Thoughts from yesterday

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cooperblade

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Really strange how the game panned out.

Thought we started ever so well going forward, McMahon got into more advanced positions than he has so far this season and it made a huge difference. Notts were all at sea from set pieces and we could've scored another 2 or 3 from corners after Harry's opener.

We passed the ball really well and made loads of space against 10 and oceans against 11. We looked almost like the side of last season at times (stress the almost). Sorry to mention our pitch again but it was noticeable that we could switch play quickly with passes along the floor in a way we haven't managed at home.

Throughout our good spell we were really poor as a unit at the back though. I wouldn't say there were poor performances individually necessarily but Notts had loads of chances and could've had 3 quite easily in the first 20 minutes and they continued to look a threat after Zoko's red card.

I said to Micalijo (who was lovely and quiet throughout - I'd like to think he was being respectful as I was with my lad but I think he was in a Jaipur induced slumber) that we'd have to get a 2nd because Notts looked nailed on to get one. As the 2nd half started, I thought we looked like adding to our tally but we soon fizzled out and, as DW rightly points out, went overly direct and dropped deeper. There was no obvious reason for it but we went from playing well to totally flat all of a sudden.

Few points on individuals:

George Long - confidence looks to be slipping a bit and he looks a bit more like the lad who was all at sea v Exeter than the confident keeper who came in at Orient and has done well for most of the time since. One specific thing I think he needs to sort is at set pieces, he gets involved in pushing matches and, quite often, when a dead ball is delivered his hands are in a poor position (too low) and he struggles to get a meaningful contact in or a catch.

McMahon - much better in terms of attacking play in the first half. One slightly reckless tackle in the first half which could've resulted in a red quite easily if he'd made any contact with the attacker.

Murphy - showed on a couple of occasions that he's capable of absolutely destroying a full back with a burst of pace or a touch of skill. That was really encouraging. However, he needs a bit more composure with his final ball and he needs someone to get hold of him and explain what his responsibilities are in terms of helping out his full back defensively. He totally abandoned Westlake on a few occasions - fine if we were all over County but at times when we were on the back front, he was missing in action.

Flynn - was more than willing to try and go on the outside of the full back he was up against but he looked like he was running through quicksand. I was we could combine him and Murphy into one player - a quicker Flynn or a more aware Murphy would be a good little player.


Why did the level of performance drop so much and why couldn't we address it? I really don't know. You look at the players on the pitch and with the likes of Higginbotham, Doyle and Kitson, we shouldn't be short of an experienced, vocal presence. You look at McDonald and we should have someone who gets irate when we go overly long and demands the ball so we can spread the play and move the opposition's defence about.

Personally, I wouldn't drop Doyle or McDonald at this point so I'd be more inclined to go with the suggestion on here the other week (from Bergen?) of adding Whitehouse to midfield and making it a 3 or 5 in there. Flynn would be the man to drop out for me and I'd have Blackman and Murphy playing wide / off a target man. I think the extra body in there would make us play more of a possession game and we'd have more variety of attacking threat with a midfield runner getting into the box alongside the front / wide players.

In terms of the target man, my first choice would be Porter but I assume he's still injured. With him out, I think Ironside must be pushing Kitson very, very close for a start but making a difference from the start is very different to making an impact off the bench so Joe still has a lot to prove - he's shown great signs so far that he's up to it though.

Overall, worried...yes, panicking...no. DW seems to recognise where we're going wrong (based on his interviews), we made plenty of chances yesterday for a time (even at 11 v 11) and I think we're capable of going on a run again. Needs to start soon though otherwise it could become a real problem. Let's hope it starts on Tuesday (weather permitting).

UTB
 



DW seems to recognise where we're going wrong (based on his interviews)

Talk's cheap though fella. If he really knows what's wrong, it's disappointing that the only change we made was the obligatory substitution of Kiston.

I don't want a change of manager, but it wont take much more of the same to tip me over the edge.

UTB
 
Talk's cheap though fella.

UTB

Agree but we've had plenty of managers recently who didn't show any sign of realising there was a problem or what it was. After the Yeovil game, he talked of the need to 'take the brakes off' and we definitely saw evidence of that yesterday (for a time).

What he needs to prove now, in my opinion, is that he's capable of getting some urgency and desire back into the team (which doesn't mean lump it or kicking people) whether that's by changing the team, giving them all a rocket or just bringing them back together as a group.

The players have to take some responsibility as well though and as I've said above, our team should be big enough and experienced enough to do that.
 
We passed the ball really well and made loads of space against 10 and oceans against 11. We looked almost like the side of last season at times (stress the almost).

Which is what made most of our second half so frustrating, at times, we probably even passed it a little too quickly and made too many options... leaving them unable to decide when and how to finish the move. There were passages of play where we made them look stupid... Before reverting to just tossing them the ball back and watching.

We also had stages where we looked lively, closed down really well and pressured them into giving us the ball back... It looked easy at those points. Again, we reverted to backing off and leaving them to it.

We are good enough to move the ball and dominate possession, we just seem to love making it hard on ourselves.

It's not about tactics, it's about players taking responsibility to control the game.
 
Good to read a balanced and sensible view Coops, with some reasoned suggestions where players might be going wrong and tactics adjusted.
I'm a bit like you on the DW situation, its always how a manager reacts to adversity that is the test of mettle. We'll see over the next couple of months what he's made of, lets hope it's what my gut feeling tells me it is and we turn it round spectacularly!

Finally - You and that Mic bloke are mates? Feckin strange world innit!;)
 
Really strange how the game panned out.

Thought we started ever so well going forward, McMahon got into more advanced positions than he has so far this season and it made a huge difference. Notts were all at sea from set pieces and we could've scored another 2 or 3 from corners after Harry's opener.

We passed the ball really well and made loads of space against 10 and oceans against 11. We looked almost like the side of last season at times (stress the almost). Sorry to mention our pitch again but it was noticeable that we could switch play quickly with passes along the floor in a way we haven't managed at home.

Throughout our good spell we were really poor as a unit at the back though. I wouldn't say there were poor performances individually necessarily but Notts had loads of chances and could've had 3 quite easily in the first 20 minutes and they continued to look a threat after Zoko's red card.

I said to Micalijo (who was lovely and quiet throughout - I'd like to think he was being respectful as I was with my lad but I think he was in a Jaipur induced slumber) that we'd have to get a 2nd because Notts looked nailed on to get one. As the 2nd half started, I thought we looked like adding to our tally but we soon fizzled out and, as DW rightly points out, went overly direct and dropped deeper. There was no obvious reason for it but we went from playing well to totally flat all of a sudden.

Few points on individuals:

George Long - confidence looks to be slipping a bit and he looks a bit more like the lad who was all at sea v Exeter than the confident keeper who came in at Orient and has done well for most of the time since. One specific thing I think he needs to sort is at set pieces, he gets involved in pushing matches and, quite often, when a dead ball is delivered his hands are in a poor position (too low) and he struggles to get a meaningful contact in or a catch.

McMahon - much better in terms of attacking play in the first half. One slightly reckless tackle in the first half which could've resulted in a red quite easily if he'd made any contact with the attacker.

Murphy - showed on a couple of occasions that he's capable of absolutely destroying a full back with a burst of pace or a touch of skill. That was really encouraging. However, he needs a bit more composure with his final ball and he needs someone to get hold of him and explain what his responsibilities are in terms of helping out his full back defensively. He totally abandoned Westlake on a few occasions - fine if we were all over County but at times when we were on the back front, he was missing in action.

Flynn - was more than willing to try and go on the outside of the full back he was up against but he looked like he was running through quicksand. I was we could combine him and Murphy into one player - a quicker Flynn or a more aware Murphy would be a good little player.


Why did the level of performance drop so much and why couldn't we address it? I really don't know. You look at the players on the pitch and with the likes of Higginbotham, Doyle and Kitson, we shouldn't be short of an experienced, vocal presence. You look at McDonald and we should have someone who gets irate when we go overly long and demands the ball so we can spread the play and move the opposition's defence about.

Personally, I wouldn't drop Doyle or McDonald at this point so I'd be more inclined to go with the suggestion on here the other week (from Bergen?) of adding Whitehouse to midfield and making it a 3 or 5 in there. Flynn would be the man to drop out for me and I'd have Blackman and Murphy playing wide / off a target man. I think the extra body in there would make us play more of a possession game and we'd have more variety of attacking threat with a midfield runner getting into the box alongside the front / wide players.

In terms of the target man, my first choice would be Porter but I assume he's still injured. With him out, I think Ironside must be pushing Kitson very, very close for a start but making a difference from the start is very different to making an impact off the bench so Joe still has a lot to prove - he's shown great signs so far that he's up to it though.

Overall, worried...yes, panicking...no. DW seems to recognise where we're going wrong (based on his interviews), we made plenty of chances yesterday for a time (even at 11 v 11) and I think we're capable of going on a run again. Needs to start soon though otherwise it could become a real problem. Let's hope it starts on Tuesday (weather permitting).

UTB

Thank goodness for your post Cooperblade. You've described extremely well, the game that I watched yesterday!

Listening to those idiots on Praise or Grumble (including Brian the Buffoon), the morons sitting behind me and some of the other match summaries read on here, I was beginning to think I was going mad!

Yes, there are problems to resolve, with team selection, tactics, player confidence, commitment and desire, but I'm sure that Danny realises all of this and is working feverishly behind the scenes, to put all of this right.
 
I completely agree with your suggested selection though I'd go Murphy on the right and Blackman on the left. I'd stick Ironside up front as I think he's got a neat and tidy touch and Kitson isn't at it.

Not sure why every defeat has to be greeted as though it's the end of the world; the 2nd half was awful but just don't understanding the vitriol of some fans.
 
In terms of the target man, my first choice would be Porter but I assume he's still injured. With him out, I think Ironside must be pushing Kitson very, very close for a start but making a difference from the start is very different to making an impact off the bench so Joe still has a lot to prove - he's shown great signs so far that he's up to it though.

Interesting.... There aren't many who hold that opinion of Porter and Kitson. While Kitson has the quality and better goal record, I don't like the way he plays. Much like Beattie did, he gets around the pitch when he'd be much more useful fulfilling his role for the team - point man for the attack. I could be doing him a disservice, but it smacks of arrogance and selfishness - something a true target man cannot be.

Porter is the antithesis - limited but wholly about the role he plays for the team. If Ironside can take the good bits from both players he'll be the answer and then some.
 
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Not sure why every defeat has to be greeted as though it's the end of the world; the 2nd half was awful but just don't understanding the vitriol of some fans.

It wasn't a defeat. The facts that made it seem like one is what's pisses people off.

I can put up with long periods of dross. I can't put up with watching my teams being out muscled, out worked and out thought by Yeovil and Hartlepool.

There are times (most of them) when sections of fans are full of shit. There are others when the team and management deserves all the criticism they get.

UTB
 
I fully think that the team and management are deserving of a lot of criticism at this point in time.

We are simply not playing well, and you can blame money, and Wilson trying to do a job on limited resources, but in all honestly under the Financial Fairplay Protocol, we still have the largest wagebill in this division.
 
Interesting.... There aren't many who hold that opinion of Porter and Kitson. While Kitson has the quality and better goal record, I don't like the way he plays. Much like Beattie did, he gets around the pitch when he'd be much more useful fulfilling his role for the team - point man for the attack. I could be doing him a disservice, but it smacks of arrogance and selfishness - something a true target man cannot be.

Porter is the antithesis - limited but wholly about the role he plays for the team. If Ironside can take the good bits from both players he'll be the answer and then some.

Kitson has many good attributes, mainly he looks after the ball well, he's a good 'cheat' (he won the corner we scored from yesterday with a cynical foul) and his goal record is good. I just think Porter is a better option when we do go long (and I hope that's infrequent) and can do more to occupy the opposition's defenders (allowing space for others) through hard work and being a fraction quicker than Kitson.

I don't think we have the perfect answer as a target man at the moment but we have 3 reasonable options in Kitson, Porter and Ironside.
 
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May I just confirm that I had a fantastic afternoon and evening out on Saturday. No booing, no moaning - couple of beers in the station, stayed in Nottingham for a couple of hours after in Canal House and Navigation and no real disappointment at the result. To stand next to the Great Cooperblade was the icing on the cake.
 



Personally I think the bigger issue is the impact the injury to Miller is having and will have on us. To me the issue of Porter/Kitson/Ironside is almost a moot point as we dont really have anyone that can score the goals.

I'm unsure if we have anyone bright enough to play alongside a "Target" man.
 
Personally I think the bigger issue is the impact the injury to Miller is having and will have on us. To me the issue of Porter/Kitson/Ironside is almost a moot point as we dont really have anyone that can score the goals.

BUT Miller was not selected for a large part of the season. His injury is not a valid reason for the rot.

It's the silly goals we are gifting the opposition at one end and the lack of chances created at the other (and by that I mean those that test the 'keeper) that is the recipe for an alarming slide in form - and yes it is alarming at the moment with only 4 wins in the last 13 matches.

The absence of Hill and Collins is a large blow to the stability of the side - the experience they bring (AT THIS LEVEL) is key to us maintaining a push for promotion - it will not win us anything but it will go a long way in preventing us tossing each game away.
 
I totally agree regards the defence, losing both Collins and Hill so close together is going to disrupt the cohesiveness of the back four, but to say his injury is not a valid reason...really???

I'm sure scoring more goals than the opposition is what wins you games, whether we have a settled back four or not and I'm sorry to say that we don't look like having anyone that can score.

But maybe we can get promoted with 0 - 0 draws eh Kenilworth?
 
I totally agree regards the defence, losing both Collins and Hill so close together is going to disrupt the cohesiveness of the back four, but to say his injury is not a valid reason...really???

I'm sure scoring more goals than the opposition is what wins you games, whether we have a settled back four or not and I'm sorry to say that we don't look like having anyone that can score.

But maybe we can get promoted with 0 - 0 draws eh Kenilworth?

Didn't say that. I agree Miller is a big loss. I merely pointed out that he hasn't been first choice for most of the season.
 
Losing Collins didn't just affect the defence. He's the only centre half at the club who seems comfortable with the ball at his feet. Whether that's playing a short pass to our midfielder or running the ball out of defence. The rest just seem to close their eyes and kick it really far. Maguire in particular is terrible for this, and we all know that composure isn't Hill's strongest point.

It's too early to say whether it's the case for Higginbotham as well.

We don't build from the back any more. Last season, endless moves started with Collins to Doyle, Doyle to McDonald, McDonald to a winger and eventually on to a chance (Evans goal). McDonald hasn't been half as good this season because we don't have the players looking for the ball when he has it. There are still two or three occasions at the very least every game where he does something with the ball where you think "nobody else on the pitch could have done that".
 
McDonald hasn't been half as good this season because we don't have the players looking for the ball when he has it. There are still two or three occasions at the very least every game where he does something with the ball where you think "nobody else on the pitch could have done that".

Absolutely right. In Doyle's case, sadly, we are left lamenting "nobody else on the pitch would have done that." The combination is not working. Recruitment needed urgently, I think.
 
We don't build from the back any more. Last season, endless moves started with Collins to Doyle, Doyle to McDonald, McDonald to a winger and eventually on to a chance (Evans goal). McDonald hasn't been half as good this season because we don't have the players looking for the ball when he has it. There are still two or three occasions at the very least every game where he does something with the ball where you think "nobody else on the pitch could have done that".
Absolutely right. In Doyle's case, sadly, we are left lamenting "nobody else on the pitch would have done that." The combination is not working. Recruitment needed urgently, I think.

Glad you two see it as I do. Every time someone criticises McDonald I wonder whether they see a different game to me.

McDonald's performance is intrinsically linked to the off-the-ball work done by the other 9 outfield players. He's most comfortable hitting the ball into space for one of our players to run forward on to. At the moment we have zero movement which removes this option.

I'd be OK with that if it wasn't the single fundamental basic way of beating teams in this league. They're all well organised but as they're third division players it's their ability to deal with movement and pace (of legs or mind). We're not exploiting that at the moment.

Oh, and Doyle can do for me - if we can find a ball-winning midfielder, either within the squad or without. Matty Harriott and Elliot Whitehouse couldn't really do much worse at the moment.
 
Glad you two see it as I do. Every time someone criticises McDonald I wonder whether they see a different game to me.

McDonald's performance is intrinsically linked to the off-the-ball work done by the other 9 outfield players. He's most comfortable hitting the ball into space for one of our players to run forward on to. At the moment we have zero movement which removes this option.

I'd be OK with that if it wasn't the single fundamental basic way of beating teams in this league. They're all well organised but as they're third division players it's their ability to deal with movement and pace (of legs or mind). We're not exploiting that at the moment.

Oh, and Doyle can do for me - if we can find a ball-winning midfielder, either within the squad or without. Matty Harriott and Elliot Whitehouse couldn't really do much worse at the moment.

plenty of movement from the wingers,Blackman and on occasion the full backs on Saturday...yet I can only remember one forward pass in the final third by KMac.

We can may all the excuses we want for KMac, however hhas the ability to drive forward and committ people which will then create space. He doesn't do it often enough
 

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