When Did Away Ends Start

[wardonia_blade]

On Wednesday, the Hull fans will be in the lower tier of the Bramall Lane end. The Blades fans will be in the other parts of the ground. This segregation will be a major factor in crowd control and safety.

This segregation of fans is not organisational rocket science. However, for a large part of the late 1960’s and 1970’s when crowd disorder was commonplace, predictable and expected it never seemed to dawn on anyone that this segregation was needed.

Going to an away match in this era, especially a youngster like me going to an unfamiliar ground for the first time, you were taking your life in your hands. On several occasions I remember ending up on the home kop and even if you ended up on the “other” end the security people allowed the home lot to “come round” from the their Kop to start trouble at your end.

At the Lane, on several occasions, I remember large numbers of early-arriving away fans to come on the Kop, notably Leeds and Manchester United in the early 70’s. Trouble ensued. Who would have guessed.

Anyway, although I have vivid memories of being chased around Bolton’s Lever End, getting punched on the Kippax when Dearden equalised and generally keeping my gob shut when we lost 5-1 at Leeds, the thing I cannot remember is when the formal away-end / home end started. Did it all start on one day? Was it gradual? Did it vary from ground-to-ground?

Anyone?

 

[Pollingtonblade]

Shrewsbury 1986

 

[wardonia_blade]

Shrewsbury 1986

Thanks - Any more detail ?

 

[Maidenhead]

On Wednesday, the Hull fans will be in the lower tier of the Bramall Lane end. The Blades fans will be in the other parts of the ground.

No they won't

 

[BigBed]

On Wednesday the Hull fans will be celebrating not seeing their team get thrashed a BDTBL.

 

[Silent Blade]

Wendy fans had the Lane End in the Easter 1980 Sheffield derby match, Leeds fans had had the Lane End in March 1985. Not sure when strict segregation started. LS26BLADE said start of 1986-87 season
'

 

[Berlin Blade]

I was wondering when ‘trouble’ started at the football. When I see really old pictures from the 30s and 40s with all the old boys in flat caps I always wonder if it used to kick off? And if not, when did that begin and why/how? Perhaps it happened a few times and then became a bit of a craze that hasn’t ever really died out. Anyone know?

 

[Digs blade]

Wendy fans had the Lane End in the Easter 1980 Sheffield derby match, Leeds fans had had the Lane End in March 1985. Not sure when strict segregation started. LS26BLADE said start of 1986-87 season
'

Way before then surely but what is meant by strict segregation?

Pretty certain in my first season 78/79 away fans were nowhere in the ground apart from the Bramall Lane end lower.

 

[Keen Blade]

I was wondering when ‘trouble’ started at the football. When I see really old pictures from the 30s and 40s with all the old boys in flat caps I always wonder if it used to kick off? And if not, when did that begin and why/how? Perhaps it happened a few times and then became a bit of a craze that hasn’t ever really died out. Anyone know?

Teddy boys arrived in the 50s in the post-war emancipation of youth , but whether they went to football I dunno. The mods & rockers fought in the early 60s , but again I dunno if football was a venue. I was born in '58 so came to footy in the second half of the 60s - certainly by the end of the 60s , it was there , along with chanting , silk scarves tied to your wrist etc. But you'd need to get hold of a social history book for the proper detail.

 

[Cheets]

It was definitely late 70s. Not sure of the exact year because I was only a kid. I remember a chant that time of "We don't need no segregation" to the tune of 'Brick In The Wall'.

 

[Silent Blade]

I was wondering when ‘trouble’ started at the football. When I see really old pictures from the 30s and 40s with all the old boys in flat caps I always wonder if it used to kick off? And if not, when did that begin and why/how? Perhaps it happened a few times and then became a bit of a craze that hasn’t ever really died out. Anyone know?

Millwall had crowd trouble in the 1930s.

Some spectators at Bramall Lane regularly changed ends by walking through the Pavilion end but SUFC stopped that during either the 1962/63 or 1963/64 season (HodgysBrokenThumb will know) because there were a bit of fighting when fans from both teams were crossing each other

 

[Alan Birchenall's hair]

Away ends definitely by the late 60s/very early 70s, although not always adhered to......

 

[metalblade]

Away ends started with all ticket games

 

[pommpey]

I remember fan violent rivalry stemming back to the late sixties and early seventies. By the time I joined Gleadless Valley school in '74 and tribal lines were drawn between the largely snorty Bankwood and Herdings cohort and the moderately clean Hemsworth posse, the violent chants and songs had firm hold, straight from the kops of he respective teams and as I recall when I went with my dad and we stood on the BLLT, we hurriedly stayed away from any building trouble. The chants and threats of a shoeing were there though even from my early recollections.

pommpey

 

[Keen Blade]

On Wednesday, the Hull fans will be in the lower tier of the Bramall Lane end. The Blades fans will be in the other parts of the ground. This segregation will be a major factor in crowd control and safety.

This segregation of fans is not organisational rocket science. However, for a large part of the late 1960’s and 1970’s when crowd disorder was commonplace, predictable and expected it never seemed to dawn on anyone that this segregation was needed.

Going to an away match in this era, especially a youngster like me going to an unfamiliar ground for the first time, you were taking your life in your hands. On several occasions I remember ending up on the home kop and even if you ended up on the “other” end the security people allowed the home lot to “come round” from the their Kop to start trouble at your end.

At the Lane, on several occasions, I remember large numbers of early-arriving away fans to come on the Kop, notably Leeds and Manchester United in the early 70’s. Trouble ensued. Who would have guessed.

Anyway, although I have vivid memories of being chased around Bolton’s Lever End, getting punched on the Kippax when Dearden equalised and generally keeping my gob shut when we lost 5-1 at Leeds, the thing I cannot remember is when the formal away-end / home end started. Did it all start on one day? Was it gradual? Did it vary from ground-to-ground?

Anyone?

The younger male home fans would always congregate in the cheapest standing area which gave a decent view , which tended to be behind one of the goals ... often termed a Kop , which by its very nature was a hill to defend against all comers.
No such thing as strict segregation until you remove the ability to pay on the turnstile.
Which occasionally happened in the old days at "all-ticket" matches ... But then you had to control who bought the tickets , which was nowhere near foolproof.
Once all-seater stadia came after 1989 , the club's/police had an easier job , because mass movement on the terraces disappeared overnight - Taylor said his report was into 'Safety' but really it was football's golden opportunity to move out of the working class into the middle class.
It was blatant social engineering - the prices went up , the players wages went up , TV & Italia 90 made it a popular thing to do for so-called "decent" people - the hooligan scum were quite literally priced-out and even if they could afford to attend , the lack of terracing stopped their antics.
So it was sanitised into something it never was - one of many entertainment options for the middle class , instead of an habitual allegiance for a manual labour working class which exists no more in the steelworks , mines , shipyards , car-factories , cutlery factories , engineering shops of our country which now manufactures next to nowt.
And has left cities & towns in the North & Midlands to stagnate.
Look at the 92 + see where the London & SouthEastern clubs are - then fetch out a set of league tables from the 60s.
See where Brighton , Bournemouth & Brentford were , just for starters.
Follow the money and that will always tell you the story.

 

[finlaytheblade]

On Wednesday, the Hull fans will be in the lower tier of the Bramall Lane end. The Blades fans will be in the other parts of the ground. This segregation will be a major factor in crowd control and safety.

This segregation of fans is not organisational rocket science. However, for a large part of the late 1960’s and 1970’s when crowd disorder was commonplace, predictable and expected it never seemed to dawn on anyone that this segregation was needed.

Going to an away match in this era, especially a youngster like me going to an unfamiliar ground for the first time, you were taking your life in your hands. On several occasions I remember ending up on the home kop and even if you ended up on the “other” end the security people allowed the home lot to “come round” from the their Kop to start trouble at your end.

At the Lane, on several occasions, I remember large numbers of early-arriving away fans to come on the Kop, notably Leeds and Manchester United in the early 70’s. Trouble ensued. Who would have guessed.

Anyway, although I have vivid memories of being chased around Bolton’s Lever End, getting punched on the Kippax when Dearden equalised and generally keeping my gob shut when we lost 5-1 at Leeds, the thing I cannot remember is when the formal away-end / home end started. Did it all start on one day? Was it gradual? Did it vary from ground-to-ground?

Anyone?

Some segregation happened in the 60's .But
I got 2 tickets for the Derby at Hillsborough in 1979 no problem what so ever( north stand).forgot the score !!!.

 

[Alan Birchenall's hair]

Aged 13, I went on the SUT coach with my Dad (although he was an Owls fan) to the 0-0 draw at Leicester, Easter 1971. My Dad knew nowt about away ends etc, and we went on the Leicester Kop at 2:00 pm, me with my red and white scarf on. He went off to the bog, only to come back and find me being jostled by a gang of Leicester fans. Cue my Dad launching into a 'Captain Hurricane' (see The Valiant comic) style 'Raging Fury', picking up Leicester fans by the scruff of the neck and hurling them about like the Captain used to do with Japanese soldiers. My dad was a tough ex Coldstream Guardsman. Nobody fucked with him.....

 

[Bill puntin]

On Wednesday, the Hull fans will be in the lower tier of the Bramall Lane end. The Blades fans will be in the other parts of the ground. This segregation will be a major factor in crowd control and safety.

This segregation of fans is not organisational rocket science. However, for a large part of the late 1960’s and 1970’s when crowd disorder was commonplace, predictable and expected it never seemed to dawn on anyone that this segregation was needed.

Going to an away match in this era, especially a youngster like me going to an unfamiliar ground for the first time, you were taking your life in your hands. On several occasions I remember ending up on the home kop and even if you ended up on the “other” end the security people allowed the home lot to “come round” from the their Kop to start trouble at your end.

At the Lane, on several occasions, I remember large numbers of early-arriving away fans to come on the Kop, notably Leeds and Manchester United in the early 70’s. Trouble ensued. Who would have guessed.

Anyway, although I have vivid memories of being chased around Bolton’s Lever End, getting punched on the Kippax when Dearden equalised and generally keeping my gob shut when we lost 5-1 at Leeds, the thing I cannot remember is when the formal away-end / home end started. Did it all start on one day? Was it gradual? Did it vary from ground-to-ground?

Anyone?

I think it was a gradual thing, I remember going with my dad in late fifties to main road we ended up on their Kop withe my blades hat and scarf on and they were great passing me down to front with other kids so we could see. How times change.

 

[Keen Blade]

I remember fan violent rivalry stemming back to the late sixties and early seventies. By the time I joined Gleadless Valley school in '74 and tribal lines were drawn between the largely snorty Bankwood and Herdings cohort and the moderately clean Hemsworth posse, the violent chants and songs had firm hold, straight from the kops of he respective teams and as I recall when I went with my dad and we stood on the BLLT, we hurriedly stayed away from any building trouble. The chants and threats of a shoeing were there though even from my early recollections.

pommpey

Yep , late 60s is when it took off + Kops had a "leader" - I believe Shoreham's was 'Eskimo' though I've no idea why he had that moniker or the exact years of his "reign"

 

[metalblade]

I went to the first derby game at the sty after the disaster United fans were on every stand including their kop. Zenith data cup game about 1990 no segrigation at all SYP advised not to do it but Unitedite bought ticket from the sty.

 

[Keen Blade]

I think it was a gradual thing, I remember going with my dad in late fifties to main road we ended up on their Kop withe my blades hat and scarf on and they were great passing me down to front with other kids so we could see. How times change.

Great story !
I'm fairly sure it crept in during the 60s.
If I had to guess , I would say it followed the "tribal" era of mods & rockers.
The famous battle of Brighton beach was1964.
We won the World Cup in 1966.
The simmering teenage rebellion mushroomed and violence between factions was just one expression of it.
It's strange , I would never condone wanton gratuitous violence and yet I do get the adolescent frustration felt + why it happens.
The Who are my all time favourite rock-band (out of the many dozens which i love) ... Probably because of the amount of emotions including frustration & anger , which is in their music.

 

[Bert]

Yep , late 60s is when it took off + Kops had a "leader" - I believe Shoreham's was 'Eskimo' though I've no idea why he had that moniker or the exact years of his "reign"

He used to wear a Parka, furry hud, Eskimo style.

 

[SheepdipBlade]

I was wondering when ‘trouble’ started at the football. When I see really old pictures from the 30s and 40s with all the old boys in flat caps I always wonder if it used to kick off? And if not, when did that begin and why/how? Perhaps it happened a few times and then became a bit of a craze that hasn’t ever really died out. Anyone know?

In some of the history books about the Blades, I remember reading of trouble kicking off at a match between a City XI and a Derbyshire XI (from Norton, Greenhill area) and that was in the 1870s.

I also remember reading that Blackburn fans trashed the trains taking them to London in the 1890s.

 

[Bill puntin]

Yep , late 60s is when it took off + Kops had a "leader" - I believe Shoreham's was 'Eskimo' though I've no idea why he had that moniker or the exact years of his "reign"
[/QUOTE
I remember Willy being a bit of a leader on the kop away fans used to go looking for him, think they wished they’d not found him.

 

[Hagansbootlaces]

First went to the Lane in 71, the BL end was the away end then, although I do remember for some odd reason as dad had season tickets in the old John St stand, we stood in the 'away' end corner when we played Fulham (with George Best)

 

[Karaoke Blade]

My Dad started taking me to the Lane regularly in the early 1970s and we'd usually stand behind the net on the lower Bramall Lane end. A mix of Blades and away fans and I can't remember any trouble. I seem to recall most of the trouble started once we started playing with the 'big boys' from 1971-72 onwards, Man U, Newcastle, Leeds, and that seemed to be centred on the kop. Lots of fighting on the kop with Man City in 1967 as well (my first ever Blades match).
I suspect, as already mentioned, proper segregation came with the advent of 'all ticket' matches.

 

[Edgar Allan Poo]

Got my one and only pasting from Leeds fans as a teenager attending a game on my own for the first time back in the 70's as I entered the Shoreham.

 

[Yewsman]

I remember going to games at BDTBL late 60’s and both sets of supporters were on the Kop with a line of police between them but not surprisingly there would frequently be fighting between respective fans. Also remember going to derby at the Sty and being in the Blades fans on Hillsborough Kop with line of police between. Can’t remember when segregation same in but think it was very late 60’s/early 70’s. Seem to remember away fans being escorted by police to Bramall Lane “ away end”.

 

[Jonboy60]

Yep , late 60s is when it took off + Kops had a "leader" - I believe Shoreham's was 'Eskimo' though I've no idea why he had that moniker or the exact years of his "reign"

I remember Eskimo, he was called at that time a ‘greaser.’ A lot of the so called greasers went in the coronation cafe on (I think) Langset or infirmary rd.

 

[SUFC Handsworth]

Recall one of my first away games at Oldham in the mid 70s, most of our fans were on the open bank behind the net, although we were on the terrace in front of the main stand. I guess when I first started going mid/late 70s, grounds had generally segregated in to home and away ends, although I can still remember pockets of our fans going on the Lane end lower standing, and away fans on our Kop. Liverpool LC in 1978 springs to mind and the pigs in 1980. Also, recall our fans in large numbers on all four sides of the ground regularly at Millmoor in the late 70s and into the 80s, ditto Boxing Day at the sty and other games there since.