Ayew or Marsh?

[Slim Man]

Just another goal for Marsh yesterday in a loan spell that's doing his confidence the world of good, while we're paying an OAP 20 odd k a week to come off the bench, not be a goal threat and tire after 3 minutes.

Marsh is, by a distance, the most technically gifted attacker we've brought through the youth setup bar the obvious superstar at Man City. Bags of energy, bags of talent and despite being slight he finds pockets of space allover the pitch.

Ayew is 35, coming off the back of 2 relegations, has never scored double figures in his career, and put into an unfit, slow and lethargic team with no energy is the complete antithesis of what we need in the team right now.

Wilder's talk of 'needing experience' as a reason for signing Ayew just makes absolutely no sense to me and is a huge reason why I think he's done for. All he's signed is experienced past it has beens or never beens, the young players we have ARE experienced. The only one that isn't is on loan from Brentford and happens to be our best player

He doesn't like bringing youth through, he doesn't trust them. But if Marsh leaves the club without having a proper run in the team or chance to prove himself it would be the biggest damning indictment on both the manager and coaching staff yet. He has everything you'd want from a deep lying forward/number 10 at this level. He's basically a young Bamford, and it's crazy that we haven't just had him as his understudy for the season...

 

[FMBlade1]

Is Ayew really on £20k a week?!

 

[dexter101]

Marsh needs a good season on loan to get minutes in mens football. Every previous loan spell he seems to start brightly, fade a bit and get injured.

This season is going to be turgid anyway, lets keep him out on loan and let him come back in the summer full of confidence.

I don't think he has had enough opportunities with the 1st team, but when he does, he hasn't really justified more chances so far.

 

[N20 Blade]

Marsh needs a good season on loan to get minutes in mens football. Every previous loan spell he seems to start brightly, fade a bit and get injured.

This season is going to be turgid anyway, lets keep him out on loan and let him come back in the summer full of confidence.

I don't think he has had enough opportunities with the 1st team, but when he does, he hasn't really justified more chances so far.

Realistically we will be in League One next season and Marsh might be ready for that level by then. Unlikely we'll hold on to One so our options will be threadbare.

 

[Slim Man]

Marsh needs a good season on loan to get minutes in mens football. Every previous loan spell he seems to start brightly, fade a bit and get injured.

This season is going to be turgid anyway, lets keep him out on loan and let him come back in the summer full of confidence.

I don't think he has had enough opportunities with the 1st team, but when he does, he hasn't really justified more chances so far.

That bottom paragraph is just stupid

He always plays in the disjointed cup teams. Of course he's not going to look great when no one knows each others games.

Mind you, most attackers look shit in Wilder teams so it's no surprise.

 

[Pedro Verde]

When Marsh has played in the first team its usually been a cup game when Wilder has made 8 or 9 changes
When Wilder does this the team always looks disjointed and doesnt really give the youngsters a chance
Let Marsh play when the better players are on the pitch like Peck like Seriki like Bamford
Im not saying Marsh is an answer to our problems but I would rather have him on the pitch instead of Ayew or Campbell

 

[Slim Man]

Is Ayew really on £20k a week?!

I'd be surprised if he's on much less

 

[KMC-1889]

Is Ayew really on £20k a week?!

Probably more after bonuses. We pay heavy appearance fees (probably don’t have to worry about goal bonuses).

Youth players should be filling these squad positions. Curtis should be in for Doherty, Ukaki should have been kept around the first team etc… the wages saved could have given Brooks what he wanted and Seriki what he wants, or spend it on better quality for the first 11.

We’ve gone backwards so much under wilder. This is as bad as the Adams team.

 

[dexter101]

That bottom paragraph is just stupid

He always plays in the disjointed cup teams. Of course he's not going to look great when no one knows each others games.

Mind you, most attackers look shit in Wilder teams so it's no surprise.

He is also on loan at a league 2 side for a reason. He has so much potential, but other than with our under 21s, he hasn't been able to fully take his opportunities in any team.

 

[Slim Man]

He is also on loan at a league 2 side for a reason. He has so much potential, but other than with our under 21s, he hasn't been able to fully take his opportunities in any team.

Fleetwood and Falkirk would've took him back happily. What do you mean?

 

[S64 Blade]

Is Ayew really on £20k a week?!

He was reportedly on £30k a week at Leicester, so even £20k might be conservative.

 

[dexter101]

Fleetwood and Falkirk would've took him back happily. What do you mean?

Couldn't find any of the others but I seem to remember them being similar:

Comments from Roy's view from Falkirk:

“Marsh looks a player”

“Marsh’s passing is looking a bit sexy, some player.”

“Big future in the game.”

“Marsh is a funny one. He has some great moments but is just not involved enough in the game for long spells. “

“Louis Marsh too lightweight and the game passes him by”

“Marsh gives the ball away a lot”


Fleetwood are also a league 2 side so the point still stands.

One is a prime example where the few chances he has had recently, he absolutely showed he was ready to compete in the main squad.

Marsh hasn't done this yet and you would assume he hasn't done enough in training to show it either (I know your feelings on Wilder but with Micky Collins having worked with him in U21s you would assume his views were listened to)

 

[KMC-1889]

Fleetwood are also a league 2 side so the point still stands.

A league 2 team that played our team off the park.

If he’s doing well in their team then by comparison he’s better than our backups.

 

[3Cheers4Ramirez]

I'd add Cannon as well as Ayew

For what both offer it is hard to justify not giving the minutes to Marsh instead

The club shouldn't let Wilder sell him. Because if he develops physically he'll be an asset. And he'll be an asset regardless if we're in L1

 

[Proper Blade]

Just another goal for Marsh yesterday in a loan spell that's doing his confidence the world of good, while we're paying an OAP 20 odd k a week to come off the bench, not be a goal threat and tire after 3 minutes.

Marsh is, by a distance, the most technically gifted attacker we've brought through the youth setup bar the obvious superstar at Man City. Bags of energy, bags of talent and despite being slight he finds pockets of space allover the pitch.

Ayew is 35, coming off the back of 2 relegations, has never scored double figures in his career, and put into an unfit, slow and lethargic team with no energy is the complete antithesis of what we need in the team right now.

Wilder's talk of 'needing experience' as a reason for signing Ayew just makes absolutely no sense to me and is a huge reason why I think he's done for. All he's signed is experienced past it has beens or never beens, the young players we have ARE experienced. The only one that isn't is on loan from Brentford and happens to be our best player

He doesn't like bringing youth through, he doesn't trust them. But if Marsh leaves the club without having a proper run in the team or chance to prove himself it would be the biggest damning indictment on both the manager and coaching staff yet. He has everything you'd want from a deep lying forward/number 10 at this level. He's basically a young Bamford, and it's crazy that we haven't just had him as his understudy for the season...

I think you're being incredibly generous to Marsh in your assessment here.

'The most technically gifted attacker we've brought through the youth setup', 'bags of energy', 'bags of talent' - these are phrases I would reserve for generationally-gifted talents, not someone who is 22 and has 6 goals in 35 career appearances.

Whenever he has played in the first team he has looked lightweight and very much on the fringes of the game. Two goals in League 2 does not change that.

I'm not saying Marsh won't come good in the end. But recasting him as this generational talent is misty-eyed bollocks. Why don't we let him have a season of professional football before making such ridiculous claims?

 

[dexter101]

A league 2 team that played our team off the park.

If he’s doing well in their team then by comparison he’s better than our backups.

Marsh in this squad, how we are currently playing, is going to contribute nothing and is likely to not develop either.

I would much rather the was out on loan building match fitness, experience and confidence than being brought on when we are 2-1 away to Stoke...

If he had previously shown on loan he was a game changer, then fair enough. Currently, he is all potential.

 

[FMBlade1]

He was reportedly on £30k a week at Leicester, so even £20k might be conservative.

Good heavens. I would have expected £10k at absolute most

 

[Rodley]

Is Ayew really on £20k a week?!

Looking at the responses, there appears to be a very strong case for “maybe”.

 

[nopigfansintown]

He's a good player but he's also in dire need of regular game time after yet another injury setback last year when he did pretty well at Falkirk. I'm talking 30+ starts minimum. If not it's not going to enhance his development sat on our bench, or competing with O'Hare which was the expectation pre loan.

I've watched quite a bit of him at youth levels. I like how balanced he is, and how quickly and accurately he moves the ball. Nice first touch and gets on the half turn well. He's not the quickest and plays too safe at times for me, especially as a 10. He reminds me of Berge in the sense that you sometimes want him to take the bull by the horns and to drive with the ball, or shoot or pass forward. Nice player though. He could also do with filling out a bit.

It's a high bar to have him above Mick Jones, Woodward, Birchenall, Harry Johnson,Tonge, Osula, Lankshear, Sharp, Dom Calvert Lewin, David/Andre Brooks as our most technically gifted academy attacking player outside of Ndiaye. Hopefully he lives up to that.

 

[Slim Man]

I think you're being incredibly generous to Marsh in your assessment here.

'The most technically gifted attacker we've brought through the youth setup', 'bags of energy', 'bags of talent' - these are phrases I would reserve for generationally-gifted talents, not someone who is 22 and has 6 goals in 35 career appearances.

Name a better one...

 

[Slim Man]

He's a good player but he's also in dire need of regular game time after yet another injury setback last year when he did pretty well at Falkirk. I'm talking 30+ starts minimum. If not it's not going to enhance his development sat on our bench, or competing with O'Hare which was the expectation pre loan.

I've watched quite a bit of him at youth levels. I like how balanced he is, and how quickly and accurately he moves the ball. Nice first touch and gets on the half turn well. He's not the quickest and plays too safe at times for me, especially as a 10. He reminds me of Berge in the sense that you sometimes want him to take the bull by the horns and to drive with ball or shoot or pass forward. Nice player though. He could also do with filling out a bit.

It's a high bar to have him above Mick Jones, Woodward, Birchenall, Tonge, Osula, Lankshear, Sharp, Dom Calvert Lewin, David/Andre Brooks as our most technically gifted academy attacking player. Hopefully he lives up to that.

I'm not sure I'm having David Brooks as ours. If so, then yeah fair enough. Jones, Woodward, Birchenall I'm not going that far back but he's better with the ball at his feet than the rest at his age and level of experience than the rest were, or even are now, apart from maybe Andre.

That goal he scored on his Chezzy debut, barely anyone in our squad could score.

 

[Slim Man]

Couldn't find any of the others but I seem to remember them being similar:

Comments from Roy's view from Falkirk:

“Marsh looks a player”

“Marsh’s passing is looking a bit sexy, some player.”

“Big future in the game.”

“Marsh is a funny one. He has some great moments but is just not involved enough in the game for long spells. “

“Louis Marsh too lightweight and the game passes him by”

“Marsh gives the ball away a lot”


Fleetwood are also a league 2 side so the point still stands.

One is a prime example where the few chances he has had recently, he absolutely showed he was ready to compete in the main squad.

Marsh hasn't done this yet and you would assume he hasn't done enough in training to show it either (I know your feelings on Wilder but with Micky Collins having worked with him in U21s you would assume his views were listened to)

Nice, but foolish of you to think OGL takes anyone's views but his own into account now. He has no one to answer to.

 

[Broomhall Blade]

Fleetwood and Falkirk would've took him back happily. What do you mean?

Not sure where you have got that from especially about Fleetwood.
He did just ok there but the Fleetwood fans i know were not that bothered about him coming back.
Falkirk I have no idea but let's be honest its one of the worst leagues in Europe.
He's still out on loan to a 2nd Division side again, no 1st Division side wanted him and he's shown nothing to say he's ready for Championship football.
Not knocking the lad maybe he's a late developer(there must be something there for us not to have released him) but he really needs to kick on in this loan if he's to have a future with us.
Ayew looked good for a split second when he first came on against Wolves then proceeded to look like a fan that had won a raffle to play the last 10min in a United game.
Leicester fans did warn us, but with Wilder in signing players no longer good enough for Championship football mode he knows better.

 

[dexter101]

Nice, but foolish of you to think OGL takes anyone's views but his own into account now. He has no one to answer to.

Foolish of me to think that any conversation could avoid a wilder in/out debate.

He does answer to Bettis and the board. You could argue that the board would be more interested now about getting most return for our academy players. Maybe going out on loan was about increasing his sale value (which again is probably more likely looking decent for Chesterfield)

The other coaching staff have a job to do and as Collins has already previously worked with Wilder, why would be take an assistant manager role where he doesn't feel valued and listened to. Tying himself to Wilder is hardly worth the short term money if it damages his long term coaching and management prospects.

 

[Slim Man]

Foolish of me to think that any conversation could avoid a wilder in/out debate.

He does answer to Bettis and the board. You could argue that the board would be more interested now about getting most return for our academy players. Maybe going out on loan was about increasing his sale value (which again is probably more likely looking decent for Chesterfield)

The other coaching staff have a job to do and as Collins has already previously worked with Wilder, why would be take an assistant manager role where he doesn't feel valued and listened to. Tying himself to Wilder is hardly worth the short term money if it damages his long term coaching and management prospects.

There's no debate to be had

 

[Snowflake]

Just another goal for Marsh yesterday in a loan spell that's doing his confidence the world of good, while we're paying an OAP 20 odd k a week to come off the bench, not be a goal threat and tire after 3 minutes.

Marsh is, by a distance, the most technically gifted attacker we've brought through the youth setup bar the obvious superstar at Man City. Bags of energy, bags of talent and despite being slight he finds pockets of space allover the pitch.

Ayew is 35, coming off the back of 2 relegations, has never scored double figures in his career, and put into an unfit, slow and lethargic team with no energy is the complete antithesis of what we need in the team right now.

Wilder's talk of 'needing experience' as a reason for signing Ayew just makes absolutely no sense to me and is a huge reason why I think he's done for. All he's signed is experienced past it has beens or never beens, the young players we have ARE experienced. The only one that isn't is on loan from Brentford and happens to be our best player

He doesn't like bringing youth through, he doesn't trust them. But if Marsh leaves the club without having a proper run in the team or chance to prove himself it would be the biggest damning indictment on both the manager and coaching staff yet. He has everything you'd want from a deep lying forward/number 10 at this level. He's basically a young Bamford, and it's crazy that we haven't just had him as his understudy for the season...

I guess you voted for Marsh !!

 

[Snowflake]

Name a better one...

DCL and Ndyie

 

[jimmymuir]

Tidy player from the bits I've seen from him, don't think he's ready for Champ level yet and remains to be seen whether he ever will. That said, I'd still much rather give him a go than have signed that lazy sod who's on 20k per week minimum.

 

[Cheeky Blade]

The way things are going I’m glad he’s out on loan getting games and enjoying himself.

We could apply this to two in the building though with Oné and Baptiste.

Baptiste having played most of the pre-season then dumped for McGuiness first game and Oné not getting a sniff until thrown on as a sub and subsequently injured.

Surely playing Baptiste, Oné and Marsh would be better than the codgers and ball dodgers we started with?

UTB.

 

[S64 Blade]

Good heavens. I would have expected £10k at absolute most

He might be. Nobody really knows tbf. But I’d be surprised if it’s so low given where he came from and the average wages in the league.