Has Big Leon's time come to an end?

[Champagneblade]

I think Clarke has turned out to be an excellent signing, let me say that first of all.

Nothing lasts forever though.

He's become a bit of a peripheral figure this season.

McGoldrick's skill set seems to have complemented Sharp very well already. These two are definitely the go to front two.

I just wonder Leon being a good allrounder is going to work against him.

He's not quite the poacher Sharp is. He doesn't have the guile of McGoldrick and now he's almost here, he's not the blunt instrument Madine is.

He offers a good mix of those components and still has a little pace, which Washington also has. But given Dowell can also play as a second striker as well, could we now see a parting of the ways?

He can only go on for so long at this level.

 

[bromtom]

As the striker on the bench who can score goals, no.

Scored on boxing day, won us the game at Brentford.

Has struggled with injuries but still has 3 goals and 3 assists, a goal every 3.3 games, compared to McG's goal every 2.3 games.

That's a more than decent striker off the bench for me.

 

[Houston_Blade]

Until we can get a striker to replace him then 'no'. Madine might be a better option if he signs, completely different players but there isn't really room for both of them to be getting a regular cameo slot.

When you compare the current strikers in the starting 11 of McGoldrick and Billy with Leon and Washington on the bench, it's an improvement on Billy and Leon with Donaldson on the bench. I think McGoldrick and Billy with Madine/Leon and Washington on the bench is an improvement again. We really should be looking to build for next season now and have another long-term option to push Billy and McGoldrick for a starting place but as ever we are looking at the short-term in order to minimise the investment required by the owners pending the court case.

 

[Champagneblade]

Agree it is always baby steps with us due to finances.

Right now I'd say Leon still has a market value. In a year's time, maybe not.

He wouldn't make a bad bargaining chip for a position elsewhere and to be fair, as you allude to, he's becoming joint 3rd or joint 4th pick.

If you sign the guy from Sunderland for instance and push out Leon and Washington, I'd say Sharp. McGoldrick, Madine and Maja looks more rounded.

 

[Houston_Blade]

Agree it is always baby steps with us due to finances.

Right now I'd say Leon still has a market value. In a year's time, maybe not.

He wouldn't make a bad bargaining chip for a position elsewhere and to be fair, as you allude to, he's becoming joint 3rd or joint 4th pick.

If you sign the guy from Sunderland for instance and push out Leon and Washington, I'd say Sharp. McGoldrick, Madine and Maja looks more rounded.

I agree, however he will require a transfer fee so not much chance of getting him.

 

[nopigfansintown]

Until we can get a striker to replace him then 'no'. Madine might be a better option if he signs, completely different players but there isn't really room for both of them to be getting a regular cameo slot.

When you compare the current strikers in the starting 11 of McGoldrick and Billy with Leon and Washington on the bench, it's an improvement on Billy and Leon with Donaldson on the bench. I think McGoldrick and Billy with Madine/Leon and Washington on the bench is an improvement again. We really should be looking to build for next season now and have another long-term option to push Billy and McGoldrick for a starting place but as ever we are looking at the short-term in order to minimise the investment required by the owners pending the court case.

I agree. Wilder has stated that his decisions on loan recruitment has been necessitated by the the club being unwilling to invest in his normal process of planning based recruitment. “Whether the changing room needs a lift or just to strengthen the squad, we need a little bit more in certain areas. I am always trying to plan. I am a planner. “Concentrating on loans takes us down a different route. I would rather go on the longer term view – the club knows that – but we have to get the right player".
The irony is that this short term method of recruitment will cost more in the long run.

 

[Revolution]

The irony is that this short term method of recruitment will cost more in the long run.

McCabe of course knows this, and acknowledged that short termism and too many loans was a major factor in our last relegation as well as not saving any money.

Perhaps he's forgotten.

 

[finlaytheblade]

McCabe of course knows this, and acknowledged that short termism and too many loans was a major factor in our last relegation as well as not saving any money.

Perhaps he's forgotten.

Loans are good value if planned correctly.
Blackwell was pulling loans out of the hat like rabbits that was his problem,loans can work well as been proved many times

 

[Lmaobob]

Someone needs to royally piss Leon off before a match. Someone said it in the chatbox. I completely agree.

He's a raging bull when pissed off but 75% of the time he just looks scared

 

[mattbianco1]

Can't see him being solid but he will most certainly slip down the pecking order now. The order is probably:

1. Sharp
2. Goldy
3. Madine
4. Clarke
5. Washington

 

[Cerberus Blade]

I think Clarke has turned out to be an excellent signing, let me say that first of all.

Nothing lasts forever though.

He's become a bit of a peripheral figure this season.

McGoldrick's skill set seems to have complemented Sharp very well already. These two are definitely the go to front two.

I just wonder Leon being a good allrounder is going to work against him.

He's not quite the poacher Sharp is. He doesn't have the guile of McGoldrick and now he's almost here, he's not the blunt instrument Madine is.

He offers a good mix of those components and still has a little pace, which Washington also has. But given Dowell can also play as a second striker as well, could we now see a parting of the ways?

He can only go on for so long at this level.

I think you're onto something,
I think the glaringly obvious thing about Clarke is that he's currently the only striker at the club with height and a physical presence. This is why we are signing Madine presumably - either to give Clarke competition or because Clarke is off elsewhere.

 

[GrayBlade]

McCabe of course knows this, and acknowledged that short termism and too many loans was a major factor in our last relegation as well as not saving any money.

Perhaps he's forgotten.

Or perhaps he just doesn’t learn from his mistakes.

 

[GrayBlade]

I think Clarke has turned out to be an excellent signing, let me say that first of all.

Nothing lasts forever though.

He's become a bit of a peripheral figure this season.

McGoldrick's skill set seems to have complemented Sharp very well already. These two are definitely the go to front two.

I just wonder Leon being a good allrounder is going to work against him.

He's not quite the poacher Sharp is. He doesn't have the guile of McGoldrick and now he's almost here, he's not the blunt instrument Madine is.

He offers a good mix of those components and still has a little pace, which Washington also has. But given Dowell can also play as a second striker as well, could we now see a parting of the ways?

He can only go on for so long at this level.

Let’s be honest, Clarke hasn’t stuck around too long at a club throughout his career so maybe there’s something in his makeup that’s caused that to happen?

But that said, even with just 3 goals, he’s our only current option who could turn a game, and if Madine signs, him and Washington won’t have contributed much to the score sheets in over a year so we’d really be in a mess backup wise unless something changes. Maybe I’m old school but I think strikers should score goals as well has running faster and jumping higher.

 

[Sean Thornton]

Leon and Madine starting up front.

Someone with very informed football knowledge - so I’ve read - says Wilder doesn’t like Billy so that’s the obvious conclusion to draw.

Undroppable dropped Leon and Unpopular Gaz.

YHIHF

 

[Sparky The Blade]

Can't see him being solid but he will most certainly slip down the pecking order now. The order is probably:

1. Sharp
2. Goldy
3. Madine
4. Clarke
5. Washington

It shouldn’t be, Clarke should be above Madine! Last year when Madine was on his run of his lifetime at Bolton, Clarke was the best performing striker in the league. Madine has not scored a goal since then with only two assists.

It’s laughable to bring someone in above Clarke who hasn’t been playing much and when they have played they’ve delivered much less than Clarke has.

I’m amazed that some think he’ll make a big difference when his record is worse than all of our current strikers. It’s delusion of the highest order.

 

[SUFC Guy]

All to move on in the summer except Billy - we'll give Billy a go in the prem

 

[Houston_Blade]

It shouldn’t be, Clarke should be above Madine! Last year when Madine was on his run of his lifetime at Bolton, Clarke was the best performing striker in the league. Madine has not scored a goal since then with only two assists.

It’s laughable to bring someone in above Clarke who hasn’t been playing much and when they have played they’ve delivered much less than Clarke has.

I’m amazed that some think he’ll make a big difference when his record is worse than all of our current strikers. It’s delusion of the highest order.

It's not though is it. Players react differently to different managers and clubs. I'd like to thing that Wilder (the bloke who got Leon to score 19 goals last season) can also get a few goals and performances out of Madine if and when he signs.

 

[SuperDuperBlades]

Can't see him being solid but he will most certainly slip down the pecking order now. The order is probably:

1. Sharp
2. Goldy
3. Madine
4. Clarke
5. Washington

I would place Washington at 99

 

[Revolution]

Fun with endpoints:

Clarke, August 2016 to March 2017: 20 league games, 1 goal
Clarke, April 2017 to 1 January 2018: 29 league games, 21 goals
Clarke, 2 January 2018 to date: 38 league games, 7 goals

 

[DronnieBlade]

Fun with endpoints:

Clarke, August 2016 to March 2017: 20 league games, 1 goal
Clarke, April 2017 to 1 January 2018: 29 league games, 21 goals
Clarke, 2 January 2018 to date: 38 league games, 7 goals

So 29 in 87 overall.

Not bad but as you rightly pick up on, a “golden” period glosses over the cracks.

For £150k he has been a decent signing.

But it must be said that overall he has SIGNIFICANTLY more poor performances overall than good ones.

About 3:1.

As predicted at the time, the move to Villa 12 months ago would have been the best move for player AND club.

For reasons that I have gone in to X many, really ain’t that good of a baller when you care to look close enough

UTB

 

[mattbianco1]

It shouldn’t be, Clarke should be above Madine! Last year when Madine was on his run of his lifetime at Bolton, Clarke was the best performing striker in the league. Madine has not scored a goal since then with only two assists.

It’s laughable to bring someone in above Clarke who hasn’t been playing much and when they have played they’ve delivered much less than Clarke has.

I’m amazed that some think he’ll make a big difference when his record is worse than all of our current strikers. It’s delusion of the highest order.

So, just to play devils advocate. If we signed Andy Carroll or Jermain Defoe - would they be above Clarke in the pecking order? Neither have been playing or scoring, but both are better players than Clarke

 

[Houston_Blade]

So 29 in 87 overall.

Not bad but as you rightly pick up on, a “golden” period glosses over the cracks.

For £150k he has been a decent signing.

But it must be said that overall he has SIGNIFICANTLY more poor performances overall than good ones.

About 3:1.

As predicted at the time, the move to Villa 12 months ago would have been the best move for player AND club.

For reasons that I have gone in to X many, really ain’t that good of a baller when you care to look close enough

UTB

If there ever was an offer from Villa and we've had sold our leading scorer when we were looking (at the time) for promotion halfway through the season there'd have been a Madine-esque meltdown on here.

With hindsight if we'd have cashed in last January it might not have been a bad thing.

 

[Topplayersleave]

Clarke's done alright for us, and still doesn't let anybody down when called upon

 

[Sparky The Blade]

So, just to play devils advocate. If we signed Andy Carroll or Jermain Defoe - would they be above Clarke in the pecking order? Neither have been playing or scoring, but both are better players than Clarke

The difference is Madine is not better than Clarke!

Madines best run of form is nowhere near as good as Clarke’s. 10 goals in half a season with half being penalties in a side set up solely to feed him. Practically zero assists.

If Wilder can get Madine to replicate his best ever form for us then we are talking 5 goals for the remainder of the season and he’s going to have to be on the field most of the time to achieve that.

If you look at the football statistics site you’ll see see over the last two years his biggest weaknesses is his hold-up play and giving away fouls. He wins just under half of airial battles and his assist record is awful.

Cardiff fans review of his time with them is 1 missed penalty, 4 missed open goals and getting an absolute battering from Millwalls centre halfs.

In no Blades world should Madine be above Clarke in the pecking order!

 

[Smirth]

Leon Clarke is a better footballer than Madine.

I understand the plan b arguments behind signing Madine but if anyone thinks we are going to start scoring from lots of corners because we sign Madine, they are wrong. I remember seeing some statistical analysis a few years ago which gave a less than 2% chance of scoring from a corner. Just because we have big gaz doesn’t mean we are going to suddenly start scoring from then. They aren’t really an effective plan for score goals.

Clarke offers us a lot in build up play. He’s rightly 3rd choice now that we have improved the frontline with McGoldrick. But an injury to one of Sharp of McGoldrick and we need him to start because Madine should only be plan b. He’s not talented or intelligent enough as a footballer to fit in to our style of play, Clarke is and has proven it these last 2.5 years.

 

[Eric Cartman]

So 29 in 87 overall.

Not bad but as you rightly pick up on, a “golden” period glosses over the cracks.

For £150k he has been a decent signing.

But it must be said that overall he has SIGNIFICANTLY more poor performances overall than good ones.

About 3:1.

As predicted at the time, the move to Villa 12 months ago would have been the best move for player AND club.

For reasons that I have gone in to X many, really ain’t that good of a baller when you care to look close enough

UTB

He's been a 'decent' signing? Are you on meths?
He cost 150k and scored 20 goals in the championship last year. Those players cost around £7mil upwards.

He has been a superb signing for us, it's his mardy attitude sometimes that winds me up. Yesterday we saw it in abundance.

 

[DronnieBlade]

He's been a 'decent' signing? Are you on meths?
He cost 150k and scored 20 goals in the championship last year. Those players cost around £7mil upwards.

He has been a superb signing for us, it's his mardy attitude sometimes that winds me up. Yesterday we saw it in abundance.

Superb.

Really ?

Superb would have a much better ratio of good games against poor ones than this lad has.

Listen, for £150k, he has worked wonders. But Wilder and Knill have a blind spot for the kid and this does not help the cause, everything considered.

UTB

 

[DronnieBlade]

If there ever was an offer from Villa and we've had sold our leading scorer when we were looking (at the time) for promotion halfway through the season there'd have been a Madine-esque meltdown on here.

With hindsight if we'd have cashed in last January it might not have been a bad thing.

Clarke has been 80% atrocious, 10% distinctly average and 10% OK since signing his new contract about 12 months ago.

I fail to see how cashing in when his stock was at its highest that it has ever and would ever be would be anything other than smarty pants super smart business.

Especially if Wilder could have been able to invest the proceeds to acquire a player that, bluntly, was even slightly better than 80% gash !!

It’s just being able to see the bigger picture that much better than Mr Average that sets the main actors apart from the scene shifters

UTB

 

[Houston_Blade]

Clarke has been 80% atrocious, 10% distinctly average and 10% OK since signing his new contract about 12 months ago.

I fail to see how cashing in when his stock was at its highest that it has ever and would ever be would be anything other than smarty pants super smart business.

Especially if Wilder could have been able to invest the proceeds to acquire a player that, bluntly, was even slightly better than 80% gash !!

It’s just being able to see the bigger picture that much better than Mr Average that sets the main actors apart from the scene shifters

UTB

With hindsight you are correct about moving him on for financial reward it would have been the right thing to do, it would have been seen at the time by the vast majority as selling our top scorer again though and we know that the money wouldn’t have bought a replacement so I for one was happy to have Clarke last season for the duration.

The rest is very subjective nonsense in my view and you clearly have something against the bloke.

 

[DronnieBlade]

With hindsight you are correct about moving him on for financial reward it would have been the right thing to do, it would have been seen at the time by the vast majority as selling our top scorer again though and we know that the money wouldn’t have bought a replacement so I for one was happy to have Clarke last season for the duration.

The rest is very subjective nonsense in my view and you clearly have something against the bloke.

Subjective ? Maybe.

But you’re finding it difficult to refute ?

UTB