New tactic - time required

[bongleblade]

There were definitely positives in yesterdays performances: Slav showed he is willing to change when things arent going well, we looked better defensively with a back 3 & we looked OK against a team 4th in league, trying out a new tactic

What i think is required now is a little tweaking and settling on that tactic as basic template (3-4-3), and then time/patience to work on it.

Yes we looked a little boring and didnt attack enough, but it could work as a basic shape,

Some suggested improvements to improve things:

Bash and Davies overlapping to provide more oomph in attack.

Play osborn at LM as he’s more creative/attacking option while ok defensively

imo play 2 forwards with a deeper lying cam/#9 (mgw/didzy) rather than a lone striker and attacking mids like we did yesterday.

Also, i think if we stick with 3-4-3, we could get away with getting in a better, box to box type of central midfielder in Jan and wouldn’t need a CB as badly

thoughts?

 

[Hagansbootlaces]

There were definitely positives in yesterdays performances: Slav showed he is willing to change when things arent going well, we looked better defensively with a back 3 & we looked OK against a team 4th in league, trying out a new tactic

What i think is required now is a little tweaking and settling on that tactic as basic template (3-4-3), and then time/patience to work on it.

Yes we looked a little boring and didnt attack enough, but it could work as a basic shape,

Some suggested improvements to improve things:

Bash and Davies overlapping to provide more oomph in attack.

Play osborn at LM as he’s more creative/attacking option while ok defensively

imo play 2 forwards with a deeper lying cam/#9 (mgw/didzy) rather than a lone striker and attacking mids like we did yesterday.

Also, i think if we stick with 3-4-3, we could get away with getting in a better, box to box type of central midfielder in Jan and wouldn’t need a CB as badly

thoughts?

Agree with a lot of that, in my opinion Osborn gets undue criticism for not creating enough, despite his goals and assists this season, he offers what others seem to lack, energy, commitment and effort.

S

 

[raimond]

Thoughts-wise, I'm not sure it is 3-4-3 is it?? And Bash came forward plenty bless 'im.

 

[bongleblade]

Thoughts-wise, I'm not sure it is 3-4-3 is it?? And Bash came forward plenty bless 'im.

hmm, i thought we were playing 3 or 5 at the back? Yeah i noticed bash overlapping, hopefully davies feels brave enough too next few matches

 

[Hagansbootlaces]

hmm, i thought we were playing 3 or 5 at the back? Yeah i noticed bash overlapping, hopefully davies feels brave enough too next few matches

Davis got forward a few times, he did seem more intent going forward in his 'channel' especially in the second half, didn't seem to get close to tge touchline, Enda, or over lap

 

[Carlton Blade]

So basically, just play Wilderball for eternity?

 

[Bladesman]

So basically, just play Wilderball for eternity?

No just play 3 at the back but in a different formation. Wilder went to a over defensive flat 3 midfield in the PL.

We are clearly too exposed defensively playing a two at the back with the players we have.

 

[Carlton Blade]

No just play 3 at the back but in a different formation. Wilder went to a over defensive flat 3 midfield in the PL.

We are clearly too exposed defensively playing a two at the back with the players we have.

And we clearly can't attack a decent team in that formation

 

[finlaytheblade]

Davis got forward a few times, he did seem more intent going forward in his 'channel' especially in the second half, didn't seem to get close to tge touchline, Enda, or over lap

Davies has the ability to play the overlapping left centre back just that Stevens isn't reliable at present to give Davies the licence to do it.
He went forwards a few times but was unsure on one occasion he went forward put us in a good position and raced back to his centreback position showing our lack of ability to keep the ball was upper most in his mind

 

[AdamSufc1997]

Davies looked scared to get forward.

 

[Hagansbootlaces]

Davies has the ability to play the overlapping left centre back just that Stevens isn't reliable at present to give Davies the licence to do it.
He went forwards a few times but was unsure on one occasion he went forward put us in a good position and raced back to his centreback position showing our lack of ability to keep the ball was upper most in his mind

Noticed that mid way through the second half, drove forward, passed the ball and instead of staying in an advanced position, running into space or offering an option, quickly ran back

 

[raimond]

hmm, i thought we were playing 3 or 5 at the back? Yeah i noticed bash overlapping, hopefully davies feels brave enough too next few matches

Aye we were. It's the rest I'm not sure about!! I s'pose 5-3-1-1 or something?? Not that it matters too much anyway mate!

 

[bertieblade]

The big problem was our inability to Move off the ball and show for it.
Midfield players when defence had the ball and attackers when midfield had the ball.
when they did move it created space to move into with the ball unfortunately at least for the first 70 minutes we chose to knock it back or square.
movement creates space to either receive the ball or to move into, good teams with confidence do it, we at the moment do not

 

[Trafford]

Davies looked scared to get forward.

Whereas Egan thinks that he’s playing rugby and that a forward pass is a foul…. . To be fair he did play a couple of balls forward towards the end of the game yesterday but everything went sideways or backwards before then.

 

[Grey Blade]

hmm, i thought we were playing 3 or 5 at the back? Yeah i noticed bash overlapping, hopefully davies feels brave enough too next few matches

It's easy with hindsight but it all went wrong when O'Connell was injured and not replaced. Now we have reverted to 3 at the back, until Davies is confident to do the over lapping role, we will struggle to attack up the left side. I get very frustrated by Stevens charging forward, checking back inside then having to pass backwards because he can't use his right foot and no one has overlapped him, as used to happen with O'Connell playing. The system used to work like clockwork in many of the games during the first premier league season but I don't know if it could be made to work again - and I doubt Slav's heart is in it either. As things are, if we continue playing 3 at the back, I would prefer Osborn as LWB because his mobility, both getting forward and back, is better than Stevens'.

 

[bongleblade]

So basically, just play Wilderball for eternity?

well... maybe something resembling more like Wilderball 1.0 ... The Wilder-Ball with a CAM and attacking intent.

I'm thinking more wide up top though, more advanced WB's so they play more like Defensive Wingers.

I don't see the problem with doing that at the moment, it is a transition season, evolution not revolution.

We are transitioning from playing 3 at the back for the past 5 years, to playing a more pressing style, 3-4-3 might give us the best shot for both defending but implementing some of Slav's philosophies.

Next season, we can see where we are at, a couple of decent signings for the defence and midfield, and then we can start to look at playing a back 4, but for now, i think it's obvious we cannot

 

[BigBed]

Or 3-4-2-1 if hes determined to get wingers in?

 

[Panini]

I don't believe it was a proactive decision to revert to 3 at the back.

It was the 'least worst' solution to the problem created by the lack of available midfielders, with Norwood banned and Guediora injured (plus Brunt out on loan).

An unintended but positive consequence was that no decision was needed re Davies, as he could be picked without affecting Egan or Basham.

I like 3421 but we don't have the players for it. SJ likes 4231 but we don't have the players for it. I reckon SJ will go for what SJ prefers, over what I or anyone else thinks.

Our midfield personnel aren't great in a 4231 but they are somewhere between awful and anonymous in a 352, as we saw yesterday and the last 18 months.

Unfortunately for SJ, returning to his preferred formation means he has to answer the centre back question.
Drop Egan?
Push Basham alongside Norwood? Adapt the formation, something like 4321, to accommodate Basham in midfield without dropping Norwood and Fleck? That would leave us really short in attack.

With the right defensive midfielder, and at least one proper winger (hopefully two) coming in January I think we'll be a competitive side playing 4231. We'll only be halfway to replacing the 6 starting XI members who need replacing, but the "transition" will be much more manageable.

Keep the faith.

 

[Frank the tank]

As soon as slav gets 2 quick wingers in we can judge him on his results
Until then it's wilder team of semi retired has beens

 

[Large Mendonca]

Davies looked scared to get forward.

I would too if i was leaving Egan on his own

 

[bogo40]

So basically, just play Wilderball for eternity?

ATM and for the remainder of this season this looks like the best method. We aren't going to get the players Slav needs, in the JTW. if things to be believed. I would much rather watch the 343 than the turgid other formations, whilst we have the same squad.

 

[Snowflake]

There were definitely positives in yesterdays performances: Slav showed he is willing to change when things arent going well, we looked better defensively with a back 3 & we looked OK against a team 4th in league, trying out a new tactic

What i think is required now is a little tweaking and settling on that tactic as basic template (3-4-3), and then time/patience to work on it.

Yes we looked a little boring and didnt attack enough, but it could work as a basic shape,

Some suggested improvements to improve things:

Bash and Davies overlapping to provide more oomph in attack.

Play osborn at LM as he’s more creative/attacking option while ok defensively

imo play 2 forwards with a deeper lying cam/#9 (mgw/didzy) rather than a lone striker and attacking mids like we did yesterday.

Also, i think if we stick with 3-4-3, we could get away with getting in a better, box to box type of central midfielder in Jan and wouldn’t need a CB as badly

thoughts?

Someone to take on defenders either out wide or just down the middle. A couple of those would make a huge difference and may give the others the confidence to be more positive themselves.

 

[The Hobott]

Could Gibbs-White be the new Duffy in the number 10 role instead of out right?

 

[blade67]

And we clearly can't attack a decent team in that formation

I'm not sure that is clear in this league.

We couldn't against premier league teams with Lundstram trotting around midfield and Ampadu/Robinson/Bryan scrapping it out for LCB.

I think we with MGW and Davies filling those roles we could have a go at it and get ourselves in the top half of the league by the end of Jan. If he's signed an animal for midfield and a couple of wingers we can do something different for the final 3rd of the season ready for a clearout in the summer and real go at it next season.

 

[Nagima]

For me it is 1 left winger and 2 CM players that are required. We have no pace and not enough drive forward and support from our CM pairing.
For 70 min....Coventry's midfield were zipping around and trying to move the ball forward quickly. The fact that they lacked cutting edge up front and were not good enough in the final third of the pitch let us off the hook.

Due to our lack of athleticism in CM and lack of desire to bust a gut we ended up passing side ways and moving at pedestrian pace.
We had a free kick near the touch line that was about 15M from the edge of their box. We ended up going back to the keeper instead of putting it into the box. By contrast any time in the first 70 min, Coventry went backwards it was one pass back with the next one going forward so the were trying to push on again. There was more industry and desire from their midfield.

It does not matter what formation you play. If we don't get in 2 CMs. We won't win enough ball or deliver enough quick balls to really trouble teams. Neither Norwood or Hourihane cover enough ground or show enough leadership. Fleck plays well in patches and is not the player he was so his effect on things is limited.

We need leadership, a footballing brain, athleticism and passion in the CM roles and we are not seeing much of that are we?. Fix this area and we will play better and get the most out of the rest of the team. We would still have weaknesses here and there in the team. But we would be climbing the league as other than the top 2 to 3 there is nothing special about any other team.

 

[blades14]

Davies looked scared to get forward.

I would be aswell playing next that clown stevens

 

[Smirth]

I'm struggling to see the positives from Saturday myself. We were poor again, and only looked threatening in the last 20 mins after Coventry changed system and sacrificed a midfielder for a forward and lost the control they were having which allowed us to create some chances. Teams won't be as obliging as that normally, and up until that point we didn't create anything of note, and looked marginally more secure at the back but even less likely to score.

That said, since we don't have any wingers at the club we may have to persevere with 3 at the back until January when we can hopefully bring a couple in to be able to play with a different system. The squad is horribly unbalanced and only built to play one way.

 

[Bladeloyal]

I don't think wilder has a monopoly on playing 5

 

[Bladesman]

SJ hitting the nail on the head in the presser today:

 

[Nagima]

SJ hitting the nail on the head in the presser today:

I agree. I think he knows what is wrong but will need personnel to fix it. If we don't get CM right in transfer window then we will remain poor or get worse, due to the fact that he will lose effectiveness of his message unless he gets players in to show leadership and drive.