Outgoing? Chris Wilder

[54yrblade]

No great manager does. It's a total myth that they do. A top manager never gives his players a public 'out'. You don't do that or you create an excuse culture and undermine your own authority. Managers also need a big ego. It's a prerequisite for a top manager.

A small proportion of our fanbase wants an ego massage where the manager says "I got the lineup/firmation wrong today, xyz on twatter called it right". Never going to happen. If it does be very afraid. I'd love to see all these examples of Klopp, Mourinho, Pep, Shankly, B Clough, Ferguson etc etc blaming themselves for defeats. Bassett, Warnock, and Harris will do...

He isn't a great or top manager
He is but comparatively only, in this city.

If he was we'd be £170 million better off, setting sat navs for Liverpool, had he had the tactical nous, bought decent strikers and marshalled the defence properly to finish the job off

No top manager throws his players under the bus and 'not me guv'

If a manager wins - its on the team
Lose - take responsibility for it and deal with the players in private

That's leadership

 

[Aston max]

Looks like a fair few need to decide if they support Sheffield United or Chris Wilder.

 

[Aston max]

 

[Danetheblade]

Or league 1

it's actually scary how folk seem to think we'll end up in the national league if a washed up manager gets the sack.

 

[UTB Blade]

Sorry what? Sacking a manager who achieved 92 points because it’s seen as a failure is the epitome of short term thinking.

We hardly had a team at the end of last season.

All of a sudden we’re happy to accept maybe an 8th place finish because of some long term claptrap.

The forum is nuts.

Indeed. I read a stunning example of the long-term nonsense people come out with on this forum, yesterday - the gist of it was:

"I think we should replace a proven, successful manager, with one who'll likely take us backwards, but if we're patient in persisting with him, and wait long enough, he might actually get us back to where we started."

Genius

 

[Le Cynique]

By cycle you mean promotion and relegation? Do you know how many sides would LOVE to have played in the top flight as long as we have?
We all want to be a Brighton or a Brentford, but there's a lot of similar size clubs that would LOVE to be a United.

The cycle of treading water. The fact that other clubs would love to be in our position is absolutely not a valid reason for us to settle for it. We have to be thinking bigger, of how we can get to the next level, all the time. I hope that our owners are more hungry for building the stature of the club than some of our rather parochial-thinking fans.

 

[S64 Blade]

Believe it or not, like it not, the points total was achieved due to, the tactical approach, the recruitment, the team selection etc that you talk of.

“Boring” Burnley ground out far more results than we did over the course of the season, are they sacking Parker?

Can you please go back and take a look at the squad we had prior to signing anybody.

If Wilder goes, what is your measure for success for whoever is his replacement? Pretty football? Let’s be like Swansea.
Promotion at all costs? Let’s blow the bank like Leeds.
It’s all cake and eat it, and it’s bollocks.

Boring Burnley got promoted and didn’t bottle it.

They also had a big rebuild. They beat us twice. They scored more goals than us and conceded fewer.

 

[thehet]

Boring Burnley got promoted and didn’t bottle it.

They also had a big rebuild. They beat us twice. They scored more goals than us and conceded fewer.

Indeed.

So, which manager is going to come in, bring in 7 or 8 new players, with a new style of play, probably not fancy some of the current players, and achieve an equal or better points tally to get promoted, to stop you and the others having to repeat yourselves next May.

 

[Danetheblade]

Indeed.

So, which manager is going to come in, bring in 7 or 8 new players, with a new style of play, probably not fancy some of the current players, and achieve an equal or better points tally to get promoted, to stop you and the others having to repeat yourselves next May.

I dunno (I mean, plenty of folks have given various managers to pick from) but I'd settle on one that hasn't got a me me me complex. preferably is able to play a good brand of football not something akin to Buxton Town vs Spurs in the cup.

 

[thehet]

I dunno (I mean, plenty of folks have given various managers to pick from) but I'd settle on one that hasn't got a me me me complex. preferably is able to play a good brand of football not something akin to Buxton Town vs Spurs in the cup.

A good brand of football like Burnley? Or Sunderland even?

As for the names that have been offered up, Dyche and Southgate probably wouldn’t fit your taste for a good brand of football … they might achieve 93 points though………….

 

[Danetheblade]

A good brand of football like Burnley? Or Sunderland even?

Are we talking about the Burnley that took the piss out the league whilst gaining clean sheet after clean sheet? Or that Sunderland that took the piss out of us? It's that Sunderland with a progressive manager able to actually impact games outside throwing bodies on the pitch whilst praying right?

 

[nopigfansintown]

He isn't a great or top manager
He is but comparatively only, in this city.

If he was we'd be £170 million better off, setting sat navs for Liverpool, had he had the tactical nous, bought decent strikers and marshalled the defence properly to finish the job off

No top manager throws his players under the and goes hands off.

If a manager wins - its on the team
Lose - take responsibility for it and deal with the players in private

That's leadership

So because you aren't one of the universally accepted top managers you shouldn't manage like them? Totally disagree. You should be learning from them and implementing their methods. If you create an excuse culture the players are managing the club. Terrible idea.

The reason we were even in contention is down to Wilder. Despite the revisionism on here very few posters had us challenging for top two.

Managers blame their players for results every single week. Are you new to this sport?

The managers blame the strikers for not scoring, the defenders for not defending, the referee, the linesman. Very rarely themselves. They use phrases like "collective responsibility", "we win together and we lose together", "individual errors". It's extremely rare to see them come out and say "that was all my fault not the players".

They're not wrong either. Elite athletes are capable of motivating themselves and playing successfully in multiple formations. Our team, for example, were more than capable of beating Sunderland.

 

[paidsy]

Wilder hasn't had a successful season since 2020. We failed to go up this year bottling top 2 and mega bottling a final when in absolute control due to him repeating failures of the past.

 

[thehet]

Are we talking about the Burnley that took the piss out the league whilst gaining clean sheet after clean sheet? Or that Sunderland that took the piss out of us? It's that Sunderland with a progressive manager able to actually impact games outside throwing bodies on the pitch whilst praying right?

The Burnley that the league took the piss out of for being boring and the Sunderland that lost 5 in a row and were, in most people’s opinions absolutely woeful in all 3 playoff games yes.

Make your mind up on what your issue is.

 

[nopigfansintown]

A good brand of football like Burnley? Or Sunderland even?

As for the names that have been offered up, Dyche and Southgate probably wouldn’t fit your taste for a good brand of football … they might achieve 93 points though………….

The style of football thing is a bit of a myth. Whilst ever we, Burnley, Sunderland whoever are big hitters in this league teams will set up to bore us to death. Low block, narrow, break us down if you can. Even the top teams did exactly that when they came to the Lane. It could change but that is likely to coincide with us being shit. Southampton, Leicester, Sunderland, Burnley fans have all moaned like fuck about their style of play.

 

[Danetheblade]

The Burnley that the league took the piss out of for being boring and the Sunderland that lost 5 in a row and were, in most people’s opinions absolutely woeful in all 3 playoff games yes.

Make your mind up on what your issue is.

Yet still got promoted, and beat us both times. They might have lost five in a row, who were they against? Did they lose three in a row to two teams in the bottom half (one literally rock bottom) and the other in and around the playoffs? Woeful in all three? I'd say they were woeful in the semis. They had a manager with the tactical nous to actually change things against us.

You know what my issue is

 

[nopigfansintown]

The Burnley that the league took the piss out of for being boring and the Sunderland that lost 5 in a row and were, in most people’s opinions absolutely woeful in all 3 playoff games yes.

Make your mind up on what your issue is.

A lot of Sunderland fans wanted the bright young thing managing them sacked months ago.

 

[Younger Dryas Blade]

Sorry what? Sacking a manager who achieved 92 points because it’s seen as a failure is the epitome of short term thinking.

We hardly had a team at the end of last season.

All of a sudden we’re happy to accept maybe an 8th place finish because of some long term claptrap.

The forum is nuts.

The re-build was under Abdullah. Credit to him and CW for getting the players in but maybe the new owners expected that a team in the top 2 for the majority of the season should go up as pretty much we all did.
They extended CW contract as his deal was only to the end of the season, they dangled the carrot to motivate him and erase doubt and provide some security.
They probably don't give a rats ass how many points we got since we kick off next season in the EFL, they will view this as failing the set objective. They are here to operate in the EPL.
They probably see the squad as being better than 3rd place and the lack of XG and expansive attacking football is way below par for the talent we have.
They probably think spending £10m on Tom Cannon should have yielded the goals to get us over the line. I doubt they are thrilled with his one goal contribution.
They probably think that conceding 12 points to Leeds and Burnley is unacceptable.
They probably saw Wilder engaging in fan baiting at Plymouth after throwing away the auto's as very unprofessional.
They maybe think Wilder getting pissed and standing on a chair singing mind the gap Sheffield Wednesday as very unprofessional.
They probably watched in disbelieve how we managed to throw away the Play off final and maybe asking questions regarding Wilder's subs (that can be said about many games throughout the season).

 

[paidsy]

The Burnley that the league took the piss out of for being boring and the Sunderland that lost 5 in a row and were, in most people’s opinions absolutely woeful in all 3 playoff games yes.

Make your mind up on what your issue is.

We lost 4 out of 5 against those 2 sides. Probably shouldn't be throwing stones in those directions I'd say.

 

[54yrblade]

So because you aren't one of the universally accepted top managers you shouldn't manage like them? Totally disagree. You should be learning from them and implementing their methods. If you create an excuse culture the players are managing the club. Terrible idea.

The reason we were even in contention is down to Wilder. Despite the revisionism on here very few posters had us challenging for top two.

Managers blame their players for results every single week. Are you new to this sport?

The managers blame the strikers for not scoring, the defenders for not defending, the referee, the linesman. Very rarely themselves. They use phrases like "collective responsibility", "we win together and we lose together", "individual errors". It's extremely rare to see them come out and say "that was all my fault not the players".

They're not wrong either. Elite athletes are capable of motivating themselves and playing successfully in multiple formations. Our team, for example, were more than capable of beating Sunderland.

We didn't. They proved utterly unable to self motivate and do better, because they can't and Wilder failed to get it and other games over the line.

'Are you new to the sport?' Check out my name on here my friend. 40 yrs of management in a range of industries too. If he worked in any of them he would have been disciplined after his post Wednesday match performances and potentially out the door already.

Hopefully the new owners bring in standards and expectations fitting for a potential PL club.

 

[thehet]

Yet still got promoted, and beat us both times. They might have lost five in a row, who were they against? Did they lose three in a row to two teams in the bottom half (one literally rock bottom) and the other in and around the playoffs? Woeful in all three? I'd say they were woeful in the semis. They had a manager with the tactical nous to actually change things against us.

You know what my issue is

We could and on another day would have been 4-0 up before they scored.

Coulda shoulda woulda of course.

We lost a one-off game.
We were the third best team in the league over 46 games by a huge margin.

I am not Wilder’s biggest fan, but mark my words, if we replace him we will not better our points tally next year. So you better hope we make it into the playoffs with whatever swashbuckler comes in.

 

[thehet]

We lost 4 out of 5 against those 2 sides. Probably shouldn't be throwing stones in those directions I'd say.

Doesn’t make what I said not true.

 

[paidsy]

We could and on another day would have been 4-0 up before they scored.

Coulda shoulda woulda of course.

We lost a one-off game.
We were the third best team in the league over 46 games by a huge margin.

I am not Wilder’s biggest fan, but mark my words, if we replace him we will not better our points tally next year. So you better hope we make it into the playoffs with whatever swashbuckler comes in.

And we lost a one off game we controlled because Wilder clearly cannot or will not learn from his mistakes. We lost a game the opposition were never in, not for the 1st/2nd/3rd time this season either.

 

[thehet]

The re-build was under Abdullah. Credit to him and CW for getting the players in but maybe the new owners expected that a team in the top 2 for the majority of the season should go up as pretty much we all did.
They extended CW contract as his deal was only to the end of the season, they dangled the carrot to motivate him and erase doubt and provide some security.
They probably don't give a rats ass how many points we got since we kick off next season in the EFL, they will view this as failing the set objective. They are here to operate in the EPL.
They probably see the squad as being better than 3rd place and the lack of XG and expansive attacking football is way below par for the talent we have.
They probably think spending £10m on Tom Cannon should have yielded the goals to get us over the line. I doubt they are thrilled with his one goal contribution.
They probably think that conceding 12 points to Leeds and Burnley is unacceptable.
They probably saw Wilder engaging in fan baiting at Plymouth after throwing away the auto's as very unprofessional.
They maybe think Wilder getting pissed and standing on a chair singing mind the gap Sheffield Wednesday as very unprofessional.
They probably watched in disbelieve how we managed to throw away the Play off final and maybe asking questions regarding Wilder's subs (that can be said about many games throughout the season).

More claptrap. They extended his deal. Jokes on them.

 

[UTB Blade]

... (That manager that slagged the club, fans and every single aspect of the club off before fucking off out the fire exit).
...

Ah, so now we get to the nub of it. You don't want to get rid of Wilder and replace him with someone else because you think we'll get a better manager, you just can't stop blubbing your eyes out like a teenage girl who's been dumped, because of the way he left last time. Maybe try growing a little bit, as a person, instead of letting the bitterness eat you up.

 

[Danetheblade]

We could and on another day would have been 4-0 up before they scored.

Coulda shoulda woulda of course.

We lost a one-off game.
We were the third best team in the league over 46 games by a huge margin.

I am not Wilder’s biggest fan, but mark my words, if we replace him we will not better our points tally next year. So you better hope we make it into the playoffs with whatever swashbuckler comes in.

"could"

we could've been up automatically if Wilder hadn't insisted on not changing the glaringly obvious issue during those three defeats. "third best team in the league" - that counts for absolutely nothing when we failed to gain promotion. If anything that only works against him when the owners sit down to decide his fate.

I get that. Though I think with a fresh manager/team, and fresh ideas, I see no reason why promotion wouldn't be achievable.

 

[nopigfansintown]

We didn't. They proved utterly unable to self motivate and do better, because they can't and Wilder failed to get it and other games over the line.

'Are you new to the sport?' Check out my name on here my friend. 40 yrs of management in a range of industries too. If he worked in any of them he would have been disciplined after his post Wednesday match performances and potentially out the door already.

Hopefully the new owners bring in standards and expectations fitting for a potential PL club.

Get better players then - better characters. I'm actually of the opposite opinion: they did great and we had an excellent season.
Congratulations to the manager and the players for that .

You'd have thrown the baby out with the bath water and shown a huge amount of naiveté there. A school boy error as it were.

Football isn't any other industry. It's unique. Wilder's behaviour is perfect for a football club. Galvanising and motivating.

 

[Danetheblade]

Ah, so now we get to the nub of it. You don't want to get rid of Wilder and replace him with someone else because you think we'll get a better manager, you just can't stop blubbing your eyes out like a teenage girl who's been dumped, because of the way he left last time. Maybe try growing a little bit, as a person, instead of letting the bitterness eat you up.

Deluded. Deluded to the hilt and back. I want to get rid of Wilder, cause he's a poor manager (as evidenced this season) he's a manager who's lost his mojo, hasn't got a clue about setting a team up to attack proficiently, relies on moments of individual brilliance. Hasn't got a clue when it comes to tactical decisions during key points in games.

I've named several managers who have those attributes, I think it's yourself that needs to be reaching for the Kleenex mate. Don't be sad that it's over, be happy it happened

 

[thehet]

"could"

we could've been up automatically if Wilder hadn't insisted on not changing the glaringly obvious issue during those three defeats. "third best team in the league" - that counts for absolutely nothing when we failed to gain promotion. If anything that only works against him when the owners sit down to decide his fate.

I get that. Though I think with a fresh manager/team, and fresh ideas, I see no reason why promotion wouldn't be achievable.

What happens when two other teams achieve 100points next year?

 

[Danetheblade]

What happens when two other teams achieve 100points next year?

Then I'll bare my arse on the town hall steps (whilst praying we get 101).

All if, buts and maybes.