5 subs, good or bad for us?

[lazyfecklessblade]

With this being implemented in the Bundesliga, and discussed by the league members it seems pretty likely.

I reckon this isn't great for us.

We've got a fairly shallow squad (granted deeper than it has been during this era, but compared to the riches around us we're nowhere near).

Secondly, Wilder has in the past been undone by tactical switches mid-game (2 examples last season would be Bristol City 2-3 where they pushed their left full back right up after about 15 minutes, another the Swansea, 1-2 loss where a winger coming on and playing v high up completely did us). This can be achieved with no subs, or the existing 3 of course, but can't help but feel that being able to make 5 changes increases a manager's scope for this stuff.

Last one (I promise). Our play is all about the structure we keep off the ball, and the patterns we go through on it, neither of these things benefit from making lots of changes.


For these reasons I think this might make our lives a bit tougher.

 

[Nonamedhorse]

Not if we don’t use them, but good for us if we do need to use them.

 

[Superblades]

Stronger imo. We have experienced players in Jagielka & Rodwell on the bench if needed to see out a game and I’m sure we will see more of Restos & Zikovich too. Nearly forgot about Besic too.

 

[Pedro Verde]

Cant see it making much difference
If you have to put 5 subs tactically I think it says a lot about the manager getting stuff wrong

 

[Beans]

There might be the odd specific situation where it makes a big impact (eg, a side has made 3 subs, then someone gets injured) but I think the pros and cons will balance out so much that overall it doesn't make much difference.

If you wanted to spin it in our favour you could say that, given we play in quite a high-intensity was with our pressing, overloads and counter-attacking, our players will be able to go all-out a bit more knowing that we have more opportunities to switch them if they get fatigued. However, same applies for all teams, so... very very marginal gains/losses.

Good that they're limiting it to three stoppages for subs to avoid piss-taking timewasting by making five individual subs in the last few minutes. First step towards no subs at all in the last 10 minutes

 

[Harry's Game]

There might be the odd specific situation where it makes a big impact (eg, a side has made 3 subs, then someone gets injured) but I think the pros and cons will balance out so much that overall it doesn't make much difference.

If you wanted to spin it in our favour you could say that, given we play in quite a high-intensity was with our pressing, overloads and counter-attacking, our players will be able to go all-out a bit more knowing that we have more opportunities to switch them if they get fatigued. However, same applies for all teams, so... very very marginal gains/losses.

Good that they're limiting it to three stoppages for subs to avoid piss-taking timewasting by making five individual subs in the last few minutes. First step towards no subs at all in the last 10 minutes

I would agree but that can only come in once we have open timing and the clock stopping for serious injuries and VAR checks otherwise when does the real last ten minutes start? I’ve seen games when a player has broken a leg and up to 15 minutes of added time is played..

I have been an advocate of open timing with the clock displayed on the scoreboard and stopping it for injuries, subs, var checks and penalties, not however for Fee kicks, throw ins corners or goal kicks.

 

[Beans]

I would agree but that can only come in once we have open timing and the clock stopping for serious injuries and VAR checks otherwise when does the real last ten minutes start? I’ve seen games when a player has broken a leg and up to 15 minutes of added time is played..

I have been an advocate of open timing with the clock displayed on the scoreboard and stopping it for injuries, subs, var checks and penalties, not however for Fee kicks, throw ins corners or goal kicks.

Ha yeah I'm being a bit tongue in cheek - it's just a minor-ish bugbear of mine. Just stop the clock for substitutions and I'll be very happy, or at least happier than I am watching one player standing there waiting for the other guy to drag himself off, and then the ref waiting til the sub has jogged into position before restarting.

 

[Bladezz]

Bad in terms of other teams have larger squads than is

Positives are we can run and run and run and make changes

 

[DronnieBlade]

Wilder only tends to regularly substitute the forward lads. Due one would assume to the necessary press workload demanded of them.

I could see a disproportionate amount of forwards on our bench if this becomes a rule.

UTB

 

[Nonamedhorse]

Bad in terms of other teams have larger squads than is

Positives are we can run and run and run and make changes

They don’t have larger squads. We all have the same, 25.

 

[bromtom]

If it's the same as the Bundesliga, there are windows to make subs, so you can't for example bring 4 attackers on in the 78th minute when you're losing 1-0, so I can't see it being that much more effectual than normal substitutions.

For us personally I see it as a positive, as more players will get game time, players like Luke Freeman and Mo Besic, as well as the hopefully decent duo of Zivko and Retsos will now much more likely to get time on the pitch.

 

[BLADES1988]

If only we had a few more Mousset's

 

[JOEYDEE]

If it's the same as the Bundesliga, there are windows to make subs, so you can't for example bring 4 attackers on in the 78th minute when you're losing 1-0, so I can't see it being that much more effectual than normal substitutions.

For us personally I see it as a positive, as more players will get game time, players like Luke Freeman and Mo Besic, as well as the hopefully decent duo of Zivko and Retsos will now much more likely to get time on the pitch.

Yep..its still only 3 stoppages in play for the 5 subs,ie 2x2,and 1x1,so restricts options somewhat.
Can't see it making too much difference imo.

 

[Liaminho9]

They don’t have larger squads. We all have the same, 25.

25 + any players under 21

 

[Champagneblade]

Cant see it making much difference
If you have to put 5 subs tactically I think it says a lot about the manager getting stuff wrong

Can't think of many instances where players are blowing out of their arses in the modern game.

Can't think of many instances where we've benefitted from teams running out of players through injury either.

Whilst it might be nice to have an extra game changer in theory, if you're coming on 4th or 5th pick then you can't have been that close to being good enough to start in the first place!

Once the novelty has gone, I don't think it will make much, if any difference either.

 

[Upton_Blade]

There might be the odd specific situation where it makes a big impact (eg, a side has made 3 subs, then someone gets injured) but I think the pros and cons will balance out so much that overall it doesn't make much difference.

I’m not sure how that would work tbh as, in Germany and the plan for here, you can make 5 subs but only in 3 blocks so 2+2+1 if need be.

Not sure if the rules allow for the situation where you’ve made 3 single subs and get an injury so want to use another one.

 

[Niceguyeddie]

Be a good thing I think given how much our coach likes to change tactics during a game and will mean more gamerime for the likes of berge and zivkovic

 

[Bladezz]

They don’t have larger squads. We all have the same, 25.

Apologies I wasn’t clear. I meant more in terms of their 25 man squad would be stronger than ours. The more years in the PL the stronger your squad becomes in terms of the 25 as a whole.

I expect our squad to be stronger next year and it is this year for example.

 

[YES Blade]

It’s got to be voted on first hasn’t it? I think there is a real chance this won’t get the 14 votes needed.

You look at some of the players the big 6 have on the bench at times, it’s gotta be a greater advantage to them than the rest of the league.

I’d vote against it personally.

 

[Kenilworth]

Thought it was going to be about dietary advice

 

[Ricky]

So it's confirmed - 5 subs allowed with 9 named on the bench.

Not sure it'll benefit us but it will benefit players in our squad like Zivkovic, Robinson and the Freemans.

As these 5 changes can still only be made in 3 goes, preventing timewasting, I wonder if it's something football will adopt permanently? I wouldn't mind this. But maybe 4 instead of 5.

 

[Dimyan93]

I really don't think it will make a difference at all to us.

Majority of this season it's normally been two strikers and a mid centre sub hasn't it. The main 13/14 can do 90 minutes anyway, we are 100% the fittest squad in the league

 

[bladesadviser]

Apparently us, West Ham, Bournemouth and Villa were the 4 clubs that opposed the extra subs

 

[LoughboroBlade]

Apparently us, West Ham, Bournemouth and Villa were the 4 clubs that opposed the extra subs

Not quite. Us, West Ham, Bournemouth and Norwich opposed allowing 5 subs. Villa were in favour of 5 subs being used, but along with Us, West Ham and Bournemouth opposed an extension to 9 subs for the bench.

 

[nopigfansintown]

Anybody know if the changes effect the FA Cup.

 

[BigBed]

I'd say Bad, because we don't have the biggest squad, and were one of the fittest teams in the league.
But, it might give us a chance to see Zivkovic's pace, or Luck Freeman get a run out?? I think we can look at it 2 ways?
Eather those ways, it's happening, so we will see!

 

[Addison]

Don't understand why we are opposed to this? Only 3 times in the game can subs be made so restricting time wasting. The very fact we could potentially have to play 13 games in a 6 week period if you include the FA Cup suggests it will help. There has been a longer lay off than a usual pre season and so this is likely to affect match sharpness.

If there are fears about our squad not being big enough then surely it is to our advantage especially in the early games so that we can ensure players don't pick up injuries in a unique situation and rest them accordingly.

Why are we worrying about opposition players? We haven't all season.

If we have concerns about it becoming the norm in future then fair enough but my understanding is this is just for Project Restart to protect the safety and well being of players. If this ensures we get games up and running and it limits the moaners finding reasons not to start them I'm all for it.

 

[LoughboroBlade]

If there are fears about our squad not being big enough then surely it is to our advantage especially in the early games so that we can ensure players don't pick up injuries in a unique situation and rest them accordingly.

How many games are you envisaging where a comfortable lead means we can suddenly lift the core of our team to give them a breather? This isn’t something we are likely to benefit from at all. We have a squad where we have some good replacement options if they’re sprinkled into the team while maintaining the bulk of the XI. But the more changes we make, the more disjointed we look. Freshen up half of the top squads in the remaining games against either our less fresh first team or one where we’ve made 4 or 5 changes and it’s a completely different game.

We’re not stupid, Wilder & Knill will have carefully considered the pros and cons of this change in terms of how it might affect games going forward. If the difference was thought to be negligible from our point of view we wouldn’t have voted the way we have.

 

[blade too long]

What are they thinking

They had the chance to just have 3 on the bench. pre chosen .
So just 6 on 2 benches . Instead there's 14
Could have had 8 less at risk

Is that too logical

 

[Bladesman]

Don't understand why we are opposed to this? Only 3 times in the game can subs be made so restricting time wasting. The very fact we could potentially have to play 13 games in a 6 week period if you include the FA Cup suggests it will help. There has been a longer lay off than a usual pre season and so this is likely to affect match sharpness.

If there are fears about our squad not being big enough then surely it is to our advantage especially in the early games so that we can ensure players don't pick up injuries in a unique situation and rest them accordingly.

Why are we worrying about opposition players? We haven't all season.

If we have concerns about it becoming the norm in future then fair enough but my understanding is this is just for Project Restart to protect the safety and well being of players. If this ensures we get games up and running and it limits the moaners finding reasons not to start them I'm all for it.

I think Wilder believes in the fitness of our squad and knows they can compete in more than one match a week due to the Championship being almost a two game a week season. So probably doesn't feel the need for extra subs.

It does look like its cover for players at other clubs who took their foot off the gas and didn't try to stay fit during lockdown. Especially having 9 players on the bench? that is a piss take.