Defending/Attacking Balance

[BladeInIreland]

To be fair they had cathcart back who is their best defender and set up a lot more defensively than usual playing on the counter

Yet at no point did I think during that game that Watford we’re defending well.

 

[Latters]

Can't complain about being unbeaten away from home, and maybe being greedy asking for us to go at teams. I'd have taken a point before today, and we did it without playing very well.

However, things have to change at home. We just have to revert to 3-4-1-2. Despite how harsh it may sound, Lundstram needs to make way for Freeman at home so we can go at teams with a but more purpose and movement through the lines. It is very evident that our plan away from home is successful, and the same approach is proven to be unsuccessful at home.

I’d drop Norwood before I dropped Lundy.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Ditch the flat 3, that is the biggest reason we are infertile going forward. Fine away at Anfield etc. but we have lost that creative play and balance that Duffy gave us last season.

 

[Sean Thornton]

Ditch the flat 3, that is the biggest reason we are infertile going forward. Fine away at Anfield etc. but we have lost that creative play and balance that Duffy gave us last season.

Who would you leave out though? Personally I think Norwood is suspect defensively. Lunny and Fleck central ?

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Who would you leave out though? Personally I think Norwood is suspect defensively. Lunny and Fleck central ?

Probably unfair but I would leave Lunny out, especially at home. The link up with the attacking midfield is as important as the overlapping CB's. Lets be brave.

 

[LoughboroBlade]

Today was crying out for someone like him to change the game. I think we’ve wasted our subs today, not one changed the game in our favour nor did it give us any extra impetus in the game.

Two weeks in a row that I felt he was the change we needed to make. Had we gone 1 down with about 15 mins left we’d have probably been on with a formation change too. But you can understand it today at the same time – their best chances in open play happened when we pressed high up the field after all. There was one instance where Fleck had a shot blocked near their box, with the block itself then setting off a dangerous counter. I’m not sure that cautious mentality will change till we have more points on the board.

Most frustrating thing in my view is how we’ve gone from an innovative set-piece team where we’d create great opportunities to one where we waste free-kicks and corners cheaply.

 

[ShockingBadBuy]

I’d drop Norwood before I dropped Lundy.

Though, if the question is “how can we become more creative?”, leaving out the most creative player in the current starting XI (Norwood) to make way for another (Freeman) ... might not take us very far forward?

Norwood looked our best player, technically, today by a mile.

I think we need to find a way to play them both.

 

[Red Wing Blade]

I'm in agreement about being brave at home, but not against Arsenal. Keep the same three to start with, but for crying out loud, drop Robinson.

 

[bromtom]

Two weeks in a row that I felt he was the change we needed to make. Had we gone 1 down with about 15 mins left we’d have probably been on with a formation change too. But you can understand it today at the same time – their best chances in open play happened when we pressed high up the field after all. There was one instance where Fleck had a shot blocked near their box, with the block itself then setting off a dangerous counter. I’m not sure that cautious mentality will change till we have more points on the board.

Most frustrating thing in my view is how we’ve gone from an innovative set-piece team where we’d create great opportunities to one where we waste free-kicks and corners cheaply.

Set pieces have been shite you're right.

Crying out for something drilled in, or a pass to a player on the near post like JOC against Rotherham, or a deep one to be headed across. Just something different than mediocre lofty delivery and a straight up in the air header from either us or them.

 

[bromtom]

Though, if the question is “how can we become more creative?”, leaving out the most creative player in the current starting XI (Norwood) to make way for another (Freeman) ... might not take us very far forward?

I think we need to find a way to play them both.

1 striker.

We currently have 2 strikers getting no service because we need a 10, surely 1 striker getting service because we've put a 10 on instead of a second striker is preferable if it means we can keep all our midfielders who are doing a fine job.

 

[Wards]

Difficult given their willingness to sit on their own penalty spot while we looked a bit too afraid to push a midfielder forward - left too big a gap between them and the forwards. McGoldrick would’ve been ideal today.

 

[Akinbiyi]

Ditch the flat 3, that is the biggest reason we are infertile going forward. Fine away at Anfield etc. but we have lost that creative play and balance that Duffy gave us last season.

We cannot do that and be as defensively solid

 

[blader]

I’d drop Norwood before I dropped Lundy.

But we know Lundstram doesn't work in a midfield 2. Norwood was our best player today, I thought. The whole system falls down without Norwood. We got promoted (and scored a hatful of goals) with Fleck and Norwood with a number 10. It has to be time to revert to what made us so successful I think.

 

[Rob86]

Who would you leave out though? Personally I think Norwood is suspect defensively. Lunny and Fleck central ?

You’ve highlighted the key problem in playing a 3 with a holding player. That player has to be bang on with everything in this division and Norwood isn’t unfortunately.

Probably unfair but I would leave Lunny out, especially at home. The link up with the attacking midfield is as important as the overlapping CB's. Lets be brave.

As above, you drop Lunny then you are requiring Norwood to be far more athletic and defend better.

Just to add further - have the centre backs going forward had any positive impact so far ?

 

[Sean Thornton]

But we know Lundstram doesn't work in a midfield 2. Norwood was our best player today, I thought. The whole system falls down without Norwood. We got promoted (and scored a hatful of goals) with Fleck and Norwood with a number 10. It has to be time to revert to what made us so successful I think.

Good game but the three created next to nothing for the strikers.

Two strikers and a number 10? I can’t see any combination of Two in central midfield from Fleck, Lunny and Norwood being good enough in the Premier League.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

We cannot do that and be as defensively solid

And we can carry on and not score goals? What do you do? I would trust our defence and make the sacrafice, especially at home.

 

[Niceguyeddie]

Yet at no point did I think during that game that Watford we’re defending well.

Ok ...so..what does that mean ?

 

[BladeInIreland]

Ok ...so..what does that mean ?

That the lack of threat was a consequence of our own shortcomings, not because Watford defended well or had their best defender back.

 

[Niceguyeddie]

That the lack of threat was a consequence of our own shortcomings, not because Watford defended well or had their best defender back.

It couldn't have been both ?

 

[BladeInIreland]

It couldn't have been both ?

It could, but it wasn’t imo.

 

[Niceguyeddie]

It could, but it wasn’t imo.

Guess were down then

 

[BladeInIreland]

Guess were down then

Too early to say, we have other players who can improve us.

 

[Niceguyeddie]

Too early to say, we have other players who can improve us.

Like who ?

 

[BladeInIreland]

Like who ?

Mousset, Sharp, McGoldrick, Freeman and imo McBurnie will come good. The ingredients are there, we just need to use them and use them right.

 

[BladeInIreland]

Like who ?

Who would your preferred front two be?

 

[Rob86]

And we can carry on and not score goals? What do you do? I would trust our defence and make the sacrafice, especially at home.

I’ll answer as a general opinion if that’s ok ? but I think I’d abort the 5-3-2 and switch to a 4-1-3-2 because as Akinbiyi et al. say, we would be so open using an attacking midfielder in this formation.

I don’t want Norwood dropping at all, but, if we persist with a 3 in midfield, he is not good enough as a holding player in this division. We have no better at present so it’d be a case of let’s see if we can stay up and then he’d need replacing.

Going 4 at the back and pushing another into midfield would keep him in the team as the ball player he is because there would be more support defensively.

What value has pushing JOC and Bash forward really had ? Some of Bash and Baldock’s link up play today was eye wateringly poor. Would Baldock and Enda be better linking with another midfielder ?

 

[Niceguyeddie]

Mousset, Sharp, McGoldrick, Freeman and imo McBurnie will come good. The ingredients are there, we just need to use them and use them right.

Mousset and sharp played today mcgoldrick is injured and Freeman coming on would have either meant changing shape or taking fleck off ( neither of which I'm averse to )
None of those players would have made any difference today imo

Give Watford a bit of credit ,they have been shipping goals for fun and set up to keep a clean sheet at home by playing like an away team

 

[Niceguyeddie]

Who would your preferred front two be?

Probably mcgoldrick and mousset but neither of them were available or fit enough for a start today

 

[BladeInIreland]

Mousset and sharp played today mcgoldrick is injured and Freeman coming on would have either meant changing shape or taking fleck off ( neither of which I'm averse to )
None of those players would have made any difference today imo

Give Watford a bit of credit ,they have been shipping goals for fun and set up to keep a clean sheet at home by playing like an away team

They played and we looked better with them on. I was talking about going forward not necessarily today. No doubt Watford sat deep, but it was hardly tough defending by them. I can’t inagine we will play someone as poor as that again until maybe the home fixture( if they don’t turn it around)

 

[BladeInIreland]

Probably mcgoldrick and mousset but neither of them were available or fit enough for a start today

Mousset looked fit enough to me? Did Wilder say he wasn’t fit?