Best striker at Lane since Deane left in 93?

[Ollessendro]

It's easy to pick faults in peoples arguments, but come on guys this is just a bit of light hearted discussion. Thus said, the fact that you are suggesting people is contributing to the discussion helps, but I'd sooner hear why people thought X was their best stiker and what memories they have etc. It's easy for people to say 'Phil starbuck, David white, Gareth Taylor, Johnathon Forte and/or Tony Battersby should have been on the list'. I listed the best strikers I could think of (plus a few for fun) in the years since Deane left.
Micalijo started a great posts about best away games and I thought this might be interesting. I'm sure people will appreciate debating something else rather than the merits of Blackwell, Evans, McCabe and Monty.

Still I feel the need to respond to some of your claims.

Andy Gray. Aparently he had a good goal scoring rate (at least one season). However he was very lazy. I never rated him at all (although others might and I realise that this is not a reason to include him). I was never convinced by his time at United and although he scored quite a lot I would be very surprised if anyone actaully thought her was better than Hulse, BT, Fjortoft or Shipps.

Dean Saunders. Magical player. One of the best I've seen playing for the Blades. The reason why I din't put him in was because I don't see him as a striker. He played a lot out wide and also his finshing wasn't great. Don't get me wrong, he was brilliant for us and scored quite a few goals, but he missed a lot of chances. I guess if I have Flo in there (albeit as a bit of a joke) I should have the likes of Gray, saunders, Asaba etc.

Henderson. I really think Henderson is an asset. He is big, strong and a decent finisher. Even the people who call him Donley have (this season) realised what he adds to out team. However, I find it difficult to believe that any Blade thinks he is there number one.

I can only apologise for notting putting these in. Nade, Deane (mark 2) and Asaba slipped my mind, so sorry again.

However, i'll lay something down. If anybody genuinly thinks that Gray, Saunders, Asaba, or anyone i've missed was the best striker at the Lane since Brian Deane then I'll buy them a beer at the next game thatr I'm at. How's that sound? (and Swiss/Come form Away call me tight). There is a catch of course. You have to convince me. I want a convincing argument as to why Gray was better than Hulse, or Saunders classier than BT etc and of course i'll attmept to rip it apart!? As with any of my opinions I'll happily debate over a beer with any United fan. This time i'll buy the beer, providing you actaully beleive it (and I believe you atcually beliieve it).

 

[Ollessendro]

List of no. of goals scored by all strikers since 93-4 (league only). Strikers only (so no Brown for example). Though some may disagree with my definitions - i.e. I have included Devlin but not Ndlovu and White (and the latter were mainly wide players and the former played a substantial number of his games as a central striker).

The most striking thing (as Revolution never fails to point out is the low number for our leading scorers) over 16 years - only 34!


34. Blake, J. Beattie
25. Gray
23. Taylor, Marcelo, Asaba
22. Devlin, Webber
20. Walker, Bent
19. Katchuoro, Fjortoft
18. Peschisoldio
17. Flo, Saunders, Kabba
16. Henderson
15. Veart
12. Lester
11. Deane, D'Jaffo, Shipperley
10. Smith
8. Shaw, Hulse, Stead, Sharp
7. Allison
6. Morris, Kelly, Windass, J.Ward
5. Suffo, A.Ward
4. A.Scott, Littlejohn
3. Campbell, Notman, Akinbiyi, Nade, Evans
2. Angell, Furlong, Lupoli, Cork
1. R.Scott, Davison, Battersby, Hall, Thomas, Lovell, Onoura, Forte, Cadamarteri, Shelton, C.Beattie, Creswell, Camara.

Thanks Daz, but can you put number of appearences down to give us a flavour of how many goals per game that got?

The list is interesting but it may be a little misleading.

 

[JJ Sefton]

However, i'll lay something down. If anybody genuinly thinks that Gray, Saunders, Asaba, or anyone i've missed was the best striker at the Lane since Brian Deane then I'll buy them a beer at the next game thatr I'm at. How's that sound?

Gray was our best striker since Jimmy Dunne. Make mine a double.

 

[Revolution]

The list is interesting but it may be a little misleading.

A fair number of the top 10 have the wrong goals totals as well (Devlin, Pesky, and Veart I think, and maybe more).

the list of 1 goal wonders contains an odd cast of characters....

 

[Darren]

The list is interesting but it may be a little misleading.

A fair number of the top 10 have the wrong goals totals as well (Devlin, Pesky, and Veart I think, and maybe more).

the list of 1 goal wonders contains an odd cast of characters....

Come on, give me a break, it was cobbled together from memory in about 30 mins

 

[SESKU Blade]

I've gone for Jan-Aage. To me he's one of the most complete strikers I've seen at the lane. Good in the air, close control, vision, technique, finishing, positioning, probably not the quickest but still had a decent turn of pace over a couple of yards and his aeroplane celebration is legendry (I still do it now when I get the occasional goal on a sunday morning!)

I loved Nathan Blake when he played for us, sometimes looked a little sluggish but when he was really up for it he seemed unplayable.

Good shout from Raul re Martin Smith - He wasn't a typical out and out striker and didn't play too many games for us but he looked to have real quality, remember being gutted when we sold him. Thought he would have gone onto better things.

Regarding Rev & Darren's point re low scorers I think it's because we never kept most of those players longer than a couple of season - as soon as they hit some consistent goalscoring form they were sold on. If we were to find a 20 goal a season striker I reckon they'd be sold as well the following season ;-)

 

[Darren]

My totals for Devlin and Cork were wrong and I have corrected them - any other errors let me know. I am pretty sure Pesky and Veart are right. The controversy with Pesky maybe because Warnock decided to give to PP the goal Brown scored at Walsall on 24/10/01 as he thought he needed to up his tally! I haven't counted that goal (nor have I given the 2nd goal at Burnley on 9/8/05 to Webber - that was Morgan's for me).

 

[Ollessendro]

I've gone for Jan-Aage. To me he's one of the most complete strikers I've seen at the lane. Good in the air, close control, vision, technique, finishing, positioning, probably not the quickest but still had a decent turn of pace over a couple of yards and his aeroplane celebration is legendry (I still do it now when I get the occasional goal on a sunday morning!)

I loved Nathan Blake when he played for us, sometimes looked a little sluggish but when he was really up for it he seemed unplayable.

Hear hear SESKU. I see Fjortoft as a poor mans Fernando Torres. Torres, the best striker in the world IMO, has everything. Pace, arial ability, skills, strength, touch. Jan Aage was similar to this. He was a little lazy, but he was a complete striker. He was quick, strong as an ox, good with both feet and good in the air. Of course he was nowhere near as good as Fernando is now, but strikers like him are a nightmare for defenders.

I loved Blake at the Lane. He was strong as an ox and had a real eye for goal. However he was overweight and lazy. When we sold him to Bolton and he was then in the Premiership he immediately lost over a stone. He then went on to bbecome a better player. That really pissed me off. He gave us some great goals at the Lane, but I felt his best years came after leaving United.

 

[Ollessendro]

After Darrens list of goal scorers I decided to try and put this into context. This is slightly flawed (as I've included sub appearences in appearences) but it gives a better idea of games, goals and hence ratios. Ok, here goes.


--------------Games - Goals--Goal every X games
1. Fjortoft --- 34 ----19 -------1.7
2. BT --------62 -----34------ 1.8
3. Blake ------69---- 34 --------2
4. Gray ------ 58 -----25------ 2.3
5. Bent ------ 48----- 20 ------2.4
6. Marcelo ---- 65---- 25 ----- 2.6
7. Asaba ----- 67 ----23 ------2.9
8. Henderson --56 ----17 ------3.3
9. Taylor ----- 86 ----24 ----- 3.5
- HMS Shipps - 39 ---- 11 --- 3.5

Others to note

Hulse--- 50 8 6.2 (pre injury 26 8 3.1)
Peschy -79 16 4.75
Lester --44 12 3.66
Kat ----95 19 5

 

[Darren]

After Darrens list of goal scorers I decided to try and put this into context. This is slightly flawed (as I've included sub appearences in appearences) but it gives a better idea of games, goals and hence ratios. Ok, here goes.


--------------Games - Goals--Goal every X games
1. Fjortoft --- 34 ----19 -------1.7
2. BT --------62 -----34------ 1.8
3. Blake ------69---- 34 --------2
4. Gray ------ 58 -----25------ 2.3
5. Bent ------ 48----- 20 ------2.4
6. Marcelo ---- 65---- 25 ----- 2.6
7. Asaba ----- 67 ----23 ------2.9
8. Henderson --56 ----17 ------3.3
9. Taylor ----- 86 ----24 ----- 3.5
- HMS Shipps - 39 ---- 11 --- 3.5

Others to note

Hulse--- 50 8 6.2 (pre injury 26 8 3.1)
Peschy -79 16 4.75
Lester --44 12 3.66
Kat ----95 19 5

Saved me a job!

If you discounted for sub appearances, Fjortoft's stats would look even better as I believe he played a fair few games as sub, whilst I think Beattie was only ever sub once.

 

[Bladesway]

Great thread for a change.

BT from Hulse from Blake for me. All awesome strikers for different reasons. BT could get you a goal from absolutely anywhere but we were over reliant on him.

Hulse led the line as well as anyone I remember and Blake was one of the most gifted strikers I have had the pleasure of seeing in red and white. Had we signed him 10 games earlier we would never have been relegated that season.

 

[JJ Sefton]

Wasnt there some Brian Gayle style hold up with signing Blake? Seem to remember we wanted to earlier but were short of cash.

 

[Ollessendro]

Saved me a job!

If you discounted for sub appearances, Fjortoft's stats would look even better as I believe he played a fair few games as sub, whilst I think Beattie was only ever sub once.

Actually, closer inspection shows differently. The following shows, all appearences (before it was just league), sub appearences, gaols and then the ratio:

------starts (sub apps) goals ratio

Beattie 60 (5)--------41----1.45
Fjortoft 37 (6) --------23 ----1.6
Blake 59 (15) -------- 35 ---- 1.7
Marcelo 60 (20) ------ 32 ---- 1.9
Peschy 41 (54) ------- 20 ---- 2
Lester 31 (19) -------- 14 ---- 2.2
Bent 56 (0) ---------- 24 ---- 2.3
Gray 61 (2) ---------- 26 ---- 2.3
Asaba 60 (17) -------- 24 --- 2.5
Taylor 69 (36) -------- 26 ----2.7
Shipps 34 (5) -------- 11 ----- 3
Hendo 58 (7) --------- 17 ---- 3.4

It shows that Beattie was the most prolific striker for the Blades with 2 goals every 3 starts. Closely followed by Fjortoft and Blakey.

Makes an interesting top 12 in terms of goals to game ratio. Of course Blake, Marcelo, Asaba, Taylor, Lester and particularly Peschisolido have an unfair advantage as they are liklier to have scored in sub appearences.

 

[Grecian2000]

Great thread for a change.

BT from Hulse from Blake for me. All awesome strikers for different reasons. BT could get you a goal from absolutely anywhere but we were over reliant on him.

Hulse led the line as well as anyone I remember and Blake was one of the most gifted strikers I have had the pleasure of seeing in red and white. Had we signed him 10 games earlier we would never have been relegated that season.

Think you've over estimated the number of games there. We signed him and then Harry didn't start him for a couple (came on as sub v QPR and scored when we drew 1-1 I think). If we'd actually started him as soon as we got him I think we'd have stayed up.

 

[happyhippy]

Think you've over estimated the number of games there. We signed him and then Harry didn't start him for a couple (came on as sub v QPR and scored when we drew 1-1 I think). If we'd actually started him as soon as we got him I think we'd have stayed up.

Blake made his début three matches earlier away at Ipswich on a Tuesday night in the snow (I once explained why that defeat was my fault), and scored his first goal in the 2-2 draw away at Spurs on the Saturday.

I must admit though, I can't remember how many matches he missed (or possibly didn't) straight after signing for us from Cardiff.

As for my opinion as to the best since Deane? Not decided yet!

 

[SRBlade]

All this talk about all these strikers makes me think of the better partnerships we've had since Deane and Agana.

Especially as we don't have a partnership upfront at the minute, irregardless as to who is up front.

As well as the fact BT never really linked up well with anyone.

Onoura was pretty much brought to the club to partner Asaba, but he was just poor.

Maybe a mention for the Chief and Pesch, I recall away at Gillingham pesch got a hat trick and i think all 3 were Allison assists.

But having payed little attention to the Blades in the 90's I would say that when Hulse and Stead played together it was great to watch, they seemed to have just clicked, tragic that we would never see that partnership again after Hulse's injury.

 

[The One]

I guess Beattie wins? Just?

 

[PeterNdlovu081]

The answer to this question is James Beattie by a mile. I can't see how a case can be made for anyone else.

 

[happyhippy]

Beattie(pen) was enormously helpful, and even I'll say that under different management could have gone on to eclipse many of our favourites over the last sixteen years. That said, I can't have him as the best.

We also performed better without him despite his transfer. Now I'm not going to say that I was happy with his departure, but in retrospect, maybe it wasn't the worst thing we could have done. Take the penalties away, it is a different story.

The years after relegation in 1994 to the rejuvenation under St Neil really don't give me much inspiration. Had we stayed up, I'm sure that Blake would have been much better than he was at Bolton and Blackburn with us had we stayed up.

Taylor was decent enough, but never got to an iconic status, save for his awful miss for Burnley at the away end

It's between four for me. Bent, Peschi, Sarbs and Fjortoft.

Fjortoft was the one who pissed me off most, and probably pissed himself off most, because we never got the best from him at a time we could have done.

Asaba was a striker nobody was really sold with, but who did win people over, and also became our main threat at that time. He wasn't very good, but neither were we.

Marcus Bent came into a terrible side, and was made into a commodity! St Neil was right when he said that he was bought as a £300k player who could be a £3m player when he wanted, and a £3 player at oher times.

The winner has to be Peschi. He surely did more as a sub than Bobby Davison ever did, not that his achievements should ever be forgotten. It's just that for me, the Canadian was part of the wave which nearly brought us so much.

He also still has Karren Brady's number (I'm sure), and yes I definitely bloody would, and I like the way the queue is shortening.

 

[User Name:]

I think Beattie must have been camera shy because when I ever I saw him, which was only on tele, he was average to a bit crap. However, I know from his scorining record and how many blades rate him he obviously wasnt.

Cue someone to prove me wrong - anybody know how many sky games he played for us (foxtell over here in Oz) and if he ever scored - I cant remember ever seeing him bag one.

 

[Santos]

People are always happy to pick holes in arguments.

Ashley Ward, are you winding me up.

Andy Gray would be on the worst strikers list since Deane.

Why don't you shoot down my attempt to start a debate away from Blackwell and current form by suggesting some more mediocre (or worse striker names). Oh, I missed of David White, Gareth Taylor, Phil Starbuck.

The answer to your last question I don't know. But does anyone seriously think that he is the best striker at the Lane since Deane? I'll buy you a drink Jim if somebody else genuinly thinls that Henderson is that brilliant (and gives me a good explanation why).

Come on get voting you buggers!

I would say Andy Gray, Darius Henderson and Gareth Taylor are/were all better strikers than Steve Kabba, Danny Webber and Marcus Bent for us! But opinions I suppose. I think people get carried away with a few month goal spree and the promotion/02/03 season when they talk about Kabba & Webber.

 

[Ollessendro]

The answer to this question is James Beattie by a mile. I can't see how a case can be made for anyone else.

In your opinion my friend!

Not in every body else's. Here's why I think BT is not the best striker since Deane:

He didn't form a partnership with anyone, didn't work hard for the team and often seemed in it for himself. This was shown when he disappeared from games and seemed to perform better when the cameras were there. Don't get me wrong, he was fantastic, but i would question his work rate. Also, everyone seems to forget the fact that we played better (as a team) without him.

I honestly think that Hulse and Fjortoft were better than him in their time at the Lane. You could arguably add Shipprely, Bent and Blake to that list.

Hulse (as stated before) beofre he broke his leg wins it hands down for me. What a striker in that premiership season. Ok his goal ratio was much lower than BT, Jan Aage etc, but he was playing in the premiership. 8 in 26 is not bad in the top flight, particularly for a struggling team. He was strong, skilful, good in the air and decent on the deck. Really though to defend against. This is not to mention how he played for the team, he lead the line the best I've seen (apart from Shipps maybe) and really took the pressure of his team mates in times of need.

Jan Aage. Now I remember going to the Lane in my teens and being blown away by this guy. He was magnificent. I say in sincerity that he reminds me of (or the other way) Fernando Torres. Big, strong, fast, good with both feet, good touch, skilful. When Fjortfot was on form you simply couldn't defend against him. He was cool, calm and collected. And talk about strike a ball. He scored 5-10 wonder goals in his short time at the Lane. He also forged a decent partnership with Deane (something BT didn't do). You'll notice that his goals to game ratio is very cloe to BT's and he didn't take penalties!

Shipperley. Formed 2 fantastic partnerships with Kabba and Webber and made the difference between us getting promoted and finsihing in the play offs in 2005/2006. He lead the line brilliantly. He also contributed 11 goals from 30odd games. The guy was a beast and very few championship defences knew how to handle him.

This argument is not clear cut Ndlovu! Yes BT is ahead, but people have short memories. To state that there is no other argument is simply arrogant.

 

[Ollessendro]

I would say Andy Gray, Darius Henderson and Gareth Taylor are/were all better strikers than Steve Kabba, Danny Webber and Marcus Bent for us! But opinions I suppose. I think people get carried away with a few month goal spree and the promotion/02/03 season when they talk about Kabba & Webber.

That's a fair point Santos. But it's difficult to think of everybody when you are settinh these things up. By putting the goals to game ratio and seeing those 3 are in the top 10 i've got egg on my face.

If you see my post earlier I apologise for this. I also state that I'll buy anyone a beer (at the next game I go to) if they think one of the strikers i've missed off (Gray, Asaba, Taylor, Henderson etc) is genuinly the best striker to have played at the halloow turf at BDTBL. Of course they have to convince me but i stand by this.

 

[Santos]

That's a fair point Santos. But it's difficult to think of everybody when you are settinh these things up. By putting the goals to game ratio and seeing those 3 are in the top 10 i've got egg on my face.

If you see my post earlier I apologise for this. I also state that I'll buy anyone a beer (at the next game I go to) if they think one of the strikers i've missed off (Gray, Asaba, Taylor, Henderson etc) is genuinly the best striker to have played at the halloow turf at BDTBL. Of course they have to convince me but i stand by this.

No worries Ollie. I agree that you had a tough task setting up the list. I don't think people are saying Gray et al were the best striker just that they were better than some of the selections available.

 

[GainsboroBlade]

I would say Beattie and Fjortoft

 

[Ollessendro]

No worries Ollie. I agree that you had a tough task setting up the list. I don't think people are saying Gray et al were the best striker just that they were better than some of the selections available.

Yeah I realise that matey. The fact that I've included Webber and Katchouro says that I should have put in the names you mentioned. There should also have been the likes of Chief and Jack Lester. In hindsight, what I should have done is sat down with a pen and paper and wrote down all the names of anyone who'd scored more than 5 goals in the last 15 years. If I could add names to the poll I would, but (unlike a post/thread) it cannot be edited once the poll started. I had to delete the thread (and start again) 2 or 3 times and this of course stifles the debate.

So BT is running away with things. But people recongnise the class of Hiulse and Fjortoft also. And I see Big Jostein got a few votes!!!???

 

[mattbianco1]

List of no. of goals scored by all strikers since 93-4 (league only).

34. Blake, J. Beattie
25. Gray
23. Taylor, Marcelo, Asaba, Devlin
22. Webber

I think the fact that Beattie scored that many in 1.5 seasons means he is the clear winner. Goals speak for themselves.

Out of interest does anybody know the goals/game ratio of these?

For example Webber scored 22 in about 50years. How many games did Beattie & Blake play?

Play Jamie Ward upfront and i think he could end up topping the list

 

[Ollessendro]

I think the fact that Beattie scored that many in 1.5 seasons means he is the clear winner. Goals speak for themselves.

Out of interest does anybody know the goals/game ratio of these?

For example Webber scored 22 in about 50years. How many games did Beattie & Blake play?

Play Jamie Ward upfront and i think he could end up topping the list

Read the complete thread you pillock!

I've listed the all of the strikers from the list, the goals the games and the ratio. There are 2 lists (one with sub games included in the total and no cup games, the other with appearences, sub appearences, goals etc and this includes cup games).

 

[mattbianco1]

Read the complete thread you pillock!

I've listed the all of the strikers from the list, the goals the games and the ratio. There are 2 lists (one with sub games included in the total and no cup games, the other with appearences, sub appearences, goals etc and this includes cup games).

proof read your post you pillock!

 

[Ollessendro]

proof read your post you pillock!

touche ...... pillock