Outgoing? Chris Wilder

[thehet]

Therein lies one of our previous problems. Both fans and previous owners have generally expected promotion in season 1 of a new manager's reign.

What is an acceptable timeframe is down to the owners. As fans we don't often give them time to truly build a good team and develop players because of the obsession with results.

Sometimes you have to sacrifice a season or two to give us a chance of going up and staying up.

And here you are, wanting yet another change of manager who started building a team at the beginning of the season.

 

[Tony_Kaufman]

And here you are, wanting yet another change of manager who started building a team at the beginning of the season.

It's the performances and lack of tactical nuance that bothers me with Wilder, not the results. The way he conducted himself off the pitch and at full time was often unprofessional and reflected badly on the club.

He may have been rebuilding this season but he kept putting square pegs in round holes as he picked a system and didn't sign players that suited them, nor picked a formation that suited some of those that he did.

His constant negative tactics in trying to defend 1-0 leads proved to be our ultimate downfall. He is a shadow of his former self and I can't see him changing his ways, he's too arrogant and stubborn. The club wants to become a modern club. Wilder is old school and stuck in his ways.

As for rebuilding I don't trust Wilder anymore as his track record with money is woeful and the only players he's signed who've left for profit is Ramsdale and Bogle. The rest were all losses or left for free at the end of their contracts.

For every Choudhury he's signed there's a Clarke.

We'll never agree on this and that's fine.

Personally I want change for the long term and I can accept not getting promoted if I see progress, see an improvement in players we've signed and see a better style of football along the way. I can handle buying players and selling them for significant profits as it's the only way to bankroll your transfer windows and maintain FFP in this division.

 

[blades_95]

They basically need to set out a project/vision and sell it and get buy in from whomever they consider most capable of delivering it. Which I think might be a team of people, not just a manager or head coach.

With this lot, I wouldn’t expect it to be back of a fag packet, short termist stuff. It won’t be all about next season, I have the feeling we’ll be moving beyond that.

Just my thoughts/hopes. But I think the next few years could be very interesting.

Great points Nick.

Overall we’ve had a very successful 8/9 years, and most of that is down to Wilder. The club was built around him & that showed when Slav came in - we were too ingrained in Wilder’s 5-3-2 and Hecky went back to this to make us successful again just with different players.

But a well run club shouldn’t be built around the manager. We need a clear strategy in playing style, recruitment, squad make up etc & that should be manager / head coach agnostic. We should then be consistent in the type of manager we want over the next few years.

We should be a very attractive proposition to managers, both here and in Europe. We have a very realistic chance for an ambitious manager to come in & build a strong squad, healthy budget, young players coming through - we’d have a LOT of interest beyond the usual unemployed British managers.

 

[Tony_Kaufman]

Great points Nick.

Overall we’ve had a very successful 8/9 years, and most of that is down to Wilder. The club was built around him & that showed when Slav came in - we were too ingrained in Wilder’s 5-3-2 and Hecky went back to this to make us successful again just with different players.

But a well run club shouldn’t be built around the manager. We need a clear strategy in playing style, recruitment, squad make up etc & that should be manager / head coach agnostic. We should then be consistent in the type of manager we want over the next few years.

We should be a very attractive proposition to managers, both here and in Europe. We have a very realistic chance for an ambitious manager to come in & build a strong squad, healthy budget, young players coming through - we’d have a LOT of interest beyond the usual unemployed British managers.

This is what American sports teams do. The general manager (aka Director of Football), deals with contracts, recruitment, retaining and releasing players. The coaches job is to find a system that suits what they have and plays to the players strengths. If the DoF was to bring in two pacey wingers then the coach would be expected to change whatever system they favoured to incorporate them. The coaches that don't are the ones who get sacked. This works really well in the NHL.

I'll maintain that this is why Sir Alex Ferguson was so successful at Man Utd. He wouldn't put Paul Scholes on the left wing and ask him to run at players like Ryan Giggs. If players got injured he would bring in a replacement and change the tactics/formation to suit them and play to their strengths, he wouldn't ask them to change the way they played to suit the formation and tactics. This is why he won his final Premier League title with arguably one of his weakest teams. The only time I can recall him not doing this was against Bayern Munich in the European Final where he put square pegs in round holes. But his late subs saw everyone back in their natural positions and the rest is history.

 

[Dkc]

If the meeting with ownership is legit and his job is up for discussion I’d imagine whether he keeps it or not will come down to whether he’s capable of being humble and genuinely self scouting what went wrong the 2nd half of this year.

As mentioned on other threads, this is not a credible source.

 

[Bladesince61]

I went to Wembley yet again and I was more disappointed than I’ve ever been because I thought we’d done enough to win the game before a combination of badly timed injuries and mistakes cost us.
Most of the fans that you claim deserved Chris Wilders respect and applause were disappearing for the exits as fast as humanly possible on the final whistle. Most of them had also spent the second half quiet and nervous rather than getting right behind the team and trying to lift them.
It was not the time for us to stay around for a mutual hug … Wilder along with every other Blade in the stadium was simply too devastated to think straight.
To read that he somehow disrespected us in that moment is utterly laughable. For that criticism to come from somebody who contributed to the empty seats is even more so.
Our minibus had 12 fans in it … not one of us even thought about whether the manager had applauded us. The drive home was mostly silent and sad.
Every one of us will be back next season hoping to see Wilder continue the rebuild of our club - knowing that he understands our pain that day better than any other manager could.
If you’re going to criticise - maybe go and support them first eh?
“Quitting and leaving your team alone to face a difficult time is unforgivable”
I guess you would know.

Absolutely spot on. I should have stayed at the end and applauded the players for the season they gave us but I didn't. Just wanted to get out. God knows how Wilder must have felt.

 

[Blade56]

You might well think that, however you are a self proclaimed clown, are you not?

?

 

[Ldn_Rd_Blades]

I’d be happy if wilder stays but if COH want their man in with a new, modern recruitment system I’m all for it.

 

[TJ blade]

I’d be happy if wilder stays but if COH want their man in with a new, modern recruitment system I’m all for it.

Is it just a rumour about Wilder, or is there more to it? In my opinion if there's truth in it, could be down to 3 things with him. 1. He got us to third and collapsed at the final hurdle. 2. The ill fated January window, bringing in Cannon who looked lost, & Holding hardly played but would probably be on a decent wedge! & finally number 3. Which might be the noose round his neck, the fines on & off the pitch bringing him and the club into an embarrassing situation!

 

[LondonBlade89]

This is what American sports teams do. The general manager (aka Director of Football), deals with contracts, recruitment, retaining and releasing players. The coaches job is to find a system that suits what they have and plays to the players strengths. If the DoF was to bring in two pacey wingers then the coach would be expected to change whatever system they favoured to incorporate them. The coaches that don't are the ones who get sacked. This works really well in the NHL.

I think this is a bit of a mischaracterisation, at least in the sport I know well (NFL), where the best teams make player decisions which are based not only on the views of the GM but the coaching staff too. From memory I feel like you frequent the NFL thread too, so I’m sure I’m not saying anything new, but I feel strongly that it’s not a good or even standard setup when the GM is forcing players on a HC who needs to work things out accordingly.

 

[finlaytheblade]

I’m not a Wilder fan but I think get rid of him at our peril. The only person I’d want would be Cooper but I suspect he thinks he can hold out for a better job. I’m wary of appointing someone who doesn’t understand the division and has a philosophy but won’t put that aside to do what it takes to win football matches.

Wilder is not thick. He wants to be a Premier League manager again and must surely know that this is his last realistic opportunity. No Premier League club will hire him. We are in the last year of parachute payments. For him it’s now or never.

People say he’s stubborn and arrogant. I think he’s achieved incredible things in his managerial career (what he did at Northampton is incredible). He’s experienced and knows what works and what he wants. Sticking to your guns isn’t necessarily a bad thing. A bit like Warnock who went back to Webber and Shipperley after signing Horsefield and Akinbiyi.

I read Kevin McCabe’s book and took note of Bassett’s comments. I’m concerned about appointing someone who’s trendy and interviews well but doesn’t know how to win in the Championship.

Wilder obviously cares about the club. I think get rid of him and we’ll all miss having a manager that wants to be here.

The new ownership is great in so far as intial impressions are that they will invest and seemingly care about the club based on the few public statements they’ve made. They have expertise in the health industry, real estate and films. My concern is there’s no football brain advising them and Bettis is not that man.

Wilder rebuilt the side. I’m worried we are heading for a Jokanivic type who wants to play continental style that our squad is not wired to play.

On a bigger picture, I question if this is really what us as all want? I look at some Premier League clubs and think ‘If I was a fan would I care?’

Wilder will here next season.
Maliciouse rumours ! That's all they are!.

 

[ancientblade]

It's the performances and lack of tactical nuance that bothers me with Wilder, not the results. The way he conducted himself off the pitch and at full time was often unprofessional and reflected badly on the club.

He may have been rebuilding this season but he kept putting square pegs in round holes as he picked a system and didn't sign players that suited them, nor picked a formation that suited some of those that he did.

His constant negative tactics in trying to defend 1-0 leads proved to be our ultimate downfall. He is a shadow of his former self and I can't see him changing his ways, he's too arrogant and stubborn. The club wants to become a modern club. Wilder is old school and stuck in his ways.

As for rebuilding I don't trust Wilder anymore as his track record with money is woeful and the only players he's signed who've left for profit is Ramsdale and Bogle. The rest were all losses or left for free at the end of their contracts.

For every Choudhury he's signed there's a Clarke.

We'll never agree on this and that's fine.

Personally I want change for the long term and I can accept not getting promoted if I see progress, see an improvement in players we've signed and see a better style of football along the way. I can handle buying players and selling them for significant profits as it's the only way to bankroll your transfer windows and maintain FFP in this division.

youve said in that post everything im thinking as well and without getting carried away by pigmania about wilders off field antics it is embarrasing for the club and the club need to curb him with this behaviour if hes kept in charge but i do think its time for a change of culture at the lane know it didnt work with slav but that doesnt mean it wont work this time round i honestly think the poor atmosphere at the lane this season is because of the slow sideways backwards football weve been dished up oh for the gung ho attacking football of wilder 9 years ago

 

[Ldn_Rd_Blades]

Is it just a rumour about Wilder, or is there more to it? In my opinion if there's truth in it, could be down to 3 things with him. 1. He got us to third and collapsed at the final hurdle. 2. The ill fated January window, bringing in Cannon who looked lost, & Holding hardly played but would probably be on a decent wedge! & finally number 3. Which might be the noose round his neck, the fines on & off the pitch bringing him and the club into an embarrassing situation!

Or 4. He’s an old school manger and the are looking for a modern first team coach.

 

[Tony_Kaufman]

I think this is a bit of a mischaracterisation, at least in the sport I know well (NFL), where the best teams make player decisions which are based not only on the views of the GM but the coaching staff too. From memory I feel like you frequent the NFL thread too, so I’m sure I’m not saying anything new, but I feel strongly that it’s not a good or even standard setup when the GM is forcing players on a HC who needs to work things out accordingly.

I meant to only comment on NHL as I don't follow the NFL, NBA or MLB so I didn't want to assume that it works the same way in those sports.

 

[BornOnShorehamStreet]

?

Presumably a reference to your avatar. Hope that's all it is ...

 

[MartBlade]

You fail to mention that the football can be boring to watch.
Leeds and Burnley attacked with pace and were far better than us for it.
Even Sunderland attacked with pace while we pass it sideways or backwards giving teams time to get everyone back.
We know what's going to happen if we go 1-0 up we drop deeper and deeper as we did against Sunderland instead of going for the kill. His substitutions at times can be really baffling and tend to support the fact we tend do tend to drop deep to try and hang on to 1-0.
Then there is his antics in bars singing about rival managers which at the very least is embarrassing and cringe worthy.

I agree that the football has been boring at times… but I put that in the context of t of a lot of teams that have needed to tighten up maybe getting a bit too cautious. I certainly don’t think it’s Wilders natural approach. I also agree that we dropped too deep too early but then my wife tells me that the pundits on tv were saying that we were doing everything right and not giving Sunderland a way back.
Antics in bars? Yep - cringeworthy sometimes but I’m never going to judge anybody for having one too many and getting carried away with the lads. He’s human, he’s a Blade and you don’t have to be Mr Professional for 100% of your life. If it bites him occasionally with criticism from the likes of Bannan, I don’t see a huge problem. I’d far rather have a manager with some personality than a Frank Lampard type who is simply uninspiring.
Subs do baffle me sometimes too.
You’re right on a number of those points but in my view he is still our best option by a million miles at this stage.
If the owners prove to have a huge amount of wealth to spend then I think there are some decent options out there…. but as yet we don’t know so I’d rather stick than twist.

 

[TJ blade]

Or 4. He’s an old school manger and the are looking for a modern first team coach.

Think I might go with that one

 

[Aston max]

Its not helping that some on here are falling out to early lets all wait for next week before we get the knives and personal insults out ,
Its not a unknown fact I'm in the Wilder out side of the fence .
The one thing I've learnt about top Americans doing business they have 3/ 4 plans of action in case one doesn’t work out , I suspect they'll have already targeted his replacement, just bare in mind des Taylors involvement will have produced reams of reports about wilder since January and probably before !!

 

[Blade56]

I'm in the Wilder out side of the fence

I’ve heard rumours about you fence sides antics matey.

 

[Upton_Blade]

Thank you for giving me a proper answer. I'm slightly confused about whether or not you really do want a new manager, though, as you finish by saying that you'd like to see a change in direction, but earlier you say "I honestly don't want anyone else managing my club"? Either way, it's nice to see someone able to talk about potentially changing managers, whilst still appreciating what CW has done for us.

Honestly it's because I'd truly love to have the "old" CW back so in that sense I don't want to see anyone else managing my club. The reality is that I don't think that version of CW exists anymore. The performances this season sort of prove that point.

Based on that I think it's time for a change.

 

[Calistros]

It was a great points tally and of course you can only play what's in front of you but...
Aside from Leeds and Burnley the league was pretty poor this season. We beat most of those teams without really playing well.
Just playing devil's advocate.

I’m

Is it just a rumour about Wilder, or is there more to it? In my opinion if there's truth in it, could be down to 3 things with him. 1. He got us to third and collapsed at the final hurdle. 2. The ill fated January window, bringing in Cannon who looked lost, & Holding hardly played but would probably be on a decent wedge! & finally number 3. Which might be the noose round his neck, the fines on & off the pitch bringing him and the club into an embarrassing situation!

 

[utd4ever]

He will no doubt be here next season.

I think no matter who owns us we are stuck with the keep it local shite.

 

[ThirdGenBlade]

Emotional chatter about Wilder in or Wilder out is totally blinkered. When you run a business you always look to improve - if you don’t go forwards, you’re going backwards - no such thing as standing still.

Wilder has been a huge positive input for this club - but professional business management from the board should always be considering how they can do better.

However, you DO NOT remove Wilder before you already have somebody that you believe can move you forwards better than Wilder.

If the board remove Wilder without an informal agreement with somebody that they believe will deliver better outcomes they are showing business incompetence.

If the board are not permanently looking for a better replacement for Wilder they are showing business incompetence.

When I look at our board’s histories, to a man they are business- competent.

UTB & FTP!

 

[Frank the tank]

I’m

Post of the year

 

[Blade56]

I think no matter who owns us we are stuck with the keep it local shite.

 

[thehet]

Emotional chatter about Wilder in or Wilder out is totally blinkered. When you run a business you always look to improve - if you don’t go forwards, you’re going backwards - no such thing as standing still.

Wilder has been a huge positive input for this club - but professional business management from the board should always be considering how they can do better.

However, you DO NOT remove Wilder before you already have somebody that you believe can move you forwards better than Wilder.

If the board remove Wilder without an informal agreement with somebody that they believe will deliver better outcomes they are showing business incompetence.

If the board are not permanently looking for a better replacement for Wilder they are showing business incompetence.

When I look at our board’s histories, to a man they are business- competent.

UTB & FTP!

I agree, however many on here only have “young and foreign” as the criteria required to be better than Wilder.

Piglets I presume.

 

[Nick Jansky]

I agree, however many on here only have “young and foreign” as the criteria required to be better than Wilder.

Piglets I presume.

Do they? Who has stated they only have that criteria? Not sure I’ve seen it anywhere?

 

[Sean Thornton]

Do they? Who has stated they only have that criteria? Not sure I’ve seen it anywhere?

You hater you……….

 

[Aston max]

View attachment 212303

Are you bored with it all as well mate ??
I'm just sat making memes and gifs whilst my missus is watching BGT

 

[LondonBlade89]

Emotional chatter about Wilder in or Wilder out is totally blinkered. When you run a business you always look to improve - if you don’t go forwards, you’re going backwards - no such thing as standing still.

Wilder has been a huge positive input for this club - but professional business management from the board should always be considering how they can do better.

However, you DO NOT remove Wilder before you already have somebody that you believe can move you forwards better than Wilder.

If the board remove Wilder without an informal agreement with somebody that they believe will deliver better outcomes they are showing business incompetence.

If the board are not permanently looking for a better replacement for Wilder they are showing business incompetence.

When I look at our board’s histories, to a man they are business- competent.

UTB & FTP!

I don’t think anyone is advocating for Wilder to be binned with absolutely zero replacement in mind.