Blades Against Racism

[pommpey]

I will push back on one point. And, it is my opinion, and everyone can disagree with it, that's fine. I actually feel the dismantling & defunding of the Royal Ulster Constabulary ("the police") was a very important step in moving towards a more peaceful & equal society in N Ireland. It's far from perfect, but "the new police" PSNI is a step forward (opinion) coming from what I understand defunding the police means. When I hear defund the police, I don't hear - get rid of the police, all together, no more police, not even in Haribo Ads, never, ever.....

So, let me get this right. We stop funding the organisation which stands between crime, organised, small time, personal, property, fraud ... ths list goes on. We dry up their resources, the whole organisation lays off tens, if not hundreds of thousands of law enforcement officers (and by the way, they want the prisons emptied too) and the whole fabric of an ordered, westernised, secular society simply turns into an ungodly anarchy where I can basically kill, rape, rob, embezzle as befits my want.

There is a vast difference between review and reform and destroy.

I hear more what WE'VE ALREADY DONE IN CAPITALS AS A NATION, somewhat successfully. I'm just a cuddly old anarchist really....

The restructuring of the RUC was a long-overdue process and bought peace with the PIRA and it's republican affiliates as part of a larger, Good Friday Agreement progressive movement. It is not in any way shape or form related to what BLM want in the great scheme of making our world lawless and anarchic.

pommpey

 

[Sheffsteel]

I sometimes think the best way to tackle racism is to take it right back to the beginning.
To understand what makes someone racist and why? What actually motivates them?
If someone makes a racist comment then are they a racist?

Repeating the mantra “stop racism”...only works on a proportion of society and can even drive these ugly feelings underground.

I also think it’s better to see the bigger picture of respect.
I’m never been racist from being a young school boy...but I’ve also never been the type to laugh or tease anyone who is different either.

Regards my personal experience of racism at the Lane ....I heard quite a lot of it in the 80’s but to be honest in those days some fans just wanted to intimidate opposition players. So it wasn’t just racist comments, but fat comments, ugly player comments. Anything that might upset the opposition player.

The last time I personally heard racism at Bramall Lane was in the mid 90’s.
I was with a group singing a jokey song about an opposition black player.....I didn’t sing it because it didn’t feel right
but one of my friends at the time was singing It....I found this weird because he had some close black friends.
It made me think “here’s a guy who knocks around with black guys and I knew him as NOT racist but now he’s in a little gang of white mates at a match and
he’s having a laugh singing a song about the size of a black players knob”.

Another issue is the sliding scale of racism.
In the 70’s it was nasty comments.....then these died out turning into jokey comments.
Now that these have generally stopped the spotlight has turned to covert racism, indirect racism and even subconscious racism.

Now that we have social media I don’t think it’s realistic to stop racist comments
Im afraid there will always be stupid people who want to offload their negative feelings of their sad lives or maybe they are just attention seeking.
It comes back to my original point....people make racist comments for a wide variety of reasons.

 

[de g.]

Anything which wears the 'Black Lives Matter' iconography is associated with the origin point - BLMUK, BLMUK Coalition or BLM (ZanuPF). It's a movement which has marxist ideology as it's pulsing vein and whatever traction it gains, the core belief is the dismantling of capitalism and the deconstruction of the lawmaking structure. If it distances itself from marxism, it completely loses it's motive force.

Silly me, thinking that Black Lives Matter means that, uh, there's a fundamental problem in society which makes people feel that we even need to state what ought to be bloody obvious!

That some BLM activists hold Marxist beliefs does not make BLM Marxist, just as the fact that some Nazis abhor BLM doesn't make you a Nazi.

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

So, let me get this right. We stop funding the organisation which stands between crime, organised, small time, personal, property, fraud ... ths list goes on. We dry up their resources, the whole organisation lays off tens, if not hundreds of thousands of law enforcement officers (and by the way, they want the prisons emptied too) and the whole fabric of an ordered, westernised, secular society simply turns into an ungodly anarchy where I can basically kill, rape, rob, embezzle as befits my want.

There is a vast difference between review and reform and destroy.



The restructuring of the RUC was a long-overdue process and bought peace with the PIRA and it's republican affiliates as part of a larger, Good Friday Agreement progressive movement. It is not in any way shape or form related to what BLM want in the great scheme of making our world lawless and anarchic.

pommpey

Mate. I think the reorganisation of the RUC into PSNI as part of the wider Good Friday Agreement was a good thing. If I've said more than that & mislead you, I'll unequivocally apologise. The most hostile thing I'll say is - what's going on mate?

 

[Bladesman]

I sometimes think the best way to tackle racism is to take it right back to the beginning.
To understand what makes someone racist and why? What actually motivates them?
If someone makes a racist comment then are they a racist?

Repeating the mantra “stop racism”...only works on a proportion of society and can even drive these ugly feelings underground.

I also think it’s better to see the bigger picture of respect.
I’m never been racist from being a young school boy...but I’ve also never been the type to laugh or tease anyone who is different either.

Regards my personal experience of racism at the Lane ....I heard quite a lot of it in the 80’s but to be honest in those days some fans just wanted to intimidate opposition players. So it wasn’t just racist comments, but fat comments, ugly player comments. Anything that might upset the opposition player.

The last time I personally heard racism at Bramall Lane was in the mid 90’s.
I was with a group singing a jokey song about an opposition black player.....I didn’t sing it because it didn’t feel right
but one of my friends at the time was singing It....I found this weird because he had some close black friends.
It made me think “here’s a guy who knocks around with black guys and I knew him as NOT racist but now he’s in a little gang of white mates at a match and
he’s having a laugh singing a song about the size of a black players knob”.

Another issue is the sliding scale of racism.
In the 70’s it was nasty comments.....then these died out turning into jokey comments.
Now that these have generally stopped the spotlight has turned to covert racism, indirect racism and even subconscious racism.

Exactly, boils down to education and finding out why they think that way. Their reasons for being racist will be rather trivial and stem from being wronged by someone of a different ethnic background.

 

[pommpey]

I know three white people who have explicitly said that the BLM has changed their mind and in one of their words 'become educated' about issues of racism.

So where were they before? Sat in some concrete citadel, surrounded by nazi memorabilia? Or sauntering through town laughing and pointing at black people saying 'de watee melon'? Or in a coma? Do they have friends of different ethnicities? It's hard not to be associated with someone at least vaguely not of your background these days (unless you are as above, in your bunker) What did athletes kneeling for eight seconds before a match suddenly do to lift the scales from their racist eyes?

Others have mentioned it in respectful and generally positive terms. People who, as a rule, are unlikely to champion anti-racist causes.

Yeah. I bet that had some impact.

"See the match? The players kneeling, in support of Black Lives Matter? Great wasn't it?"

"Yeah, was it ever. Pret at lunchtime?"

These do not include the lefty, woke, Marxist, SJW, do-gooder, snowflakes (or whatever you want to call them) I know, because they were 'on board' already.

'On board' in what way? I object to what you are inferring there. Am I given you are suggesting that if I don't support BLM, I am racist? When it comes to ridding human existence of racists, I am firmly 'on board'. When it comes to virtue signalling with zero-point-zero outcome on racism, whilst providing a vehicle for the broadcast of marxist dogma, I am firmly NOT on board.

A handful of people I know have also reacted in a similar way to you. They are discussing things more openly than they have before (to my knowledge).

What does that mean?

You may be correct that it is divisive for some, and the confrontational language and tone you adopt certainly seems to be inviting this (so a self-fulfilling prophecy). In a world where Trump is leader of the free world you may be right. However, I think, and hope, you are wrong about this, and if you are wrong about divisiveness then isn't that better for all of us? Surely you don't hope you are right?

Are you now aligning me with Donald Trump? Fuck me, you do have a good imagination, don't you? It's a convenient trope to group in those you don't agree with with the monsters in life, simply because it fits a template. Let me put your mind to rest. Donald Trump is a loathsome, vile, bigoted cunt of a man who will destroy every good deed the civil rights movement and progressive movements have made, and possibly the planet itself if given the chance. He is not even close to being 'the leader of the free world'

Therefore, in my limited sample, BLM is having an impact. I imagine this is being repeated with, literally, millions of people. It may 'fizzle out'. It may strengthen or bring some more racist opinions to the fore (so possibly be counterproductive). It's good to talk though. Ideally with civility.

It's long past the time for 'talking'. We've talked about racism since white examples of this species happened across their dark skinned correspondents thousands of years ago. Actions are what is need, and not kneeling on some grass and failing to comprehend what the pointlessness of it all is. It achieves nothing.Next week, next month, next years ... racists will still be racists, even more so if the movement against them is hijacked by a shadowy group of tossers intent on destroying society and making it into anarchy.

pommpey

 

[Barney]

Silly me, thinking that Black Lives Matter means that, uh, there's a fundamental problem in society which makes people feel that we even need to state what ought to be bloody obvious!

That some BLM activists hold Marxist beliefs does not make BLM Marxist, just as the fact that some Nazis abhor BLM doesn't make you a Nazi.

It doesn't make BLM marxist but those who are using the statement itself to drive a completely different agenda should be stopped. Some amongst the far left have noted that it's a hugely popular and emotive topic and have seen that as a way they can advance their own separate beliefs instead. This is at best losing sight of the original and very important BLM statement, and at worst pretty shameful behaviour.

 

[Nickydblade]

So where were they before? Sat in some concrete citadel, surrounded by nazi memorabilia? Or sauntering through town laughing and pointing at black people saying 'de watee melon'? Or in a coma? Do they have friends of different ethnicities? It's hard not to be associated with someone at least vaguely not of your background these days (unless you are as above, in your bunker) What did athletes kneeling for eight seconds before a match suddenly do to lift the scales from their racist eyes?



Yeah. I bet that had some impact.

"See the match? The players kneeling, in support of Black Lives Matter? Great wasn't it?"

"Yeah, was it ever. Pret at lunchtime?"



'On board' in what way? I object to what you are inferring there. Am I given you are suggesting that if I don't support BLM, I am racist? When it comes to ridding human existence of racists, I am firmly 'on board'. When it comes to virtue signalling with zero-point-zero outcome on racism, whilst providing a vehicle for the broadcast of marxist dogma, I am firmly NOT on board.



What does that mean?



Are you now aligning me with Donald Trump? Fuck me, you do have a good imagination, don't you? It's a convenient trope to group in those you don't agree with with the monsters in life, simply because it fits a template. Let me put your mind to rest. Donald Trump is a loathsome, vile, bigoted cunt of a man who will destroy every good deed the civil rights movement and progressive movements have made, and possibly the planet itself if given the chance. He is not even close to being 'the leader of the free world'



It's long past the time for 'talking'. We've talked about racism since white examples of this species happened across their dark skinned correspondents thousands of years ago. Actions are what is need, and not kneeling on some grass and failing to comprehend what the pointlessness of it all is. It achieves nothing.Next week, next month, next years ... racists will still be racists, even more so if the movement against them is hijacked by a shadowy group of tossers intent on destroying society and making it into anarchy.

pommpey

I think we misunderstand each other. That is fine. Thank you for the considered reply.

 

[BanderSerge]

Hi all

With the backing of the Football Supporters Association, myself and the DB gang have started a Blades Against Racism campaign.

I have been working on diversity issues with the FSA for over a year now, which has mostly involved supporting the work and campaigns of other clubs. In that time I have been thinking about what I could do - and asking 'does anything need to be done?' - at my own club.

Timing and events have led me to think that something does need to be done. And I've outlined my thoughts on the problems of racism among Sheffield United fans here. (When I say fans, I am including myself.)

We're taking early steps by spreading the simple message of 'Blades Against Racism'. You can grab a badge/sticker bundle here - with a 50p postage charge.

But these are only the first steps. Loads of fans have contacted me with ideas and messages of support asking 'What can I do to help?' and the frank answer to that question is: 'to be confirmed'. I am posting here because I know there will be members of the S24SU community who may have missed my postings on Twitter, but will be keen to get on board as BAR progresses.

If you'd like to get involved, especially if you're from a BAME background, then let's talk about it...

... do you think racism is present in stadia?
... do you think racism is present online?
.. what can be done among the grassroots to make racists feel uncomfortable?
... how does the club fulfil its promise of 'something has to change' without alienating some fans?

Only ever witnessed it once at the Lane. Early 80’s on John Street. Can’t even remember who we were playing. Fella started singing Zigger Zagger. Don’t know if he expected anybody to join in, but they didn't’. He got volleyed from one end of the terrace to the other. Don’t ever recall seeing his face again, home or away.

 

[de g.]

It's long past the time for 'talking'. We've talked about racism since white examples of this species happened across their dark skinned correspondents thousands of years ago. Actions are what is need...

I appreciate that this statement may be controversial, but... this is probably the most succinct explanation of the need for BLM that anyone has yet made on this thread.

So since you're acknowledging the need for the movement, the issue boils down to your distaste for the methods. What methods would you rather see, given that every other approach tried so far has utterly failed to achieve any notable impact?

 

[Freddy Dunning-Kruger]

I'm not taking anything away from the roots of the civil rights movement and it's extraordinarily noble mission to end Jim Crow for good and move America along from it's Confederatist past. It was a fucking moment for human existence to bookmark and for every right reason.

However, Black Power became of this, a insidious, divisive and ultimately wrong mission to carry the fight on to an ultimate and bloody end. Smith and Carlos's symbol became the black glove (yeah, we saw it Anthony Joshua) and that has a totally different morality. Taking the knee and raising the fist and using the fist as a symbol to me is as threatening as wearing the hood and burning the cross.

And it needs to fucking well stop, right now.

pommpey

On the subject of Jim Crow (sort of), California has just passed legislation (it still needs to be approved in a referendum) with the aim of allowing 'affirmative action' - what the legislation actually does is remove the following from the California Constitution:
"The State shall not discriminate against, or grant preferential treatment to, any individual or group on the basis of race, sex, color, ethnicity, or national origin in the operation of public employment, public education, or public contracting."

As MLK said: I look to a day when people will not be judged by the color of their skin, but also by their race, sex, ethnicity and national origin.

 

[PageHallBlade]

Leaving the players to one side. The club are in a very tricky situation because they rely on fans. And they've said it: "something has to change". They've just called out racism. But some of the fans are openly racist. But they've just called out racism so they have to act. But some of the fans display racial biases that should be challenged. But they've just called out racism. But these are paying customers. But they've called it out.

Now, I have nowt to do with the club other than attending matches. I think drawing clear lines helps. Nudge the window. It might not go as far as I'd - or some of the people who agree with our position - would like. But nudge the window along.

just this weekend a 'blade' referred to Moose as 'a French Spaz' what did the club do ? they unblocked him from their twitter account now granted its not in the same league as the abuse that Didzy got but its rascist and also as a club that has a very vocal and popular disabled members branch for the club to unblock this person because a few other blades mithered the club seems wrong if they are serious about tackling discrimination.

in the run up to the election we had an ex player and current SUFC employee on Facebook posting the usual "jokes" about Diane Abbott when i raised this on this site that it just lazy and racist numerous people shot me down because 'they were having a go at her because shes thick' but failed to show me any other 'jokes' about white politicians being thick ( and believe me there was enough material to go round).

as somone married to a person of colour its these little snidey racists that annoy me more and the worst thing is the very same people ive seen condeming the didzy abuse where 2 weeks ago shouting " All Lives Matter" or in the next breath they are having a pop at the roma Gypsies or the 'Muslims' whenever theres a terror incident or make shitty little comments like ' I wonder what their ethnicity is' and bang on about multi-culturalism as tough its a bad thing

if the club alienate the racisits and they stop coming good!!

oh and on Brexit i will say not all leavers are racists but all racists are leavers

 

[pommpey]

I appreciate that this statement may be controversial, but... this is probably the most succinct explanation of the need for BLM that anyone has yet made on this thread.

So since you're acknowledging the need for the movement, the issue boils down to your distaste for the methods. What methods would you rather see, given that every other approach tried so far has utterly failed to achieve any notable impact?

Great question.

I'm no sociologist, but there's a few things which won't work. Flooding our media with black faces, for example. It's patronising. It's unrepresentative, and it's unfair, to most other creeds and colours too. It doesn't 'raise awareness' of black equality, all it does is shove it down (what they wee as the) protagonists throats. Racists be racist more. Neither will swapping equality of opportunity for equality of outcome. Give everyone the same start and let them decide on the end. I hear so much about 'life is rigged for white people'. Oh yeah? It sounds like there aren't any poor, disadvantaged and underachieving white people when the clarion truth is that there's more ... and they now are the silent majority. And fuck me, the rump of racial disquiet AGAINST black people sits in that cohort of disadvantaged, disenfranchised individuals, where white boys are lagging far, far behind asians, black youths and others in education. And they see 'Black Lives Matter', and when they say, well, what about us, they are met with a wall of disgusted dismissiveness and 'you don't see the point' and 'white privilege' catcalls, mainly from middle-class intellectuals who for their own immense cleverness do 'see the point' (but can't fucking explain it very well) and understand 'white privilege' (their own) but fail to see the oxymoron.

We (as in 'we') all need to collectively demonstrate that the past is gone and the future matters more. We need to educate inside and outside the household and make sure there is zero favoured ethnicity. We need to properly define racism (as opposed to holding a different opinion) and stop this gaslighting of minds to the zeitgeist. We need to make that definition stick and censure people for it - properly. We need to properly outlaw racist movements (on all sides) and camp down on social media with greater intent.

And we need to remember as much as Black Lives do Matter, so do brown, white and other skin colours.

pommpey

 

[Davalon]

... do you think racism is present in stadia? Yes. Detectable in this country, but a giant problem in Europe and in particular, Eastern Europe. You have only to look at that abhorrent amount of abuse Sterling received last year to see this. But it is inherently cultural, and I think thankfully with every passing year, it is being washed out of our system and DNA. What it doesn't need however, is intervention from shady Marxist/Anarcist groups whose aims are far from promoting integration and harmony.

... do you think racism is present online? Yes. And the internet provides a comfy conduit to display it. It is a genie which is tremendously difficult to get back inside any bottle

.. what can be done among the grassroots to make racists feel uncomfortable? By ostracising them and preventing their liberty to be involved in football

... how does the club fulfil its promise of 'something has to change' without alienating some fans? By not using gash generalisations like 'something has to change'. What, exactly, has to 'change' and whilst on about change, by how much and for how long? The whole movement against racism is pretty impotent and replete with grandstanding 'activists', pretty large on noise and words but pretty devoid of ideas and actions. There is a massive smorgsbord of issued involved in race relations, from racism itself to enabling (true) equality of opportunity. I do think we need to identify what makes us British and what other cultures invest in that and use that as a starting block. We need to stop actively having 'black' this and 'black' that (because how do Brits of oriental extract, Europeans, Innuits and christ knows how many other identifiable individuals contribute to our identity feel about being left out too?) We also need to stop the permitting of a long, nasty finger being pointed at a particular subset of human existence - the white British male - as the sole purpose of everything wrong in the world because three or four hundred years ago, people who looked like them were utter cunts. We can't change anything if they are the target of that change and that the majority of them are fed up' of taking it in the neck for other's misdemeanors and faults. Some relatives of mine have died in World Wars, but I don't expect any Japanese citizen anywhere to take a knee because the shitheads who ran their nation starved, made a slave and murdered my wife's grandfather. I don't also expect any white British male to get all apologetic for creating a famine in the island of Ireland which decimated my ancestors and stole their land birthrights and legacies. I do expect however that everyone, white, black or whatever, to regard everyone else with dignity and respect and to never regard them as superior or inferior or make them uncomfortable about the skin they stand in. But then again, fat people are funny, aren't they? It's their fault they are so disgusting, wobbly and clumsy ... etc. So are gingers. They smell, for fuck's sake! Bald blokes ... fucking hell ... slapheads, they are so inferior when ranged against people with full heads of hair.

My dad was referred to as a ginger cunt, in the navy and every time I am described, it is 'fat bloke. Bald. Yeah, him.'

Okay, it is acknowledged that racism ... and it isn't just a black thing ... go and ask any worker in a Chinese food outlet or a woman in a veil how they feel about their worth in human existence ... but it is acknowledged that racism is a million times worse. But educating every human to treat every other human with dignity, allowance, acceptance and respect is a fucking tough cookie, moreso when the leader of the planet's biggest economic, political and military hegemony is demonstrably a fucking bigoted, rednecked nazi. But lo - what have I done there? He doesn't see it that way. He's convinced he is right. It's just 'us' who disagree.

How do we fix it? Morgan Freeman is on record saying, 'stop talking about it'. That doesn't mean 'don't do anything about it' - it means, deny these fuckers the oxygen of publicity they crave for their (in my opinion) wholly wrong point of view. For their message to survive, it needs a conduit and that conduit is hatred and that hatred is driven by aligning our differences with what divides us and focusing weak minds on that. I support wholly 'Blades Against Racism', because it is something we can get behind. I'd like to know (aside from racist chanting and online racism) if there is any systemic or institutional racism in the club, mind. I doubt it.

I will not however support the meaningless gesture politics of 'taking the knee' to support a subversive movement like BLM, given what their clear aims are and the fact that when it comes to making black people's lives any better, it is full of empty words like 'something has to be done'. I would also advise against anyone using the black fist as a gesture of unity or solidarity. I am a child of the sixties and it is to me a symbol of Black Power, which is a subversive, supremacist cult, not a very righteous movement to rid the planet of hideous racist discrimination. This is not the 1960s and we are a long way down the road from that dark time in history. If anyone used the swastika or (god forbid) symbols aligning to far right groups like the KKK, there would be a very, very sound case for a backlash. And I would support that.

Finally, while we beat ourselves up over this, I do think we need to never let the spotlight settle on the UK and other western democracies. Racism exists in far greater magnitudes overseas and within 'tribal' groups (for want of a better clumsy word). There is widespread genocide and ethnic cleansing happening RIGHT NOW in other places on this ball of shit that makes George Floyd's brutal murder look pretty insignificant. We need to make that go away too.

pommpey

So much I agree with there.

Sadly some prefer to use inflammatory phrases and bold hateful words whilst offering little in realistic and productive means.

It's really time that buzzwords and phrases intended to cause disharmony are scrapped to make way for sensible action.

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

pommpey
From what you've seen & heard (for eg the Original Post, the Sheffield Star article, Wilder's interview) from & about the Blades Against Racism "campaign", how would you describe yourself? For? Against? Undecided? How strongly?

 

[BobblesBlade]

That's an excellent article, Sam. Hits all the right notes in terms of the sorts of thoughts and phrases your average white person needs to acknowledge in order to assist change.

Badges/stickers purchased. I'll be keeping tabs on BAR's progress to see how I can get involved.

“average white person”. Ey ?! Sorry but that’s not right.

 

[BobblesBlade]

I sit on the kop. This season a guy a few rows in front of me shouted "get up you monkey" to an opposition black player who had gone down and was needing treatment.

A few years back when we played Southampton in the cup the guy behind me was calling Shane Long an Irish bastard every time he touched the ball.

A while back when we were playing Bradford at home I couldn't make out what people were singing and then my dad told me it was "United hate f'ing ISIS". I think I saw something saying United were fined for this?

West Brom away a guy a few rows behind me was calling Dwight Gayle a bumbaclart literally every few minutes to the great amusement of his mates.

Crewe away, a couple blokes joking about Campbell Ryce having a tan after his holidays.

Stoke away last season a guy behind me spent the whole 90 minutes calling James McClean an Irish bastard and telling him to fall over and die.

I have awful memory and these are instances of varying levels that I can think of off the top of my head. The knee jerk push back in this thread and from what I've seen on different united Facebook groups that there isn't a problem or that because it's not as bad as it was in the 70s then it's not a problem worth worrying about is saddening. What is less saddening is seeing supporters groups like Dem Blades and the Wednesday equivalent trying to do something about it so good on them and I hope it is a small step in the right direction.

I went to a match in the Bramall Lane end and some bloke was singing “ I’d rather be a Paki than a pig”
To make matters worse there was an Asian fella right near him. Most fans gave the bloke some verbals and the bloke apologised. The Asian fella

Rattled?

A bit sad

 

[BobblesBlade]

I sometimes think the best way to tackle racism is to take it right back to the beginning.
To understand what makes someone racist and why? What actually motivates them?
If someone makes a racist comment then are they a racist?

Repeating the mantra “stop racism”...only works on a proportion of society and can even drive these ugly feelings underground.

I also think it’s better to see the bigger picture of respect.
I’m never been racist from being a young school boy...but I’ve also never been the type to laugh or tease anyone who is different either.

Regards my personal experience of racism at the Lane ....I heard quite a lot of it in the 80’s but to be honest in those days some fans just wanted to intimidate opposition players. So it wasn’t just racist comments, but fat comments, ugly player comments. Anything that might upset the opposition player.

The last time I personally heard racism at Bramall Lane was in the mid 90’s.
I was with a group singing a jokey song about an opposition black player.....I didn’t sing it because it didn’t feel right
but one of my friends at the time was singing It....I found this weird because he had some close black friends.
It made me think “here’s a guy who knocks around with black guys and I knew him as NOT racist but now he’s in a little gang of white mates at a match and
he’s having a laugh singing a song about the size of a black players knob”.

Another issue is the sliding scale of racism.
In the 70’s it was nasty comments.....then these died out turning into jokey comments.
Now that these have generally stopped the spotlight has turned to covert racism, indirect racism and even subconscious racism.

Now that we have social media I don’t think it’s realistic to stop racist comments
Im afraid there will always be stupid people who want to offload their negative feelings of their sad lives or maybe they are just attention seeking.
It comes back to my original point....people make racist comments for a wide variety of reasons.

I sometimes think the best way to tackle racism is to take it right back to the beginning.
To understand what makes someone racist and why? What actually motivates them?
If someone makes a racist comment then are they a racist?

It’s all about difference. Different colours, nationalities, looks, hair colour, accents.
I would love to know if anyone on here has never said anything bad or took the piss out of anyone for being different in any way.

It’s part of human nature and while it is great to tackle serious prejudice I don’t think it will ever go away.

 

[BladeFisher]

I haven't heard any racism at the lane since the late 90s if truth be told.

It is something that still exists though but it has been driven underground (social media) as racists are now significantly in the minority so resort to the odd comment on social media and DM as they know that if they spurted that out on the kop they would be mobbed (and rightly so)

Still I think what you are doing is admirable and needed and I wish you well. Let mw know if I can support you in anyway.

For those of us not sure as to the scale of the issue; if you use the colour of someone's skin as the first indicator when asked to describe a person therein is the problem.

Really? BLACK lives matter, Music of BLACK origin.

If it was ALL lives matter it would get more support. I dont know of a white news channel, but I'll give you a black one. Channel 4 news or as I call it BAME news.

Sick to death of it tbh. More left wing shit, trash Britain's past, pull down statues to Nelson, Drake, Hawkins, Baden Powell, deface statue to Churchill. What these 'fucking numbskulls' dont realise is that without a British Empire they wouldn't be here to moan and if Churchill hadn't inspired us they wouldn't be here and worse might have started to suffer the same fate as the jews. No country is perfect, but Britain historically has been better than most.

There are a few things you cant do: You cant change the colour of your skin, you are not responsible for your biological parents, you are not responsible for historical matters that were culturally acceptable 200-300 years ago.

No one in their right mind would condone slavery, nor would we condone strategic bombing from the air. Both have occurred and are now widely condemned.

At the time they were sociatal norms or the only way to fight back against what was considered an evil government (funny that doesnt apply to communism in the media does it, only fascism).

No, treat people as you find them. End of. If you are black be proud of it, if you are Chinese be proud of it etc. This brand of left wing driven racial revisionism will lead to violence as whites become more alienated. Dont see many movements supporting Chinese minorities. The trouble with all this racial toss it confuses race with culture and that is where the problem is, not the colour of your skin.

Did I not like Deano 'cos he was black? Hell no he is a legend, seems a lovely bloke to listen to him and feel very frustrated now he hasn't a role in the game. Tbh we shoud have him and Billy as attacking coaches 'cos as sure as eggs are eggs we need help in that department.

UTB and crack on Didzy!

 

[JJ Sefton]

Silly me, thinking that Black Lives Matter means that, uh, there's a fundamental problem in society which makes people feel that we even need to state what ought to be bloody obvious!

That some BLM activists hold Marxist beliefs does not make BLM Marxist, just as the fact that some Nazis abhor BLM doesn't make you a Nazi.

There is - or should be - a difference between thinking that black lives matter as an idea, I agree btw, and supporting Black Lives Matter as an organisation which has some very dodgy views lurking behind that slogan.

It reminds me of Stop the War. Lots of people who were opposed to the war were sucked into what was basically an SWP front, far more than the SWP could ever get on board by calling themselves by their name. How many people in the U.K. saying/posting/wearing ‘Black Lives Matter’ know that that organisation wants to abolish prisons?

 

[Gerritforud]

Time and time again they call out, yes they have a good cause but look at their behind!
Time and time again those same folks find themselves left behind!

 

[Sean Thornton]

 

[Rodley]

I get it. You're convinced BLM is a far left, Marxist organisation. You're convinced the Tommie Smith salute shows support for a racial supremacist organisation. You're convinced taking a knee really means..... (sorry, can't remember that one). All the players have been duped & are pawns in some evil global conspiracy. I get it.
But, all I see is a few blokes, who generally make me smile anyway, doing something joyous together, against a backdrop of something serious & worrying. I don't feel threatened by that. I don't think it foretells the imminent disintegration of Ponzi Scheme, Pyramid Selling, Capitalism. You're in too deep. Come to the shallow end, the water is lovely. What are you worried about? Have this on me, Raheem Sterling is not going to introduce a Wealth Tax any time soon. Logos. Knee. Salutes. Might be a load of shit. Might not. World turned.

One of the best posts I’ve ever seen on S24SU, bravo sir.

 

[Cheesebored]

I dont know of a white news channel, but I'll give you a black one. Channel 4 news or as I call it BAME news.

Sick to death of it tbh.

Other news channels are available.

 

[Foxy]

If the club publicised a number you could text the seat number ( or just general area) of some one using racist language during the game then perhaps stewards could be directed to look out for it. Repeat offenders would be identified eventually with out the need to record audio.

Club could do an app that would alert on this as well. There’s lots that could be done without bugging every seat.

They do.

We, after calling them out in the stands at Bradford away, only for them to continue (albeit slightly reduces ferocity), reported someone... They were later dealt with and banned.

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

For me. This is a moment. All of you - raging & frothing about Black Lives Matter, taking the knee, fist salutes. The players and club by their actions have given the rest of us permission, space, courage to say, simply, you're wrong. You're on a different side of a line to us, & I've got Jack O'Connell on my side. Who the fuck have you got? A moment.

 

[S64 Blade]

I don’t get people who peddle the “all lives matter” sentiment. Of course they do, but I’m unaware of examples where the the whole of society is victimised.

An equivalent thought process would be getting pissy about Cancer Research campaigning for funding. “What about those of us without cancer, don’t we matter?” Well, yes, but cancer is a blight on my people’s lives and causes upset to those who it involves. There’s other equivalent campaigns for other illnesses. Having a cold doesn’t qualify.

On second thought, maybe those in the “All lives matter” camp should throw themselves behind extinction rebellion? They also seem to be the people concerned about it being a left-leaning organisation, so why not rebalance the debate? The biggest threat to the whole of society is ourselves and the damage we are causing to the planet. If you believe that all lives matter, then I can’t think of a better cause to get behind.

In terms of United, I’ve never heard any what I’d call ‘obtuse racism’, but you do hear plenty of tropes. Bradford away was always a place that seemed to invigorate the racism, as if the ethnicity of the local population had anything to do with a football match.

 

[de g.]

There is - or should be - a difference between thinking that black lives matter as an idea, I agree btw, and supporting Black Lives Matter as an organisation which has some very dodgy views lurking behind that slogan.

It reminds me of Stop the War. Lots of people who were opposed to the war were sucked into what was basically an SWP front, far more than the SWP could ever get on board by calling themselves by their name. How many people in the U.K. saying/posting/wearing ‘Black Lives Matter’ know that that organisation wants to abolish prisons?

There is no Black Lives Matter organisation in the UK. Or, more accurately, there is no 'official' organisation, other than a group which happens to have the blue tick on Twitter, but they are no more the representative organisation for BLM than the Football Lads Alliance is an official organisation for football fans.

 

[Houston_Blade]

Hi all

With the backing of the Football Supporters Association, myself and the DB gang have started a Blades Against Racism campaign.

I have been working on diversity issues with the FSA for over a year now, which has mostly involved supporting the work and campaigns of other clubs. In that time I have been thinking about what I could do - and asking 'does anything need to be done?' - at my own club.

Timing and events have led me to think that something does need to be done. And I've outlined my thoughts on the problems of racism among Sheffield United fans here. (When I say fans, I am including myself.)

We're taking early steps by spreading the simple message of 'Blades Against Racism'. You can grab a badge/sticker bundle here - with a 50p postage charge.

But these are only the first steps. Loads of fans have contacted me with ideas and messages of support asking 'What can I do to help?' and the frank answer to that question is: 'to be confirmed'. I am posting here because I know there will be members of the S24SU community who may have missed my postings on Twitter, but will be keen to get on board as BAR progresses.

If you'd like to get involved, especially if you're from a BAME background, then let's talk about it...

... do you think racism is present in stadia?
... do you think racism is present online?
.. what can be done among the grassroots to make racists feel uncomfortable?
... how does the club fulfil its promise of 'something has to change' without alienating some fans?

I don’t think that our fan base are any more or less ‘racist’ than many across the country. We have fans who are racist, we have older fans who don’t realise that they’re racist and we have fans who aren’t racist themselves but are complicit because they don’t stop the racist element (through either fear or being passive).

There are songs that have been sung over the years in wider football and at the Lane that people have joined in with that are racist but are probably not meant as such by the majority of fans, but this has become more amplified over recent years and it’s become less acceptable to join in with these songs. I can think of the Park Ji Sung song, Adebayor song and closer to home the Besic song this season that have racial undertones, I’m sure there are many more.

There are more overt racist songs that I’ve heard sung over the years like “town full of pakis” that I’m hoping would get shut down immediately nowadays.

I’m not sure how to change the way fans behave, I suppose it needs the majority to make it unacceptable for the minority to make racist remarks and to not join in with these songs.

It’s the same as “does your boyfriend know you’re here” really. If people don’t join in, then it will cut them off at source. You aren’t going to change people’s views though so it’s a case of making sure that they aren’t given an outlet for their views.

Good luck and I fully support the initiative.

 

[CrookesBlade]

I will push back on one point. And, it is my opinion, and everyone can disagree with it, that's fine. I actually feel the dismantling & defunding of the Royal Ulster Constabulary ("the police") was a very important step in moving towards a more peaceful & equal society in N Ireland. It's far from perfect, but "the new police" PSNI is a step forward (opinion) coming from what I understand defunding the police means. When I hear defund the police, I don't hear - get rid of the police, all together, no more police, not even in Haribo Ads, never, ever.....
I hear more what WE'VE ALREADY DONE IN CAPITALS AS A NATION, somewhat successfully. I'm just a cuddly old anarchist really....

How often do you hear those on the right demand the defunding and abolition of public sector organisations that are seen to be inefficient or failing the people they serve, no matter how vital the service they provide?

How many times on here have we seen people calling for the abolition of South Yorkshire police in the wake of Orgeave, Hillsborough, Rotherham?

The difference seems to be when Black people are calling for it then it becomes “extremism”. When you have police carrying out Judge Dredd style executions then surely a level of sanction and reform becomes necessary.

Defund the police doesn’t mean abolition of the police. The phrase has come from the US where local law enforcement has in many cases become a paramilitary force with 2nd hand army hardware they have a steady procurement route for. The privatised prison system is also a huge money spinner.

Surely it’s worth questioning whether this money would be better spent on prevention rather than cure? Better education, youth services, a proper healthcare system.

In this country the picture is slightly different as the police aren’t heavily armed and with 10 years of austerity you may wonder what is left to defund. Still the police are not beyond reproach and must stand up to scrutiny from all sections of the community they are supposed to police by consent.

“But what if somebody breaks into your house in the night and the police can’t come because they’ve been defunded?”

Nobody wants this, they want police to protect them and others. It’s reasonable to question how they use resources though. Stopping black men driving high end cars or sending 800 coppers from around the north to The Sheffield Derby just to tip away a few cans of warm lager and pen you on a tram for an hour isn’t going to keep anyone safe at night.

You don’t have to support ‘defunding’ the police get on board with the Black Lives Matter message but it’s not the extremist point of view it’s made out to be.