Let me spell it out for you Clappers

[Micalijo]

Your beloved chairman is charging our beloved football club for playing at BDTBL. And you think there is no problem? Do you grasp this very simple concept? If you rent a home, pay a mortgage, it is very similar to that - it uses your cash up. SUFC Ltd pays cash to SUFC plc which channels it upwards in the chain to Scarborough etc to cover property losses. Fine, perfectly OK business and accounting wise etc but not fine if you support SUFC and have a pride in its history and an interest in its future.

Wake up, never mind the stale bread or the handdryers and use your supposed passion for the club in the only meaningful way which is somehow making it clear that this awful property speculator has to leave our beloved club alone.

 

[Foxy]

Your beloved chairman is charging our beloved football club for playing at BDTBL. And you think there is no problem? Do you grasp this very simple concept? If you rent a home, pay a mortgage, it is very similar to that - it uses your cash up. SUFC Ltd pays cash to SUFC plc which channels it upwards in the chain to Scarborough etc to cover property losses. Fine, perfectly OK business and accounting wise etc but not fine if you support SUFC and have a pride in its history and an interest in its future.

Wake up, never mind the stale bread or the handdryers and use your supposed passion for the club in the only meaningful way which is somehow making it clear that this awful property speculator has to leave our beloved club alone.

Before we get all overexcited, would you care to furnish us with the facts of the matter?

e.g. How much the rent costs? where the rent goes other than "upwards" in the chain and how SUFC plc is separated from the interests of SUFC?

That and just how getting the man still financing the club would help us at the present time?

Is a "clapper" anyone who isn't you?

 

[SwissBlade]

Your beloved chairman is charging our beloved football club for playing at BDTBL. And you think there is no problem? Do you grasp this very simple concept? If you rent a home, pay a mortgage, it is very similar to that - it uses your cash up. SUFC Ltd pays cash to SUFC plc which channels it upwards in the chain to Scarborough etc to cover property losses. Fine, perfectly OK business and accounting wise etc but not fine if you support SUFC and have a pride in its history and an interest in its future.

Wake up, never mind the stale bread or the handdryers and use your supposed passion for the club in the only meaningful way which is somehow making it clear that this awful property speculator has to leave our beloved club alone.

Yes fully understood. Thanks for pointing it out to me.

Is it a concern for me? Not in the slightest.
Will it affect the way that I support the blades. Not a jot.
Is everything rosy at the lane on the field? No

 

[judge]

Your beloved chairman is charging our beloved football club for playing at BDTBL. And you think there is no problem? Do you grasp this very simple concept? If you rent a home, pay a mortgage, it is very similar to that - it uses your cash up. SUFC Ltd pays cash to SUFC plc which channels it upwards in the chain to Scarborough etc to cover property losses. Fine, perfectly OK business and accounting wise etc but not fine if you support SUFC and have a pride in its history and an interest in its future.

Wake up, never mind the stale bread or the handdryers and use your supposed passion for the club in the only meaningful way which is somehow making it clear that this awful property speculator has to leave our beloved

Your beloved chairman is charging our beloved football club for playing at BDTBL. And you think there is no problem? Do you grasp this very simple concept? If you rent a home, pay a mortgage, it is very similar to that - it uses your cash up. SUFC Ltd pays cash to SUFC plc which channels it upwards in the chain to Scarborough etc to cover property losses. Fine, perfectly OK business and accounting wise etc but not fine if you support SUFC and have a pride in its history and an interest in its future.

Wake up, never mind the stale bread or the handdryers and use your supposed passion for the club in the only meaningful way which is somehow making it clear that this awful property speculator has to leave our beloved club alone.

Thanks for pointing that stuff out , we need more like you on this site
You are such a selfless caring individual always putting the education and awareness of others before your own

Thank you from the bottom of my heart

 

[puppet]

I'm ashamed to have invented the phrase happy clappers now

 

[blade too long]

so hes charging sufc rent
the sufc he owns
so you are confirming hes extorting money from his self

seems your getting pent up over someone juggling his own finances
again until someone else takes over sufc ,hes not robbing the club as he is the club

clap that fact if you like

we as a club , like all others who fall into div 1 with players on big money are losing money

its a simple fact# McCabe has to manipulate as best he can to save us , with no other investors on the horizon, hes said openly hes lost enough on it , without him wed be bust now

another simple fact
Its not a good situation , but until billy bottomless wallet takes us over ,its what weve got

 

[shorehamview]

Is a "clapper" anyone who isn't you?

If you disagree with anything Micalijo says then he can label you however he likes, and it's all your fault. Yours especially, because you have dared to disagree with him at least once, and that means you are totally to blame, and the lowest of the low.

Personally I think he's a bit of a windbag, and a lot of a wind-up merchant, and so that ranks me somewhere just below Satan, but slightly above traffic wardens and those twats who seem to think folk need lots of menus for fourth rate kebab shops.

He proposes that we

.........use your supposed passion for the club in the only meaningful way which is somehow making it clear that this awful property speculator has to leave our beloved club alone.

without making it clear exactly how that is to happen. "Somehow making it clear..."

How, exactly? Because if you're asking us to act on your words without telling us what you have in mind that's going to be a little difficult, isn't it?

For the record, I think that McCabe did have United's best interests at heart but through a combination of his own errors coupled with a global recession then he failed. I don't know what we can personally do to change this, considering we're not billionaire Saudis or Russians, but saying that will mean that I am to blame for the predicament we're in. That will, of course, make me a clapper. My "supposed passion", suggesting that if I don't do anything about McCabe then it's my fault for not being passionate enough.

So if that's the case then if Micalijo doesn't personally do anything about it, doesn't take over the club, then it's his fault for not being passionate enough, and he becomes the ultimate clapper.

Put your money where your mouth is Micalijo, or shut up.

 

[StarBlade]

I think maybe things have got lost in translation, or we're all so used to SUFC being numerous companies operating all over the place, that one more transfer between the same company is neither here nor there.

The difference this time is that the real estate assets have moved away from the football club for the sole reason to encourage investment. So yes, SUFC are paying rent (perhaps) to SUFC right now, in 12 months SUFC may be paying rent to an external property developer who owns the ground and land, we're just the tenants. That is my worry, and through the lack of clarity in KM's letters, I expect the worse but of course hope for the best.

 

[Rodley]

I'm ashamed to have invented the phrase happy clappers now

Pup, as a reader of the late BUVP, I must say the standard of "knocker" (I genuinely loathe to use that term) has diminished significantly.

 

[Micalijo]

Before we get all overexcited, would you care to furnish us with the facts of the matter?

e.g. How much the rent costs? where the rent goes other than "upwards" in the chain and how SUFC plc is separated from the interests of SUFC?

That and just how getting the man still financing the club would help us at the present time?

Is a "clapper" anyone who isn't you?

Of course I do not know the facts but I can speculate and nothing I have said is outrageous. Where do you think the rent is going and how does it help our team? You're good at asking questions by the looks of your post but let's have some comments from you about why this is good or beneficial for the future of SUFC Ltd. Does it not bother you in the slightest that the club with 120 years plus history does not know own the ground which is famous and very popular. Sorry but your must have zero commercial acumen and zero awareness of how a group of companies work, zero awareness of how things could work if the football club is sold and McCabe retains the land, be incredibly gullible or more likely just get your knickers in an incredible twist when someone has a perfectly justfied pop at McCabe.

Let's have some debate Foxy rather than questions you know I can't answer. It's a forum.

 

[Micalijo]

If you disagree with anything Micalijo says then he can label you however he likes, and it's all your fault. Yours especially, because you have dared to disagree with him at least once, and that means you are totally to blame, and the lowest of the low.

Personally I think he's a bit of a windbag, and a lot of a wind-up merchant, and so that ranks me somewhere just below Satan, but slightly above traffic wardens and those twats who seem to think folk need lots of menus for fourth rate kebab shops.

He proposes that we



without making it clear exactly how that is to happen. "Somehow making it clear..."

How, exactly? Because if you're asking us to act on your words without telling us what you have in mind that's going to be a little difficult, isn't it?

For the record, I think that McCabe did have United's best interests at heart but through a combination of his own errors coupled with a global recession then he failed. I don't know what we can personally do to change this, considering we're not billionaire Saudis or Russians, but saying that will mean that I am to blame for the predicament we're in. That will, of course, make me a clapper. My "supposed passion", suggesting that if I don't do anything about McCabe then it's my fault for not being passionate enough.

So if that's the case then if Micalijo doesn't personally do anything about it, doesn't take over the club, then it's his fault for not being passionate enough, and he becomes the ultimate clapper.

Put your money where your mouth is Micalijo, or shut up.

Do you froth at the mouth with excitement every time I post?

 

[Micalijo]

I'm ashamed to have invented the phrase happy clappers now

Thing is Pup, there is no better way to describe the phenomenom of people thinking McCabe is nowt to worry about in terms of taking the land away from the club.

 

[Foxy]

Of course I do not know the facts but I can speculate and nothing I have said is outrageous. Where do you think the rent is going and how does it help our team?

I never said anything you did say was outrageous, it's just there's little substance to it without any actual knowledge of what is happening. It could be a peppercorn rent, it could be a ridiculously large amount per game, I'd hazard a guess only a few people (namely the McCabe's and the people they put in charge of finances) currently know.

The rent is going to Sheffield United PLC, the current owners of Sheffield United FC, while that fact remains, we're effectively paying ourselves are we not?

You're good at asking questions by the looks of your post but let's have some comments from you about why this is good or beneficial for the future of SUFC Ltd.

Put simply, it still mirrors what I said when the very first letter dropped, it makes very little difference whilst things remain as they are. If Kevin McCabe wanted to screw us over, he's had plenty of opportunity to do so and could regardless of the separation.

It's just as easy to argue that the move protects the most valuable assets we have from problems with the football club or more risky investors in the football club.

Does it not bother you in the slightest that the club with 120 years plus history does not know own the ground which is famous and very popular.

The owners of Sheffield United Football Club still own Bramall Lane.

Sorry but your must have zero commercial acumen and zero awareness of how a group of companies work, zero awareness of how things could work if the football club is sold and McCabe retains the land, be incredibly gullible or more likely just get your knickers in an incredible twist when someone has a perfectly justfied pop at McCabe.

Just how do you get to that conclusion? which part of anything that I've said on the situation can possibly bring you to that conclusion?

Let's have some debate Foxy rather than questions you know I can't answer. It's a forum.

If only you would ever heed your own advice

 

[Micalijo]

Foxy - if SUFC turnover is say £10m and we have to budget along those lines - if he is charging say £1m per annum then the football club is significantly worse off all other things being equal. The £1m goes to fund property losses, for example, in Scarborough or elsewhere or just goes to McCabe family. Again, all perfectly OK in business terms.

It maybe peppercorn, maybe not. What is there to stop a new owner coming in and saying stuf you McCabe were off to DVS? Any views on that - McCabe wants out of the football but wants the land. WHat kind of mug would buy the club and pay McCabe rent?

The fact that the McCabe family own SUFC Ltd and the land is the biggest red herring and I am mzed you cannot see the potential for a huge problem here - as I have tried to explain above and as Star tried to do so above.

 

[Foxy]

Foxy - if SUFC turnover is say £10m and we have to budget along those lines - if he is charging say £1m per annum then the football club is significantly worse off all other things being equal. The £1m goes to fund property losses, for example, in Scarborough or elsewhere or just goes to McCabe family. Again, all perfectly OK in business terms.

Look how many if's are in that paragraph, that's why I wanted to quantify the issue with actual figures... That could make a big difference to how the setup looks.

It maybe peppercorn, maybe not. What is there to stop a new owner coming in and saying stuf you McCabe were off to DVS? Any views on that - McCabe wants out of the football but wants the land. WHat kind of mug would buy the club and pay McCabe rent?

Again, it depends what McCabe wants, whether it's investment or to sell. It also depends on what terms he puts on any investment or sale. He's the man in control (just as he was before the change), if he chooses to screw us over then like I said before I'll be first in the queue to take it up with him in person, but until he does, he hasn't!

The fact that the McCabe family own SUFC Ltd and the land is the biggest red herring and I am mzed you cannot see the potential for a huge problem here - as I have tried to explain above and as Star tried to do so above.

The McCabe family owned previously all of what they own now, the only difference is some of the assets are attributed to a different part of their collection of companies, I fail to see how that gives them any more power to potentially screw us over than they already had?

I can see potential for a problem, it's always there, whoever is in charge. Until the moment ownership and control of one or the other changes, he can't screw himself.

In simple terms, they had full control and could do what they wanted before, they have full control and can do what they want now. The only real debate to be had from this is opinions on how likely them being in charge is to result in something we don't like.

 

[TarquinDelouche]

Of course I do not know the facts...

This thread would have been a lot shorter if you'd have simply posted this and only this at the start.

 

[Flatulent_Bob]

This reminds me of the Brasseye peadophilia episode with Neil (Dr) Fox.
"Paedophiles have genetically more in common with crabs than they do with you or me. Now that's scientific fact... there's no real evidence for it, but it is scientific fact."

 

[metalblade]

Seems a bit pointless Foxy jumping on Micalijo because he don't know how much rent we are paying......... kinda negates your counter argument too, it could be peppercorn might be £3.4m pa same as the interest owed to McCabe.
I think it all comes down to how much you trust McCabe and his cronies, looking at the choices he has made in the last five year or so and the downright deceit that has come out of BDTBL in that time I wouldn't trust him with a piggy bank. One concrete fact in all this is the football club is more at risk now than at any other time in it's history and it has all come about on McCabes watch. Will we be at the lane in 10 years who knows the club may survive but not as we know it.
I know one thing this argument has been done to death and is boring now.

 

[Foxy]

Seems a bit pointless Foxy jumping on Micalijo because he don't know how much rent we are paying......... kinda negates your counter argument too, it could be peppercorn might be £3.4m pa same as the interest owed to McCabe.

Is asking a question to try and glean more substance about the thing he's annoyed at really "jumping on" ?

It's fairly pointless discussing anything if that's the case.

 

[Micalijo]

It's the (now usual) 'smart-arse' nature of your opener asking questions that clearly I can't answer and using that as a sign of me totally making things up etc in that I think Metal is getting at. As he says, you haven't got a clue either what the rent is, yet because I haven't got details of McCabe's bank accounts it is assumed I am living in a make-believe dreamworld. We then have people 'liking' posts whch talk about peadophiles - nice one.

If you really, truly think that this separaion of club and land is for the pruposes of securing investment rather than McCabe getting his wedge back then I really do feel very sorry for you.

 

[TarquinDelouche]

It's the (now usual) 'smart-arse' nature of your opener asking questions that clearly I can't answer and using that as a sign of me totally making things up etc in that I think Metal is getting at. As he says, you haven't got a clue either what the rent is, yet because I haven't got details of McCabe's bank accounts it is assumed I am living in a make-believe dreamworld. We then have people 'liking' posts whch talk about peadophiles - nice one.

Can you explain what it is that you're spelling out to us "clappers" then? By your own admission you don't know what the rent is... but you've started a thread based upon an assumption that it's a large amount, and indicated that anybody who doesn't also assume it's a large amount is a "clapper".

As far as I can see, you're spelling out that you don't really know what you're talking about but you're feeling smug about it. I see nobody else doing that.

 

[Large Mendonca]

We then have people 'liking' posts whch talk about peadophiles - nice one.

We like the absurdity of the comment, we don't like paedophiles........

TAXI !!

 

[Flatulent_Bob]

It takes a certain amount of perverse brilliance to read my post and ignore the point, context and relevance because it had a particular word within it.

 

[Rodley]

Can I propose a new subgroup called "Tossers"; anyone who wheels out the old chestnut:

"If you don't agree with me you're a clapper/true blade/so called Blade."

 

[Linz]

We then have people 'liking' posts whch talk about peadophiles - nice one.

I feel the only response I can deign to give that is "lols".

 

[Foxy]

It's the (now usual) 'smart-arse' nature of your opener asking questions that clearly I can't answer and using that as a sign of me totally making things up etc in that I think Metal is getting at. As he says, you haven't got a clue either what the rent is, yet because I haven't got details of McCabe's bank accounts it is assumed I am living in a make-believe dreamworld. We then have people 'liking' posts whch talk about peadophiles - nice one.

So asking a question about something you are talking about now counts as "smart arse"?

I was more than happy for you to enlighten me and to therefore take the discussion further with some substance, rather than just a spat about being a "smart arse" because I had the audacity to ask you to expand upon your opinion.

If you really, truly think that this separaion of club and land is for the pruposes of securing investment rather than McCabe getting his wedge back then I really do feel very sorry for you.

I have absolutely no idea of his intentions and have never once suggested such. As I keep saying, the proof will be in the pudding and if he screws us I'll be first in line to question him directly.

 

[SotonBlade]

Bored of reading thread on thread about the same old topics. I'd go as far as to say I find people posting about what they're having for dinner on Facebook more interesting.

So the crux of things is:

- McCabe moves assets to a company that owns the club, so we still own our assets technically.
- We then pay rent on said assets. Nobody actually knows the cost.
- This rent could be minimal or considerable, again, nobody actually knows.
- This could mean one of two things, he's trying to stitch us up to get the land or trying to attract investment
- Instead of pointing out ALL possible scenarios, Mic jumps on the negative.
- Others point out that other angle, but that's not allowed.
- Result = Another playground slanging match ensues.

Learn to accept that some people like to look at the positives rather than the negatives. Don't lambast them for doing so. Just acknowledge it, accept it and move on. Likewise, if Mic feels he wants to post about negative elements on a regular basis, let him. Maybe one day though Mic you'll learn to tone down your posts to a less aggresive nature.

I can see both angles as possible outcomes. But without any evidence you can't come out so vociferously and force your own opinions on others.

If he screws us, then we can lambast him. In the meantime, just get behind the 11 guys on the pitch, not those in the board room.

 

[Princess Annes Dog]

It's the (now usual) 'smart-arse' nature of your opener asking questions that clearly I can't answer and using that as a sign of me totally making things up etc in that I think Metal is getting at. As he says, you haven't got a clue either what the rent is, yet because I haven't got details of McCabe's bank accounts

Sorry Mic, I'm usually up for a spot of McCabe bashing because I simply don't like the man. On this occasion though, we've all openly admitted that we don't have any details, so how can we have a meaningful discussion about something we don't know what we're discussiong? No point arguing for the sake of it mate, I'm sure as the season developes there'll be plenty of talking points without getting all riled up over something that may or may not be overly important in the scheme of things.

Can I propose a new subgroup called "Tossers"; anyone who wheels out the old chestnut:

"If you don't agree with me you're a clapper/true blade/so called Blade."

Can I propose a counter sub group called "Bigger Tossers" for folks who's only contribution is to call childish names and throw shit?

 

[sitwell]

Im having lamb chops with roast and mash tatoes and green beans and carrots. Would like to wash it down with a root beer but cant locate any in worksop.

 

[Bladesway]

Loving the two tier system here. Agree or disagree with Mic but the level of abuse directed his way would get others a ban. I don't agree with his view in total but he actually has a point. until anyone knows what we are going to pay and how he couod well be stripping the club, comments like this are relevant.

I don't think there is anything we can actually do about it. That's actually the biggest worry of all.