Wilder grateful for boards support

[blade too long]

You can't validate opinion though. If I don't like egg white, I don't like it, no one is going to tell me I do, not even my mum.

well unless Al Bumen is on our board its not relevant

 

[BushBlade]

well unless Al Bumen is on our board its not relevant

Of course it is. Liking KM isn't about logic or rationality, it's about emotion and feeling.

 

[sitwell]

Better we chat about the colour of the pigs kit or some other unrelated topic rather than something relevant to the club we all support you mean? Theres a nice thread about our third kit if the waters too hot in here.

TOTM ?

 

[blade too long]

Of course it is. Liking KM isn't about logic or rationality, it's about emotion and feeling.

well I dont like the wife but have learnt how to accept her decisions
and to be fair , every now and again shes right
just like mccabe the last time being 2006

 

[Kevincarterversion2.0]

Good piece of club creeping journalism from JS.

 

[Bladesway]

pretend ,
its not me espousing theories purely based on assumptions something negatives got to happen
because it has on the odd occasion

Everything we all do and say is based on hearsay and assumptions/what if. That is you, me and everyone else. Only looking backwards can we get any track record. McCabes isn't good, but I know he bought you dinner so all is well.

 

[Woodwardfan]

You're confusing the appointments of Robson and Wilson regarding KM's comments.
Apart from that I tend to agree but would, for the sake of balance, say that running a football club is actually very difficult and KM isn't the only one to get it horrendously wrong. Whilst I'm one of his biggest critics, I accept that I probably wouldn't do any better, in the same way that I'm critical of footballers who are far, far better than I could ever be.

Am I saying cut KM some slack? Maybe but probably not, it comes with the territory. I don't agree with some of the abuse he gets though and like Bladesway, I'd rather him succeed than leave.

Did Bladesway actually say that??!! "Rather him succeed than leave", well, well

 

[Woodwardfan]

I'm not actually but I worded it poorly so it seemed like I was.

The comments came after choosing Wilson over RDM. What made them so ridiculous was that he was the man who appointed Robson before that. And he was arguably proven wrong with the outcome of the two managers' respective seasons (though there are loads of contributory factors there).

I agree it's not easy and they will all get things wrong. But some posters seem to thing that he's some sort of club hero that's been let down by managers and bad luck (a myth he loves). He's actually done lots wrong. Some of it, the benefit of hindsight is needed. Some of it, it's not and was just plain stupid.

I'm not aware of any posters who think McCabe is a hero. Name us one or two. Nobody I ever recall said that, just said he was someone who tried and failed, but some thank him for trying at least, others hate him for failing. There's a whole world of sentiment between the two extremes.

 

[Barney]

I'm not aware of any posters who think McCabe is a hero. Name us one or two. Nobody I ever recall said that, just said he was someone who tried and failed, but some thank him for trying at least, others hate him for failing. There's a whole world of sentiment between the two extremes.

Unlikely given the rumours about what he'd want, but would you be in favour of McCabe selling the club?

 

[blade too long]

Unlikely given the rumours about what he'd want, but would you be in favour of McCabe selling the club?

Wheres the consortium or billionaire popping up from
Fresh money would be a god send , but Im more likely to win tomorrow's euro lottery

 

[Barney]

Wheres the consortium or billionaire popping up from
Fresh money would be a god send , but Im more likely to win tomorrow's euro lottery

I said it'd be unlikely, but it doesn't matter how realistic it is.

I'm asking hypothetically to try and understand somebody else's opinion.

 

[Worksop II]

but Im more likely to win tomorrow's euro lottery

£37 million tomorrow, not enough to buy McCabe out ........................ i dont fink so anyway

 

[Woodwardfan]

Unlikely given the rumours about what he'd want, but would you be in favour of McCabe selling the club?

Good question, mixed feelings. I fear for clubs with 100% foreign owners who might not see things through. For example Wednesday, if things don't work out during the next couple of years where will they stand? All it takes is for them to have misjudged this current manager who will spend about £50m by the end of next season and yet could well fail, likely will fail. Then they choose another manager, spend another £50m and where will they be if he fails too, as we all know that can easily happen.

I like the fact McCabe is a Blade but he hasn't chosen a really good manager EVER IMO !! He has not had proper value for his money and we have all suffered as a result.

No bad luck ( apart from Tevez which was a scandal) just bad managers who haven't got it all together to achieve what was there for the taking. Warnock, Robson et al; mostly unambitious choices apart from one who was way over-ambitious and even more unrealistic, plain stupid in fact, though I understand the motivation to 'step up a level or two into the big league'.

I'm a similar age to McCabe and I like peace of mind and contentment that I am preserving my kids' inheritance while enjoying my retirement and the remainder of my life. McCabe must be all over the place, racked with guilt about the losses and really sorry that he has reduced his kids' inheritance by £60m or so and maybe more to follow. Added to that he will feel guilt as a Blade who failed fellow Blades. All football club owners are misguided egotists and what has happened with us will keep McCabe awake at night, no doubt about that whatsoever.

I would be please if he could release himself from our club with a face-saving legacy of a brilliant new owner. Yes I'd like him to leave for his sake as well as ours. Nobody successor could achieve so little with so much investment, or could they?

 

[Trueblade]

But we did release 10 and cancel the contracts of a further two and not renew the loans of a further 3 (so 15 out in total- on top of the likes of Collins, Higdon, Khan, Dimaio etc. that Adkins got rid of) to make room for the 6 he’s brought in to date.

Absolutely agree with you. But Wilder was indicating a couple of weeks ago we would have to see a few of those listed go before he could anymore over the line.

I would be interested to know what percentage of the wage budget was cut in those ten released alone.

 

[blade too long]

£37 million tomorrow, not enough to buy McCabe out ........................ i dont fink so anyway

needs to be at least double that

 

[blade too long]

I said it'd be unlikely, but it doesn't matter how realistic it is.

I'm asking hypothetically to try and understand somebody else's opinion.

I wanted McCabe out , 2 years ago
but hes back in the game , said so himself when I asked him , he cant let go

 

[Barney]

but hes back in the game , said so himself when I asked him , he cant let go

Nothing to do with whether he's back in the game.

It's decision making and his has been poor.

 

[Pollingtonblade]

I wanted McCabe out , 2 years ago
but hes back in the game , said so himself when I asked him , he cant let go

Did you tell him that?

This thread is making my fucking teeth itch!!!

 

[blade too long]

All chairmen appoint the wrong managers at times..man utd have picked a few pigs ears of late but have now got the portuguese Chris Wilder

 

[Worksop II]

needs to be at least double that

£75 million for a 3rd division club .... ha!!

 

[Fulwood Blade]

Yes I grant you if someone offers £5m for Che then fair enough. But in the real world I still wake up with cold sweats over the utter shambles that was the deal for Harry McGuire. Only at SUFC. And let's remember that wasn't that long ago.

yes you have a point - and although the people in charge talk about re-investing money in new transfers, wages have caused us a massive problem over the past few years. There has been mis-management, but it seems to me that we have made gambles that haven't happened - and those gambles are being exploited by other clubs (Hull and Brighton). Some can say as much as they like about "don't sell, get more - etc, but the reality is we had bills to pay.

I am not disagreeing with you or anyone about our prize assets being given away cheaply - it's just a hole we have got ourselves into and as has been witnessed, is now very difficult to get ourselves out.

I am most definitely a glass half full and for the first time in a long time, CW has got me excited again at what might happen.

Winder COULD be the third coming - after Bassett and Warnock and give us some good times again. We are as a club quite unique - and history seems to show that we need managers like the Wilders of this world as against Clough/Adkins type.

UTB

 

[Woodwardfan]

£75 million for a 3rd division club .... ha!!

Half a club, no freehold - £8m?

We need to be top half Premier League for McCabe to hope to recover his losses!! - 5 year plan ending 2017??!!

 

[Woodwardfan]

yes you have a point - and although the people in charge talk about re-investing money in new transfers, wages have caused us a massive problem over the past few years. There has been mis-management, but it seems to me that we have made gambles that haven't happened - and those gambles are being exploited by other clubs (Hull and Brighton). Some can say as much as they like about "don't sell, get more - etc, but the reality is we had bills to pay.

I am not disagreeing with you or anyone about our prize assets being given away cheaply - it's just a hole we have got ourselves into and as has been witnessed, is now very difficult to get ourselves out.

I am most definitely a glass half full and for the first time in a long time, CW has got me excited again at what might happen.

Winder COULD be the third coming - after Bassett and Warnock and give us some good times again. We are as a club quite unique - and history seems to show that we need managers like the Wilders of this world as against Clough/Adkins type.

UTB

I'll join you in excitement if we sign another 3 good players - central defence, box to box midfield and target man striker. As yet we are a good bit short.

 

[Bladesway]

Did Bladesway actually say that??!! "Rather him succeed than leave", well, well

Always said that WWF you just choose your own story.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

That's if you don't count Edgar, Sammon, Woolford, Sharp because of timings and then Hammond and Baptiste. Adkins had the 'luxury' of taking plenty of time to assess the bloated squad plus his his signings and the wages of well over 30 players Murphy departed in mid-August and his fee helped cover the costs of those that joined us on top of all the others, probably a £6m wage bill despite the transfer fee income which helped of course.

All those new players were on real money on top of those already there. Murphy desperately wanted to leave and no wonder it happened on top of all that expense with as you say Hammond yet to arrive and Baptiste though the latter was for only a short time.

Thing is though, when he was sold, Phipps was explicit in stating that the proceeds would be invested back into the team. Not that they would simply cover the cost of the crap we’d already amassed.

If player power was the reason for the sale and not financial necessity (these were the lines peddled by the club) then those funds should have been available to acquire new players.


And let’s not forget, to offset the wages of those you mention, between May 2015 and May 2016 we offloaded:


Michael Doyle

Ian Turner

Ben Davies

Steven Davies

Jason Holt

Kyle Scarisbrick

Sam Berry

Craig Alcock

Ottis Khan

Michael Higdon

Connor Dimaio

Neil Collins



Of those there are 4 U21 players so 8 who were part of the first team squad went on top of Murphy’s wage and all the players we loaned out for periods of the season (Kennedy, DCL, Banton, Brooks, McNulty, Freeman, Harris, Scougall, JCR etc.)



Surely the net effect of shedding all those players compared to those we brought in has to be a saving for the club. On balance, I’d suggest Adkins was afforded nowhere near the luxuries that Clough was. Nor did we live out your mantra of giving him a year to get things as he wants them.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

the boards made errors in the past

funny how you forgot it got us to several play offs too ,

wheres that side of a balanced argument gone

our boards picked some shitty managers
theres a lot of other clubs that regretted their choices
thats why managers life span now is 15 months

but other clubs fans , seem to be able to move on
wonder why we dont

Managers’ lifespans are what they are because as a society, we have a “I want it now” mentality. Not all of our managers have been crap. In my time watching the blades Heath, Robson and Weir are the rank bad managers we have appointed. Adams did appallingly bad for us but that might be a case of wrong time and place as he has done OK in other jobs. Warnock was a very good manager but we thought we could do better with a “name”. Blackwell had us treading water whilst cutting our cloth but he lost to Warnock so a knee-jerk sacking. Wilson did OK whilst again being stripped of any assets and was very harshly sacked. Clough did great at first but got his recruitment wrong and came up short before being sacked only to replace him with Adkins who we had no intention of backing and expected him to conjure a magical promotion and sacked him when he failed to do so. Perhaps if we’d stuck with Warnock or even Blackwell we might have never been in this mess. If we’d stuck with Wilson or Clough we might have been out of it by now.


The board haven’t just made mistakes appointing poor managers. They have made the same mistakes over and over without learning. They have lied to the fans more than once. They have undermined every manager they have appointed by selling their best players and then sacked them when they fail because of what the board has done. Our managers’ haven’t all been serial failures. Our board has.


And finishing between 3rd and 6th in League 1 is not an achievement to balance against the criticism. It is an indictment of how shit they have made us.


You have a go at others for not adding balance. From what I see most are hopeful under Wilder whilst still maintaining a wait and see approach having been burned by our board so many times before. That is balanced. What is not balanced is saying things like “you can only see Robson was a bad appointment in hindsight” or “we don’t miss any player that has previously failed to get us promoted” or any other ridiculous excuse you care to make up.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

Full season wages for Edgar, Sharp, Sammon, Woolford and over half a season for Hammond on big money. All on top of a bloated squad which included Brayford and Done, Coutts and Freeman, all on good wages. Probably 12 players or so more than we needed to get through the season. No pressure to shift a few out though inevitably numbers had to go by the New Year and then some of those will have been on subsidised wages.

I'd still call the scenario where Adkins was permitted sifnings before departures as very generous and for League 1 levels, "throwing money at it".

Mor so than we are this summer for Wilder, that's for sure. He has to trim the wage bill in amongst his dealings. There was no mention of that for Adkins despite Clough's excesses.

It might not have been mentioned but it happened. Clough released some at the end of the season and loads were injured (Harris, Done, Flynn, Kennedy, Coutts, Alcock etc.) so he couldn’t get them out straight away but my previous post detailing the outs compared to the ins (and not having the benefit of controlling s retained list) meant Adkins had it much harder. Wilder has been able to cull 10 straight away on top of what Adkins had already culled. That puts him in a much healthier position to build a capable squad to play his own way even if the overall cost is reduced.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

why
like most league one clubs we occasionally have to sell our assets
we have sold about 5 players we could moan about since 2012

how many other clubs have sold less than us
if I said it was 10

how many players have say Swindon sold , or Coventry , or Millwall

its football , its how it works

When you say “moan about” do you mean the sales that significantly weakened us? If so, since the summer of 2012:-


Lowton

Quinn

Blackman

McDonald

Maguire

Murphy


That’s 6 key players sold in four years. That is not “occasionally”. That’s the best player every season. Probably Chesterfield and Swindon have sold more. I’d be interested if you could tell me any other club who has sold more than 6 key players in the last 4 years in our league? Who are the clubs? Who are the players?

 

[1danewhitehouse]

My last paragraph that you mention covered the current situation with Lewin and was not intended to compare with the Maguire or Murphy transfers. Similar forces do come into play though and I merely gave an opinion that Wilder will be involved in the value decisions which always have to be made. However in Lewin's case he is not a first choice player and therefore the opportunity to look after the short term rather than have to give the lad a pay-rise to keep him happy for a while certainly alters the dynamics of the dilemma.

Ah fair enough. I took it to be more general so to include Adams as well. I suppose with Lewin there is the fact that he’s not first choice so it’s all about potential like with Slew.

 

[1danewhitehouse]

but Im on about conspiracy theories , that our fans have, and are based entirely on beer talk
these arent based on hypothesis , just a dislike of mccabe , which isnt scientifically valid

Where do you think the dislike of McCabe comes from? Do you think we all just wake up one day and decide we don’t like the look of his face?


Or do you think it has something to do with the lies, arrogance, contempt he has shown to the fans, all whilst presiding over the worst period in our history?


I agree that some go too far with the claims he’s making money out of us when all the evidence shows he’s been losing money (like 90% of chairmen) but his reign has been disastrous and he still wants to sit about blaming luck, not coming up with any sort of meaningful strategy and assuming it will all come good in the end because we are Sheffield United. He deserves an awful lot of criticism.