Keving McDonald or John Fleck?

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Superbladesman7 said:
A great friday night pub debate?

Brought this up with a pal, I would 100% say John Fleck. Kevin McDonald I remember as being a very classy player with a bit of a lazy style but obviously a very good eye for a pass, bit of an assit master, not many goals. However, when you remember that a lot of his time was spent sending Ched through (who then was a better player than Sharp is now, sorry if that upsets anyone but lets not forget he got 35 without a full season!) Then it makes me think his job was made a touch easier. Plus he couldn't tackle or was too laid back to do that side of the game and come to think of it, I feel like he didn't turn up in big games.

Fleck for me can pretty much do every prt of the game, and do it exceptionally well! Hes got everything and is a real leader too!

So there you go, id have Fleck, what about you?
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Pub debate . You want shooting for asking and any fucker saying McDonald , wants tar and feathering .
 



Agree with those who say McDonald is more similar in style to Coutts. For those saying Quinn was just a trier, it's worth noting he has played all but 1 season of his career at a higher level. When he was at this level, like Fleck, he was the division's top assister.
 
Cerberus Blade said:
I think both are good. McDonald was more the Coutts type though. Whereas Fleck drives forward more. When Fleck plays well we really play well. He's been a bit below his best in the last few games imo. Not bad - but not exactly on fire like he was a month ago.
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Coutts is the McDonald equivalent. They're very similar in terms of style, strength and weakness.

Fleck is a class above McDonald, if not in pure ability, then in attitude. And ability is nothing without attitude.
 
Not even a debate this. Fleck is a totally different sort of player and brings a lot more to the team.

As stated above McDonald and Coutts would be a closer comparison in terms of style. Even then I would pick Coutts. Does everything McDonald can do and more. He is also more industrious.

McDonald is alright. He's steady. He was however one of the most overrated players we've ever had. I suppose for a while our supporters weren't used to seeing someone that could control a ball with one touch and pass it to a teammate. Basics for me but whatever.
 
Coutts for me has been the player of the season, no if's or but's. would argue more influential than Fleck. But then that's arguing over your favourite Beatle (if they all played in our midfield).
 
YES Blade said:
Fleck alongside McDonald would be an awesome midfield! Coutts is a poor mans McDonald IMO.
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Both showed one in ten in past seasons, but Coutts has pulled the strings this season. McDonald couldn't wait to fuck off and insomuch wrote Weirs P45 for him. so he's got bollock all place on a Blades thread so far as I'm concerned.
 
sufcboy95 said:
I would say fleck was the best out of the two while they played for us. However think Macdonald has gone to another level since leaving us
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Patrick Suffaux said:
Not even a debate this. Fleck is a totally different sort of player and brings a lot more to the team.

As stated above McDonald and Coutts would be a closer comparison in terms of style. Even then I would pick Coutts. Does everything McDonald can do and more. He is also more industrious.

McDonald is alright. He's steady. He was however one of the most overrated players we've ever had. I suppose for a while our supporters weren't used to seeing someone that could control a ball with one touch and pass it to a teammate. Basics for me but whatever.
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He's one of the most avaricious players we've had recently - didn't he end up playing with the Wolves youth team as he had his head turned by Fulham and their promise of more cash?. How is it that people rate him and slag Hanson, etc.

McDonald has quality, but is lazy and only bothered about one thing. Fleck will have the better career because he has quality and desire. Coutts cares more as well. So glad McDonald and all the others not caring a toss about SUFC are history.
 
I've never really thought of comparing the two before, but they have a lot of weird parallels:
  • Both Scottish central midfielders.
  • Both joined us at a similar age (McDonald 23, Fleck 24).
  • Both were free agents when they joined us.
  • Big things were expected of both from a young age - Fleck mainly because he scored a wonder goal in the Scottish Youth Cup final at 18, McDonald because he scored a brace to knock Arsenal out of the cup when he was 20. But neither quite lived up to that and eventually dropped down to League One.
McDonald went on to be an established Championship central midfielder with both Wolves and Fulham - let's hope Fleck can do the same but with us. And I think he can go even further; he has more of an all-round game than McDonald. I remember there being serious doubts about KM's defensive capabilities when he first joined us, it was a bit of a surprise he was chosen for the first Sheffield derby for example.
 
PeterNdlovu081 said:
This isn't even a fucking question.

Kevin McDonald is the most overrated player ever to play for this club.
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I don't really get this. He was a stand out player while here, he then joined a side that walked the division, and then established himself as a player in the division above.

As far as the comparison goes, Fleck is a more complete player. McDonald was a fantastic passer of the ball but very clumsy in the tackle at times. Fleck is better defensively. The only edge McDonald has is that he's played at Championship level and stayed there. Fleck has to prove he can do that before I'd consider it settled.
 
Bladesway said:
Both showed one in ten in past seasons, but Coutts has pulled the strings this season. McDonald couldn't wait to fuck off and insomuch wrote Weirs P45 for him. so he's got bollock all place on a Blades thread so far as I'm concerned.
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The difference is that McDonald was actually playing well enough to attract interest from other clubs.

Had Coutts showed any sort of ability prior to this season he might have also "fucked off".

It's easy to be loyal when you're playing shit and no one wants to make you a better offer!
 
Rodley said:
He's one of the most avaricious players we've had recently - didn't he end up playing with the Wolves youth team as he had his head turned by Fulham and their promise of more cash?. How is it that people rate him and slag Hanson, etc.

McDonald has quality, but is lazy and only bothered about one thing. Fleck will have the better career because he has quality and desire. Coutts cares more as well. So glad McDonald and all the others not caring a toss about SUFC are history.
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Kevin McDonald made the best career move for Kevin McDonald when he left United, what's wrong with that? Same as John Fleck making the best move for John Fleck by joining United.

We were a complete shambles under Weir and only managed to salvage the season with a cup run and late failed playoff push under Clough whilst McDonald won the division with Wolves. He then went on to establish himself in the Championship whilst we stuck around in League One, so surely leaving was the best move for McDonald's career?

I really don't get the bitterness towards players who want to move on and better their careers, it's only like Fleck leaving Coventry for United and showing them no loyalty.
 
YES Blade said:
Kevin McDonald made the best career move for Kevin McDonald when he left United, what's wrong with that? Same as John Fleck making the best move for John Fleck by joining United.

We were a complete shambles under Weir and only managed to salvage the season with a cup run and late failed playoff push under Clough whilst McDonald won the division with Wolves. He then went on to establish himself in the Championship whilst we stuck around in League One, so surely leaving was the best move for McDonald's career?

I really don't get the bitterness towards players who want to move on and better their careers, it's only like Fleck leaving Coventry for United and showing them no loyalty.
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Fleck played 162 games for Cov and won the Fans and Players Player on the Year award during that time. I think he showed plenty of loyalty.

I've no issue with players earning good money and furthering his career. I just think McDonald has a chequered history of incidents and fallouts and has never had the attitude to make the most of his ability.

http://www.expressandstar.com/sport...ulham-bound-kevin-mcdonald-nears-wolves-exit/

Not my kind of player and not an SUFC type of player any more.
 



Fleck 100% He offers so much more for the team. MacDonald was a bit like a Maserati, flattered to deceive all too often.

With Fleck (like Jake Wright), you have to wonder why he is at this level. He's an absolute grafter, but some of the passes he picks out are sublime.

I'd like to see Fleck work on his shooting, as with Coutts, in the Championship we'll need more goals from the central pair.
 
davidblade said:
Fleck , everyday. Big games against the better teams MacDonald went missing, good player when teams stood off us but wasn't prepared to put his foot in.
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Yep, agree with that. McDonald didn't do much all that often. Coutts has at least had one good full season under his belt. You could argue that Coutts injuries were partly responsible for his lack of performance and all round fitness or the fact he is now playing under a manager who clearly gets the most out of players.

Fleck in my estimation is streets ahead as all I really remember McDonald for was going missing most games. He appeared to be one of those players who wanted a team building around him and when we did (under Weir) he took the first chance to jump ship. I don't expect undying loyalty but I do at least expect a player to stick around when the manager has clearly built a team around you and (if memory serves me right) you hadn't long since had a new contract under your nose.
 
Rodley said:
Fleck played 162 games for Cov and won the Fans and Players Player on the Year award during that time. I think he showed plenty of loyalty.

I've no issue with players earning good money and furthering his career. I just think McDonald has a chequered history of incidents and fallouts and has never had the attitude to make the most of his ability.

http://www.expressandstar.com/sport...ulham-bound-kevin-mcdonald-nears-wolves-exit/

Not my kind of player and not an SUFC type of player any more.
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I appreciate that McDonald has had a few issues but when settled at a club I can't fault his ability.

I have little doubt Fleck will be a success at Championship level, but the rest of our midfield I have big doubts. Like I said before, McDonald with Fleck would be a class midfield and an improvement on what we have it's as simple as that for me.
 
YES Blade said:
I appreciate that McDonald has had a few issues but when settled at a club I can't fault his ability.

I have little doubt Fleck will be a success at Championship level, but the rest of our midfield I have big doubts. Like I said before, McDonald with Fleck would be a class midfield and an improvement on what we have it's as simple as that for me.
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Coutts and Fleck will be good enough and Duffy should be certainly a squad member at worst. We might need a bit more power and mobility in there, a Conor Coady type, if we play 4-4-2.
 
Slightly biased opinion because Fleck is our player after signing for us and apparently money wasn't the main issue, whilst McDonald for me whilst obviously talented, is just a twat

Rightly or wrongly, I have little time for players that walk out on our club

Fleck all day long
 
Rodley said:
Coutts and Fleck will be good enough and Duffy should be certainly a squad member at worst. We might need a bit more power and mobility in there, a Conor Coady type, if we play 4-4-2.
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The reason I have doubts over Coutts is that he didn't really produce at Championship level previously and in a team that struggled (with United before this season) he's been poor.
 
Fleck, but they're different players. Fleck's all round game and attitude gives him the edge.

But anyone who doesn't think McDonald was a good player is slightly clueless or in denial. There's no debate to be had, especially when you look at what he's done since.

They'd be one hell of a pairing, that's for sure. But Coady would be more suitable for us now.
 
As good as McD was, he had a terrible injury record, his ankles were made of glass, any meaningful challenge usually meant he was out for a week, again.
 
Superbladesman7 said:
A great friday night pub debate?

Brought this up with a pal, I would 100% say John Fleck. Kevin McDonald I remember as being a very classy player with a bit of a lazy style but obviously a very good eye for a pass, bit of an assit master, not many goals. However, when you remember that a lot of his time was spent sending Ched through (who then was a better player than Sharp is now, sorry if that upsets anyone but lets not forget he got 35 without a full season!) Then it makes me think his job was made a touch easier. Plus he couldn't tackle or was too laid back to do that side of the game and come to think of it, I feel like he didn't turn up in big games.

Fleck for me can pretty much do every prt of the game, and do it exceptionally well! Hes got everything and is a real leader too!

So there you go, id have Fleck, what about you?
Click to expand...
Fleck in the team, Mc Donald cleaning his boots at training.
 
YES Blade said:
I appreciate that McDonald has had a few issues but when settled at a club I can't fault his ability.

I have little doubt Fleck will be a success at Championship level, but the rest of our midfield I have big doubts. Like I said before, McDonald with Fleck would be a class midfield and an improvement on what we have it's as simple as that for me.
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And it's simply wrong. Paul Coutts is a Rolls-Royce of a player. He's every bit as good as John Fleck and integral to everything we do. John Fleck would be the first to agree with that. They are a fantastic combination. Why anyone would want to undermine that I don't know. It must be that we're so uncomfortable with talent in S2 that we elevate the likes of non-footballers Montgomery and Doyle to favourite players.
 
Rodley said:
Coutts and Fleck will be good enough and Duffy should be certainly a squad member at worst. We might need a bit more power and mobility in there, a Conor Coady type, if we play 4-4-2.
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Coady is in and out of a mediocre Wolves team and sometimes played at right-back isn't he? He doesn't have Couttsy's quality on the ball. No contest for me.
 



YES Blade said:
The reason I have doubts over Coutts is that he didn't really produce at Championship level previously and in a team that struggled (with United before this season) he's been poor.
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He had a serious injury, which took a long time from which to recover, just as it would any player. He has a good deal more Championship experience than John Fleck. They will both be excellent next season, as they have this. Neither would want the other to be replaced, especially by a talentless ragamuffin of the kind so popular in S2.
 
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