clough going nowhere

[Torrix1889]

Sorry to say but a lot of what Tezza says is correct, however it's not rocket science to realise Clough is staying as he wouldn't have been aloud to get rid of Doyle if he was about to get the boot. I have been told we can't afford to get rid but that doesn't mean we were going to. I think it will have been discussed at board level and the decision to keep him will have been made. I don't however agree with what Tezza says about getting rid next season as when we sign the 2 central defenders, midfielder and forward clough wants we will be much closer than this year and if anyone likes a bet I'd get mine on us now at 13/2.

Whilst I take Tezza's "statement on behalf of the Board of SUFC" with a pinch of salt but just picking up on part of your post DP, how do we know that the decision to get rid of Doyle, (and Holt for that matter) was Clough's? Could it not be that the Board, (Mal B) had made both decisions for more financial reasons and simply from the fact that it had already been decided Doyle wouldn't be offered a new deal and any transfer funds were "on hold" therefore Holt was told his option was not being taken up?

 

[cooperblade]

My word, they've opened up board meetings to the public, now! I'm all for open government Jim, but this is on a grand scale. Why wasn't I invited?

Phipps (according to his Twitter) was in Riyadh and Brannigan (according to me) was on the 17:57 from St Pancras to Sheffield so it must have been a conference call - you probably just missed the email with the dial in details.

 

[Cyprus Blade]

It did cross my mind that the Board has not really had time to meet or discuss next season (JP is on holiday with his family at the moment) and the nature of Doyle's departure might suggest that his contract was just left to expire with an embargo on new signings until the Board has met to discuss next season. I saw a reference to Barker joining us (admittedly the source is unreliable) but that he wouldn't be offered a contract until June which would fit with that. Can't assume anything with the Blades. I agree it does look like Clough is here for next season but JP said, before the play-offs, that front office and the footballing side would be reviewed at season end and so far the Board have not said anything.

 

[Longtimesupporter]

Is this debate useful at this time?

 

[Torrix1889]

Is this debate useful at this time?

I don't think us debating the situation will have any influence one way or the other but we have got to have something to natter about or it's just Cricket..

 

[Sothall_Blade]

There's a big percentage of people who don't contribute to message boards or use Twitter (this is everyone I know from close friends, work mates, pub regulars) . They may or may not use computors. There's not a cat in hell's, in my estimation, that 80% of them would support Clough. UTB

Fair enough. The original question you asked was what gave the Board the impression that the fanbase didn't want Clough to be sacked.
65% of people who voted on here don't as a small sample. That's a fact.

Other than that, what indication have the "silent" masses given that they do want a change of manager?
Non-renewal of season tickets? Car Park protests? Angry pitch invasions? Boycotts? Vociferous and repeated chants of "Clough Out" at matches?

None of the usual signs are there that the fanbase as a whole wants a change at this point.
I suspect "Give him at least the first 12 matches but we need to be in and around the top two" would be the majority viewpoint.
If the Board has arrived at that conclusion, it's the obvious one to reach and I think they are correct.

 

[BushBlade]

Well if he's staying he's staying. I'm not going to dwell (though I was hoping he would go) on hating him. However, I reserve the right to call it as I see it next season without being called a slasher, doom monger, moaner etc.

New season starts now, first expectations is to see a clear out and a proper team structure put together sooner not later. Non of this waiting for the right man, go get the feckers

Only problem is if board are nervous will the release funds?

That would be the worst possible scenario. If they're not going to back him they have to get rid.

 

[stringjunior]

Am I missing something? Where is it reported Doyle is going?

 

[Pinchy]

Fair enough. The original question you asked was what gave the Board the impression that the fanbase didn't want Clough to be sacked.
65% of people who voted on here don't as a small sample. That's a fact.

Other than that, what indication have the "silent" masses given that they do want a change of manager?
Non-renewal of season tickets? Car Park protests? Angry pitch invasions? Boycotts? Vociferous and repeated chants of "Clough Out" at matches?

None of the usual signs are there that the fanbase as a whole wants a change at this point.
I suspect "Give him at least the first 12 matches but we need to be in and around the top two" would be the majority viewpoint.
If the Board has arrived at that conclusion, it's the obvious one to reach and I think they are correct.

Exactly. An Internet football forum is quite an insular place. We would do well to remember that the vast majority of Blades neither use nor read them.

I speak to ordinary people occasionally (a chore but noblesse oblige). There is a good deal of dissatisfaction and indeed bewilderment about last season, but no general groundswell in terms of "Clough must go". The rumblings have been far greater in the past in relation to Warnock, SemiPro and (yes) Bassett.

What we have is a sizeable but vociferous (and in some cases very unpleasant) minority who will miss no opportunity (however contrived; however absurd) to turn any statement or development coming out of BDTBL into a reason to knock a manager who has had but one full season and, whisper it quietly, has actually done OK with plenty of room for improvement.

 

[Pinchy]

So is that 13/2 for us to get 'much closer' or 13/2 on Clough getting the players we've known are required all last season, but NC has utterly failed to sign? If it's the latter, I think 50/1 would be fairer.

50/1. I'll have some of that. What's the maximum stake?

 

[submarine]

Am I missing something? Where is it reported Doyle is going?

Gone !! with a few comments for Nigels ears only !!!

 

[Grappler]

Am I missing something? Where is it reported Doyle is going?

He said so himself in a radio interview, he has not been offered a new contract.

 

[bladeinspaceandtime]

Is this debate useful at this time?

What would you rather have people talk about, your Aunt Mabel's slippers?

 

[Bladesway]

I know that it will be breaking news shortly, but our man, is still our man, the costs of removing him and the expenditure are proving too much, in his opinion, he's half way through a 4 year plan,.and in the boards opinion its 50/50 to quit now on him,.players, backroom staff.. etc..

However, recent public opinion shows the fanbase are behind him till xmas at least so he got the go ahead....

Some people need to hang their head in shame, because we have a man who will not be wrong, is ruthless, stubborn, and shows every trait of being a winner... without ever winning as a manger..

See you in 12 months, when we can afford to ditch the serial loser.

2 more seasons in league one, at the very least have been guaranteed today..

I'd just like to thank you for your fabulous support and positive statements of intent on how you feel we will progress.

What if we start next season with several wins and go clear of the pack early on, would you come back on and reiterate your "people need to hang heads in shame"? Because I think with an arrogant statement like that you should look closer to home when it comes to hanging your head.

 

[Bladesway]

So where've they got that impression from?

UTB

The fans?

 

[Bladesway]

Clough picked his signings carefully? Are you on drugs?!!

Nope but I know a man who is.

 

[davidpinder]

Whilst I take Tezza's "statement on behalf of the Board of SUFC" with a pinch of salt but just picking up on part of your post DP, how do we know that the decision to get rid of Doyle, (and Holt for that matter) was Clough's? Could it not be that the Board, (Mal B) had made both decisions for more financial reasons and simply from the fact that it had already been decided Doyle wouldn't be offered a new deal and any transfer funds were "on hold" therefore Holt was told his option was not being taken up?

Fair point i suppose, i had just assumed the board would have already discussed his future on a "we go up he stays" or "we don't go up he's off" type of decision. Getting rid of Doyle could of been down to the board but i gathered from his interview it was cloughs.

 

[alcoblade]

Fair enough. The original question you asked was what gave the Board the impression that the fanbase didn't want Clough to be sacked.
65% of people who voted on here don't as a small sample. That's a fact.

Other than that, what indication have the "silent" masses given that they do want a change of manager?
Non-renewal of season tickets? Car Park protests? Angry pitch invasions? Boycotts? Vociferous and repeated chants of "Clough Out" at matches?

None of the usual signs are there that the fanbase as a whole wants a change at this point.
I suspect "Give him at least the first 12 matches but we need to be in and around the top two" would be the majority viewpoint.
If the Board has arrived at that conclusion, it's the obvious one to reach and I think they are correct.

I agree with your analysis above. I didn't agree with your previous assertion that 80% of non twitterers (ie most of the fanbase) would be behind him. I'm sure it's much more split than that.

I don't think the poll on here is representative either. I would "accept" that there's probably a majority, overall, who'd stick with him - though a majority that will be doing so through gritted teeth.

UTB

 

[Bladesway]

I agree with your analysis above. I didn't agree with your previous assertion that 80% of non twitterers (ie most of the fanbase) would be behind him. I'm sure it's much more split than that.

I don't think the poll on here is representative either. I would "accept" that there's probably a majority, overall, who'd stick with him - though a majority that will be doing so through gritted teeth.

UTB

Tell you what Alco, we might not agree on some things but your about the most balanced poster around these parts. Couldn't agree with that statement more if I tried. I think the majority are behind Clough but its getting a small majority these days. Next season really is shit or bust for him and if anything the pressure will be greatest. I worry about any person coping with that pressure.

 

[davidpinder]

So is that 13/2 for us to get 'much closer' or 13/2 on Clough getting the players we've known are required all last season, but NC has utterly failed to sign? If it's the latter, I think 50/1 would be fairer.

I don't think he 100% failed to sign players, they just didn't work out. I'd say Butler, Wallace and Higdon were expected to play a major part this season but for one reason or another it didn't happen. Lets be honest we all got excited about higdon after the opening day even though we lost, Butler looked a big signing and many on here were really hoping Wallace could get fit as he looked good. Thats the spine of the team gone and we all know the JTW is when teams hold you to ransom and teams panic buy, the summer signings are the important ones. Not the mentioned JB who we had to wait for therefore that didn't work out to well either.

This is a massive summer for Clough and he will know it, he has to keep hold of all the better players or get rid of the ones he knows want to leave sooner rather than later (like maguire last summer). That team needs to be built by early July ready for pre season and then he can work out the best formation and first team. We can't afford to do what we did last season and not know our best side/formation, Clough will learn from his mistakes and we have to give him chance to rectify this seasons disappointment. I haven't been a fan of Clough all season long his tactics, signings and failure to spot what has gone wrong has been some what annoying but looking at what we have and need it won't take much to turn that side into a genuine promotion chasing team. I just hope has signings work this time and the right players come in, don't get me wrong if we start next season with just 2 or 3 average signings and players out of position then questions will have to be asked.

 

[alcoblade]

Tell you what Alco, we might not agree on some things but your about the most balanced poster around these parts. Couldn't agree with that statement more if I tried. I think the majority are behind Clough but its getting a small majority these days. Next season really is shit or bust for him and if anything the pressure will be greatest. I worry about any person coping with that pressure.

I worry that there's so many of us backing him through gritted teeth that as a club (including the fans), we'll react so badly to a bad start that we'll end up pulling the trigger, Blackwell style.

If we give him the summer budget, we should give him until Christmas at least. But along the way, we should be looking out for his replacement behind the scenes - not the usual case of whoever's unemployed at the time.

UTB

 

[LoughboroBlade]

I don't think the poll on here is representative either. I would "accept" that there's probably a majority, overall, who'd stick with him - though a majority that will be doing so through gritted teeth.

UTB

In all honesty, when I clicked 'Clough In' I was expecting that to be very much the minority. This should, what with it being days after the end of a disappointing season, probably be the low point of Clough's level of support this summer. I'm surprised given the negativity in recent months on here, maybe a bit encouraged, that a substantial majority want to stick with him, albeit for the time-being.

 

[Lord Bos of Eckington.]

Tell you what Alco, we might not agree on some things but your about the most balanced poster around these parts. Couldn't agree with that statement more if I tried. I think the majority are behind Clough but its getting a small majority these days. Next season really is shit or bust for him and if anything the pressure will be greatest. I worry about any person coping with that pressure.

Bladesway , Alco . Total agreement . I am one of the pro Clough fans , who is split down the middle , but vote to keep him only for the status quo . ( not that pop shit group before anybody says ) . I think the board will be of the same mindset . Whether its right or wrong only time will tell. Problem is time is now a luxury in football ,not a necessity IMO.

UTB

 

[Latters]

In all honesty, when I clicked 'Clough In' I was expecting that to be very much the minority. This should, what with it being days after the end of a disappointing season, probably be the low point of Clough's level of support this summer. I'm surprised given the negativity in recent months on here, maybe a bit encouraged, that a substantial majority want to stick with him, albeit for the time-being.

That depends. If he signs another ten or so no-marks that nobody has ever heard of again, that could be the low point.

 

[LoughboroBlade]

That depends. If he signs another ten or so no-marks that nobody has ever heard of again, that could be the low point.

Very true. But I reckon with the addition of some actual centre-backs, we'll probably start the season in a typically optimistic mood, till inevitable disappointment creeps in.

 

[Latters]

I hope Clough realises how badly he knackered us up last summer transfer window by signing masses of "steady" and little, if any quality. A couple of good signings would be the first step towards winning the doubters over. I must say that even though my views have mellowed since the aftermath of the ten goal, bollock dropping extravaganza, I am still erring on the side of scepticism where Clough is concerned. His summer signings need to send a message to us, and the rest of the division, that we mean business.

Another few nobodies being signed and he is, and in turn we are, even deeper in the shit, because if he does go early doors next season, we'll be stuck with too many naff players.

 

[Fiery Blade]

I honestly think it would be madness to ditch Mr Clough at this stage, yes he has made mistakes What manager hasn't but I believe that with two or three quality signings we will walk the league next season - My view is that we have too many OK players and too few that possess that extra quality !
There are several players that need to take a long hard look at themselves including Baxter, McEverley, Harris, Higdon, Scougall, McNulty and Flynn who all have some quality but unfortunately only display it now and again.
This season we achieved fifth spot having turned in some very ordinary performances and never really getting out of third gear, dropping 32 points at home and only scoring 66 goals in the league this season - not good enough but far better than eighteen teams in this division.
Mr Clough has to sort it this summer so that the squad is in place before the season starts and there are no more slip ups !
It might help if the Whingers and Whiners got off his back and give the team 100% support rather than the sniping and moaning they just love to give out !

 

[robbiez666]

I honestly think it would be madness to ditch Mr Clough at this stage, yes he has made mistakes What manager hasn't but I believe that with two or three quality signings we will walk the league next season - My view is that we have too many OK players and too few that possess that extra quality !
There are several players that need to take a long hard look at themselves including Baxter, McEverley, Harris, Higdon, Scougall, McNulty and Flynn who all have some quality but unfortunately only display it now and again.
This season we achieved fifth spot having turned in some very ordinary performances and never really getting out of third gear, dropping 32 points at home and only scoring 66 goals in the league this season - not good enough but far better than eighteen teams in this division.
Mr Clough has to sort it this summer so that the squad is in place before the season starts and there are no more slip ups !
It might help if the Whingers and Whiners got off his back and give the team 100% support rather than the sniping and moaning they just love to give out !

I'm confused by this kind of opinion. We all said that we'd walk the league last season with 2 or 3 quality signing and he signed 20 odd. I'm also confused by previous views along the lines of "Clough has now realised what players he needs to sign...". I would have thought someone who had been in football management for 18 years would have maybe realised earlier? Like signing Centre Backs for instance. An 8 year old child would know this, yet people are quite happy to support a manager who didn't. It's not like he's a rookie manager, but all his many mistakes are justified in one way or another. Not that the actual answer could be that he's not a very good manager. It also annoys me that everyone assumes that we can't replace him with anyone better.

 

[Lord Bos of Eckington.]

I honestly think it would be madness to ditch Mr Clough at this stage, yes he has made mistakes What manager hasn't but I believe that with two or three quality signings we will walk the league next season - My view is that we have too many OK players and too few that possess that extra quality !
There are several players that need to take a long hard look at themselves including Baxter, McEverley, Harris, Higdon, Scougall, McNulty and Flynn who all have some quality but unfortunately only display it now and again.
This season we achieved fifth spot having turned in some very ordinary performances and never really getting out of third gear, dropping 32 points at home and only scoring 66 goals in the league this season - not good enough but far better than eighteen teams in this division.
Mr Clough has to sort it this summer so that the squad is in place before the season starts and there are no more slip ups !
It might help if the Whingers and Whiners got off his back and give the team 100% support rather than the sniping and moaning they just love to give out !

Fiery , perhaps the Whinges and Whiners have a right to moan. Yes Clough has made some mistakes , but the crux of it all , they were basic fundemental mistakes . That i think is the issue . Lets hope for us all , he bucks the trend , and comes to basic football senses. I am sure the board weren't happy bunnies all the time.

We actually don't ask for much IMO.

UTB

 

[Lord Bos of Eckington.]

I'm confused by this kind of opinion. We all said that we'd walk the league last season with 2 or 3 quality signing and he signed 20 odd. I'm also confused by previous views along the lines of "Clough has now realised what players he needs to sign...". I would have thought someone who had been in football management for 18 years would have maybe realised earlier? Like signing Centre Backs for instance. An 8 year old child would know this, yet people are quite happy to support a manager who didn't. It's not like he's a rookie manager, but all his many mistakes are justified in one way or another. Not that the actual answer could be that he's not a very good manager. It also annoys me that everyone assumes that we can't replace him with anyone better.

Its a bit like ground hog day . What we are saying now is what we were saying before. No wonder we are confused .
Clough realised what he needed to do this season , and its exactly the same next season . It does not take a genius to work this out.
.
UTB