Centre Midfield

[robbiez666]

All the talk has been around the lack of CBs but I'm more than a little concerned about the middle of the park.

It looks like we'll be attacking but I'm struggling to see how Baxter and Basham aren't going to be owned by most teams. Baxter gives nothing defensively and Basham is not the kind of player that can carry him. I would guess that most home games we'll be facing three in the centre of the park. There's also a good chance that Basham will have to cover at the back and Wallace is likely to be injured, so that's Coutts/Reed and Baxter. I can't see us being able to protect a slow and dubious CB pairing.

If we're talking about spines, we still have a dubious keeper (whichever starts)

Our spine last season was weak in 4 positions. This year it's 3. We've not addressed 3/4 of the issues (admittedly, the keeper situation id the least pressing).

Bit worrying.

 

[Lord Bos of Eckington.]

All the talk has been around the lack of CBs but I'm more than a little concerned about the middle of the park.

It looks like we'll be attacking but I'm struggling to see how Baxter and Basham aren't going to be owned by most teams. Baxter gives nothing defensively and Basham is not the kind of player that can carry him. I would guess that most home games we'll be facing three in the centre of the park. There's also a good chance that Basham will have to cover at the back and Wallace is likely to be injured, so that's Coutts/Reed and Baxter. I can't see us being able to protect a slow and dubious CB pairing.

If we're talking about spines, we still have a dubious keeper (whichever starts)

Our spine last season was weak in 4 positions. This year it's 3. We've not addressed 3/4 of the issues (admittedly, the keeper situation id the least pressing).

Bit worrying.

Problems with the goalkeeper , CB , midfield , attack . anybody from outer space landing on this planet , would think we were favourites for relegation .

I want 2no CB , but what do i know , Adkins will sort it .

He has a reputation to keep in tact , and i dont think failure is on the agenda at SUFC anymore.

Dont worry .

UTB

 

[Blade82]

With the right attitude and right players around him Baxter could run the show. Adkins is a great man manager and I think we'll see a different Jose this year

 

[Barney]

CB is being adressed as mentioned by Adkins so that's that one sorted. Basham in my opinion is one of the best central midfielders in this league and if Wallace can keep fit there's a making for a great CM partnership there. I'm quite confident Baxter will do well there as well if and when Wallace isn't available or Adkins could favour him over Wallace, but all in all I don't think CM is that much of a problem.

 

[S5Blade]

Baxter has been quality pre-season sitting deeper and controlling / breaking up play and distributing the ball all over the field. CM is one area of the pitch I am not personally concerned about.

 

[SUFC Handsworth]

Don't have too many concerns about centre mid. Basham paired with any of the other options I'm happy with. Coutts looked a different player when Basham did the dirty work for him. If it's James Wallace that's paired with him and he keeps fit that would be a big, big bonus (though with his injury record I'm defo not counting on it). Reed's an excellent player, ditto Baxter, ditto even Scougall.

Basham's the key in centre mid though, he does the spade work to allow the other players to be creative.

 

[robbiez666]

My point was, which has seemingly been missed, that in a competitive game (not a pre-season stroll) I do not believe Basham and Baxter can dominate against 3 tough tackling CMs. The midfield needs to protect the defence as there's zero pace. Baxter isn;t chasing after shit so Basham has to win the midfield battle on his own and cover for Collins and J-Mac. Can't see it myself.

 

[Foxy]

It's Bash with either Wallace or Baxter for me based on pre-season.

Bash is strong and competitive enough, the other two will be fine when they are in form.

Coutts, once he's fit (if we can get him there) and Reedy there when we can fit him in (as quality as his is/will be).

 

[Patrick Suffaux]

Baxter, Basham, Reed, Calvert-Lewin, Scougall, Wallace, Coutts.

I think we'll be ok there.

 

[Cyprus Blade]

CM will operate with one hand tied behind its back so to speak unless they have a solid defence behind them. A decent defence and I think MF will do ok especially with more forward out-ball opportunities.

Howard needs to up his game and I don't think Long is commanding enough to do the job well. He is still learning. Freeman is looking good going forward but I am not convinced about him defensively - more of a WB than a FB. Bomber Harris can be a bit hit and miss and the McEveley and Collins combo lacks pace and distribution. Baxter playing deep may help the latter but I don't see that defence seeing us through a season so Nige 3 needs to get someone decent in at CB early doors and for the season if its a loan in my view.

 

[ziggy4001]

I can't remember too many teams bossing us in central midfield last season? We dominated possession most games. It was when we got into the final phase we struggled but I'd say that was mainly due to tactics in particular the slow tempo.

 

[Kian_barlow00]

There is also reed for a bit of youth but Wallace and basham centre mid for me!

 

[Gibbo89]

Having seen the Newcastle and Hull games it goes without saying for me that Baxter and Basham should start every game in centre mid. Their abilities complement each other perfectly and they both look far better players when together. It was very noticeable how the tempo and quality in those games diminished when they weren't playing in tandem.
If needed we still have J Wallace, Coutts, Scougall, Reed, Calvert-Lewin, etc, effectively to cover 2 midfield places.
Stop worrying

 

[BushBlade]

If we play 442 we'll always lose the midfield battle against a team that plays 451. So don't try to pass through midfield, go direct. If you've got two upfront then you need to play the game in their half.
If there are games where NA thinks we need to control midfield he'll stick another body in there, or play 'lopsided' with one of the wide midfielders tucking in.

 

[BornOnShorehamStreet]

With the right attitude and right players around him Baxter could run the show. Adkins is a great man manager and I think we'll see a different Jose this year

Already seen a different Jose versus Newcastle IMO

 

[Balham]

Our central midfield options:

Basham - a player transformed last season. Box to box with a decent touch. Good at being in the right place to break up the play without needing to fly into tackles.
Defensive 8
Attacking 6
Workrate 9

Baxter - from all the pre-season reports it seems that either the change of manager or his failed drugs test has given him the kick that he so desperately needed. A new role as deep lying playmaker (one for the Football Manager players there!) seems to suit him
Defensive 6
Attacking 8
Workrate 5 (based on last season)

Coutts - there were signs of the classy operator revered by Preston fans last season but obvious fitness issues prevented him playing consistently well. Fitness is the major concern - if he's recovered from his knee injury he'll be one of the best midfielders in the division: and who better to make that happen than a manager with a physiotherapy background?
Defensive 7
Attacking 8
Workrate 7

Wallace - we've not seen the best of James Wallace because we've hardly seen him in a Blades shirt. Hopefully he'll be over the injury problems which plagued him last season; again, Adkins' sport science based approach will help enormously.
Defensive 7
Attacking 7
Workrate 8

Reed - small in stature but with an eye for a pass, if last season was a breakthrough then this season is all about finding consistency. One of our brightest prospects
Defensive 6
Attacking 7
Workrate 7

Scougall - even smaller than Reed and suffered second season syndrome. His form seems to react to the team's as a whole; if the team's struggling then Scougall struggles more but in his first season his energy was allied to a decent touch and ability to make things happen. Will have to accept that he's in the second tier of CM choices though.
Defensive 5
Attacking 7
Workrate 8

Cuvelier - another one we've not seen the best of after he was seemingly* frozen out by Clough. When he's fit his challenge is to rediscover the form which earned him a call up to the Belgian U21s.
Defensive 6
Attacking 7
Workrate 7
*for 'seemingly' read 'definitely and without any justification'

Dimaio - made his debut against Rotherham in 2013/14 but disappeared in 2014/15 rather than pushing on as hoped. His last appearance was out of position (right wing) against Preston in the FA Cup 4th round. Another one who, for whatever reason, got on the wrong side of Clough; this is a make-or-break season. Might benefit from a loan spell.
Defensive ?
Attacking ?
Workrate ?

Whiteman - signed a two year (?) pro deal last December and is highly thought of in the academy and U21s. Up to him to use any game time to force a greater level of involvement but he may have to start with cameos and JPT roles.
Defensive ?
Attacking ?
Workrate ?

I make that 7 first team squad central midfielders plus two U21s. I don't see CM as a problem at all.

 

[Slim Man]

Basham is good enough to 'carry' anyone in this league, make no bones about it. Theres no one in this league I'd rather have sitting in the middle of the park.

 

[Fulwood Blade]

Is it just me that is getting concerned about centre midfield and central defence?
It seems some are just "hoping" for the best, in that things will be better then last season and that Adkins/Wilkins are some sort of miracle workers.

Well, you might be right, and I hope you are.

Chances are we are going to be in a very similar situation to last year. Some of the problems we had last season exist this, and it looks like we are one less in midfield - even more reason to be solid.

strong centre halves should be able to look after themselves - all this crap about covering and deep lying central midfield is bollocks - deep lying midfield means your CH's are suspect and it is the main reason why teams don't score enough as there isn't as many options when you attack.

Good teams actually attack with 8 players as and when needed. 2 forwards, 4 midfield and 2 full backs - The key is to have all those available for options, that ideally the centre midfield exploit and use. It's called putting pressure on the opposition.

Two decent centre halves should be able to look after themselves and if teams break, then they should have the speed, confidence (in their own ability) and skill to initially hold up the opposition so that others can get back. It doesn't take much - just a few seconds of concentration and to know what you are doing.

A team that has a strong core usually does well - we look very very familiar to last season. I hope Adkins recent radio interview with Andy Giddens proves to be correct and that someone is coming in.

UTB

 

[Guesty]

I can't remember too many teams bossing us in central midfield last season? We dominated possession most games. It was when we got into the final phase we struggled but I'd say that was mainly due to tactics in particular the slow tempo.

Swindon, to borrow a phrase from Pinchy, used our midfield as training cones in the Play-off first leg. There were also plenty of instances of goals coming from quick breaks after either Baxter had given the ball away/put in a halfhearted challenge or Scougall had been bullied off the ball.

I agree about dominating possession but I thought the middle of the park was weak off the ball a lot last season.

 

[Cyprus Blade]

all this crap about covering and deep lying central midfield is bollocks -

As a non-technically endowed spectator I'd agee with this post.

From what I saw the defensive nature of our approach to midfield stemmed as much from both a lack of ability in the CH's and a lack of confidence in them as anything else. Ok Collins, for whatever reason, went on to the naughty step for the rest of the season after the Swindon defeat and he is a CH, but I am not deluding myself that he has suddenly gained a yard in pace or a second in anticipation so, for me, the central defensive frailties are still annoyingly apparent and what we have is not good enough for the whole season.

I haven't been fortunate to see any of the pre-season games other than the Newcastle and Hull ones on BP but our CM looks a lot more attack minded thankfully and those interminably boring and risk averse two yard sideways and backwards passes are far less in evidence. Last season our slow development play meant the opposition could flood midfield and know they had time to get back. If we break quickly they may not feel so confident about leaving the back exposed and will sit deeper. Attack as the best form of defence so to speak.

I'm still to be convinced that Coutts can overcome the effects of his injuries, but it is beginning to look encouraging about Wallace, if he overcomes the injury fears in his head (interesting piece on him in the Stir about that http://www.thestar.co.uk/sport/sheff-utd/sheffield-united-wallace-is-ready-to-be-unleashed-1-7396977 ). Baxter looks much more on the ball and aware, his passing is crisper and he is potentially as much a key player this season as he was a liability at times last season. I very much hope so. Reed is developing, but we need to watch his confidence levels (remember Notts County away and afterwards?). Basham picks himself at the moment though his playmaking and passing leaves something to be desired for me. Overall, for me, CM is less of a concern than the defence. As Nigel 3 said - defence wins you titles.

 

[BushBlade]

Is it just me that is getting concerned about centre midfield and central defence?
It seems some are just "hoping" for the best, in that things will be better then last season and that Adkins/Wilkins are some sort of miracle workers.

Well, you might be right, and I hope you are.

Chances are we are going to be in a very similar situation to last year. Some of the problems we had last season exist this, and it looks like we are one less in midfield - even more reason to be solid.

strong centre halves should be able to look after themselves - all this crap about covering and deep lying central midfield is bollocks - deep lying midfield means your CH's are suspect and it is the main reason why teams don't score enough as there isn't as many options when you attack.

Good teams actually attack with 8 players as and when needed. 2 forwards, 4 midfield and 2 full backs - The key is to have all those available for options, that ideally the centre midfield exploit and use. It's called putting pressure on the opposition.

Two decent centre halves should be able to look after themselves and if teams break, then they should have the speed, confidence (in their own ability) and skill to initially hold up the opposition so that others can get back. It doesn't take much - just a few seconds of concentration and to know what you are doing.

A team that has a strong core usually does well - we look very very familiar to last season. I hope Adkins recent radio interview with Andy Giddens proves to be correct and that someone is coming in.

UTB

Even Arsene Wenger has started to appreciate the need for a defensive midfielder and a tactical approach that consists of more than just chucking everyone forwards.
The best defensive midfielders, like Matic, do offer something going forwards too but they're quite rare at this level so generally you have to use someone who's more box to box but with instructions to sit when the full backs go forward. The alternative is to alternate the full backs so when one goes forward the other stays back.
It's a basic principle of defending that you don't go two on two so, if you're playing against two upfront you keep three in defensive areas. If you're playing against one you can push your DM a bit further up to congest the midfield or allow your full backs to bomb on.

 

[Slim Man]

The only time our midfield was overrun was when Basham wasn't in it. IE: Swindon first leg, second half. For the first 45 we pretty much shaded it. Funnily enough Basham was in the middle.

There is nothing to worry about as long as we keep him as fit as we did last season and just let him concentrate on that one position alone.

 

[Darthblade]

All the talk has been around the lack of CBs but I'm more than a little concerned about the middle of the park.

It looks like we'll be attacking but I'm struggling to see how Baxter and Basham aren't going to be owned by most teams. Baxter gives nothing defensively and Basham is not the kind of player that can carry him. I would guess that most home games we'll be facing three in the centre of the park. There's also a good chance that Basham will have to cover at the back and Wallace is likely to be injured, so that's Coutts/Reed and Baxter. I can't see us being able to protect a slow and dubious CB pairing.

If we're talking about spines, we still have a dubious keeper (whichever starts)

Our spine last season was weak in 4 positions. This year it's 3. We've not addressed 3/4 of the issues (admittedly, the keeper situation id the least pressing).

Bit worrying.

I believe that our CM issue depends completely upon whether Wallace and Coutts can get / be fit enough to partner Basham in CM, in League 1 games.

A few have commented on Baxters performances vs Newcastle & Hull in the pre season games ...... he will shine when playing against higher division opposition but put him into agricultural league 1 games and he, just like Scougal, will be a liability !

The League is our no1 priority and it requires that the players are able to "look after themselves" because referees at this level would not recognise a foul if it hit them in the face.

We are already beginning the season with a patched up, cobbled together makeshift CH pairing. I don't know if this is because the promises of financial support from the Board have been reneged on again, or because NA is "biding his time" to produce the desperately needed two dominant CHs. But if we start with a weak, midget midfield AND a patched up defence, the only likelihood is that we will be playing "catch up" to the top 3 or 4 teams again, just like last season.

My worry is that this squad of ours, as it is at the moment will leak goals so there's going to be a huge amount of pressure on the strikers / midfield to score more than we concede .......

Currently, I believe that we will not be able to seriously challenge for the top two places .......
UTB & FTP

 

[Fulwood Blade]

Even Arsene Wenger has started to appreciate the need for a defensive midfielder and a tactical approach that consists of more than just chucking everyone forwards.
The best defensive midfielders, like Matic, do offer something going forwards too but they're quite rare at this level so generally you have to use someone who's more box to box but with instructions to sit when the full backs go forward. The alternative is to alternate the full backs so when one goes forward the other stays back.
It's a basic principle of defending that you don't go two on two so, if you're playing against two upfront you keep three in defensive areas. If you're playing against one you can push your DM a bit further up to congest the midfield or allow your full backs to bomb on.

yes agree with a lot of that. The only game we really dominated last season was Gills at home, where we pushed virtually the whole team backwards. Notts C played very deep as well, but that was more out of choice especially as we gifted them a goal (Howards error from corner and Doyle ball watching).

I was just amazed last season that so many teams came to BDTBL and pushed onto us - even with 5 in midfield. In hindsight you have to say we were sussed out by clever opposition management and hard working teams. Just because we have a new manager doesn't mean it will be any different this season. Big ground, big club, day out, big scalp and probably more of an incentive with NA as manager to put one over on us.

It is going to be very interesting as to how our 4-4-2 can cope. I like the NA philosophy - when you have the ball you use it, when you haven't you get it back and working hard seems a pre-requisite.

Hope it all comes off - just can't quite see it happening with the core 4 players not being suitable for the "agricultural" division as Darth likes to call it.

Not long to wait !

UTB

 

[Fulwood Blade]

As a non-technically endowed spectator I'd agee with this post.

From what I saw the defensive nature of our approach to midfield stemmed as much from both a lack of ability in the CH's and a lack of confidence in them as anything else. Ok Collins, for whatever reason, went on to the naughty step for the rest of the season after the Swindon defeat and he is a CH, but I am not deluding myself that he has suddenly gained a yard in pace or a second in anticipation so, for me, the central defensive frailties are still annoyingly apparent and what we have is not good enough for the whole season.

I haven't been fortunate to see any of the pre-season games other than the Newcastle and Hull ones on BP but our CM looks a lot more attack minded thankfully and those interminably boring and risk averse two yard sideways and backwards passes are far less in evidence. Last season our slow development play meant the opposition could flood midfield and know they had time to get back. If we break quickly they may not feel so confident about leaving the back exposed and will sit deeper. Attack as the best form of defence so to speak.

I'm still to be convinced that Coutts can overcome the effects of his injuries, but it is beginning to look encouraging about Wallace, if he overcomes the injury fears in his head (interesting piece on him in the Stir about that http://www.thestar.co.uk/sport/sheff-utd/sheffield-united-wallace-is-ready-to-be-unleashed-1-7396977 ). Baxter looks much more on the ball and aware, his passing is crisper and he is potentially as much a key player this season as he was a liability at times last season. I very much hope so. Reed is developing, but we need to watch his confidence levels (remember Notts County away and afterwards?). Basham picks himself at the moment though his playmaking and passing leaves something to be desired for me. Overall, for me, CM is less of a concern than the defence. As Nigel 3 said - defence wins you titles.

Some good stuff there and agree with the sentiments.
I am still to be convinced that Baxter can "run" the whole game for 90 minutes as our chief playmaker.
As for Coutts - there is defo a footballer - some don't think so, but they can't see past his injuries, plus NC played him wide right at times which IMO was daft. He is CM or nothing really. As some have eluded to he has a strange running style - very short leg movement, which gives the impression of him being slow. He has the quality and ability to sit deep and doesn't seem a box to box player.
The crux for me is once again Wallace - think we all have to hope he stays fit. Considering pre-season, Baxter will probably start v gills with perhaps Wallace for the last 20-30 minutes. Would like to see it the other way round.
We are all waiting for Reed - if we keep him long enough we should be discussing Reed and ??? for CM.

As for defence - true. The old adage....don't concede, don't lose which NC seemed to lay his entire philosophy on - trouble is, he didn't have to gorillas in central defence. I genuinely think if we had those 2 players last August we would have gone up.

Not long to wait.

UTB

 

[BushBlade]

yes agree with a lot of that. The only game we really dominated last season was Gills at home, where we pushed virtually the whole team backwards. Notts C played very deep as well, but that was more out of choice especially as we gifted them a goal (Howards error from corner and Doyle ball watching).

I was just amazed last season that so many teams came to BDTBL and pushed onto us - even with 5 in midfield. In hindsight you have to say we were sussed out by clever opposition management and hard working teams. Just because we have a new manager doesn't mean it will be any different this season. Big ground, big club, day out, big scalp and probably more of an incentive with NA as manager to put one over on us.

It is going to be very interesting as to how our 4-4-2 can cope. I like the NA philosophy - when you have the ball you use it, when you haven't you get it back and working hard seems a pre-requisite.

Hope it all comes off - just can't quite see it happening with the core 4 players not being suitable for the "agricultural" division as Darth likes to call it.

Not long to wait !

UTB

Although I was pro-Clough I think we were quite one dimensional last season, fairly predictable and lacking sufficient threat up front.
NA has addressed the problems up front and will not impose a 'must build from the back' philosophy, allowing the defenders to use the 'out' ball more frequently; Sammon will chase everything and anything.
Hopefully...

 

[Fulwood Blade]

Although I was pro-Clough I think we were quite one dimensional last season, fairly predictable and lacking sufficient threat up front.
NA has addressed the problems up front and will not impose a 'must build from the back' philosophy, allowing the defenders to use the 'out' ball more frequently; Sammon will chase everything and anything.
Hopefully...

I have had a few "discussions" over the years with Blades about moving the ball quicker at times.
I too was pro clough, but with the benefit of hindsight we were certainly sussed out last season - and as you suggested, probably our one dimensional play.
yes, here's hoping.........

UTB

 

[robbiez666]

well, we totally dominated midfield as predicted, creating wave after wave of chances.