The fat lad from sheffield

[Guesty]

I'd prefer players that haven't twice failed to perform for the club to be honest with you.

 

[Pinchy]

All good points. However to counter, in a game famous for lack of loyalty, a hiring and firing club has been happy to keep extending his employment.

And we should remember that we are talking about his ability to coach / manage a third division under 21 setup. It's an entirely different prospect to managing a club, and he shouldn't be measured against that, even if we could.

UTB

Isn't it crucial that the U-21s are coached to play the game the "right way" - a phrase you won't like but widely used in football. Put another way, to avoid side issues, the way Nigel Adkins wants the first team to play.

"Nowt Fancy - like Bassett" is a philosophy of despair. It makes me cringe that one of our coaches promotes it.

 

[DronnieBlade]

I'd prefer players that haven't twice failed to perform for the club to be honest with you.

Which translates roughly as you can't !!!

Seriously, I have no idea if Sharp is available or wants to come.

Even less of an idea that he might, just might be on the slippery slope downwards in his career, which is entirely possible.

But to constantly write the guy off based on his time at the Lane under Blackwell (!!), when he has proved, beyond any reasonable doubt to be an accomplished if not brilliant Championship standard striker is, frankly, daft.

You know where I stand on this. Played correctly, Sharp would be as close to a cast iron guarantee of 20 goals a season in this division you could possible have.

Bearing in mind Adkins initial assessment being that we need more goals, and to concede far less, I suspect he will be high up on Adkins wish list for the former.

UTB

 

[wizadry]

Alright fella.

Find me a player with these sort of stats

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Billy_Sharp

Who is :-

1. Available.
2. Under £300k fee (ish)
3. Wage demands within reason.
4. Wants to and is willing to play in L1 for SUFC !!!!

Then lets have a natter !!

UTB

He's on just shy of 20 grand so unless we can sort a loan out then there is not a cat in hells chance of him coming, plus there are other players out there who our scouts must be able to sort something out. The football database is huge mate, lets look beyond the perimeters a bit shall we.

 

[Lane Ender]

Isn't it crucial that the U-21s are coached to play the game the "right way" - a phrase you won't like but widely used in football. Put another way, to avoid side issues, the way Nigel Adkins wants the first team to play.

"Nowt Fancy - like Bassett" is a philosophy of despair. It makes me cringe that one of our coaches promotes it.

What grounds have you to imply that Morgan will instil in our youngsters the order of the big boot.
He's obviously got all his badges that go with the job and only time will tell whether he'll get the young uns playing.
What I can guarantee you that he'll stand no nonsense and instil desire and discipline in them.
Results will be what he's judged on.

 

[Flatulent_Bob]

Forget the bladey blade bollocks.

There would be a number of championship clubs that would covet the signature of Sharp.

His signing would be a major coup for ANY L1 team.

But not in deepest darkest S2 !!! We (The Royal We) know better !!!!!!!!

I fuckin despair.

UTB

Major coup? Don't understand what that would be based on, certainly not his recent history.

 

[DronnieBlade]

He's on just shy of 20 grand so unless we can sort a loan out then there is not a cat in hells chance of him coming, plus there are other players out there who our scouts must be able to sort something out. The football database is huge mate, lets look beyond the perimeters a bit shall we.

Your info is inaccurate. Wage is nearer half that.

Yes the database is huge.

I repeat, find me a player under 30 years old who is available for the price and who will play in L1 with nearly 150 goals to his name.

UTB

 

[DronnieBlade]

Major coup? Don't understand what that would be based on, certainly not his recent history.

No it wouldnt Bob. You are right.

However, you need to be able to understand why this is.

For example, most recently at Leeds, he was sub ( a lot) and was played as a left sided midfielder ( a lot).

just think that all things considered, we could do a lot worse than sign the lad. Maybe it would work this time round, maybe not.

UTB

 

[Deadbat]

I am surprised Morgan has remained in the last few changes. I think Wilson knew him and liked him so of course after he packed in playing found a role for him but when Weir came in he remained bit very much in a fringe role and was not involved in the 1st team. I did expect him to depart when Clough came in but he was involved more but not so much on match days and was mostly was involved with the u21's.

I get the impressions when these new managers come in, that they have been told that they can bring in own first team coach and assistant manager but that it would be useful to keep Morgan around and the message is of how he is well liked at club by board/staff left and fans and the managers keep him around for the u21 stuff. It would be more interesting if they were told he had to remain as a direct first team coach/assistant.

He is a nice guy and I wish we had his ilk back as centre back at this level now as we need some toughness/no nonsense defending but jury still out on him as a coach. People say he has been involved in developments of young players but Adams came from elsewhere and Reed almost bypassed u21's. Not sure some of others have quite progressed with likes of Ironside, Mcfadzean not coming through and Di Maio and Khan going backwards in last year. Not suggesting that the blame is on Morgan of course 9some of these may just not be good enough) but he will be judged on how he helps develop players at this level.

In my opinion he is miles off being considered a future manager at this level as needs to get some real longer term experience of being the number one at a club whether it be Conference level if he has to. I am surprised he has stayed around. I feel if he serious about being a number one; he will have to move on sooner rather than later.

Be interesting to see if Adkins does retain him longer term as he likes his own staff. Morgan does seem to have a personality and work ethic that has allowed him to be retained but I have my doubts whether he has the innovative approach or tactical nous 9having seen quite a few u21 games) necessary at this stage of his career for him to do much more than he is doing. Harsh as that sounds.

 

[Deadbat]

Your info is inaccurate. Wage is nearer half that.

Yes the database is huge.

I repeat, find me a player under 30 years old who is available for the price and who will play in L1 with nearly 150 goals to his name.

UTB

The fact is most of those goals came when he was at Scunny and Doncaster a fair time ago. He has scored only 11 goals in the last 2 and a bit seasons and has not been a regular starter at Leeds most of last season.

I love the fact he is so passionate about SUFC and would take a pay cut allegedly to come back but he is another player on his way down for me and another type of player we should be avoiding. He showed nothing at Leeds last season to suggest he the player he was when he was free scoring.

My feeling over not signing him is not based on his previous spells at the Lane but the fact he looked a poor player when I saw him for Leeds (watched him quite a few games) last season. If it was not for the Blades connection and we went for a player with his record over the last few seasons I think fans would be distinctly unimpressed. He is a similar type of player to McNulty to me and I believe that having two such players of this type would be counter productive of our use of resources. We need some out and out raw pace, a player who has been regularly scoring goals and or some height/hold up play/strength. As McNulty is contracted already unsure why we would bring in another player that does not hit many/any of these attributes and we would have to pay him out of his contract to get him. It's a no from me. Maybe Adkins can get him back to what he was but people forget it is 3 or 4 years when he was the free scoring player he was. He has done very little in recent times; even when he as back at Doncaster.

 

[YES Blade]

Based on what? He record of one goal in six for us in the past?

His five goals in 33 league appearances for Leeds?

Christ, sign him up immediately.

16 of those were as a sub!

 

[Guesty]

Which translates roughly as you can't !!!

Seriously, I have no idea if Sharp is available or wants to come.

Even less of an idea that he might, just might be on the slippery slope downwards in his career, which is entirely possible.

But to constantly write the guy off based on his time at the Lane under Blackwell (!!), when he has proved, beyond any reasonable doubt to be an accomplished if not brilliant Championship standard striker is, frankly, daft.

You know where I stand on this. Played correctly, Sharp would be as close to a cast iron guarantee of 20 goals a season in this division you could possible have.

Bearing in mind Adkins initial assessment being that we need more goals, and to concede far less, I suspect he will be high up on Adkins wish list for the former.

UTB

I certainly don't claim any great knowledge of the scouting network, no. Frankly, if the people we have can't do better than Sharp then we aren't going anywhere next season.

You claim he failed under Blackwell, was that the same environment that led to notorious Blades flop James Beattie failing to score any goals?

Would you look at Sharp twice if he weren't a Sheffield United fan? Look at his recent record and answer honestly.

 

[YES Blade]

The fact is most of those goals came when he was at Scunny and Doncaster a fair time ago. He has scored only 11 goals in the last 2 and a bit seasons and has not been a regular starter at Leeds most of last season.

I love the fact he is so passionate about SUFC and would take a pay cut allegedly to come back but he is another player on his way down for me and another type of player we should be avoiding. He showed nothing at Leeds last season to suggest he the player he was when he was free scoring.

My feeling over not signing him is not based on his previous spells at the Lane but the fact he looked a poor player when I saw him for Leeds (watched him quite a few games) last season. If it was not for the Blades connection and we went for a player with his record over the last few seasons I think fans would be distinctly unimpressed. He is a similar type of player to McNulty to me and I believe that having two such players of this type would be counter productive of our use of resources. We need some out and out raw pace, a player who has been regularly scoring goals and or some height/hold up play/strength. As McNulty is contracted already unsure why we would bring in another player that does not hit many/any of these attributes and we would have to pay him out of his contract to get him. It's a no from me. Maybe Adkins can get him back to what he was but people forget it is 3 or 4 years when he was the free scoring player he was. He has done very little in recent times; even when he as back at Doncaster.

1. That was playing in the Championship against better defences.
2. Leeds are a bang average Championship team, he's hardly going to be getting chance after chance.
3. WE'RE IN LEAGUE ONE! What do you expect? Patrick Bamford? Troy Deeney? We ain't going to be signing strikers who look quality in Championship teams.

 

[wizadry]

Your info is inaccurate. Wage is nearer half that.

Yes the database is huge.

I repeat, find me a player under 30 years old who is available for the price and who will play in L1 with nearly 150 goals to his name.

UTB

Like i said the scouting database is huge and it's down to the scouts to get the required players not me.

We will not get Billy for 300k, not a chance, strikers in the championship go for more than that, especially when you consider we got Matty Done for 750k from League one.

Two names i would consider infront of Billy at the moment would be Tom Bradshaw and Cody Mcdonald. I'd see getting Billy as a big gamble due to wages and his fee, i would see getting the aforementioned as a lot less of a gamble and they'd propably get just as many goals.

I believe who told me what he's on, whether it's wrong or not is another matter but i very much doubt it's wrong 'tbh'.

 

[Guesty]

16 of those were as a sub!

Because he couldn't break his way into the side.

'He didn't play much' isn't a very good excuse is it?

 

[alcoblade]

Isn't it crucial that the U-21s are coached to play the game the "right way" - a phrase you won't like but widely used in football. Put another way, to avoid side issues, the way Nigel Adkins wants the first team to play.

"Nowt Fancy - like Bassett" is a philosophy of despair. It makes me cringe that one of our coaches promotes it.

It's absolutely crucial and I'd hope that Adkins has the say on Morgan. Unlike you, he will be in a position to judge. The previous management failures, all championed by you throughout their tenure for playing "the right way" (roll on Fleetwood again by the way), also opted to keep him on.

To be straight with you Pinchy, you seem to be a fan of abject failure. Perhaps this is the best advertisement for Morgan that there is.

UTB

 

[Deadbat]

16 of those were as a sub!

Why could he not command a regular first team spot though. Played under several manager and never established himself under any. Leeds were a mess last season and had no proven strikers at all. Sharp really should have nailed down a regular spot there if he was the ace goal getter/player he is being made out to be. He was brand new at Leeds and within a season he is seen as surplus which is a concern to me.

 

[YES Blade]

Because he couldn't break his way into the side.

'He didn't play much' isn't a very good excuse is it?

So we shouldn't be looking at signing players who aren't first team regulars in the Championship?

 

[YES Blade]

Why could he not command a regular first team spot though. Played under several manager and never established himself under any. Leeds were a mess last season and had no proven strikers at all. Sharp really should have nailed down a regular spot there if he was the ace goal getter/player he is being made out to be. He was brand new at Leeds and within a season he is seen as surplus which is a concern to me.

And if he had nailed down a regular first team start, we wouldn't have a hope in hell of signing him!

 

[Ben_1982]

Like i said the scouting database is huge and it's down to the scouts to get the required players not me.

We will not get Billy for 300k, not a chance, strikers in the championship go for more than that, especially when you consider we got Matty Done for 750k from League one.

Two names i would consider infront of Billy at the moment would be Tom Bradshaw and Cody Mcdonald. I'd see getting Billy as a big gamble due to wages and his fee, i would see getting the aforementioned as a lot less of a gamble and they'd propably get just as many goals.

I believe who told me what he's on, whether it's wrong or not is another matter but i very much doubt it's wrong 'tbh'.

We certainly didn't pay 750k for Matt Done

 

[Guesty]

So we shouldn't be looking at signing players who aren't first team regulars in the Championship?

We shouldn't look to be signing Billy Sharp. I'm not speaking in generalities.

 

[itsinyerblood]

Why could he not command a regular first team spot though. Played under several manager and never established himself under any. Leeds were a mess last season and had no proven strikers at all. Sharp really should have nailed down a regular spot there if he was the ace goal getter/player he is being made out to be. He was brand new at Leeds and within a season he is seen as surplus which is a concern to me.

And therein the reason why we must avoid signing Sharp. Circumstance was in his favour, it was all there for Billy to exploit, but it still wasn't enough. It's not about whether he's a first team regular or not, it's about looking at a position that cries out for very obvious talents. When Sharp was in his prime he wasn't exactly the fastest player around, and unless Sharp has undergone some type of bionic procedure we'll be waiting for Billy to make his way into the penalty area while the rest of the team fanny about with the ball until he's in position....a novel ploy I admit, but one destined to be sussed by the opposition by game 2 at the latest.

Provided Done receives service and support, we may already have a player who can get 15-20 goals next season, so what we need is someone who can contribute to that threat and make us worthy contenders for promotion.

 

[wizadry]

We certainly didn't pay 750k for Matt Done

That's only what i sore somewhere Ben, can't remember where, i'll try and find it. What was the fee then mate?

 

[Ben_1982]

More like 400k

 

[DronnieBlade]

And therein the reason why we must avoid signing Sharp. Circumstance was in his favour, it was all there for Billy to exploit, but it still wasn't enough. It's not about whether he's a first team regular or not, it's about looking at a position that cries out for very obvious talents. When Sharp was in his prime he wasn't exactly the fastest player around, and unless Sharp has undergone some type of bionic procedure we'll be waiting for Billy to make his way into the penalty area while the rest of the team fanny about with the ball until he's in position....a novel ploy I admit, but one destined to be sussed by the opposition by game 2 at the latest.

Provided Done receives service and support, we may already have a player who can get 15-20 goals next season, so what we need is someone who can contribute to that threat and make us worthy contenders for promotion.

Mmmmmm
Now let me have a think what kind of player you are describing !!!!!!!

UTB

 

[wizadry]

More like 400k

That is propably the best bit of buisness ever if that's the case Ben, i think that could be rising to 750k then. I've definately seen it somewhere.

 

[DronnieBlade]

I certainly don't claim any great knowledge of the scouting network, no. Frankly, if the people we have can't do better than Sharp then we aren't going anywhere next season.

You claim he failed under Blackwell, was that the same environment that led to notorious Blades flop James Beattie failing to score any goals?

Would you look at Sharp twice if he weren't a Sheffield United fan? Look at his recent record and answer honestly.

Categorically Yes.

Honestly.

UTB

 

[YES Blade]

Categorically Yes.

Honestly.

UTB

And so would every club in league one given the chance!

 

[bladesmanluke]

Ched Evans didn't have a great record in the championship either. Nor Matty Friatt at Leicester. Drop to league one and bang. It's a piss poor division that even Chris Porter managed to score 20 in once. Billy Sharp would bag for fun

 

[Pinchy]

Forget the bladey blade bollocks.

UTB

If only we could, but it just keeps on coming....