

[BornOnShorehamStreet]

Definitely agree with the original post regards the coaching staff.

If true not got a problem with the appointment of Clough, because on the whole Derby fans
seem to think he's done a good job. But at the same time they are all critical of his coaching staff
for what ever reason ( could be all ex forest ) mainly clueless and idiots often mentioned.
So surely can't be right for half a dozen of our coaching staff to lose their livelihoods so he can
surround himself with his yes men.

Maybe he knows he can't bring his staff and maybe that's why he is hanging on to get them a good deal from Derby. Maybe HRH said, "No Morgs, no job!"

 

[Pinchy]

Definitely agree with the original post regards the coaching staff.

If true not got a problem with the appointment of Clough, because on the whole Derby fans
seem to think he's done a good job. But at the same time they are all critical of his coaching staff
for what ever reason ( could be all ex forest ) mainly clueless and idiots often mentioned.
So surely can't be right for half a dozen of our coaching staff to lose their livelihoods so he can
surround himself with his yes men.

But the existing staff, by your definition, must be someone else's "Yes Men"!

Football is a team game. Of course a manager will want people he works well with around him. Talk of people "losing their livelihoods" is rather melodramatic. They will move on. That's football. It happens all the time.

 

[Pinchy]

Maybe he knows he can't bring his staff and maybe that's why he is hanging on to get them a good deal from Derby. Maybe HRH said, "No Morgs, no job!"

The admirable Mr. Phipps has made it pretty clear that Morgan will continue to have a role. I hope that is because NC wants him, rather than any insistence from within the club. If the latter, and I don't think it is, that would be an unwarranted imposition on a new manager.

Maybe there's a niche for CM as a specialist defence coach? I would sooner him do that than take the U-21s.

 

[sheffielder]

I think if I was Clough I would at least be working with Morgs until the end of the season. Slowly slowly catch a monkey Nigel. I do however think Chris has probably shown enough to take on a manager's job in the 3rd when one comes up.

 

[ghandi]

But the existing staff, by your definition, must be someone else's "Yes Men"!

Football is a team game. Of course a manager will want people he works well with around him. Talk of people "losing their livelihoods" is rather melodramatic. They will move on. That's football. It happens all the time.

All the coaching set-up throughout the academy will remain the same. Morgan falls into this category as u-21 coach. Clough (if it is him) will have to accept that situation as a given and as its not going to change. I assume like Weir he'll have his assistant and main first team coach as his choice only.

 

[Pinchy]

All the coaching set-up throughout the academy will remain the same. Morgan falls into this category as u-21 coach. Clough (if it is him) will have to accept that situation as a given and as its not going to change. I assume like Weir he'll have his assistant and main first team coach as his choice only.

I'm not sure the u21 is part of the Academy; what with overage players and all that stuff. Do you know that for sure?

I've a hunch Morgan will be assigned first team duties. I may be wrong. It had to happen one day.

 

[frechyblade]

All the coaching set-up throughout the academy will remain the same. Morgan falls into this category as u-21 coach. Clough (if it is him) will have to accept that situation as a given and as its not going to change. I assume like Weir he'll have his assistant and main first team coach as his choice only.

As mentioned in another thread, thats not what Clough did at Derby. He brought his own staff in from academy up, I see no reason to think he won't do exactly the same here.

As for men losing their livelihood, the likes of Morgs may be able to secure a job somewhere else but people like Travis will find it a lot less easy.

UTB

 

[ghandi]

As mentioned in another thread, thats not what Clough did at Derby. He brought his own staff in from academy up, I see no reason to think he won't do exactly the same here.

As for men losing their livelihood, the likes of Morgs may be able to secure a job somewhere else but people like Travis will find it a lot less easy.

UTB

I'll be extremely suprised if this happens as it flies in the face of what has been built at the academy. Why would you give up everything that has been successful on a punt with someone with only a 3 year contract?

 

[ghandi]

I'm not sure the u21 is part of the Academy; what with overage players and all that stuff. Do you know that for sure?

I've a hunch Morgan will be assigned first team duties. I may be wrong. It had to happen one day.

Yes ...Morgan was told that he had to sharpen up his act by the academy CEO types such as Stephenson and to coach the U21 in the same methods they had learnt coming through the academy.

Looks like he learn't pretty quickly looking at his 3 match stint in as much as that long ball was not played ad-nauseum

 

[SouthEssexBlade]

Metgod, Crosby and maybe one other will arrive, where that leaves Morgan remains to be seen. Could be he goes back to u21s or he just might have some first team involvement.

 

[Pinchy]

Yes ...Morgan was told that he had to sharpen up his act by the academy CEO types such as Stephenson and to coach the U21 in the same methods they had learnt coming through the academy.

Looks like he learn't pretty quickly looking at his 3 match stint in as much as that long ball was not played ad-nauseum

I'm very pleased to hear that. Thank you.

 

[Pinchy]

As mentioned in another thread, thats not what Clough did at Derby. He brought his own staff in from academy up, I see no reason to think he won't do exactly the same here.

As for men losing their livelihood, the likes of Morgs may be able to secure a job somewhere else but people like Travis will find it a lot less easy.

UTB

That may be true, but it's a daily reality in professional football. Sorry to be harsh, but we are not a charitable trust with a duty to give young coaches a job for life.

 

[frechyblade]

I'll be extremely suprised if this happens as it flies in the face of what has been built at the academy. Why would you give up everything that has been successful on a punt with someone with only a 3 year contract?

I guess it will be a case of wait and see. I hope you are right.

UTB

 

[1889]

That may be true, but it's a daily reality in professional football. Sorry to be harsh, but we are not a charitable trust with a duty to give young coaches a job for life.

No, but we are supposed to be a 'professional' football club and as such should be in a position to research and recruit the very best conditioning and training coaches available, to ensure that our team is in the very best physical condition possible to carry out the role that any manager may ask of them.

Once that team has been established and proven their worth to the owners, then why should a change of manager affect their position? They are then our coaches, using techniques that are proven, have been successful, tailored to the individual needs of the squads and providing consistency for all. Why should some ex pro who's now turned his hand to management, know more about the science of physical conditioning than an expert in that field. They should be told, "This is the playing staff, these are our coaches, if in the future you have any issues with either, please let us know and we will be open to suggestions. In the meantime you can select your own assistant manager"

I'm afraid the days of a new manager being followed from club to club by a bunch of his parasitic mates and other sponging hangers on should be consigned to history.

 

[Pinchy]

No, but we are supposed to be a 'professional' football club and as such should be in a position to research and recruit the very best conditioning and training coaches available, to ensure that our team is in the very best physical condition possible to carry out the role that any manager may ask of them.

Once that team has been established and proven their worth to the owners, then why should a change of manager affect their position? They are then our coaches, using techniques that are proven, have been successful, tailored to the individual needs of the squads and providing consistency for all. Why should some ex pro who's now turned his hand to management, know more about the science of physical conditioning than an expert in that field. They should be told, "This is the playing staff, these are our coaches, if in the future you have any issues with either, please let us know and we will be open to suggestions. In the meantime you can select your own assistant manager"

I'm afraid the days of a new manager being followed from club to club by a bunch of his parasitic mates and other sponging hangers on should be consigned to history.

The flaw in your argument is that, by definition, the existing coaches are the parasitic mates of the person who appointed them.

You also appear to be suggesting that the composition of the "playing staff" should be off limits to the manager. That's a novel and, I'm afraid, rather ridiculous, suggestion.

 

[1889]

No I'm not, I'm suggesting that the club should research and recruit the best available coaching team. (See first sentence) you are relating it to the current archaic 'jobs for the boys system', not me.

The point about the playing staff is that the new manager should be told these are our players and likewise these are our coaches. If in the future you have a genuine suggestion as to how either team could be improved then we will discuss it and if agreeable, implement it. (Second paragraph)

You appear not to have even read the composition of my response, prior to composing your critique, which though novel, is also quite ridiculous.

 

[Pinchy]

No I'm not, I'm suggesting that the club should research and recruit the best available coaching team. (See first sentence) you are relating it to the current archaic 'jobs for the boys system', not me.

The point about the playing staff is that the new manager should be told these are our players and likewise these are our coaches. If in the future you have a genuine suggestion as to how either team could be improved then we will discuss it and if agreeable, implement it. (Second paragraph)

You appear not to have even read the composition of my response, prior to composing your critique, which though novel, is also quite ridiculous.

I've read what you say again. You are proposing a scheme that reduces the Manager's function to vanishing point. That's not how it works in English football. Who are these people by whom the manager should 'be told' these silly things?

 

[1889]

Erm, the clubs owners obviously, as they are actually the managers employers.

The managers role is to pick the side and implement style of play and tactics whilst liaising with the clubs coaches with regard to what drills he would like the squad to concentrate on. Player recruitment etc. That should give him enough to do so as not to feel completely redundant, as you suggest.

I think you'll find this is becoming more and more common in the modern game and certainly it is the practice the higher up the football pyramid you go. No, the 'bring all your mates too' attitude that you advocate, is at total odds with modern thinking. Not too dissimilar to Hoofball v Pass and move

 

[Pedro Verde]

A manager needs coaches he can trust and delegate to and carry out his instructions, he needs a good working relationship with them. He may not get any of that if he is reliant on coaches that are already at the club