Too many average players

[FTPE]

We have an awfully assembled squad, not all Wilder’s fault, but he’s had two windows now and also signed Cannon.

And aside from Jairo, we are the only club in the top two divisions to have a fully British / Irish squad. That says it all about how modern and effective our recruitment is and Wilder’s outlook. Even Bolton and Lincoln have a more diverse squad than ours.

What about chong? We've got Nils as well.
Suppose you'd want more Jefferson Cáceres', Christian Nwachukwu' and Simane's.
Not sure you automatically get more points for being diverse.

 

[Jan Age]

Meanwhile we are handing out contracts to players who can’t manage a full 90 and look disinterested most of the time … crack on United

 

[Borbokisfreekick]

You’re right, I thought Chong was from Manchester as he came through Man U’s academy.

Nils is frozen out of the squad and not a Wilder signing either.

What I would like is a modern management, scouting and recruitment team that search Europe, South American and Asia for talented players to sign, like every Premier League club and most ambitious forward thinking Championship clubs.

Or even just go and try and sign the likes of Chair, Louza or Morishita from the Championship…but I doubt we’d even try and do that given they’re not English.

We could have signed tried to sign Chair the last time we came down from the Premier league, and never even made an effort. The lad is an outstanding talent playing for chuffing QPR!

What about chong? We've got Nils as well.
Suppose you'd want more Jefferson Cáceres', Christian Nwachukwu' and Simane's.
Not sure you automatically get more points for being diverse.

 

[Darren William]

You’re right, I thought Chong was from Manchester as he came through Man U’s academy.

Nils is frozen out of the squad and not a Wilder signing either.

What I would like is a modern management, scouting and recruitment team that search Europe, South American and Asia for talented players to sign, like every Premier League club and most ambitious forward thinking Championship clubs.

Or even just go and try and sign the likes of Chair, Louza or Morishita from the Championship…but I doubt we’d even try and do that given they’re not English.

We could have signed tried to sign Chair the last time we came down from the Premier league, and never even made an effort. The lad is an outstanding talent playing for chuffing QPR!

The recruitments shocking all needs changing personal ,never mind just the coaching staff as in knill .

 

[Champagneblade]

I think there’s a player in Romelle Donovan - he’s still only 19 - he’s showing flickers of talent. I just hope he can show more attacking threat and continue building a partnership with Seriki a’la Brooks.

Phillips will be an interesting one. Swap him in for Peck.

I’d try:

Cooper
Seriki Tanganga McGuinness McCallum
Riedewald
Donovan Phillips Rothwell
Ohare
Bamford

Riedewald provides extra protection.
Ohare has free rein in the 10 role.
Encourage Phillips to feed COH/Bamford.
Donovan/Seriki is the outlet.

We hear too often of culture carriers.

I get it, if your squad consists of Bash, Billy, Norwood, Baldock, Courts, Didz, Henderson...demanding standards.

For all the focus that we still supposedly place on this, who's carrying the culture at the moment?!

You’re looking towards Peck, Bamford, Tanganga, Arblaster, all of whom with the exception of Bamford, are relatively young or new to leadership.

I suppose you could argue that the recent recruitment of Doherty, Phillips and going back a little further, Rothwell, should add experience and knowhow to the group.

 

[Champagneblade]

I dont mind us playing long ball football if we are set up to play it. I loved it under Bassett. However we are playing it with a team full of players who were signed to play the passing game.

I don’t think we meant to do that. It just seemed after the first ten minutes of total ball dominance we lacked composure for a while. It’s obvious we need an outlet on the left isn’t it? Someone to just take the ball and run at pace and create space elsewhere. Someone like Jack Clarke would be ideal though I’d be surprised if they let him go. They have Maeda now, so perhaps he is first pick but as Philogene seems to want to leave then Clarke would be next up.

 

[Blades1971]

I watched Watford v Southampton yesterday. In the first half Watford played on the front foot and were quite aggressive. Southampton couldn't deal with it. They made them look very ordinary. Perhaps we could try this style.
They did have two big cbs though

 

[Kozzy_is_my_Dad]

I watched Watford v Southampton yesterday. In the first half Watford played on the front foot and were quite aggressive. Southampton couldn't deal with it. They made them look very ordinary. Perhaps we could try this style.
They did have two big cbs though

We're more likely to aim for looking very ordinary and not able to deal with the opposition, TBF...

 

[ckpe147]

You’re right, I thought Chong was from Manchester as he came through Man U’s academy.

Nils is frozen out of the squad and not a Wilder signing either.

What I would like is a modern management, scouting and recruitment team that search Europe, South American and Asia for talented players to sign, like every Premier League club and most ambitious forward thinking Championship clubs.

Or even just go and try and sign the likes of Chair, Louza or Morishita from the Championship…but I doubt we’d even try and do that given they’re not English.

We could have signed tried to sign Chair the last time we came down from the Premier league, and never even made an effort. The lad is an outstanding talent playing for chuffing QPR!

I bet you QPR will finish above us this season.
Their squad has been assembled well over the last couple of years. They've got quick, talented players everywhere, defense has two players that should have been signed by us (Dunne + Edwards), and the midfield has only been strengthened with the addition of Kamara.
They targeted the league below with additions like Kone, Burrell, Poku and Mbengue. All players we could have looked at.

 

[sheepbridge]

To many average players
Not enough any good
Too many Ivo's not enough heros
Coming up with the goods


Sorry Paul, that's terrible, I know.
Ruined one of the best songs ever.

 

[54yrblade]

Brum bullied us all over the pitch! And they'll not be the first to do it this season, we're a soft touch sadly.

The 2016-20 Blades side put this current lot into the shade.

Wilder was rightly proud of them, as were we all.

The drop off in fitness and attitude is very clear but we don't ask difficult questions of CW and the off field team.

We are entitled to ask what happened since that changed it down the gears?

The days of a 'proper Sheffield united performance' are long gone.

 

[ancientblade]

No , Wilder's fault that we kept hoofing up to our strikers - doesn't he see what's happening in a game or can't he think how to correct it ?

spot on he seems devoid of ideas to change things round maybe missing knilly but your right weve a squad of mid table players at the minute im afraid and unless we bring 3/4 players in that are genuine contenders for a place in the starting line up mid table is where we will finish think its as simple as that

 

[Kenilworth]

You’re right, I thought Chong was from Manchester as he came through Man U’s academy.

Nils is frozen out of the squad and not a Wilder signing either.

What I would like is a modern management, scouting and recruitment team that search Europe, South American and Asia for talented players to sign, like every Premier League club and most ambitious forward thinking Championship clubs.

Or even just go and try and sign the likes of Chair, Louza or Morishita from the Championship…but I doubt we’d even try and do that given they’re not English.

We could have signed tried to sign Chair the last time we came down from the Premier league, and never even made an effort. The lad is an outstanding talent playing for chuffing QPR!

Watford have the link with Udinese because of ownership connections. Thats why they have a conveyor belt of players and managers from that region. I’ll bet you get Watford fans bemoaning the fact that their recruitment is one dimensional and that they’d like some spine in their team.

We’re not a prem club
We’re not set up with the infrastructure to manage a wider catchment.
If you’re not set for that then you pay an agency to do that for you (what other clubs do)
It’s not as simple as you make it out to be.

 

[Wizard]

O'Hare looks lost on the left. Was not in the game at all on Saturday. He's great in the middle but doesn't really complement Bamford in a 2 since neither stretch the pitch as both want to drop in and link play. He worked best with Gyokeres at Coventry who was a fantastic focal point striker that could simultaneously stretch play while also competing physically against opposing centre backs to hold the ball up. Neither Cannon nor Campbell offer that combination so O'Hare ends up not really having a natural place in the team. He clearly pairs best profile-wise with One but that leaves Bamford out the side who has been fantastic since joining.

We're also severely lacking in quality out wide post Brooks and Hamer sales which dulls our attack.

 

[Borbokisfreekick]

Watford have the link with Udinese because of ownership connections. Thats why they have a conveyor belt of players and managers from that region. I’ll bet you get Watford fans bemoaning the fact that their recruitment is one dimensional and that they’d like some spine in their team.

We’re not a prem club
We’re not set up with the infrastructure to manage a wider catchment.
If you’re not set for that then you pay an agency to do that for you (what other clubs do)
It’s not as simple as you make it out to be.

With the resources that have passed through the club in the past 7 years then we should absolutely have a version of this in place, it doesn't have to be as big as an established Premier League club, but at least something more modern and wide reaching than what we have. This is the problem. There doesn't appear to have been a high level of investment or planning put into this. How we still don't have some form of Technical Director / Director of football at the club is also connected to this.

Thats the point. We have stood still, whilst other "smaller" clubs have completely passed us by in this area.

 

[Kenilworth]

With the resources that have passed through the club in the past 7 years then we should absolutely have a version of this in place, it doesn't have to be as big as an established Premier League club, but at least something more modern and wide reaching than what we have. This is the problem. There doesn't appear to have been a high level of investment or planning put into this. How we still don't have some form of Technical Director / Director of football at the club is also connected to this.

Thats the point. We have stood still, whilst other "smaller" clubs have completely passed us by in this area.

I believe you drastically underestimate how much such a set up of those proportions costs. Your comment about not appearing to have been a high level of investment alludes to it but the figures required are way above what we got for those seasons in the prem.

But, hey, DoF

Also, which smaller clubs have passed us by?

 

[Borbokisfreekick]

I believe you drastically underestimate how much such a set up of those proportions costs. Your comment about not appearing to have been a high level of investment alludes to it but the figures required are way above what we got for those seasons in the prem.

But, hey, DoF

Also, which smaller clubs have passed us by?

It can be done on a moderate budget and creatively with the right structure, it comes down to where you decide and spend your resources and thinking long term. The strategy and planning is needed, hence the need for DoF or technical director. Leaving it up to a manager who lasts around 18 months on average and his mate as a scout is hardly a strategy for long term recruitment and succession planning.

Smaller or similar sized clubs that have passed us by....Brentford, Bournemouth, Burnley, Crystal Palace, Brighton, Ipswich, Nottingham Forest.

Leeds are a much bigger club than us, but we had a year head start on them in getting to the Premier League, even then, look at some of the players they unearthed from beyond the British isles.

The most glaring issue at the club is the recruitment of players, lack of long term structure, lack of overseas scouting, and over the past 7 years a lack of investment in the space. I don't see how that is even a debate, its clear for anyone to see. Hence why we have such an average squad.

Every top club in the world and pretty much every top flight team has some form of director of football or technical director. We still haven't managed to even get that in place.

 

[Kenilworth]

So much to unpick
A DoF doesn’t negate the revolving door of a new coach every 18 months. I fact it appears to shorten that cycle - but the DoF remains in post (what a surprise?)
All it does is shift the responsibility but no accountability since that remains with the coach.

Three of those you mentioned.
Brighton, Brentford, Bournemouth etc passed us by?
Smaller clubs?
You need to understand the level of investment they laid down to get to where they are. Streets ahead of the funding available at BL. No comparison at all.

Forest spent a fortune because of a hugely wealthy (some say dodgy) owner.

Ipswich I consider comparable but I don’t believe they use a DoF. They have a director of football opps who oversees the academy and women’s team but not the first team.

 

[Nick Jansky]

So much to unpick
A DoF doesn’t negate the revolving door of a new coach every 18 months. I fact it appears to shorten that cycle - but the DoF remains in post (what a surprise?)
All it does is shift the responsibility but no accountability since that remains with the coach.

Three of those you mentioned.
Brighton, Brentford, Bournemouth etc passed us by?
Smaller clubs?
You need to understand the level of investment they laid down to get to where they are. Streets ahead of the funding available at BL. No comparison at all.

Forest spent a fortune because of a hugely wealthy (some say dodgy) owner.

Ipswich I consider comparable but I don’t believe they use a DoF. They have a director of football opps who oversees the academy and women’s team but not the first team.

Wrong on two counts.

1. A DoF is absolutely accountable. They lose their jobs just as managers do. They are not immune from the sack.

2. Ipswich Town’s DoF does oversee first team affairs.

 

[The Fox]

Average in terms of what ?

For a start they are professional footballers playing in the championship. Thats a little above average.

If you look at championship level I'd say Cooper , Sereki , McCallum , Tangs , Blaster , Philips , Peck , CoH and Bamford are all above average Championship players.
Arguable about Burrows, Jairo , and both have above average championship ability but lack a bit of fitness / consistency.


We may have too many similar players but most mentioned would fit into a top 3rd championship squad which id say is above average .

Most teams at this level have very few outstanding players , were no different.

We've alot of the same , but individually not average .

 

[Sean Thornton]

Wrong on two counts.

1. A DoF is absolutely accountable. They lose their jobs just as managers do. They are not immune from the sack.

2. Ipswich Town’s DoF does oversee first team affairs.

Other than that though…….

 

[Borbokisfreekick]

If you’re happy with our recruitment set up and how we’re structured as a club then good for you. We’ll continue being mediocre and occasionally have a season in the top flight every 12-16 years.

Other clubs of a similar scale and size of us have moved with the times, whilst we still operate like it’s the mid 90’s.

Meanwhile we’ve completed wasted hundreds of millions of pounds and an opportunity to put in a modern recruitment and footballing structure that will set us up for the long term and protect us the next time Wilder gets sacked or we sell our best player.

So much to unpick
A DoF doesn’t negate the revolving door of a new coach every 18 months. I fact it appears to shorten that cycle - but the DoF remains in post (what a surprise?)
All it does is shift the responsibility but no accountability since that remains with the coach.

Three of those you mentioned.
Brighton, Brentford, Bournemouth etc passed us by?
Smaller clubs?
You need to understand the level of investment they laid down to get to where they are. Streets ahead of the funding available at BL. No comparison at all.

Forest spent a fortune because of a hugely wealthy (some say dodgy) owner.

Ipswich I consider comparable but I don’t believe they use a DoF. They have a director of football opps who oversees the academy and women’s team but not the first team.

 

[Kenilworth]

If you’re happy with our recruitment set up and how we’re structured as a club then good for you. We’ll continue being mediocre and occasionally have a season in the top flight every 12-16 years.

Other clubs of a similar scale and size of us have moved with the times, whilst we still operate like it’s the mid 90’s.

Meanwhile we’ve completed wasted hundreds of millions of pounds and an opportunity to put in a modern recruitment and footballing structure that will set us up for the long term and protect us the next time Wilder gets sacked or we sell our best player.

It needs greater investment than any owner we’ve had can afford.
Should the prince have spent what Wilder won on the recruitment side and not tried to improve the squad?
We know the Brewster money was a waste but that’s hindsight.
It’s not as though we’ve been in a position to spend what Florist and Sunlan did.
Should we have done what Norwich did?

 

[Borbokisfreekick]

It needs greater investment than any owner we’ve had can afford.
Should the prince have spent what Wilder won on the recruitment side and not tried to improve the squad?
We know the Brewster money was a waste but that’s hindsight.
It’s not as though we’ve been in a position to spend what Florist and Sunlan did.
Should we have done what Norwich did?

Those are fair questions, but back to my original point is that it doesn’t take that much money at all to restructure - put in a Dof/Technical Director and the recruitment team. Thats just standard salaries that don’t break the bank. A network of international scouts can be built via part time positions, basic salaries. I’ve seen it done at clubs with less turnover than us. I believe the club have put some investment in analytics already, so that is a positive.

Norwich are interesting, at least they have a top end training facility and Category 1 Academy to show for their time in the Premier League. And they look strong this year.

I understand the investment the likes of Brighton and Bournemouth have had. For me it’s more about actual footballing strategy that can help us over achieve with less and have a long term plan vs being reactive from window to window and manager to manager.

 

[Kenilworth]

Those are fair questions, but back to my original point is that it doesn’t take that much money at all to restructure - put in a Dof/Technical Director and the recruitment team. Thats just standard salaries that don’t break the bank. A network of international scouts can be built via part time positions, basic salaries. I’ve seen it done at clubs with less turnover than us. I believe the club have put some investment in analytics already, so that is a positive.

Norwich are interesting, at least they have a top end training facility and Category 1 Academy to show for their time in the Premier League. And they look strong this year.

I understand the investment the likes of Brighton and Bournemouth have had. For me it’s more about actual footballing strategy that can help us over achieve with less and have a long term plan vs being reactive from window to window and manager to manager.

I’m not averse to a different structure.
I’m far from convinced a DoF is appropriate for us at the moment because of the things you have stated. We need to commit to funding Cat 1 before that happens. Norwich spent a few more seasons in the PL than we did so their plan, given the extra coin they earned, may have been just that.

I do think that the identity of all clubs is becoming vanilla. And that’s not a good thing IMO. That’s the main risk to my mind. We lose all identity and then we’re just like the rest of the beige crew.

Being an exile the traditions of my club are important factors for me. My Sheffield roots, my home city, my team. The experience of going to the match is not just the 90 minutes or the result. It’s so much more than that. If that gets diluted and formulaic I will seriously consider leaving the fold.

I want us to be Sheffield United. I want us to be disrupters. I want us to represent the heart of the city, the courage in adversity, the fight to win, the doggedness of conviction, the hustle, the stamina, the elation when we score. I don’t want us to become Franchise FC because I’m not interested in clicks or likes or acknowledgement. Leave that shit to the other lot.

I don’t want us to be managed by a Russell Martin type. Mealy mouthed, formulaic, metrosexual, menstrual, meek and nesh. I want some fight and guts and determination. Yes, I’d like skill and speed and the winning feeling but those aren’t mutually exclusive.

The game has changed immeasurably over the last 30 years. If we’re not going to go the route of Man City (do we really want that?) then what do we want? Where do we want to be? Is the experience of Bournemouth and Brighton and Brentford as also rans in the top flight the goal? Ever present but never premium. Is it the panacea or just a purgatory?

 

[Borbokisfreekick]

I’m not averse to a different structure.
I’m far from convinced a DoF is appropriate for us at the moment because of the things you have stated. We need to commit to funding Cat 1 before that happens. Norwich spent a few more seasons in the PL than we did so their plan, given the extra coin they earned, may have been just that.

I do think that the identity of all clubs is becoming vanilla. And that’s not a good thing IMO. That’s the main risk to my mind. We lose all identity and then we’re just like the rest of the beige crew.

Being an exile the traditions of my club are important factors for me. My Sheffield roots, my home city, my team. The experience of going to the match is not just the 90 minutes or the result. It’s so much more than that. If that gets diluted and formulaic I will seriously consider leaving the fold.

I want us to be Sheffield United. I want us to be disrupters. I want us to represent the heart of the city, the courage in adversity, the fight to win, the doggedness of conviction, the hustle, the stamina, the elation when we score. I don’t want us to become Franchise FC because I’m not interested in clicks or likes or acknowledgement. Leave that shit to the other lot.

I don’t want us to be managed by a Russell Martin type. Mealy mouthed, formulaic, metrosexual, menstrual, meek and nesh. I want some fight and guts and determination. Yes, I’d like skill and speed and the winning feeling but those aren’t mutually exclusive.

The game has changed immeasurably over the last 30 years. If we’re not going to go the route of Man City (do we really want that?) then what do we want? Where do we want to be? Is the experience of Bournemouth and Brighton and Brentford as also rans in the top flight the goal? Ever present but never premium. Is it the panacea or just a purgatory?

Can’t disagree with any of that, good post.

Would fundamentally like an ownership group who care as much as the fans do and set the club up in a modern way that can sustain a “top 25 club” without losing its roots and identity.

I’d be happy with ever present in the top flight vs ever present in the championship! And why couldn’t we have that, and still have a club with a strong identity. But as you allude to, unfortunately the modern game means you probably need a billionaire owner just to get regular 16th to 8th place in the premier league.

 

[Slim Man]

What about chong? We've got Nils as well.
Suppose you'd want more Jefferson Cáceres', Christian Nwachukwu' and Simane's.
Not sure you automatically get more points for being diverse.

Slimane is Norwich's number 10 and had a really good season. He'd instantly improve us.

 

[FTPE]

Slimane is Norwich's number 10 and had a really good season. He'd instantly improve us.

What?! No he fucking wouldn't

 

[Slim Man]

What?! No he fucking wouldn't

Yeah, he definitely would. He had a better season than any of our midfielders last season.

 

[joe casey]

Yeah, he definitely would. He had a better season than any of our midfielders last season.

5 goals, 2 assists

Meanwhile...
Hamer: 5 goals, 13 assists
O'Hare: 8 goals, 8 assists
Peck: 5 goals, 4 assists
Brooks: 6 goals, 3 assists