FAO Scunthorpe United

[Bladesman]

Yeovil - another Championship club not too long ago - are about to be relegated to the 6th tier too.

Rochdale look set to be added to the list of 'traditional' Football League clubs like Notts County, Chesterfield, Oldham and Southend who've dropped into non-league in recent years.

The further down you go, the harder it appears to get back up.

They were saying on Talksport today they should allow 3 teams up from non-league. I agree with that.

 

[Torrix1889]

Hope they are the only SUFC to fuck things up this season.

Southend are trying their best to fuck things up as well...

 

[Tickhill Blade]

My nephew is in the academy at Scunny, spare a thought for the kids in the academy and the staff that run it there as well. Everyone was told last week that the academy will be shut as they won't get the funding to run it following relegation.

 

[Ndiayewillalwaysloveyou]

They were saying on Talksport today they should allow 3 teams up from non-league. I agree with that.

Yeah totally agree. Nothing wrong with 3 going down from L2 like the other leagues.

4 go down from L1, why the 2 team difference?

 

[dublin 10 blade]

When I first moved over to Ireland early 80’s
I used to get ferry over on a Friday night (4th division days )
They used to be a few Scunny fans ( irish Iron ) in the pub before I travelled over
Respect were it’s due , that’s loyalty

 

[Houston_Blade]

My nephew is in the academy at Scunny, spare a thought for the kids in the academy and the staff that run it there as well. Everyone was told last week that the academy will be shut as they won't get the funding to run it following relegation.

Non-league clubs retain their FA funding of approximately £500k for the first 2 seasons following relegation from the EFL. After that they’re on their own in terms of how they fundraise.

A lot of clubs still run with an ‘academy’ but they charge parents (so it’s an academy in name only but not status). There’s still some prestige associated with playing for these clubs but they don’t compete against other ‘proper’ academies, they just play in glorified grassroots leagues.

 

[mattbianco1]

2016/17 - we had a right battle at the top of League 1 along with Bolton and Scutnorpe.

Fast forward 6 years. United had 2x PL seasons and hopefully about to head to our 3rd... Scunthorpe are about to drop for a 3rd time.

Sliding Doors.

 

[Lord Eddard Muir]

They were saying on Talksport today they should allow 3 teams up from non-league. I agree with that.

Absolutely. There's every chance a team will finish on 100+ points this season and not get promoted given the miserable lottery that is a 6-team playoff system, but as has been shown in recent years pretty much any team near the top of the Conference can more than hold their own against the dross treading water in L2 once they clear that bottleneck.

 

[Tickhill Blade]

Absolutely. There's every chance a team will finish on 100+ points this season and not get promoted given the miserable lottery that is a 6-team playoff system, but as has been shown in recent years pretty much any team near the top of the Conference can more than hold their own against the dross treading water in L2 once they clear that bottleneck.

Since they introduced promotion into the league in 1997, every single team coming up has stayed up the first season. Sort of tells you what you need to know about the relative standards of the top half of the national League and the bottom of league 2

 

[TakeTheHighRoad]

They were saying on Talksport today they should allow 3 teams up from non-league. I agree with that.

Notts County and Wrexham have made a great point this season by dominating their league and simultaneously pointing out the ridiculousness that is 1 auto promotion spot from NL.

NL teams often stay up in League 2, and relegated League 2 rarely bounce straight back, showing the way that the majority of NL are well organised and structurally sound

 

[Cappy]

I know he’s no longer with us, but did Boo get a fucking ticket or what?!

 

[Sheffsteel]

Was thinking the Lincolnshire area is proving a graveyard for football clubs.
Is there some curse in that area?

Doncaster, Lincoln, Grimsby, Scunthorpe and not too far away Notts County.
All former league clubs, spending several seasons struggling in the non league.

 

[Berkshire Blade]

The national League has probably has about 10/15 clubs who could just about get by in the league above and then a few bigger clubs who would thrive. The one automatic promotion place probably helps increase the quality of the league tbh

 

[IdLiketoRogerMoore]

Non-league clubs retain their FA funding of approximately £500k for the first 2 seasons following relegation from the EFL. After that they’re on their own in terms of how they fundraise.

A lot of clubs still run with an ‘academy’ but they charge parents (so it’s an academy in name only but not status). There’s still some prestige associated with playing for these clubs but they don’t compete against other ‘proper’ academies, they just play in glorified grassroots leagues.

My boy is in with Chesterfield at the moment and we have to pay monthly to subsidise. It's actually not a bad deal as the coaching is brilliant and the club recognise developing their own youngsters is the only way they're really going to be able to survive.

This season we've had loads of games against other 'academies' too...

There is still life!!

 

[Ndiayewillalwaysloveyou]

Neal Bishop and his ex missus was funny times on twitter.

 

[oldblade]

Since they introduced promotion into the league in 1997, every single team coming up has stayed up the first season. Sort of tells you what you need to know about the relative standards of the top half of the national League and the bottom of league 2

I think you may have hit the number 9 key twice by mistake.
Promotion to the fourth division started in 1987. Scarborough were the first team promoted to the league under the new promotion/relegation system.
I think that was the season that Burnley nearly went out of the league. They had to win their last game to stay up and even then they were dependant on results elsewhere.

 

[jt64]

The national League has probably has about 10/15 clubs who could just about get by in the league above and then a few bigger clubs who would thrive. The one automatic promotion place probably helps increase the quality of the league tbh

It's a huge bottleneck right now, agreed. I would kind of like the idea of going back to the old days of the bottom tier being north/south - expand from the current 24 in one division to 18/20 or so in each of two, three down from each of those to NLN/NLS, and then two up plus a north/south playoff winner to L1. That ought to help a lot of expenses for lower league clubs at the same time

 

[metalblade]

Was thinking the Lincolnshire area is proving a graveyard for football clubs.
Is there some curse in that area?

Doncaster, Lincoln, Grimsby, Scunthorpe and not too far away Notts County.
All former league clubs, spending several seasons struggling in the non league.

I think the clue is Lincolnshire, North Notts and South Yorkshire is a deprived area then you look how the premier league is dominated by London and southern clubs if you take out the Liverpool & Manchester duo's. In areas where yhere isn't much money sloshing about the football teams seem to suffer unless they find a rich benefactor.

 

[The Crab]

Was thinking the Lincolnshire area is proving a graveyard for football clubs.
Is there some curse in that area?

Doncaster, Lincoln, Grimsby, Scunthorpe and not too far away Notts County.
All former league clubs, spending several seasons struggling in the non league.

Boston too are ex league aren’t they?

 

[jt64]

Boston too are ex league aren’t they?

Yep. Think they did a Leeds and went into administration at half time on the final day when they knew they were fucked

 

[Balham]

Boston too are ex league aren’t they?

Boston are slightly different, they're one of those traditional non-league teams which got an owner prepared to pump money in for a bit. They rose beyond their natural level but came back down to earth when the finances unravelled.

EDIT

I love the National League. It's probably one of the most competitive divisions in the UK. It's a real graveyard for some teams; I'd split it into two at the moment but with four games to go it's likely that at least two of the former EFL sides will be in tier 6 next year.

Ex-EFL fallen on hard times: Wrexham, Notts County, Chesterfield, Barnet, Oldham, Scunthorpe (R), York C, Yeovil, Torquay, Southend, Dagenham & Redbridge
Well-run smaller teams: Woking, Wealdstone, Bromley, Boreham Wood, Eastleigh, Solihull, Halifax, Aldershot, Maidenhead, Maidstone (R), Gateshead, Altrincham, Dorking

 

[The Crab]

Boston are slightly different, they're one of those traditional non-league teams which got an owner prepared to pump money in for a bit. They rose beyond their natural level but came back down to earth when the finances unravelled.

Like Gretna in the Scottish league?

 

[Balham]

Like Gretna in the Scottish league?

They're more like Rushden & Diamonds. Came from absolutely nowhere, spent big, imploded and then disappeared.

 

[Houston_Blade]

My boy is in with Chesterfield at the moment and we have to pay monthly to subsidise. It's actually not a bad deal as the coaching is brilliant and the club recognise developing their own youngsters is the only way they're really going to be able to survive.

This season we've had loads of games against other 'academies' too...

There is still life!!

This is a slight bone of contention with me and I'll preface my comments below by saying that it's very age group specific and that if your son enjoys it then that's the main thing.............

I don't agree with the whole premise of the Chesterfield FC 'academy', in the same way that I don't think places like Qualitas, Kickabout, YP, BSFA, Evo etc. should be allowed to use the suffix 'academy' to describe what they are providing. They are all essentially grassroots level organisations, although most of these run as 'for profit' organisations. People I know were even asked for around £200 for kits on top of £50 per month subs. They all played at a standard below the team that I coach.

We charge £22 a month with nothing additional for anything that we do and I frequently arrange games against the development teams of EFL and PL clubs to test the players and hopefully get them spotted. I've had 2 players sign for the pig academy this season and have another on the verge of signing academy forms. Since I've been coaching the team 6 players have signed academy forms with teams from Blades, Lincoln, Derby and Pigs. I know I'm qualified to the same level as the Chesterfield FC coaches because a few of them were on my UEFA C course.

What Chesterfield FC use to their advantage is the badge and kit of Chesterfield FC to try to elevate themselves in terms of parents and players. Whenever we've played the 2 Chesterfield teams at our age group we've beaten them comfortably and me and the lad who I run the team with have been asked a few times to move over and become the Chesterfield FC 'academy' team at our age group.

A genuine academy is completely free of charge and provides Uefa A/B level coaching at all age groups. The ones discussed above are not at this standard and therefore shouldn't be trying to kid people into thinking that they're paying for some kind of premium service.

Sorry, bit of a rant but I've seen a few kids get very jaded with football as a result of signing for these places and the promise that they'll become a footballer one day seems to be underpinning it all, it's a all a pretence as far as I can see.

 

[IdLiketoRogerMoore]

This is a slight bone of contention with me and I'll preface my comments below by saying that it's very age group specific and that if your son enjoys it then that's the main thing.............

I don't agree with the whole premise of the Chesterfield FC 'academy', in the same way that I don't think places like Qualitas, Kickabout, YP, BSFA, Evo etc. should be allowed to use the suffix 'academy' to describe what they are providing. They are all essentially grassroots level organisations, although most of these run as 'for profit' organisations. People I know were even asked for around £200 for kits on top of £50 per month subs. They all played at a standard below the team that I coach.

We charge £22 a month with nothing additional for anything that we do and I frequently arrange games against the development teams of EFL and PL clubs to test the players and hopefully get them spotted. I've had 2 players sign for the pig academy this season and have another on the verge of signing academy forms. Since I've been coaching the team 6 players have signed academy forms with teams from Blades, Lincoln, Derby and Pigs. I know I'm qualified to the same level as the Chesterfield FC coaches because a few of them were on my UEFA C course.

What Chesterfield FC use to their advantage is the badge and kit of Chesterfield FC to try to elevate themselves in terms of parents and players. Whenever we've played the 2 Chesterfield teams at our age group we've beaten them comfortably and me and the lad who I run the team with have been asked a few times to move over and become the Chesterfield FC 'academy' team at our age group.

A genuine academy is completely free of charge and provides Uefa A/B level coaching at all age groups. The ones discussed above are not at this standard and therefore shouldn't be trying to kid people into thinking that they're paying for some kind of premium service.

Sorry, bit of a rant but I've seen a few kids get very jaded with football as a result of signing for these places and the promise that they'll become a footballer one day seems to be underpinning it all, it's a all a pretence as far as I can see.

I hear you, and I'll say straight from the outset that my boys primary sport is Track so football is just for 'fun'! Although, on that subject, it's interesting that I'm expected to pay £150 to be a UK Athletics licenced coach so I can officially coach him - so it's not just football where there's a culture of trying to grab money!! And based on my experience of track coaches, I've got exponentially more knowledge than they'll get from paying £150 to watch 10 hours of videos twice a year, so think I'll keep my money in my pocket!

You're right though. My boys team played the top Evo team for his age group and we drew 3-3 despite our GK not being there and only having 10 available players. The parents from the Evo side were quite upset as they're paying £50+ a month and being told that the top Evo team is the highest standard around...

Moral of the story is keep your wits about you, as its like the wild west out there and there's a whole culture out there of 'coaches' trying to take your money!!

Anyhow, if anyone's interested, I run a hills session in Ecclesall Woods every Wednesday night? £10 a session...

 

[Sheffsteel]

Boston too are ex league aren’t they?

and Chesterfield and Mansfield Town have had a few years in the non league too.

South Yorkshire as a whole have underperformed for decades.
Does make you agree with Metalblade, so many clubs in Lincolnshire, South Yorkshire and North Derbyshire down on their luck in the lower divisions.

Where as traditional small clubs in Greater Manchester, London and the South coast have all had a decent recent spells in the Premier League.

 

[Houston_Blade]

I hear you, and I'll say straight from the outset that my boys primary sport is Track so football is just for 'fun'! Although, on that subject, it's interesting that I'm expected to pay £150 to be a UK Athletics licenced coach so I can officially coach him - so it's not just football where there's a culture of trying to grab money!! And based on my experience of track coaches, I've got exponentially more knowledge than they'll get from paying £150 to watch 10 hours of videos twice a year, so think I'll keep my money in my pocket!

You're right though. My boys team played the top Evo team for his age group and we drew 3-3 despite our GK not being there and only having 10 available players. The parents from the Evo side were quite upset as they're paying £50+ a month and being told that the top Evo team is the highest standard around...

Moral of the story is keep your wits about you, as its like the wild west out there and there's a whole culture out there of 'coaches' trying to take your money!!

Anyhow, if anyone's interested, I run a hills session in Ecclesall Woods every Wednesday night? £10 a session...

Evo use their links to the porkers as a selling point, at the age group we play at they have a few at the pork development/ETC squad. I'm sure the coaching is very good and I know they give them feedback and they play at SGP etc. but it's all a business at the end of the day so they tell kids what they want to hear.

Qualitas are the same, good coaches and bad ones but they are ultimately out to make money.

There'd be a marked change in Chesterfield FC's approach and levels of cutthroatness (not a word I know!) if they were to get their funding back upon promotion, I suppose from a players perspective it's this that keeps them interested.

 

[IdLiketoRogerMoore]

Evo use their links to the porkers as a selling point, at the age group we play at they have a few at the pork development/ETC squad. I'm sure the coaching is very good and I know they give them feedback and they play at SGP etc. but it's all a business at the end of the day so they tell kids what they want to hear.

Qualitas are the same, good coaches and bad ones but they are ultimately out to make money.

There'd be a marked change in Chesterfield FC's approach and levels of cutthroatness (not a word I know!) if they were to get their funding back upon promotion, I suppose from a players perspective it's this that keeps them interested.

I just find it amusing. All these parents chucking money at it, trying to get their kid spotted. We stump up the cash for Chesterfield because 3 of his team already go, and like I say the coaching there is really good and the boy is enjoying it.

However, the best example of the futility of it - a Wednesday scout came to watch us and despite us having 4 or 5 Evo players in our team, he picked out my lad and a Polack we've just picked up. Neither of them can particularly play very well (the Polack can't even kick the ball properly) but both are quick as fook, and the Polish is a lunatic throwing himself all over the place, into tackles. My lad is just the fastest kid on the pitch most weeks...

So yes, mummy & daddy can chuck £50+ a month for years trying to get junior 'spotted' but in the grand scheme of things, it's physicality which makes all the difference.

Like I say, Hill sessions £10 a pop - anybody????

 

[1889]

There seems to be so many kids ‘academy’ teams nowadays who are unrealistically raising youngsters future expectations, football academies are the harshest of environments. The majority of the team will be strung along for many years, just to have their dreams crushed at 16, it’s little wonder that so many of them fall out of love with the game.
I agree with derekacorah if they can’t do 100m in around ten seconds or can’t play in goal, they’re going to struggle to get a career in the modern game

 

[Houston_Blade]

I just find it amusing. All these parents chucking money at it, trying to get their kid spotted. We stump up the cash for Chesterfield because 3 of his team already go, and like I say the coaching there is really good and the boy is enjoying it.

However, the best example of the futility of it - a Wednesday scout came to watch us and despite us having 4 or 5 Evo players in our team, he picked out my lad and a Polack we've just picked up. Neither of them can particularly play very well (the Polack can't even kick the ball properly) but both are quick as fook, and the Polish is a lunatic throwing himself all over the place, into tackles. My lad is just the fastest kid on the pitch most weeks...

So yes, mummy & daddy can chuck £50+ a month for years trying to get junior 'spotted' but in the grand scheme of things, it's physicality which makes all the difference.

Like I say, Hill sessions £10 a pop - anybody????

The bit about speed is very valid and it will get a kid into an ETC/development team, because the pro clubs (rightly or wrongly) assume that if a kid has physical attributes then they can coach the football into them. I have a kid in my team who is apparently in the top 5 sprinters in the country at his age and has just been given a scholarship for private school on this basis, but it's like watching Ollie Burke when it comes to playing football. His athletics also clashes with training so he (quite rightly) prioritises that and I'll never teach him how to be a footballer by him just turning up the odd session and then to matches, he just doesn't get it.

There's another lad who's not quite as fast but he's left footed and a bit better at football, he's been in the pig development squad all season, but he's not good enough to make the step up as he doesn't have the football intelligence that is necessary and he's another one who only turns up for training every other week due to other commitments.

Of the lads who've gone to EFL academies and are playing for them week in, week out, there's one kid who I had that I think has the potential to be a footballer when he's older. He signed for the pork as soon as he could at U9 and he's had a few years there now and is playing an age group above his natural age despite being a midget. His dad still says that when they go to Leicester, Man U, Liverpool, Newcastle etc. he is bang average compared to what they've got. If I put him in my team he could probably carry the other 8 lads through most games. There are levels all the way through football and kids just need to play at the level that they enjoy it. I'd never push my lad past what he enjoys, he plays in the top league both Saturdays and Sundays, with his mates and is a decent player, that's what he enjoys so it's what we'll keep doing with him.