Joe Ashton in The Star

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felix

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Disillusioned Owls and Blades fans may be but I doubt they are ready for this plan put forward by Joe Ashton and reported this evening by Martin Smith in The Star.

Another year over, another 12 months of football mediocrity to forget.
Sheffield, a city of half a million people, the cradle of the game as we know it and we’re miles behind.

Miles behind places like Southampton, Swansea, Hull, Stoke, Newcastle, Norwich and Sunderland. All technically smaller cities and all supporting Premiership teams.
But Sheffield, sad though it is to admit, is not big enough to fund, support or maintain two Premier League teams.

So it’s time, once again, to speak of the unmentionable. Not an idea dreamed up on the Star’s Christmas do or even one from our much-venerated Wishful Thinking Department.

This time it’s from former Wednesday director Joe Ashton.

Joe, now in his eighties but still a fan and teller of glorious tales, reckons it’s time to merge. The former Bassetlaw MP, playwright, national newspaper columnist and scourge of Thatcherites believes that only radical surgery can save the ailing patient that is Sheffield football.

“The fans are sick of it now, both sets,” said Joe.

“We’ve had to put up with rubbish for years and I think the majority of Sheffielders would get behind one team. People realise that we’re never going to get anywhere with two teams and that Sheffield is missing out on the big time. If you want to be in the Premier League you have to get a city behind the team. Wait until both teams are out of the FA Cup and then ask the fans when they’ve nowt to play for except survival.

“I also think a combined team could play at Bramall Lane or Hillsborough - not the Hillsborough ground as it is now, that will always be associated with the disaster that claimed 96 lives. They should knock it down and build a new, modern ground with a suitable memorial.

“Kevin McCabe has been trying to sell United for years and Mandaric is the same at Wednesday. If the two clubs were to combine, get the city right behind them then they could attract some big money from overseas investors, I’m sure of it.”

It’s controversial but it has logic.

Are Sheffield’s football fans ready for one team or are tribal loyalties still more important than a better chance of success?


Of course tribal loyalties are important but it's a shame to see Sheffield's two teams doing so badly. Once upon a time both Wednesday and United were established First Division clubs but even so neither of them has been a contender for the League Championship for about 100 years.

Imagine it, folks, Sheffield City Deedahs: top of the Premier League. Eh? If Hayes and Yeading could get together, why can't the Owls and Blades? And there's a ready-made nickname, the Pigs, as both sides are already lovingly referred to by their rivals.

Come on Yooo Piggies!
 

When you merge with Exeter we'll give it some consideration.
 
Of course it won't happen. The washed-up Ashton (used to see him in my local, surprised drink hasn't killed him) is just one of Wendy's in-house, failed Labour politicos. (Betts, Blunkett and Hattersley) are others.

So we have a failing local 'newspaper', a flop of an MP wanting to be seen 'in the news' and the result is a non-story which rears it's head every so often.

Can see why it would appeal to Wendy, though. That death-trap, rusting shit hole of a ground has a pitch which floods if a black cloud goes over.
 
I think such a move would lead to a lot of die hards who put up with all the crap never going again. The support of Sheffield FC would swell. Two half arsed attempts at forming FC Wendy and FC Blades would be attempted. A passive support could develop from the South Yorkshire region but they would be quick to come and go.

One thing is for sure, a new neutral ground is a must for any such venture. I couldn't contemplate watching a merged team at Hillsborough. An innovative new ground that actually keeps an atmosphere in and would have an massive kop would also be a planning necessity that I don't think anyone involved would get right. If the home was a soulless bowl then I'll become an armchair fan (possibly not of the merged team).
 
I'd rather watch Sheffield F.C.

Why would United want to merge with a club that's about to have it's arse burned over a non-existent safety certificate?
 
Joe, now in his eighties but still a fan and teller of glorious tales, reckons it’s time to merge. The former Bassetlaw MP, playwright, national newspaper columnist and scourge of Thatcherites and attention seeking wanker who needs some attention as he has vanished from the news and cant get it up anymore.
 
For me, exiled in Leeds since 1969, there would be nothing to come home for any more so it would be goodbye Sheffield for me.

I'd probably go and watch Guiseley

Same for me except my mum still lives in Sheffield and I wouldn't watch Guiseley.

I support United and frustrating as they are, I always will.

Joe Ashton should be consigned to the twats thread.

UTB
 
This old chestnut assumes that you would be able to simply add their attendance to ours and therefore we'd have loads of fans and be rich, but I honestly don't think a combined club in Sheffield would get many more than 30,000 a week.

Look at the way football is going. Nobody cares about fans any longer. It is cheaper to sit and watch the big teams from the comfort of your own armchair, there's no incentive for a fan to go to a game any more. The type of plastic fan that would adopt a brand new team with no history or heritage will be just as likely to support Man Ure. The real fans that go to games out of a twisted and perverse sense of loyalty will be totally alienated by a move like that.

I'm sure that in time, as the kids grow up and they are more used to it than the older generation, attendances would grow. But I can't see them getting to 50,000. Football fans are fickle. You only sell out a stadium when you're in the top flight and winning things. The success has to come first, not the crowds. Newcastle were averaging 50,000 and then they went down. They lost 8,000 fans for their Championship season and it is only just recovering now. Can you imagine how many more they'd have lost had they not gone straight back up?

But we wouldn't be like Newcastle anyway, because we've always had two teams. The mentality is just different. There is no desire to all get behind one team as a city, because it's never been like that. You're not going to change that overnight.
 
I agree wholeheartedly with "They should knock it down". The rest of it is nonsense. Especially as all of those towns are smaller than Sheffield (some half the size) and not long ago several of them were where we are now.
 
This old chestnut assumes that you would be able to simply add their attendance to ours and therefore we'd have loads of fans and be rich, but I honestly don't think a combined club in Sheffield would get many more than 30,000 a week.

Look at the way football is going. Nobody cares about fans any longer. It is cheaper to sit and watch the big teams from the comfort of your own armchair, there's no incentive for a fan to go to a game any more. The type of plastic fan that would adopt a brand new team with no history or heritage will be just as likely to support Man Ure. The real fans that go to games out of a twisted and perverse sense of loyalty will be totally alienated by a move like that.

I'm sure that in time, as the kids grow up and they are more used to it than the older generation, attendances would grow. But I can't see them getting to 50,000. Football fans are fickle. You only sell out a stadium when you're in the top flight and winning things. The success has to come first, not the crowds. Newcastle were averaging 50,000 and then they went down. They lost 8,000 fans for their Championship season and it is only just recovering now. Can you imagine how many more they'd have lost had they not gone straight back up?

But we wouldn't be like Newcastle anyway, because we've always had two teams. The mentality is just different. There is no desire to all get behind one team as a city, because it's never been like that. You're not going to change that overnight.


Indeed. It's amazing the power of sentiment. Bristol is an even more stark example. Here we have the 7th biggest city in England with 2 teams who between them have only had 4 years in the top flight (City 1976-80) in the last 80ish years and where neither team has ever won anything. Common sense would suggest the city should have just one club, but I bet the City and Rovers fans say exactly what United and Wednesday fans say whenever the talk of merger comes up.
 

every time they trot out this argument i trot out my counter argument
just because you have more fans doesn't automatically mean that you 'll have a successful team on the pitch. if us and the pigs were in the prem we'd 'both' be getting 30k+ crowds in every week
 
“Kevin McCabe has been trying to sell United for years and Mandaric is the same at Wednesday. If the two clubs were to combine, get the city right behind them then they could attract some big money from overseas investors, I’m sure of it.”

Havent we just got this big money investor from overseas?

Also, no chance Id want a merger as the next 5 - 10 years will be awesome being a Blade watching us climb the leagues from this shitty position and watch the filth drop into the conference
 
"scourge of Thatcherites"

There is not and never was a Thatcherite who considered this fat, drunken, Piggy perv a "scourge".
 
I think its a good idea and I for one would support the idea of 1 team in the city , if they combine the 2 clubs they would get around 25k , they could raise the sty to the ground , and still have a ground to play in , they would'nt have to pay for a manager because they would have one in situ , so all in all I for one support it I mean the dingles are struggling to support 2 teams they sooner they merge into one the better in my view .:)
 
"scourge of Thatcherites"

There is not and never was a Thatcherite who considered this fat, drunken, Piggy perv a "scourge".

I think in this context "scourge of Thtacherites" is lazy newspaper shorthand for "was a Labour MP in the 80's".
 
Whilst I've never liked the idea I've always admitted that there is some logic to it and it probably is a sensible option because I think enough people would come round to the idea eventually to make it work. Not sure I could but I'm one man.

Teams from smaller cities have done better than us for a number of reasons. Take Liverpool as a perfect example, their most successful club achieved nothing pre 60/70's but capitalised on some initial success both as a club and a city. It seemed to coincide with the emergence of a famous band amongst other things which their local authority are still using to promote the city present day.

Sheffield has always been an economically and commercially backwards city with no demonstration of foresight from either football club or the council. It's a city that has always been catching up with places of equivalent or smaller size and one that has never backed it's own potential or the potential of it's football clubs. It's a city that has always just wanted to plod along rather than trying to cultivate anything.....just my opinion.

For me the City can easily cater for two Premier League clubs, given the fan base. The problem now is that both have shot their own boat too many times and still have an old fashioned attitude. Stuck in the 1990's at best.
 
Surely if you merge the two teams together then it should be called Sheffield United.
 
Surely if you merge the two teams together then it should be called Sheffield United.
And you would want to play in a ground in or near the city centre. Bramall Lane then. May as well take the red from our shirt and the white from theirs while we are at it.
 
It is ridiculous and the logic is flawed.

The intention of creating one professional club in Sheffield would obviously result in three. FC Sheffield United and FC Sheffield Wednesday would be created by die hard fans who would not support the new club and then therre would be whatever the combined entity is called. So the result would be precisely the opposite of what was set out to achieve.

And where is the logic in.... much smaller places have successful premiership teams but we as a big city can't potentially sustain two Mr Ashton?
 
This old chestnut assumes that you would be able to simply add their attendance to ours and therefore we'd have loads of fans and be rich, but I honestly don't think a combined club in Sheffield would get many more than 30,000 a week.

We have an example up the road in Leeds. Single club city with a catchment area much bigger than that of Sheffield and yet, whilst they get decent attendances, I can't ever see them needing a "bowl" holding 60, 70K.
Our combined attendances must be greater than that of LUFC.

And it's also a rugby city I guess
 
Teams from smaller cities have done better than us for a number of reasons. Take Liverpool as a perfect example, their most successful club achieved nothing pre 60/70's but capitalised on some initial success both as a club and a city. It seemed to coincide with the emergence of a famous band amongst other things which their local authority are still using to promote the city present day.
it also coincided with the Moores family (littlewoods pools) chucking loads of money their way ;)
 
Liverpool has 2 teams and they aren't too shabby at attracting big crowds
So has Manchester.
Birmingham has a few clubs around it.

It is all down to success on the pitch and how the club are marketed.
End of.

Oh and Joe Ashton... Met him twice- Not a likeable chap.
 

Can you imagine how boring it would be with no one to goad? It would be like this forum with no Walthy or Darren!:eek:
 

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