International breaks

[gordoncharles]

International games are shit, I barely even paid attention to the world cup. If they want to make it be more appealing I think that they need to drastically reduce the number of international games per year so that it actually seems a bit special, not just another week

But more is seen as better, let's just not have club games at all and have international games every week instead

I can't improve on the first four words of your post, so what I'm going to say is redundant, but at least this barmy 3-team format gives a nod to competitive football, instead of interrupting the football season with endless rounds of games against Andorran hill farmers and ski instructors. and teams made up of National League players from former Soviet states barely one of us could find if dropped in Minsk with a map and a compass.

The majority of international football is akin to watching the BBC try to hype up their 3rd round live MoTD coverage when some plucky underdog like Yeovil hosts a Man Utd side featuring half of its regulars and they try to pretend there's actually any drama in what ensues. Euro and World Cup qualification groups are like that, only Yeovil are stronger than most of the opposition England draw in these phony excuses for football.

And yet still, commentators routinely refer to football "at this level" as if it's a step up. I saw 15 minutes of last night's game and sure enough, Martin Tyler and Alan Smith were discussing the very same. Alan Smith, one of whose 2 international goals was against the USSR, before it split in 10 separate UEFA teams, speaking about quality in Croatia - one of seven countries that when he played was simply called Yugoslavia.

 

[Klanger]

For what it’s worth, I generally approve of an initiative that does away with meaningless friendlies, I know Southgate needs game time to assess his players and tactics but the whole business of unlimited substitutes etc. was just farcical, and the supporters pay for it.

Of course, it’s all undermined by the fact that United fans are not really fans of England, I certainly would trade an England victory for a United victory without a second thought, and I was over England’s semi final loss in seconds, whereas United have been ruining my weekend for over 60 years.

 

[YES Blade]

Fair points. I'm probably jumping the gun a bit with criticism. Just don't like the 3 team format

I agree that the 3 team format isn’t ideal but with limited international breaks it would probably mean changing the Euros and World Cup qualification systems to make the groups bigger or getting rid of friendlies altogether.

Maybe after a few tournaments have taken place they might start looking at tweeks and improvements, but at the moment it’s a positive introduction to international football.

 

[Cassius Kray]

So you're saying that England v Spain is "The Johnson's Paint", but England v San Marino year in year out isn't?
Good one......

It's like the Johnson's Paint Trophy because it's interrupting proper football for a meaningless game that people are trying to justify by giving it a name and trophy hardly anyone cares about winning*. YES Blade has suggested it may gain prestige over time - maybe. The Paint Trophy certainly hasn't.

As for the Spain or San Marino thing - I watch most England matches, and I want England to win, but I don't get any greater pride out of beating better teams in friendlies. I enjoy games against the smaller teams because there are often lots of goals, and even enjoy the occasional games where it doesn't go our way and there's the tension of potentially being turned over by a massive underdog.

I feel particularly bad for the group D teams. Not sure what attendance Moldova got v San Marino last night but we've essentially condemned their fans to a lifetime of minor football without even the occasional respite of a big game.

At the end of the day international friendlies still seem to me to be a waste of time, whether or not they're dressed up in a tedious new format, and I'd far rather we stuck to uninterrupted club football with the occasional qualifier, and major tournaments to liven up every other summer.

*Don't want to sound too arrogant about the Paint Trophy, I appreciate there are some lower league teams who would look forward to the prospect of a day at Wembley. Don't think the same applies in the Nations League, which is so heavily biased in favour of the bigger teams.

 

[Cassius Kray]

Thinking about it, perhaps a better comparison would be those rubbish pre-season friendly cups, which are only of interest because we're so football starved from the summer and therefore made infinitely worse by being played instead in the middle of the season. The Anglo-Italian cup at least had some exotic flair. Imagine if we were forced to play it as friendly game against Bristol in November. That's essentially the Nation League.

 

[BushBlade]

It's like the Johnson's Paint Trophy because it's interrupting proper football for a meaningless game that people are trying to justify by giving it a name and trophy hardly anyone cares about winning*. YES Blade has suggested it may gain prestige over time - maybe. The Paint Trophy certainly hasn't.

As for the Spain or San Marino thing - I watch most England matches, and I want England to win, but I don't get any greater pride out of beating better teams in friendlies. I enjoy games against the smaller teams because there are often lots of goals, and even enjoy the occasional games where it doesn't go our way and there's the tension of potentially being turned over by a massive underdog.

I feel particularly bad for the group D teams. Not sure what attendance Moldova got v San Marino last night but we've essentially condemned their fans to a lifetime of minor football without even the occasional respite of a big game.

At the end of the day international friendlies still seem to me to be a waste of time, whether or not they're dressed up in a tedious new format, and I'd far rather we stuck to uninterrupted club football with the occasional qualifier, and major tournaments to liven up every other summer.

*Don't want to sound too arrogant about the Paint Trophy, I appreciate there are some lower league teams who would look forward to the prospect of a day at Wembley. Don't think the same applies in the Nations League, which is so heavily biased in favour of the bigger teams.

Wouldn’t it be interrupted by a couple of meaningless friendlies instead? It seems internationals are cash cows for the national football associations and they’re desperate to milk them.

I think the idea of promotion is that the minnow nations aren’t condemned to playing each other as the top of the group gets promoted. It means they play ‘competitive’ games against teams of a similar size, games they can actually win, as opposed to the usual hammering they get in the World Cup/Euros qualifiers, which they’re still going to be playing in.

I do agree though that there just should be fewer international games during the season, I’d much prefer it if we were playing today.

 

[Stretch]

I've got about as much interest in the England team as I have in figure skating. Detest international breaks, always have and always will. They should be re-named 'International Interruptions' because interupt the league is all they fucking do as far as I am concerned.

 

[itsinyerblood]

Certain sporting events have, until now, have been viewed as sacrosanct when it comes to remaining on terrestrial tv. Reaching the widest audience has been regarded as the primary reason for this decision, yet with an almost inevitable disregard for this audience we've found that England games have been sold to the highest bidder, so bugger those who once had an expectation that they could watch their national team, instead the powers that be (in other words, the FA) rationalise this due to yet another income stream and hive off England games simply because they can.

Doesn't Wimbledon have some sort of sanction imposed on it that it will always be viewed by a terrestrial audience? It's not as if they don't bring in enough money on a regular basis, so choosing to offer this to the widest possible audience shows a pragmatic awareness of why it matters to reach out to as many people as possible.

Of course logic and money were always alien concepts to the FA (at least in modern times), so the accumulation of filthy lucre, paying inordinate amounts to managers who, in other circumstances, could be expected to be paid a more realistic wage, and so on and so on. The corrupting influence of those who administer the well being of our national game is reflective of so much that is wrong with contemporary football. Divorcing the national team from a potentially important section of it's domestic audience is crazy, but since when did that matter to the suits who quite possibly enjoy the type of perks and expense accounts that they seem to think is theirs as of a right? This will come back to bite their arses, but maybe by then the once the relationship between team and audience will be irreparably damaged.

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

It's like the Johnson's Paint Trophy because it's interrupting proper football for a meaningless game that people are trying to justify by giving it a name and trophy hardly anyone cares about winning*. YES Blade has suggested it may gain prestige over time - maybe. The Paint Trophy certainly hasn't.

As for the Spain or San Marino thing - I watch most England matches, and I want England to win, but I don't get any greater pride out of beating better teams in friendlies. I enjoy games against the smaller teams because there are often lots of goals, and even enjoy the occasional games where it doesn't go our way and there's the tension of potentially being turned over by a massive underdog.

I feel particularly bad for the group D teams. Not sure what attendance Moldova got v San Marino last night but we've essentially condemned their fans to a lifetime of minor football without even the occasional respite of a big game.

At the end of the day international friendlies still seem to me to be a waste of time, whether or not they're dressed up in a tedious new format, and I'd far rather we stuck to uninterrupted club football with the occasional qualifier, and major tournaments to liven up every other summer.

*Don't want to sound too arrogant about the Paint Trophy, I appreciate there are some lower league teams who would look forward to the prospect of a day at Wembley. Don't think the same applies in the Nations League, which is so heavily biased in favour of the bigger teams.

Cassius Kray
You make a point about Moldova v San Marino & we've essentially condemned them to a lifetime of minor football without the occasional respite of s big game.
Sorry, but you've got that completely wrong. The UEFA Nations League is IN ADDITION to EURO 2020 QUALIFYING, not instead of it. In December, there will be the normal seeded, all teams in it, 5 or 6 teams in a Qualifying Group for EURO 2020. Every chance Moldova will get Germany and San Marino get England (a fucking gain). No chance Moldova & San Marino will be in the same group.

"Minnows" such as San Marino now still have the guarantee of big games (eg v Italy) in EURO Qualifying AND the chance to actually win games in the Nations League v "their own level" (eg Moldova).

Much much much better than the previous arrangement.

 

[ShorehamRevolution]

Was talking about this earlier. In theory, it's a great idea. In actuality, the format that's currently in play is complicated, convoluted and ultimately there doesn't seem to be much incentive to treat it too much differently to a friendly.

Convoluted.... I would say that the word of the day but you posted it yesterday which would make it the word of the day for yesterday, although I’m reading it today which makes it my word of the day.

 

[Yewsman]

This is the funniest thread I have ever read! I have been rolling around with laughter at so many of the posts. Just confirms what a brilliant sense of humour Blades' fans have.

I am firmly in the camp that this is the "Watching Paint Dry Trophy". Last night the wife was watching a recording of last weekend's X Factor so being desperate I tried watching England v Croatia in the other room but just could not stay awake. Dreadful. Nothing of interest at all. Nothing really at stake and surely nobody cares who wins or loses.

I turned over to NI v Austria to watch our man Ollie. At least I was interested in seeing how Ollie did but he hardly got a mention as NI never got the ball (in the bit I watched). Still better than X Factor but only marginal. Had to watch some stuff on catch up instead.

Would be interested to know what the viewing figures were for these matches. Bet they were very low and anyone watching last night is unlikely to bother watching again. UEFA (and the other football authorities) are in danger of killing the golden goose by trying to have too many meaningless matches/competitions. Roll on the Derby game.

 

[BushBlade]

This is the funniest thread I have ever read! I have been rolling around with laughter at so many of the posts. Just confirms what a brilliant sense of humour Blades' fans have.

I am firmly in the camp that this is the "Watching Paint Dry Trophy". Last night the wife was watching a recording of last weekend's X Factor so being desperate I tried watching England v Croatia in the other room but just could not stay awake. Dreadful. Nothing of interest at all. Nothing really at stake and surely nobody cares who wins or loses.

I turned over to NI v Austria to watch our man Ollie. At least I was interested in seeing how Ollie did but he hardly got a mention as NI never got the ball (in the bit I watched). Still better than X Factor but only marginal. Had to watch some stuff on catch up instead.

Would be interested to know what the viewing figures were for these matches. Bet they were very low and anyone watching last night is unlikely to bother watching again. UEFA (and the other football authorities) are in danger of killing the golden goose by trying to have too many meaningless matches/competitions. Roll on the Derby game.

First half was dire, really fucking awful, with a strange non atmosphere. I watched the second half with the tv turned down and music on, which made it better. Last twenty minutes was decent, we should have won.

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

For what it’s worth, I generally approve of an initiative that does away with meaningless friendlies, I know Southgate needs game time to assess his players and tactics but the whole business of unlimited substitutes etc. was just farcical, and the supporters pay for it.

Of course, it’s all undermined by the fact that United fans are not really fans of England, I certainly would trade an England victory for a United victory without a second thought, and I was over England’s semi final loss in seconds, whereas United have been ruining my weekend for over 60 years.

Klanger
Yeah right. There was a group of Blades knocking around in Rijeka last night. And, there'll be the usual much larger contingent in Seville this weekend. Look, I get it. Many posters wanting to waggle their dicks & prove how Big Blades they are by pretending they can't wait a week to listen to a Blades match on the fucking radio.
Seem to get by in the Summer alright though.

 

[SteveBlade]

They're friendlies against better sides even though when friendlies were arranged they were generally chosen against sides of a similar quality. You only really play shithouse teams in the qualifiers anyway, and they'll still happen.

So it's all the same expect there are leagues now, and you don't win anything, you just earn the right to play friendlies against slightly better sides, alongside your friendlies outside of the friendly league that seem to happen randomly anyway.

Fantastic.

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

They're friendlies against better sides even though when friendlies were arranged they were generally chosen against sides of a similar quality. You only really play shithouse teams in the qualifiers anyway, and they'll still happen.

So it's all the same expect there are leagues now, and you don't win anything, you just earn the right to play friendlies against slightly better sides, alongside your friendlies outside of the friendly league that seem to happen randomly anyway.

Fantastic.

In what sense don't you win anything? There's a Trophy. And Medals. Just one winner. Everyone else second or worse. That's football, isn't it?...

 

[Northyorksblade]

Limped off with a thigh strain. Apparently not too bad.

Whoosh

 

[Birdwell Blade]

In what sense don't you win anything? There's a Trophy. And Medals. Just one winner. Everyone else second or worse. That's football, isn't it?...

You could say that about the JPT though.

 

[SteveBlade]

In what sense don't you win anything? There's a Trophy. And Medals. Just one winner. Everyone else second or worse. That's football, isn't it?...

Yeah but we all got medals for finishing 2nd in the Thursday night 5 a side League Division 4 at Goals.

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

You could say that about the JPT though.

Indeed & The Championship....

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

Yeah but we all got medals for finishing 2nd in the Thursday night 5 a side League Division 4 at Goals.

Yes & for "winning League One". Fun though wasn't it?

 

[Birdwell Blade]

Indeed & The Championship....

Yes, exactly the same

 

[SteveBlade]

Yes & for "winning League One". Fun though wasn't it?

Yeah, but not because we won a trophy for it. We got promoted to a better league, which opened up new, and better opportunities for our club.

If England get promoted from whatever division they're in, then they win the right to play France or whoever in a friendly, rather than Croatia. Take to the streets.

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

Yeah, but not because we won a trophy for it. We got promoted to a better league, which opened up new, and better opportunities for our club.

If England get promoted from whatever division they're in, then they win the right to play France or whoever in a friendly, rather than Croatia. Take to the streets.

Yep.
That's my point. If you win the best vs best, like v like, everyone can get promoted, everyone can get relegated, there is only one winner, you've proved you are the best International side in Europe, game in, game out, there's no one else to play in Europe, might as well get on a Cigar, that's a thing isn't it? And maybe if you beat the team who have got Mbappé in, that's not really the Johnson Paint - FFS

 

[SteveBlade]

Yep.
That's my point. If you win the best vs best, like v like, everyone can get promoted, everyone can get relegated, there is only one winner, you've proved you are the best International side in Europe, game in, game out, there's no one else to play in Europe, might as well get on a Cigar, that's a thing isn't it? And maybe if you beat the team who have got Mbappé in, that's not really the Johnson Paint - FFS

I don't know man, your words are trying to make it sound good but I don't think it's actually good.

 

[YES Blade]

It’s always going to be of lesser importance to the World Cup and Euros, no one trying to calm it’s bigger than it is.

It’s better than than the usual friendlies we have so I can’t see what the issue is. Just wait until next month when we’re playing the USA in a friendly, that’ll give the moaners something to moan about!

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

... good thread...
Peace In Our Time
I've moved a number of posters into the "yet to be convinced" category

 

[SteveBlade]

... good thread...
Peace In Our Time
I've moved a number of posters into the "yet to be convinced" category

It might be marginally better than friendlies.

There.

 

[I should coco]

The UEFA Nations League is the best thing to happen to International Football in my lifetime

this Nations League is a real Game Changer

All I can say is it's promotion & relegation like the Football League that Sheffield United Football Club are in. If you get promoted enough times England/Sheffield United will be in the top division

All that would be well and good, were the only motive the desire for the 'little' teams to improve and play more meaningful games with the big boys. Surely this laudable aim, can be the only motivation behind UEFA's selfless act to set up this Corinthian league system?

Well, er no. UEFA recognise they miss out on the massive TV revenues generated by the Premier League, La Liga etc and also FIFA's World Cup. First thing to do then is to keep expanding the Euros from its original 8 teams until every team in Europe, apart from the Faroe Islands, get in.
Trouble is that golden egg only comes every 4 years, so in a flash of marketing brilliance they are trying to monetise crap friendlies by making them into a league.
Moldova v San Marino in a friendly? No thanks.
Moldova v San Marino in a grandly titled league competition? Well er, still no thanks.

No matter, UEFA will keep picking up this equine carcass and beating it repeatedly. They think there is a tv pot of gold at the end of the rainbow, so they will keep chasing it.

While I'm on old sayings, consider:-
-this silly new competition
-the 48 team expanded WC,
-a potential 3rd Euro club competition,
then rearrange the following words:
goose
egg
kill
golden
lay

 

[Ball_Sup (Phil)]

I'm not interested in pulling punches
UEFA are a fucking shambles
FIFA are a fucking shambles
Fuck 'em
A 48 team World Cup is a farce
A 24 team EUROs is a farce
Fuck 'em

But, here's a much more sensible tournament. Like v like. Promotion & relegation. A very manageable Four Team Finals. That's better. Got to be. Surely...

 

[I should coco]

I'm not interested in pulling punches
UEFA are a fucking shambles
FIFA are a fucking shambles
Fuck 'em
A 48 team World Cup is a farce
A 24 team EUROs is a farce
Fuck 'em

Couldn't agree more.

But, here's a much more sensible tournament. Like v like. Promotion & relegation. A very manageable Four Team Finals. That's better. Got to be. Surely...

Sorry but it has been done for the wrong reasons entirely.

The guardians of the game should be cutting down the number of games for the top players, not increasing them. The international breaks for friendlies were a joke before this, so more competitive games for the top players are not needed.

Some jokingly compared it to the Paint Pot trophy and maybe they had a point. The top 12 European teams should not be playing. Let San Marino play Moldova, with the winners going on to be promoted and play Iceland and Roumania. They can even have a little trophy and an open top bus from the Lane to the Town Hall if they want.