Clough man management

[bertieblade]

I hear from various sources that Clough was virtually clueless with regard to man management; and the players despite making all the right noises about team spirit etc. were resentful of the man, his methods and his staff.
It could explain some of the gutless displays against inferior teams as the players only seemed to raise themselves for big matches.
This in effect could only be good, as having heard NA interviews and spoken to people who worked with him, he seems to be a fair minded, sensible guy who will earn, as oppose to demand respect.
With this in mind I would expect him to get more out if the same group,of players.

 

[gavtheblade]

Clough has gone,along with his mentality.
Move on.

 

[stringjunior]

With this in mind I would expect him to get more out if the same group,of players

Crikey, let's hope so

 

[Gee]

Jeez! Who gives a fuck, he's gone. Move on!!!

 

[SwissBlade]

Always seems odd considering so many joined because of clough....

Perhaps some of them a) didn't like criticism when they didn't perform and b) didn't like to do the graft as well as the fancy stuff

 

[alcoblade]

Always seems odd considering so many joined because of clough....

Perhaps some of them a) didn't like criticism when they didn't perform and b) didn't like to do the graft as well as the fancy stuff

Yep, it can't go both ways. He's criticised for only signing players he's worked with and criticised because players he's worked with don't respect him.

The two can't be true.

UTB

 

[1889]

Yep, it can't go both ways. He's criticised for only signing players he's worked with and criticised because players he's worked with don't respect him.

The two can't be true.

UTB

I don't believe in the mercenary world of Football, that any player would sign purely because they wanted to link up with an ex manager.

There is just one driving force behind any transfer, for both player and agent and it isn't sentimentality. I'd be surprised if any of his signings were financially penalised for joining Utd or had any comparative alternatives on offer at the time of their move.

Agent. "Do you want to go and play for NC again?"
Player A. "Not fucking likely"
Agent. "They're offering you £500 a week more?"
Player A. " Go on then, I've always had a lot of time for Cloughy"

 

[wizadry]

Yep, it can't go both ways. He's criticised for only signing players he's worked with and criticised because players he's worked with don't respect him.

The two can't be true.

UTB

The players he signed who had previously worked with him obviously respected him otherwise they wouldn't have come, what was clear though is how they seemed to play week in week out without getting criticised or dropped, an easy ride if you like, no wonder they came.

 

[alcoblade]

The players he signed who had previously worked with him obviously respected him otherwise they wouldn't have come, what was clear though is how they seemed to play week in week out without getting criticised or dropped, an easy ride if you like, no wonder they came.

Spot on, that's fair criticism. Coutts being a perfect example of this.

UTB

 

[alcoblade]

I don't believe in the mercenary world of Football, that any player would sign purely because they wanted to link up with an ex manager.

There is just one driving force behind any transfer, for both player and agent and it isn't sentimentality. I'd be surprised if any of his signings were financially penalised for joining Utd or had any comparative alternatives on offer at the time of their move.

Agent. "Do you want to go and play for NC again?"
Player A. "Not fucking likely"
Agent. "They're offering you £500 a week more?"
Player A. " Go on then, I've always had a lot of time for Cloughy"

I fully accept that it's about money in football. But Brayford took a pay cut to come and play for him. Too many came back for him to have been some impossible Ogre.

I think there was plenty of scope for criticising Clough, as I often did. There's really no need to invent new ways.

UTB

 

[wizadry]

Spot on, that's fair criticism. Coutts being a perfect example of this.

UTB

Yes, although i think Coutts will be a good player for us next season and did have some good games he did have some bad ones aswell without getting criticised or dropped unlike some the other players. Never mind, he's gone now and i will be intrigued as to who he manages next. Are wendies still looking for someone

 

[SwissBlade]

Yep, it can't go both ways. He's criticised for only signing players he's worked with and criticised because players he's worked with don't respect him.

The two can't be true.

UTB

Yeah I'd say there's probably a bit of truth in both, but how much is completely open and perhaps irrelevant as well.

The players always seemed to give 100% and apart from a handful of games they seemed to care.

I'd imagine that these stories come from the players who aren't in the side every week and perhaps being asked to do more to get a start.

 

[Lord Bos of Eckington.]

The players he signed who had previously worked with him obviously respected him otherwise they wouldn't have come, what was clear though is how they seemed to play week in week out without getting criticised or dropped, an easy ride if you like, no wonder they came.

Perhaps one rule for one , one rule for another etc.

The bottom line , i think Clough was just frustrated that he had dug a hole for himself , with some of the signings , and just voiced is opinions too openly . What happens on tour , should stay on tour .

Its history now , and under Adkins we will see if some of the Clough public criticism of certain players , carried any weight and justification. Lets see who can hack it , and who cant , from the clean sheet perspective, of all players , who now have a great chance to prove themselves.

UTB

 

[SwissBlade]

I don't believe in the mercenary world of Football, that any player would sign purely because they wanted to link up with an ex manager.

There is just one driving force behind any transfer, for both player and agent and it isn't sentimentality. I'd be surprised if any of his signings were financially penalised for joining Utd or had any comparative alternatives on offer at the time of their move.

Agent. "Do you want to go and play for NC again?"
Player A. "Not fucking likely"
Agent. "They're offering you £500 a week more?"
Player A. " Go on then, I've always had a lot of time for Cloughy"

You think we're paying more than Cardiff were to Brayford, Blackpool were to Davies etc?

 

[wizadry]

The players always seemed to give 100% and apart from a handful of games they seemed to care.

We must have different perceptions as to what giving 100% is and looks like, they had a funny way of showing they cared for the Red and White stripes last season, maybe that was how Cloughy got them looking.

 

[SwissBlade]

We must have different perceptions as to what giving 100% is and looks like, they had a funny way of showing they cared for the Red and White stripes last season, maybe that was how Cloughy got them looking.

Yeah think we do. They made a lot of mistakes, collectively but they put the effort in.

 

[Pierre's PC]

I hear from various sources that Clough was virtually clueless with regard to man management; and the players despite making all the right noises about team spirit etc. were resentful of the man, his methods and his staff.

These sources, are they Twitter, Facebook and here by any chance?
I mean, the guy has gone. What is the point of all these kinds of threads? Is the summer without football that boring to people that they have to make shit up just to start a thread on a board?

According to various sources the world is going to end in September, same shit and ultimately worth not a second of anyone's time.

 

[SwissBlade]

These sources, are they Twitter, Facebook and here by any chance?
I mean, the guy has gone. What is the point of all these kinds of threads? Is the summer without football that boring to people that they have to make shit up just to start a thread on a board?

According to various sources the world is going to end in September, same shit and ultimately worth not a second of anyone's time.

Totally agree. Summer is always shit on forums

 

[wizadry]

Yeah think we do. They made a lot of mistakes, collectively but they put the effort in.

Fair enough mate if that's how you saw it. Basically what you're saying is if we put the same effort in and care as much with less errors you think we'll be alright next season then?

 

[wizadry]

You think we're paying more than Cardiff were to Brayford, Blackpool were to Davies etc?

Brayford will have got 250k signing on fee so i don't think he'll be short of a few bob. Davies i agree with.

 

[SwissBlade]

Fair enough mate if that's how you saw it. Basically what you're saying is if we put the same effort in and care as much with less errors you think we'll be alright next season then?

Yeah, it was the errors which cost us ultimately. Errors in one or two players not quite being good enough or not fitting into the system

 

[wizadry]

Yeah, it was the errors which cost us ultimately. Errors in one or two players not quite being good enough or not fitting into the system

Can't disagree with one or two of the players not being good enough, although it was propably more than that in all honesty, unfortunately these same players got re-signed, lets hope Adkins either gets shut of them or gets them playing better than they did last season. It makes for an interesting summer no matter what happens from here on in.

 

[Kenilworth]

Errors in not having decent centre backs all season. Hence shipping too many goals.
Compounded by the error of not having any decent strikers at be beginning of the season.
Bar the League Cup run the whole of last season was a string of errors - right from the disastrous pre season results.
Ill judged
Ill planned
Poorly executed
Inflexible
Unsuitable
Inacceptable

 

[Pinchy]

Yeah I'd say there's probably a bit of truth in both, but how much is completely open and perhaps irrelevant as well.

The players always seemed to give 100% and apart from a handful of games they seemed to care.

I'd imagine that these stories come from the players who aren't in the side every week and perhaps being asked to do more to get a start.

Precisely. Not only that I'm astonished (okay I'm not really) that anyone finds it remotely acceptable that any player can choose whether or not to give 100% depending on their view of the manager. Any such player is a fucking disgrace and has no place at our club. The players seem immune from criticism by some, unless they happen to be former Derby players. Collins and Butler, for example, have improved immensely simply by not playing. Remarkable...

 

[BornOnShorehamStreet]

I fully accept that it's about money in football. But Brayford took a pay cut to come and play for him. Too many came back for him to have been some impossible Ogre.

I think there was plenty of scope for criticising Clough, as I often did. There's really no need to invent new ways.

UTB

I'm sure he probably did come despite a pay cut but don't forget that if they don't ask for a transfer they get a cut of the transfer fee - 10% I think - nice money for your autograph on a contract.

Not that he'll be short of a bob or two.

 

[BornOnShorehamStreet]

Errors in not having decent centre backs all season. Hence shipping too many goals.
Compounded by the error of not having any decent strikers at be beginning of the season.
Bar the League Cup run the whole of last season was a string of errors - right from the disastrous pre season results.
Ill judged
Ill planned
Poorly executed
Inflexible
Unsuitable
Inacceptable

I agree with you there, Kenilworth.

I think it was unacceptable as well ...

 

[sitwell]

I hear from various sources that Clough was virtually clueless with regard to man management; and the players despite making all the right noises about team spirit etc. were resentful of the man, his methods and his staff.
It could explain some of the gutless displays against inferior teams as the players only seemed to raise themselves for big matches.
This in effect could only be good, as having heard NA interviews and spoken to people who worked with him, he seems to be a fair minded, sensible guy who will earn, as oppose to demand respect.
With this in mind I would expect him to get more out if the same group,of players.

Are your various sources ,Mr and Mrs DiGentilerossi or whatever that tosser is called ,Davie blade and his Derby friends and Metal blade or are you just talking utter shit. Weird that so many players have followed him here from previous clubs to play for someone so clueless in man management ,but then again that gives you another excuse to have a go for signing players rom Derby etc doesn't it.

 

[grafikhaus]

Perhaps one rule for one , one rule for another etc.

True. Did they renew their contact with NC out of 'respect'? Or because they knew that if they bit their tongue, brown-nosed and didn't make waves, they were assured a start. Unlike the host of players who were shipped out sharpish - often (Butler, J C-R etc.) being better than some who got a regular place.

 

[grafikhaus]

Totally agree. Summer is always shit on forums

And Twitter and Facebook are always shit.

 

[bertieblade]

The point of the thread is to gauge opinion as to whether we think the new manager will be able to get more out if the same group of players?