Nigel Clough - opinions from a Derby fan

[blade too long]

You never can tell
Why was Ian Hollaway such a disaster at Leicester, then worked miracles at Blackpool

Why did Watford summarily sack the man whos taken Burnley up

Cloughs come in and theres a nice buzz about the place, horses for courses

 

[bladeinspaceandtime]

You never can tell
Why was Ian Hollaway such a disaster at Leicester, then worked miracles at Blackpool

Why did Watford summarily sack the man whos taken Burnley up

Cloughs come in and theres a nice buzz about the place, horses for courses

It is a lottery, unless you give the job to Bryan Robson.

 

[JOEYDEE]

You never can tell
Why was Ian Hollaway such a disaster at Leicester, then worked miracles at Blackpool

Why did Watford summarily sack the man whos taken Burnley up

Cloughs come in and theres a nice buzz about the place, horses for courses

Why did Reading sack Brendan Rodgers ?

 

[Rampage]

13 months on - what's the general opinion on your manager?

 

[SherburnBlade]

Pretty much what you said originally
UTB

 

[sitwell]

13 months on - what's the general opinion on your manager?

Why did you ask this after a disappointing result, so you can get your shit stirring point across ?

 

[yuley82]

For me it's turning into exactly what your post warned us about, dull toothless team with signings that have well, let's say they haven't pulled up any trees. It's becoming very much a chore for myself to go to bramall lane now, I'm sick of watching it. An its never Nigel's fault! That's my own opinion people will have others.

 

[Rampage]

Why did you ask this after a disappointing result, so you can get your shit stirring point across ?

I didn't even know you played last night. If you must ask, we have a Nigel Clough thread on our forum which got people talking again.

I did find it interesting that everyone took the negatives out of my post in the first place. Probably more of a reflection of where you were 13 months ago. I tried to be fair and balance and give you all the general opinion of all Derby fans, not just my own. There were a lot of Derby fans, maybe even the majority, who were disgusted with his sacking. Looking back I didn't convey that very well.

"Shit-stirring point". Read my posts again. I would take a lot of pleasure in Cloughie doing well at the Blades.

 

[pommpey]

13 months on - what's the general opinion on your manager?

Still think he is a good manager and I still think the board are wholly responsible for short selling him and the supporters. We are now reduced to loanees and items from non-league. This after a rich Saudi joins the board and we flog our best prospect for £2.5m. If the club was awash with quality players and we were still playing like snap-offs then I'd want Cluffy binned.

Guys, give Rampage a break, eh? He is here in peace and asking a salient question, which deserves a reasoned response.

pommpey

 

[sitwell]

I didn't even know you played last night. If you must ask, we have a Nigel Clough thread on our forum which got people talking again.

I did find it interesting that everyone took the negatives out of my post in the first place. Probably more of a reflection of where you were 13 months ago. I tried to be fair and balance and give you all the general opinion of all Derby fans, not just my own. There were a lot of Derby fans, maybe even the majority, who were disgusted with his sacking. Looking back I didn't convey that very well.

"Shit-stirring point". Read my posts again. I would take a lot of pleasure in Cloughie doing well at the Blades.

Fair dos ,there is a past history of tossers from some clubs who like to put the knife in. I think he is a good manager who is still building ,he does make mistakes ,like leaving the left wing bare last night ,but I also think he has been let down by some players who need letting go.

 

[itsinyerblood]

Still think he is a good manager and I still think the board are wholly responsible for short selling him and the supporters. We are now reduced to loanees and items from non-league. This after a rich Saudi joins the board and we flog our best prospect for £2.5m. If the club was awash with quality players and we were still playing like snap-offs then I'd want Cluffy binned.

Guys, give Rampage a break, eh? He is here in peace and asking a salient question, which deserves a reasoned response.

pommpey

Interesting reading was Rampage's post, and well done you pommpey for calling for reasoned responses. The OP wasn't attritional, it was a statement of one poster's considered view. I wonder what NC himself would think if he could find the time to read it? I wonder if he'd recognise the character traits as described by Rampage? I certainly don't think that what's needed is something that's mildly hysterical and only able to pick up the negatives of the OP's post.

It could be that because NC was given a directive from his board of directors at Derby to slash the wage bill that he took the lower league and Scottish route. I think the scouting aspect of any club's infrastructure is at the root and branch level of what we can expect from the eleven who represent SUFC. What about players from Europe, even south America or other parts of the world? There's a cost involved in this, but it would seem to be a necessary one.

I don't think Rampage was in any way hostile or seeking to cause trouble. If anyone is in doubt return to the OP and read carefully.

I try not to allow my emotions to run riot after a game, at least when we drop points. I hope COG does offer something we've been missing up front. Of course I'll be rooting for the guy but I'm not expecting a Robin Van Persie in his prime, just a solid display of a forward who can mix it with defenders, motivate those around him to work hard, and in the process I hope we'll see goals from wherever they happen to flow from. What happens this season will tell us far more than last season's rollercoaster ride. We're in the pack that matters, but something is lacking, not sure what, but there's definitely an absence of genuine quality from some quarter that we're in need of.

I'm pro-Clough, if only because chopping and changing is the idiot's knee-jerk response to any problem. As a club we don't have a right to anything. We have to fight to make progress. The very top players graft with the best of them, so we should expect our lower league 'heroes' to put a shift in and sweat their bollocks off. The quality that's missing is just that, quality. I hope that from somewhere NC and his team will unearth someone who can conjure up the necessary magic we need.

 

[Small Mendonca]

13 months on - what's the general opinion on your manager?

Last season: very good tactician; got the most out of players and built team moral. Saved us from what would have been an embarrassing relegation and managed to get us to the FA cup semi, one of the best runs of our recent history.

This season: Distinctly average. The majority of the signings he has brought in over the summer have been very average players for this division. His negative tactics, particularly at home and his stubbornness is really starting to annoy fans and people are becoming impatient. He doesn't really have a plan B in games either and some of his team selections are quite frankly baffling at times. This season, it appears he isn't getting the best out of the players, often playing players in positions they are not suited to. The only reason we are in the play offs is due to the terrible standard of this division. Although having said that, he has helped us put together another good cup run in the League Cup this time around.

I think there is a good manager in there but his pitfalls are starting to wear thin.

 

[Rudders]

Last season: very good tactician; got the most out of players and built team moral. Saved us from what would have been an embarrassing relegation and managed to get us to the FA cup semi, one of the best runs of our recent history.

This season: Distinctly average. The majority of the signings he has brought in over the summer have been very average players for this division. His negative tactics, particularly at home and his stubbornness is really starting to annoy fans and people are becoming impatient. He doesn't really have a plan B in games either and some of his team selections are quite frankly baffling at times. This season, it appears he isn't getting the best out of the players, often playing players in positions they are not suited to. The only reason we are in the play offs is due to the terrible standard of this division. Although having said that, he has helped us put together another good cup run in the League Cup this time around.

I think there is a good manager in there but his pitfalls are starting to wear thin.

One thing that is beginning to bug me is why we keep conceding soft goals from corners. I think Clough and his management team need to take some responsibility for this. One for continually changing the backline, Two for allowing our loan centre back not to train with us and 3 for binning off two solid centre backs in Butler and Collins.

A successful team builds from the back and has a solid spine. We do not have this. We do not score from our own set plays. We have no aerial threat.

I reckon this side would get promoted with Butler and Collins at centre back. We would also score regularly from set plays. Its not rocket science.

 

[judge]

So what about transfers? He was a lot more hit than miss, which was pretty impressive given where we got our players from. I’m all for scouting the lower leagues and Scotland, but that was as far as his scouting network ever went, which I’m sure made the job much more difficult than it needed to be. But there’s a hell of a lot of positivity to mention in this field. You’ve got players like Brayford, Bryson, Buxton, Russell and Moxey who he’s brought into the Championship for under a million pounds (some of those names even came in for peanuts). When he’s paid seven figure sums it’s also gone well, with the possible exception of Sammon, who’s yet to really make his price tag seem worth it.

We did miss out on a lot of targets though. He point blank refused to have a Director of Football, and his brother Simon was our head scout. The way we went about our transfers felt a bit…amateurish. If you don’t ask, you don’t get – but with Clough’s management team, we asked and too often we didn’t get, and it really held us back. It’s one of the things the board were allegedly growing tired of. Immediately, Steve McLaren has come in and managed to spend some available cash on fairly decent loan signings. Clough was also very frugal with money and it’s said that he didn’t spend some of his available cash as he wanted a small-close knit squad of 20 players.

I suggest people read this part and tell me they're not worried by the similarities

 

[sitwell]

I suggest people read this part and tell me they're not worried by the similarities

Higdon was from Holland ,Ogrady,Mcevely Harris, Davies , Basham and Mcgahey are from the championship ,Alcock and Jcr are from our league. Mcarthy is from the premier league. Doesn't really stand up that to be fair.

 

[Fiery Blade]

I think it's down to the players - they are all making individual errors which are proving very costly - Clough was tearing his hair out last night at some of the poor decisions and mistakes the players were making !
Unfortunately, most of the players are not up for the fight and on last nights performance Higdon is not even up for a game of football !

 

[Tony Currie]

Higdon was from Holland ,Ogrady,Mcevely Harris, Davies , Basham and Mcgahey are from the championship ,Alcock and Jcr are from our league. Mcarthy is from the premier league. Doesn't really stand up that to be fair.

Agreed totally, Derby gave Nigel 4 years on a tight budget - we gave Warnock 7 years to get us to the premiership.

To me there are similarities to Warnock. We are going on cup runs; the players want to play for him; he can spot an upcoming talent; he can work on a budget; he doesn't suffer disruptive players

There are also differences of course. Nigel's teams play football; they don't get stuck in (just look at the number of fouls against); Nigel doesn't love strikers

All Nigel needs is time, no team has a god given right to promotion and a number of teams have struggled to get promoted from this division (Leeds, Southampton, Wednesday). What we do know is that the teams promoted generally manage to stay up so this division is not that poor .

 

[YES Blade]

I personally don't think he is getting the best out of the players. Our squad is at a level to compete for auto promotion but we don't look anywhere near capable.

What makes it even worse is how dull it is to watch. We look to keep it tight and try and score it the second half, which is tactics of a team with one the lower budgets not one of the highest.

We have scored only 4 goals in the first half which is simply not acceptable for a team with aspirations of automatic promotion. Fair enough we have scored 21 in the second half, but we should be taking the game to teams and lead at half time. At the moment the opposition is always in the match and I can't really remember any comfortable wins, which a promotion team will always have.

 

[OllyBlade]

Agreed totally, Derby gave Nigel 4 years on a tight budget - we gave Warnock 7 years to get us to the premiership.

To me there are similarities to Warnock. We are going on cup runs; the players want to play for him; he can spot an upcoming talent; he can work on a budget; he doesn't suffer disruptive players

There are also differences of course. Nigel's teams play football; they don't get stuck in (just look at the number of fouls against); Nigel doesn't love strikers

All Nigel needs is time, no team has a god given right to promotion and a number of teams have struggled to get promoted from this division (Leeds, Southampton, Wednesday). What we do know is that the teams promoted generally manage to stay up so this division is not that poor .

I'm sorry, but the difference is in undergoing that process in league one and the championship. We are in league one, we should want to get out of this division as soon as possible. No way should any manager be given that kind of time. Those other teams you mention took 3 seasons tops to get out. We are looking down the barrel of a fifth. It betrays the lack of ambition that corrupts this club like a tumour that so many are willing to accept this mediocrity.

 

[GRUMPY BLADE]

I'm sorry, but the difference is in undergoing that process in league one and the championship. We are in league one, we should want to get out of this division as soon as possible. No way should any manager be given that kind of time. Those other teams you mention took 3 seasons tops to get out. We are looking down the barrel of a fifth. It betrays the lack of ambition that corrupts this club like a tumour that so many are willing to accept this mediocrity.

Thing is though the counter should be reset when you change the manager, Clough should not be included in the failings of those who went before.

 

[Patrick Suffaux]

13 months on - what's the general opinion on your manager?

Still think he's a good manager. My only criticism of him would be his Wenger style rigidity when it comes to playing style. Won't change for anything or anyone.

In theory his playing style can work on a consistent basis but I feel there's a gap between what he wants to do and what he needs to be able to do it. When working at SUFC he will always fall short of the resources to make his ideal style work week in week out.

Hence he must be more flexible to get results with what he has. Either the board need to relent and back him a bit more in January or he needs to compromise on his playing style.

 

[judge]

Can't ever see him achievine anymore here than he did at Derby myself

 

[Lord Bos of Eckington.]

Interesting reading was Rampage's post, and well done you pommpey for calling for reasoned responses. The OP wasn't attritional, it was a statement of one poster's considered view. I wonder what NC himself would think if he could find the time to read it? I wonder if he'd recognise the character traits as described by Rampage? I certainly don't think that what's needed is something that's mildly hysterical and only able to pick up the negatives of the OP's post.

It could be that because NC was given a directive from his board of directors at Derby to slash the wage bill that he took the lower league and Scottish route. I think the scouting aspect of any club's infrastructure is at the root and branch level of what we can expect from the eleven who represent SUFC. What about players from Europe, even south America or other parts of the world? There's a cost involved in this, but it would seem to be a necessary one.

I don't think Rampage was in any way hostile or seeking to cause trouble. If anyone is in doubt return to the OP and read carefully.

I try not to allow my emotions to run riot after a game, at least when we drop points. I hope COG does offer something we've been missing up front. Of course I'll be rooting for the guy but I'm not expecting a Robin Van Persie in his prime, just a solid display of a forward who can mix it with defenders, motivate those around him to work hard, and in the process I hope we'll see goals from wherever they happen to flow from. What happens this season will tell us far more than last season's rollercoaster ride. We're in the pack that matters, but something is lacking, not sure what, but there's definitely an absence of genuine quality from some quarter that we're in need of.

I'm pro-Clough, if only because chopping and changing is the idiot's knee-jerk response to any problem. As a club we don't have a right to anything. We have to fight to earn anything. The very top players graft with the best of them, so we should expect our lower league 'heroes' to put a shift in and sweat their bollocks off. The quality that's missing is just that, quality. I hope that from somewhere NC and his team will unearth someone who can conjure up the necessary magic we need.

itsinyerblood and pompey are right . Mr Clough and the Blades were in the right place at the right time for each other . Let us not change managers with knee jerk reactions like previously . We want stability and promotion. Mr Clough will sort out the quality . We are getting there.


Give Mr Clough a chance.

UTB

 

[Living In a Fantasy World]

13 months on - what's the general opinion on your manager?

On the fence, he talks well and makes good points when talking to the press but some of the decisions with tactics/ subs/ players are just plain daft at times.

 

[Fulwood Blade]

Can't ever see him achievine anymore here than he did at Derby myself

well, if he gets us to the Chmapionship and then "someone" takes over and the season after we are top of the Championship, then I am sure we would all settle for that (a la Derby).

Would be very ruthless, but football has become just that - £100m per season in the premier - daft, just daft.

UTB

 

[pommpey]

Give Mr Clough a chance.

UTB

It's not us - the supporters - who need to give Clough the chance. With all the Ched Evans fuck-arsery going on, we seem to have taken our eye off the ball a bit (as it were). Clough has enough confidence an d backing from the fans to keep him airborne well past another disappointing promotion campaign and into another uninspiring season in the third tier of English football.

I keep banging on about this ... but don't let shit results against gash teams and failed attempts by rapists (as well as iffy non-league loan/signings) steer your attention away from the fact that the board of Sheffield United has the ultimate responsibility to fulfil their pledges, to get the team into the upper echelons of English football at the earliest opportunity. They also still have to define and account for this Game Changing Investment proclamation, where we expected a little bit more than the loaning in of Brayford and Coady, and certainly better efforts to hang onto Maguire. I don't give a fat rats arse about what people say 'Clough brought in twenty players' - without any details on how much they cost, they could have been for two copies of Mayfair and twenty Bensons. I don't give much of one for the 'three failed target players' either. Who were they? How much did they cost? Why did they not want to come to Bramall Lane? What was the dealbreaker that prevented this?

Please don't go with the 'look-at-the-eyes-look-at-the-eyes' smoke and mirrors shit the board expects you to swallow. Before anyone starts calling for the xit of Clough firstly ask yourself this:

1. Has he what you'd expect to be a decent footballing side at his disposal?
2. Are we being told the truth about everything?
3. Where s the Maguire money?
4. Who would you have in his place and how would he change a team full of shit players into winners?

pommpey

 

[Dnblade]

The Derby fans who say he took them as far as he could,also say he cleared out the deadwood and the high earners and left them with solid foundations ...if that's the case then let him crack on and do the same for us,and if he is then found wanting then the next man will inherit a healthier United to the one which NC had when he walked in the Lane,and can progress us from there.

 

[Woodwardfan]

Fascinating to read the OP after 12 months, thanks to the Derby fan who took the time to write it.

Some of the comments in the OP strike chords with me:

No Plan B, no subs before 70 minutes.
Negativity, especially away.
Not a master tactician
Frugal with money, didn't spend some of budget
Scouting amateurish, asked many times but didn't get, only lower leagues and Scotland not enough.
Dull interviews, Derby dull place to watch football


On the plus side:
signings on the plus side overall
football played on the ground, pressing hard to recover
good young player developer

Interesting:
Never got animated - he does now, maybe a sign of the pressure he's feeling


I'm still with the man. He needs somehow to decide his best team and be more positive with the formations especially at home. Up to now this season I rate his performance 6/10 but last season 9/10. For me he has credit in my bank. Nobody is perfect and I have doubts obviously, but sometimes defining moments change the season, maybe that's the O'Grady signing, maybe not, but we need a settled side and something to spark a run. Step up Baxter, please, you and/or Scougall need to come to the party.

4-5-1 at home is no way to combat defensive line-ups. Having said that it is right for MKD on Tuesday and maybe O'Grady will make a difference.

 

[Cyprus Blade]

13 months on - what's the general opinion on your manager?

I think your assessment of Clough is pretty much spot on Rampage and thanks for sharing it with us. Apologies also for some of the negative responses. I have read your OP quite often throughout the season and been surprised at how the same issues and characteristics keep recurring. One thing I would add is that NC doesn't seem to have developed as a manager - either tactically or with his man management skills. He comes across as a reet mardy arse at times with certain players. I am seriously unimpressed with his brother as chief scout.

 

[judge]

Higdon was from Holland ,Ogrady,Mcevely Harris, Davies , Basham and Mcgahey are from the championship ,Alcock and Jcr are from our league. Mcarthy is from the premier league. Doesn't really stand up that to be fair.