Total embarrassment...

[OO 21]

Everything alright at home mate?

 

[Bellypork]

The thing is, are there circumstances where you would assent to a Wednesdayesque approach for the sake of the points?

Would United have gleaned a point at bonny 'Boro with such a strategy, for instance?

After all, points make prizes.

All matters discussed by Owls and Blades mates in the de-brief down at the local at the weekend.

At least after the name-calling and finger-pointing had subsided.

And what if other teams come to the Lane and employ similar tactics to the Owls?

If so, what does Tufty need to do to overcome them?

 

[alcoblade]

Honestly? As things are going, they won't go down, we won't go up, and we'll start again next season in the same league separated by alphabetical order, together in gnawing, clawing mediocrity, with the only points of boast being that, whilst they can only command 25% possession when they play out insipid draws, we can get to 75%. They will also claim they've not got their full side out, yet again. Our 30+ players will be a year older, a year closer to retirement, the quality keeper will have returned to his parent club, we'll have lost at least one of norwood/fleck/joc, the market value of what we need to bring in will be 25% higher, the owners will be still at loggerheads & CW more frustrated. But lets not dwell on the current and the downbeat, as tempting as trumpeting our 2nd 0-0 against them is, let's collectively fantasize about next season's game at BDTBL (hopefully under the lights & on TV), where we kick off and sit on the ball for 90 minutes without a challenge been made or an attack being attempted, allowing our fans the opportunity to give each other reach-arounds & teabag each other, due the fact we've hit 99.9% possession and we can all go home a sweaty, excited mess with 1 point in the bag. Whoopy. Fucking. Doooo. We will then truly be the kings of Sheffield and all we survey. Sheffield isn't red & white nor is it blue & white, it's fucking beige. Faded beige at that.

You’ve used my point about how poor they were to turn it into a mega moan about our own club, for some bizarre reason.

They are the poorest team I’ve seen at BDTBL this season. Have you seen anyone worse, based on what you saw on Friday.

On a completely seperdte note, we’ve got our own issues to sort out, if we’re serious about promotion.

 

[vorpal blade]

Villa were no great shakes.

At least Wednesday had a plan and it worked.

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

You’ve used my point about how poor they were to turn it into a mega moan about our own club, for some bizarre reason.

They are the poorest team I’ve seen at BDTBL this season. Have you seen anyone worse, based on what you saw on Friday.

On a completely seperdte note, we’ve got our own issues to sort out, if we’re serious about promotion.

Not really a mega moan about the club, AB. More an exaggerated post in sheer frustration at some of the posts being made on this forum, and the red tinted logic that some of us are employing to defend the pattern developing. I want the Blades to do well & Wednesday to be properly put in their box. The only way to do that us for us to get promoted (and stay there) and them not. It is as simple as that. That would shift the dynamic between the two clubs for the next generation. Anything that doesn't increase the possibility off that happening, doesn't further that ambition or appears to be be misguided praise gets on my nerves at the moment.

Your point about Wednesday being poor and being in trouble is really neither here nor there. They are that poor that they have come to BDTBL and got quite an easy 0-0. After successfully changing their formation and asking players to play different roles, something our superior set-up can't seem to do. That doesn't reflect on us particularly well on us does it? They did the same thing last season, the only difference being they forced a cracking save from Moore that could've made it 0-1.

After a season and a half, we've not seemed to work out a way of altering that? Not against them, not against other limited sides. That's worrying to me, time is ticking away and time is our enemy for a number of reasons. If we are not careful, time will put us back into League 1 without the means of ever getting out again.

From what i'd seen of their keeper he was a bag of nerves/poor and yet again, as with Pantilimon v. Forest, due to the purity of our collective footballing ethos we've not put him under one iota of concerted pressure, no stinging long shots, nothing put under bar, nothing in the glare of the floodlights, nothing to test his handling and nobody loosening his cough early on. The biggest game of his young career, he & the defence have let in goals left right and centre, the conditions were poor, the pitch greasy and we've not tested the fibre of his fabric and yet some of us are crowing about 75% possession? I can't see the justification in it tbh, he should've come off that pitch after 90 minutes a broken man.

The bit about them being in trouble is nonsense as well, as there are at least 3 worse teams than them this season. But it's just the type of comments that are coming out post Friday night as an excuse or justification. After a bad run of results, they came for a point against better opposition and got one. We on the other hand wanted to win a home game against inferior opposition and failed miserably at the second attempt. Why should it be viewed as some sort of moral victory for us? I'd be delighted if we'd managed to implement & execute the same type of plan at Boro, Bristol, Derby & Forest .That might sound like i'm favouring the pragmatic over the romantic, the compact over the expansive, and you'd be right. Four more points in the bag now and we'd be top of the league, and at season's end it's the type of play that has earned you an extra 10 to 15 points and gets you promoted.

For all the huffing and puffing and posturing we do about how good we are as a team and how nice our football is, we are now becoming held back by it. What we are is good at keeping and passing the ball in non threatening areas. Like Crewe used to do under Dario Gradi and like Auxerre did under Guy Roux, didn't win anything, but pretty on the eye. And in some instances it's self fulfilling, because teams now know we like doing it and let us, which we do, which increases our possession stats and it gets everyone excited and encourages us to do it more. When it all boils down to it, possession without purpose is as bad as aimless long balls, don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

Tactics are due to the manager and the coaching staff. Our ability to pass and retain possession in non threatening areas has improved since last season, and our ability to pick up points/defend points in important games has remained static. That's my area of concern. Our lack of a Plan B has been evident for nearly a season and a half, and yet we boast about possession stats? We've delayed putting the ball into the box for a season and a half and it's only just being mentioned? JOC was shit at attacking set pieces last season, and he's still shit at it this. We are still dragging both forwards out wide to involve themselves in aimless passing triangles. Other than DH & Norwood, our recruitment has been poor. We are crying out for one, just one player of quality upfront and we keep on signing toss. When I say toss, I mean Lundstram, Washington, Johnson, Crainie, Leonard, Holmes, Thomas, Evans, Wilson, Woodburn toss.

As I said, no matter how bad we're claiming Wednesday to be and how good we are, the way we're are going we'll still be in the same division next season. We've picked up 5 points out of 15 and are beginning to drift, we've got Brentford, Leeds & WBA coming up who are all good sides, and Rotherham won't lay down for us either. It's not inconceivable that by mid December we'll be within 2 or 3 places off wednesday in lower mid table, and then all we'll have to boast about is moral victories.

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

Everything alright at home mate?

No, I've had a letter saying that my gas & electric charges are going up in the new year and it's knocked me for six. It's made me question everything & re-evaluate things.

 

[Roygbiv]

Not really a mega moan about the club, AB. More an exaggerated post in sheer frustration at some of the posts being made on this forum, and the red tinted logic that some of us are employing to defend the pattern developing. I want the Blades to do well & Wednesday to be properly put in their box. The only way to do that us for us to get promoted (and stay there) and them not. It is as simple as that. That would shift the dynamic between the two clubs for the next generation. Anything that doesn't increase the possibility off that happening, doesn't further that ambition or appears to be be misguided praise gets on my nerves at the moment.

Your point about Wednesday being poor and being in trouble is really neither here nor there. They are that poor that they have come to BDTBL and got quite an easy 0-0. After successfully changing their formation and asking players to play different roles, something our superior set-up can't seem to do. That doesn't reflect on us particularly well on us does it? They did the same thing last season, the only difference being they forced a cracking save from Moore that could've made it 0-1.

After a season and a half, we've not seemed to work out a way of altering that? Not against them, not against other limited sides. That's worrying to me, time is ticking away and time is our enemy for a number of reasons. If we are not careful, time will put us back into League 1 without the means of ever getting out again.

From what i'd seen of their keeper he was a bag of nerves/poor and yet again, as with Pantilimon v. Forest, due to the purity of our collective footballing ethos we've not put him under one iota of concerted pressure, no stinging long shots, nothing put under bar, nothing in the glare of the floodlights, nothing to test his handling and nobody loosening his cough early on. The biggest game of his young career, he & the defence have let in goals left right and centre, the conditions were poor, the pitch greasy and we've not tested the fibre of his fabric and yet some of us are crowing about 75% possession? I can't see the justification in it tbh, he should've come off that pitch after 90 minutes a broken man.

The bit about them being in trouble is nonsense as well, as there are at least 3 worse teams than them this season. But it's just the type of comments that are coming out post Friday night as an excuse or justification. After a bad run of results, they came for a point against better opposition and got one. We on the other hand wanted to win a home game against inferior opposition and failed miserably at the second attempt. Why should it be viewed as some sort of moral victory for us? I'd be delighted if we'd managed to implement & execute the same type of plan at Boro, Bristol, Derby & Forest .That might sound like i'm favouring the pragmatic over the romantic, the compact over the expansive, and you'd be right. Four more points in the bag now and we'd be top of the league, and at season's end it's the type of play that has earned you an extra 10 to 15 points and gets you promoted.

For all the huffing and puffing and posturing we do about how good we are as a team and how nice our football is, we are now becoming held back by it. What we are is good at keeping and passing the ball in non threatening areas. Like Crewe used to do under Dario Gradi and like Auxerre did under Guy Roux, didn't win anything, but pretty on the eye. And in some instances it's self fulfilling, because teams now know we like doing it and let us, which we do, which increases our possession stats and it gets everyone excited and encourages us to do it more. When it all boils down to it, possession without purpose is as bad as aimless long balls, don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

Tactics are due to the manager and the coaching staff. Our ability to pass and retain possession in non threatening areas has improved since last season, and our ability to pick up points/defend points in important games has remained static. That's my area of concern. Our lack of a Plan B has been evident for nearly a season and a half, and yet we boast about possession stats? We've delayed putting the ball into the box for a season and a half and it's only just being mentioned? JOC was shit at attacking set pieces last season, and he's still shit at it this. We are still dragging both forwards out wide to involve themselves in aimless passing triangles. Other than DH & Norwood, our recruitment has been poor. We are crying out for one, just one player of quality upfront and we keep on signing toss. When I say toss, I mean Lundstram, Washington, Johnson, Crainie, Leonard, Holmes, Thomas, Evans, Wilson, Woodburn toss.

As I said, no matter how bad we're claiming Wednesday to be and how good we are, the way we're are going we'll still be in the same division next season. We've picked up 5 points out of 15 and are beginning to drift, we've got Brentford, Leeds & WBA coming up who are all good sides, and Rotherham won't lay down for us either. It's not inconceivable that by mid December we'll be within 2 or 3 places off wednesday in lower mid table, and then all we'll have to boast about is moral victories.

Did you expect promotion this season? That's the only way I can see why you are so down about the situation. Most of us accept we aren't good enough to get in the play offs whilst also being happy where we are and the huge progress we have made. I share your fears on the future and have said so before but I can see we are massively punching above our weight and I'm enjoying what we are producing. Its frustrating but we will look back on these days in years to come and talk fondly of how we played football.

 

[alcoblade]

Not really a mega moan about the club, AB. More an exaggerated post in sheer frustration at some of the posts being made on this forum, and the red tinted logic that some of us are employing to defend the pattern developing. I want the Blades to do well & Wednesday to be properly put in their box. The only way to do that us for us to get promoted (and stay there) and them not. It is as simple as that. That would shift the dynamic between the two clubs for the next generation. Anything that doesn't increase the possibility off that happening, doesn't further that ambition or appears to be be misguided praise gets on my nerves at the moment.

Your point about Wednesday being poor and being in trouble is really neither here nor there. They are that poor that they have come to BDTBL and got quite an easy 0-0. After successfully changing their formation and asking players to play different roles, something our superior set-up can't seem to do. That doesn't reflect on us particularly well on us does it? They did the same thing last season, the only difference being they forced a cracking save from Moore that could've made it 0-1.

After a season and a half, we've not seemed to work out a way of altering that? Not against them, not against other limited sides. That's worrying to me, time is ticking away and time is our enemy for a number of reasons. If we are not careful, time will put us back into League 1 without the means of ever getting out again.

From what i'd seen of their keeper he was a bag of nerves/poor and yet again, as with Pantilimon v. Forest, due to the purity of our collective footballing ethos we've not put him under one iota of concerted pressure, no stinging long shots, nothing put under bar, nothing in the glare of the floodlights, nothing to test his handling and nobody loosening his cough early on. The biggest game of his young career, he & the defence have let in goals left right and centre, the conditions were poor, the pitch greasy and we've not tested the fibre of his fabric and yet some of us are crowing about 75% possession? I can't see the justification in it tbh, he should've come off that pitch after 90 minutes a broken man.

The bit about them being in trouble is nonsense as well, as there are at least 3 worse teams than them this season. But it's just the type of comments that are coming out post Friday night as an excuse or justification. After a bad run of results, they came for a point against better opposition and got one. We on the other hand wanted to win a home game against inferior opposition and failed miserably at the second attempt. Why should it be viewed as some sort of moral victory for us? I'd be delighted if we'd managed to implement & execute the same type of plan at Boro, Bristol, Derby & Forest .That might sound like i'm favouring the pragmatic over the romantic, the compact over the expansive, and you'd be right. Four more points in the bag now and we'd be top of the league, and at season's end it's the type of play that has earned you an extra 10 to 15 points and gets you promoted.

For all the huffing and puffing and posturing we do about how good we are as a team and how nice our football is, we are now becoming held back by it. What we are is good at keeping and passing the ball in non threatening areas. Like Crewe used to do under Dario Gradi and like Auxerre did under Guy Roux, didn't win anything, but pretty on the eye. And in some instances it's self fulfilling, because teams now know we like doing it and let us, which we do, which increases our possession stats and it gets everyone excited and encourages us to do it more. When it all boils down to it, possession without purpose is as bad as aimless long balls, don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

Tactics are due to the manager and the coaching staff. Our ability to pass and retain possession in non threatening areas has improved since last season, and our ability to pick up points/defend points in important games has remained static. That's my area of concern. Our lack of a Plan B has been evident for nearly a season and a half, and yet we boast about possession stats? We've delayed putting the ball into the box for a season and a half and it's only just being mentioned? JOC was shit at attacking set pieces last season, and he's still shit at it this. We are still dragging both forwards out wide to involve themselves in aimless passing triangles. Other than DH & Norwood, our recruitment has been poor. We are crying out for one, just one player of quality upfront and we keep on signing toss. When I say toss, I mean Lundstram, Washington, Johnson, Crainie, Leonard, Holmes, Thomas, Evans, Wilson, Woodburn toss.

As I said, no matter how bad we're claiming Wednesday to be and how good we are, the way we're are going we'll still be in the same division next season. We've picked up 5 points out of 15 and are beginning to drift, we've got Brentford, Leeds & WBA coming up who are all good sides, and Rotherham won't lay down for us either. It's not inconceivable that by mid December we'll be within 2 or 3 places off wednesday in lower mid table, and then all we'll have to boast about is moral victories.

Bloody hell, when I get a spare hour or two I’ll read and respond.

But very quickly - you’ve used my post as a straw man. I’m not making any claims about us in it.

 

[Sean Thornton]

Not really a mega moan about the club, AB. More an exaggerated post in sheer frustration at some of the posts being made on this forum, and the red tinted logic that some of us are employing to defend the pattern developing. I want the Blades to do well & Wednesday to be properly put in their box. The only way to do that us for us to get promoted (and stay there) and them not. It is as simple as that. That would shift the dynamic between the two clubs for the next generation. Anything that doesn't increase the possibility off that happening, doesn't further that ambition or appears to be be misguided praise gets on my nerves at the moment.

Your point about Wednesday being poor and being in trouble is really neither here nor there. They are that poor that they have come to BDTBL and got quite an easy 0-0. After successfully changing their formation and asking players to play different roles, something our superior set-up can't seem to do. That doesn't reflect on us particularly well on us does it? They did the same thing last season, the only difference being they forced a cracking save from Moore that could've made it 0-1.

After a season and a half, we've not seemed to work out a way of altering that? Not against them, not against other limited sides. That's worrying to me, time is ticking away and time is our enemy for a number of reasons. If we are not careful, time will put us back into League 1 without the means of ever getting out again.

From what i'd seen of their keeper he was a bag of nerves/poor and yet again, as with Pantilimon v. Forest, due to the purity of our collective footballing ethos we've not put him under one iota of concerted pressure, no stinging long shots, nothing put under bar, nothing in the glare of the floodlights, nothing to test his handling and nobody loosening his cough early on. The biggest game of his young career, he & the defence have let in goals left right and centre, the conditions were poor, the pitch greasy and we've not tested the fibre of his fabric and yet some of us are crowing about 75% possession? I can't see the justification in it tbh, he should've come off that pitch after 90 minutes a broken man.

The bit about them being in trouble is nonsense as well, as there are at least 3 worse teams than them this season. But it's just the type of comments that are coming out post Friday night as an excuse or justification. After a bad run of results, they came for a point against better opposition and got one. We on the other hand wanted to win a home game against inferior opposition and failed miserably at the second attempt. Why should it be viewed as some sort of moral victory for us? I'd be delighted if we'd managed to implement & execute the same type of plan at Boro, Bristol, Derby & Forest .That might sound like i'm favouring the pragmatic over the romantic, the compact over the expansive, and you'd be right. Four more points in the bag now and we'd be top of the league, and at season's end it's the type of play that has earned you an extra 10 to 15 points and gets you promoted.

For all the huffing and puffing and posturing we do about how good we are as a team and how nice our football is, we are now becoming held back by it. What we are is good at keeping and passing the ball in non threatening areas. Like Crewe used to do under Dario Gradi and like Auxerre did under Guy Roux, didn't win anything, but pretty on the eye. And in some instances it's self fulfilling, because teams now know we like doing it and let us, which we do, which increases our possession stats and it gets everyone excited and encourages us to do it more. When it all boils down to it, possession without purpose is as bad as aimless long balls, don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

Tactics are due to the manager and the coaching staff. Our ability to pass and retain possession in non threatening areas has improved since last season, and our ability to pick up points/defend points in important games has remained static. That's my area of concern. Our lack of a Plan B has been evident for nearly a season and a half, and yet we boast about possession stats? We've delayed putting the ball into the box for a season and a half and it's only just being mentioned? JOC was shit at attacking set pieces last season, and he's still shit at it this. We are still dragging both forwards out wide to involve themselves in aimless passing triangles. Other than DH & Norwood, our recruitment has been poor. We are crying out for one, just one player of quality upfront and we keep on signing toss. When I say toss, I mean Lundstram, Washington, Johnson, Crainie, Leonard, Holmes, Thomas, Evans, Wilson, Woodburn toss.

As I said, no matter how bad we're claiming Wednesday to be and how good we are, the way we're are going we'll still be in the same division next season. We've picked up 5 points out of 15 and are beginning to drift, we've got Brentford, Leeds & WBA coming up who are all good sides, and Rotherham won't lay down for us either. It's not inconceivable that by mid December we'll be within 2 or 3 places off wednesday in lower mid table, and then all we'll have to boast about is moral victories.

Keep going, I'll breathe for you.......

 

[DazBlade88]

Nicolaus_Copernicus

You're not wrong that we needed to put them to bed. We all know that. Wilder and the staff know that. Every single one of them will be disappointed that we didn't capitalise on Friday.

Every single person I speak to, young or old, says this is the best football we've ever played. It's hard to argue with that because we are an absolutely joy to watch. We're not perfect. We need to be more clinical and maybe mix it up a little sometimes. Yes the recruitment hasn't been as good as it could have been, but that's the nature of the beast of having a smaller budget than the teams we're competing against.

Your frustrations are valid. We can be better and the reason it's frustrating because we're so close to getting there, but it takes time. Teams have been in this league for years and not ruffled as many feathers as we have in a season and a third.

We play exciting football, we win more than we lose and people are taking notice as our reputation grows. These are the things that stand us in good stead and why we can hold our heads high and enjoy the ride. Players will want to come here and be part of it if we continue like this.

For me, what the club needs to do now is back Wilder enough to get the 1 or 2 players of quality that can win you a tight game out of nowhere with a bit of individual brilliance. That's how close we are IMO. They showed that they're prepared to pay money for the right player in Egan, so hopefully they can do it again at the other end of the pitch.

Apologies for the length of this btw. I've not said anything since Friday out of frustration

 

[Topplayersleave]

The thing is, are there circumstances where you would assent to a Wednesdayesque approach for the sake of the points?

Would United have gleaned a point at bonny 'Boro with such a strategy, for instance?

After all, points make prizes.

All matters discussed by Owls and Blades mates in the de-brief down at the local at the weekend.

At least after the name-calling and finger-pointing had subsided.

And what if other teams come to the Lane and employ similar tactics to the Owls?

If so, what does Tufty need to do to overcome them?

It depends on whether you are the type of person who just believes points make prizes or not
We won plenty of games under Kevin Blackwell but I can barely remember leaving the lane with a smile on my face, he could even make a 4-0 win boring and there'd still be more bad in it than good.

If we'd got a draw via a negative performance at Middlesboro I'd have been a bit naffed off at first because there's always the feeling that "We got a draw playing crap, what would have happened if we'd tried to play a bit"

But, I could never be happy about turning up at Swillsborough and parking the bus and contributing absolutely nothing to the game in an attacking sense.

I've said it before that United will always struggle to break down stubborn defences because that extra quality required isn't there, our wins have generally come because we get a goal and force the other team out.
If that early-ish goal doesn't come the ideas start to dry up and it becomes repetitive

Going through the middle is something that we do quite well for a period of time but then it gets abandoned for some reason and we end up probing down each wing constantly, even stranger when we don't have natural wingers or extremely good crossers of the ball.
We lost our way last season by adopting this tactic, sideways, backwards, sideways again, backwards again, try again down the other wing, backwards again, try again down the other wing, backwards again etc etc etc

The safe pass instead of trying something more ambitious

 

[SUFC Guy]

Exactly! folk must appreciate where we were, where we are now and where we can go - given a little more time and money.

We are building year on year so please don't expect too much too soon. The football is excellent and with the correct recruitment it will pay off in time.

We are not strong enough for autos and may fall short of the play offs - no shame in that seeing as we were in the 'Pub League' (can't wait until the Pigs drop into that league that they so cruelly name changed) 2 seasons ago. I fully expect us to be a force to be reckoned with next August with a good amount of backing from the owner(s)

2 fast quality strikers and a younger Duffy like for like player will cost us the earth - but it's a must if we are to progress. The owners and management know this but will it happen? - who knows?

UTMB
DTP

 

[itsinyerblood]

Whether or not perspective helps, going into this game it was wendy who were concerned, it was the blue and white excuse merchants who were imagining getting beaten. All that was lacking was a goal, and but for McG's fluffed attempt (or would that be a great save?), well we'll never know. But to repeat the boxing analogy mentioned elsewhere, they had nothing to offer. Even if they want to wave a flag in celebration (no idea why?) they're still close to the bottom of this division, so what they think they've achieved is beyond me. The most worrying thing for wendy fans is what will happen to their owner? Does anyone seriously think he'll revisit his wallet and spend heavily? They don't have the nous to buy wisely, their scouting network seems intent on ignoring the lower divisions, and even those players they do profess to be interested seem incapable of making their mark when it matters.

As for us, do not, under any circumstances, imagine that Wilder is not alive to the type of player(s) we'll need if we're to be involved in the final promotion push. I try not to pay too much attention to the media, but our owners, even with their impending court case, seem united in understanding what's required. Let's hope they can act like mature grownups, enabling Wilder to buy the players who will help us become a Premiership club.

 

[Bellypork]

Well, wherever you stand on the issue, one thing is for certain. Wednesday will never be able to get away with playing that way in the return derby. They won't be able to get away with it against Derby either. Not at those prices.

 

[kyle salmon]

Not really a mega moan about the club, AB. More an exaggerated post in sheer frustration at some of the posts being made on this forum, and the red tinted logic that some of us are employing to defend the pattern developing. I want the Blades to do well & Wednesday to be properly put in their box. The only way to do that us for us to get promoted (and stay there) and them not. It is as simple as that. That would shift the dynamic between the two clubs for the next generation. Anything that doesn't increase the possibility off that happening, doesn't further that ambition or appears to be be misguided praise gets on my nerves at the moment.

Your point about Wednesday being poor and being in trouble is really neither here nor there. They are that poor that they have come to BDTBL and got quite an easy 0-0. After successfully changing their formation and asking players to play different roles, something our superior set-up can't seem to do. That doesn't reflect on us particularly well on us does it? They did the same thing last season, the only difference being they forced a cracking save from Moore that could've made it 0-1.

After a season and a half, we've not seemed to work out a way of altering that? Not against them, not against other limited sides. That's worrying to me, time is ticking away and time is our enemy for a number of reasons. If we are not careful, time will put us back into League 1 without the means of ever getting out again.

From what i'd seen of their keeper he was a bag of nerves/poor and yet again, as with Pantilimon v. Forest, due to the purity of our collective footballing ethos we've not put him under one iota of concerted pressure, no stinging long shots, nothing put under bar, nothing in the glare of the floodlights, nothing to test his handling and nobody loosening his cough early on. The biggest game of his young career, he & the defence have let in goals left right and centre, the conditions were poor, the pitch greasy and we've not tested the fibre of his fabric and yet some of us are crowing about 75% possession? I can't see the justification in it tbh, he should've come off that pitch after 90 minutes a broken man.

The bit about them being in trouble is nonsense as well, as there are at least 3 worse teams than them this season. But it's just the type of comments that are coming out post Friday night as an excuse or justification. After a bad run of results, they came for a point against better opposition and got one. We on the other hand wanted to win a home game against inferior opposition and failed miserably at the second attempt. Why should it be viewed as some sort of moral victory for us? I'd be delighted if we'd managed to implement & execute the same type of plan at Boro, Bristol, Derby & Forest .That might sound like i'm favouring the pragmatic over the romantic, the compact over the expansive, and you'd be right. Four more points in the bag now and we'd be top of the league, and at season's end it's the type of play that has earned you an extra 10 to 15 points and gets you promoted.

For all the huffing and puffing and posturing we do about how good we are as a team and how nice our football is, we are now becoming held back by it. What we are is good at keeping and passing the ball in non threatening areas. Like Crewe used to do under Dario Gradi and like Auxerre did under Guy Roux, didn't win anything, but pretty on the eye. And in some instances it's self fulfilling, because teams now know we like doing it and let us, which we do, which increases our possession stats and it gets everyone excited and encourages us to do it more. When it all boils down to it, possession without purpose is as bad as aimless long balls, don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

Tactics are due to the manager and the coaching staff. Our ability to pass and retain possession in non threatening areas has improved since last season, and our ability to pick up points/defend points in important games has remained static. That's my area of concern. Our lack of a Plan B has been evident for nearly a season and a half, and yet we boast about possession stats? We've delayed putting the ball into the box for a season and a half and it's only just being mentioned? JOC was shit at attacking set pieces last season, and he's still shit at it this. We are still dragging both forwards out wide to involve themselves in aimless passing triangles. Other than DH & Norwood, our recruitment has been poor. We are crying out for one, just one player of quality upfront and we keep on signing toss. When I say toss, I mean Lundstram, Washington, Johnson, Crainie, Leonard, Holmes, Thomas, Evans, Wilson, Woodburn toss.

As I said, no matter how bad we're claiming Wednesday to be and how good we are, the way we're are going we'll still be in the same division next season. We've picked up 5 points out of 15 and are beginning to drift, we've got Brentford, Leeds & WBA coming up who are all good sides, and Rotherham won't lay down for us either. It's not inconceivable that by mid December we'll be within 2 or 3 places off wednesday in lower mid table, and then all we'll have to boast about is moral victories.

Is there not a word limit on these posts?!

 

[BigBed]

Imagine how embarrassed and indeed ashamed you’d be if you supported Wednesday.

Sorted that for you pal, didn't need all those extra words.........

 

[GRUMPY BLADE]

Honestly? As things are going, they won't go down, we won't go up, and we'll start again next season in the same league separated by alphabetical order, together in gnawing, clawing mediocrity, with the only points of boast being that, whilst they can only command 25% possession when they play out insipid draws, we can get to 75%. They will also claim they've not got their full side out, yet again. Our 30+ players will be a year older, a year closer to retirement, the quality keeper will have returned to his parent club, we'll have lost at least one of norwood/fleck/joc, the market value of what we need to bring in will be 25% higher, the owners will be still at loggerheads & CW more frustrated. But lets not dwell on the current and the downbeat, as tempting as trumpeting our 2nd 0-0 against them is, let's collectively fantasize about next season's game at BDTBL (hopefully under the lights & on TV), where we kick off and sit on the ball for 90 minutes without a challenge been made or an attack being attempted, allowing our fans the opportunity to give each other reach-arounds & teabag each other, due the fact we've hit 99.9% possession and we can all go home a sweaty, excited mess with 1 point in the bag. Whoopy. Fucking. Doooo. We will then truly be the kings of Sheffield and all we survey. Sheffield isn't red & white nor is it blue & white, it's fucking beige. Faded beige at that.

Want to borrow my moniker?

 

[GRUMPY BLADE]

The thing is, are there circumstances where you would assent to a Wednesdayesque approach for the sake of the points?

Would United have gleaned a point at bonny 'Boro with such a strategy, for instance?

After all, points make prizes.

All matters discussed by Owls and Blades mates in the de-brief down at the local at the weekend.

At least after the name-calling and finger-pointing had subsided.

And what if other teams come to the Lane and employ similar tactics to the Owls?

If so, what does Tufty need to do to overcome them?

Our manager wouldn't survive turning up at the sty with a white flag, he'd be gone before the week was out.

We wouldn't claim no success either.

 

[Sean Thornton]

It depends on whether you are the type of person who just believes points make prizes or not
We won plenty of games under Kevin Blackwell but I can barely remember leaving the lane with a smile on my face, he could even make a 4-0 win boring and there'd still be more bad in it than good.

If we'd got a draw via a negative performance at Middlesboro I'd have been a bit naffed off at first because there's always the feeling that "We got a draw playing crap, what would have happened if we'd tried to play a bit"

But, I could never be happy about turning up at Swillsborough and parking the bus and contributing absolutely nothing to the game in an attacking sense.

I've said it before that United will always struggle to break down stubborn defences because that extra quality required isn't there, our wins have generally come because we get a goal and force the other team out.
If that early-ish goal doesn't come the ideas start to dry up and it becomes repetitive

Going through the middle is something that we do quite well for a period of time but then it gets abandoned for some reason and we end up probing down each wing constantly, even stranger when we don't have natural wingers or extremely good crossers of the ball.
We lost our way last season by adopting this tactic, sideways, backwards, sideways again, backwards again, try again down the other wing, backwards again, try again down the other wing, backwards again etc etc etc

The safe pass instead of trying something more ambitious

We lost and didn't replace our playmaker.

 

[Nicolaus_Copernicus]

Is there not a word limit on these posts?!

That was my 2nd edit as well. I was tempted to serialise the first version.

My posts are like diarrhoea, my ideas coming gushing out, ill formed and watery, then I clean ‘em up, but no matter how I try, a couple of days later there’s still a vague smell of shit about them.

 

[Bellypork]

Our manager wouldn't survive turning up at the sty with a white flag, he'd be gone before the week was out.

We wouldn't claim no success either.

The thing is though Grumps that had Jos not employed those tactics he'd have been gone before the week was out anyway.

Those tactics were about avoiding a hiding and his saving his job.

He may have done that - at least for now - but many Owls fans feel the same way about it as you do.

 

[oldblade]

They didn't have the time to play tippy tappy. Pressured from the off. It was hoof from the start. Kicking for touch to relieve the pressure.

Even without bias, worst side I've seen at BL since we were promoted.

What you say is true. But, Wednesday did come with a plan and stuck to it religiously. They rode their luck and it was a bit like the Alamo. But in the end they escaped with a point and will be more satisfied than we are.

Had the penalty gone in, and particularly at such an early stage in the game, I think we would have been comfortable winners. That is the problem with the approach they adopted. If the opposition score, you are well and truly in the brown stuff.

 

[SouthEssexBlade]

 

[GRUMPY BLADE]

What you say is true. But, Wednesday did come with a plan and stuck to it religiously. They rode their luck and it was a bit like the Alamo. But in the end they escaped with a point and will be more satisfied than we are.

Had the penalty gone in, and particularly at such an early stage in the game, I think we would have been comfortable winners. That is the problem with the approach they adopted. If the opposition score, you are well and truly in the brown stuff.

You mean they're not already?

 

[oldblade]

You mean they're not already?

Not yet, but if they carry on like that they soon will be. They got away with it and had a slice of luck in that we failed to score from a penalty. However, as the long haired Ipswich bloke on You Tube (whose name escapes me!) pointed out. In spite of having around 75% possession and controlling the game we didn't carve open too many really good chances. That wasn't just down to luck or our own failings. It was also down to the defensive Maginot line that they dug.

They got a point from this game, but there will be many cases where they aren't quite so lucky and don't defend quite as resolutely. If they were to carry on with those tactics they will probably lose as many as they draw and win virtually no games at all.

They have a squad that on paper should not be in any kind of relegation trouble. However, mental attitude is an important part of football. Their attitude appears similar to that of a side deep in relegation trouble.

In 2010-11 we had a squad that should not have got relegated. And yet it did, and did so quite comfortably. IMO that was largely down to a poor mental attitude. We lost most games before we even got on the pitch.

 

[ForgeBlade]

Fair play to Bellypork for coming on here after that match and discussing, in reasonable, balanced and non-deluded terms his team's frankly shameful display on Friday night.

They were shit. Fact. It looked at times like a L1 side playing a prem side in the cup, desperate to earn a money-spinning replay. In my 24 years as a blade, this is the worst I've ever seen the team from the other side of the city. A couple of my mates (pigs) are rightly ashamed of their approach to the game. We were underdogs at the sty last season, but we went there to attack, and ended up deservedly spanking them in their own back yard. If we ever went to H'boro and set up, and played, like they did on Friday I'd be fucking fuming, regardless if we got a (undeserved) point or not.

I take some positives from the game. Firstly, the Bannan/Fleck debate is dead. One of them tried to make things happen, played good passes, had a long-range effort well saved, and looked like a top-end championship midfielder. The other one spent his evening passing to the opposition or into touch, and generally making a mockery of his apparent status (in pig-speak) as one of the best players in this league.

Secondly, in front of sky TV, the whole world saw the gulf in class that now exists between the two sides. It's "ifs and buts" but IF McG had scored the pen, we'd have given them a beating that their grandkids would have been crying about in 100 years. They'd have been forced to open up, and try and play, and we would have scythed them apart and scored at least another 3 or 4. They might have gone mega-defensive once it reached 4-0, but that would have been enough for us. Sadly, it wasn't to be.

Occasionally, a really good team will play against a really shit team, and for whatever reason be unable to break them down and turn the possession, corners and chances into the goals that the performance merits. This is all that happened on Friday. We played (at best) a mediocre to poor side, who came for a point, defended like their careers depended on it, and came away with a very lucky point. Shit happens. If it had been any other bottom-half team we'd already have chalked it up as "one of those days" and moved on.

We'll just have to set the record straight and batter them at the sty (again) in March.

UTB.