scougal

[bertieblade]

what does the guy offer this season?
Last season , burst into space, give and go, retain possession, quick feet around the box.
This season, just runs into blind alleys and loses possession, I would replace him, baxter and doyle in the centre, where we need physical presence but God knows where we find it.

Coutts had to play and then we need two more, possibly Flo but we are crying out for someone who is a presence both physically and mentally, someone who gets at players and imposes himself.

 

[SwissBlade]

what does the guy offer this season?
Last season , burst into space, give and go, retain possession, quick feet around the box.
This season, just runs into blind alleys and loses possession, I would replace him, baxter and doyle in the centre, where we need physical presence but God knows where we find it.

Coutts had to play and then we need two more, possibly Flo but we are crying out for someone who is a presence both physically and mentally, someone who gets at players and imposes himself.

Thought he was one of the better players tonight and has shown excellent form in last few games.

Pity he went off, looked like he took a knock

 

[judge]

I thought he was awful tonight and I like the lad and really want him to do well
mcnulty was dreadful tonight as well but
I'm hoping both can ImProve on that

 

[alcoblade]

He's a passenger with the ball, which is where he should excel. Improved of late, but not good enough overall. Along with Baxter, I expect him to make way for new signings.

UTB

 

[JohnDenver]

I'd love to see Scougs in a midfield three with two other players who back up his runs and help him close down. Hunt in packs....

 

[alcoblade]

I'd love to see Scougs in a midfield three with two other players who back up his runs and help him close down. Hunt in packs....

They can't back up his runs with the ball, because he doesn't - other than into empty safe space. He gathers the ball, runs really quickly into space, looks up and passes to a winger. Everyone is sat so deep that the ball then goes back into the middle until we catch up. In the 2nd half, we are allowed to get into their half and it works better. Repeat and rinse. It's so predictable it's unbelievable.

Surely we now have a midfielder or two prepared to take responsibility and go through the middle. Preferably one with a gut smaller than mine.

UTB

 

[davidpinder]

Doesn't score enough goals for me, gets into good positions then either scuffs it or gives the keeper an easy save.

 

[JohnDenver]

until we catch up.

Exactly that... We don't attack or defend as a unit when we pick this midfield. We need a fit Wallace or Coutts to come good. Both would be even better.

 

[AnonymousBlade1995]

lets see what holt can do

 

[Grappler]

Scougall, for me, should only come on in the last 20 minutes, to use his pace when defenders are tired. He is too small (along with Baxter, Doyle and Reed) to be effective when balls are being pumped over head. We have been crying out for some height in the middle of the park for some time.

 

[longinthe toothblade]

Thought he was one of the better players tonight and has shown excellent form in last few games.

Pity he went off, looked like he took a knock

Agree with some of that. Certainly his form has improved this last few weeks and that's got to be a huge positive. He's not firing on all cylinders as he was last year but there's enough evidence that he can turn it around.

There were worse players than Scougall on that pitch tonight.

 

[Grappler]

Agree with some of that. Certainly his form has improved this last few weeks and that's got to be a huge positive. He's not firing on all cylinders as he was last year but there's enough evidence that he can turn it around.

There were worse players than Scougall on that pitch tonight.

True, and we were too late making changes, didn't even use all our subs

 

[Kempy]

what does the guy offer this season?
Last season , burst into space, give and go, retain possession, quick feet around the box.
This season, just runs into blind alleys and loses possession, I would replace him, baxter and doyle in the centre, where we need physical presence but God knows where we find it.

Coutts had to play and then we need two more, possibly Flo but we are crying out for someone who is a presence both physically and mentally, someone who gets at players and imposes himself.

Getting fed up of people knocking Scougs on here... those who do quite simply must be either blind or just have a poor understanding of the game.

Simple answer which is unbelievably easy to see if people open their eyes is here:
http://www.s24su.com/forum/index.php?threads/baxter-and-doyle-in-central-midfield.38213/

The midfield is incredibly immobile with Baxter and Doyle in it. Scougall at the moment is doing twice the work harrying down to cover for Baxters inability to get anywhere near the ball defensively. Doyle I appreciate if stuck in his correct and limited position as a ball winner is fine. However, the midfield is made shockingly worse by the likes of another slow player who cannot get back in time to defend.

One of the big differences from this year and last year for Scougall? - Coady. A highly mobile and hard working player who gets back defensively and makes positive forward runs into space. The lad was box to box last year giving Scougall more freedom to run into the space provided and nick balls of slow opposition players in advanced areas. Instead, playing along Baxter who does not make these runs leaves a man free for the opposition to double up on Scougs.

Are you honestly telling me you cannot see the running and closing down Scougs has to do to cover that entire upper section of the midfield 3? Simply because Baxter sits back to 'playmake' in the position which Doyle should be sitting in? Reed makes a difference when he comes on with his intelligent balls but also his harrying of defenders. This allows Scougall to do his normal work load and often appears to make him more available... I wonder why? How much more dangerous did we look in the second half against Swindon with Reed and Scougs playing in the middle? Funnily enough we scored both our goals with those two playing in the midfield instead of Wallace. Wallace had a poor game on Saturday, his lack of harrying and chasing left Reed to do the majority of that to support Higo/Murphy in closing down once they breached the halfway line.

It's quite easy to see that if any one of the two advanced players is not coupled with another hard working player we play shit. This is because the game is completely bypassed in that vital section of the midfield. Clough's formation relies on 2 hard working midfielders who harry and chase down the opposition CM's/Cb's and support the striker with forward runs. Anything that gets past these 2 is then picked up by Doyle due to the pressure put on by the two in front.The same with support for the striker, it's the overload method from center midfield which creates and breaks up play with more options than the opposition has. By playing a less mobile player in this position it completely nullifies our attacking,defensive, and counter options.

Baxter has the ability to do something special with the ball at any point, problem is.... he does that 1-2/10 games, if lucky. Simply, at the minute we have better options which allow Scougall to play his correct role and the team to play the correct method they are set out to play.

- So there you go, Scougall is not playing crap, it's those around him who negate what he is suppose to be doing.

 

[Grappler]

Getting fed up of people knocking Scougs on here... those who do quite simply must be either blind or just have a poor understanding of the game.

Simple answer which is unbelievably easy to see if people open their eyes is here:
http://www.s24su.com/forum/index.php?threads/baxter-and-doyle-in-central-midfield.38213/

The midfield is incredibly immobile with Baxter and Doyle in it. Scougall at the moment is doing twice the work harrying down to cover for Baxters inability to get anywhere near the ball defensively. Doyle I appreciate if stuck in his correct and limited position as a ball winner is fine. However, the midfield is made shockingly worse by the likes of another slow player who cannot get back in time to defend.

One of the big differences from this year and last year for Scougall? - Coady. A highly mobile and hard working player who gets back defensively and makes positive forward runs into space. The lad was box to box last year giving Scougall more freedom to run into the space provided and nick balls of slow opposition players in advanced areas. Instead, playing along Baxter who does not make these runs leaves a man free for the opposition to double up on Scougs.

Are you honestly telling me you cannot see the running and closing down Scougs has to do to cover that entire upper section of the midfield 3? Simply because Baxter sits back to 'playmake' in the position which Doyle should be sitting in? Reed makes a difference when he comes on with his intelligent balls but also his harrying of defenders. This allows Scougall to do his normal work load and often appears to make him more available... I wonder why? How much more dangerous did we look in the second half against Swindon with Reed and Scougs playing in the middle? Funnily enough we scored both our goals with those two playing in the midfield instead of Wallace. Wallace had a poor game on Saturday, his lack of harrying and chasing left Reed to do the majority of that to support Higo/Murphy in closing down once they breached the halfway line.

It's quite easy to see that if any one of the two advanced players is not coupled with another hard working player we play shit. This is because the game is completely bypassed in that vital section of the midfield. Clough's formation relies on 2 hard working midfielders who harry and chase down the opposition CM's/Cb's and support the striker with forward runs. Anything that gets past these 2 is then picked up by Doyle due to the pressure put on by the two in front.The same with support for the striker, it's the overload method from center midfield which creates and breaks up play with more options than the opposition has. By playing a less mobile player in this position it completely nullifies our attacking,defensive, and counter options.

Baxter has the ability to do something special with the ball at any point, problem is.... he does that 1-2/10 games, if lucky. Simply, at the minute we have better options which allow Scougall to play his correct role and the team to play the correct method they are set out to play.

- So there you go, Scougall is not playing crap, it's those around him who negate what he is suppose to be doing.

Everyones view of a game is different, depending on where you sit in the ground. I just want some height in the middle of the park, we won nothing tonight in mid-air.

 

[Nick Jansky]

Getting fed up of people knocking Scougs on here... those who do quite simply must be either blind or just have a poor understanding of the game.

Simple answer which is unbelievably easy to see if people open their eyes is here:
http://www.s24su.com/forum/index.php?threads/baxter-and-doyle-in-central-midfield.38213/

The midfield is incredibly immobile with Baxter and Doyle in it. Scougall at the moment is doing twice the work harrying down to cover for Baxters inability to get anywhere near the ball defensively. Doyle I appreciate if stuck in his correct and limited position as a ball winner is fine. However, the midfield is made shockingly worse by the likes of another slow player who cannot get back in time to defend.

One of the big differences from this year and last year for Scougall? - Coady. A highly mobile and hard working player who gets back defensively and makes positive forward runs into space. The lad was box to box last year giving Scougall more freedom to run into the space provided and nick balls of slow opposition players in advanced areas. Instead, playing along Baxter who does not make these runs leaves a man free for the opposition to double up on Scougs.

Are you honestly telling me you cannot see the running and closing down Scougs has to do to cover that entire upper section of the midfield 3? Simply because Baxter sits back to 'playmake' in the position which Doyle should be sitting in? Reed makes a difference when he comes on with his intelligent balls but also his harrying of defenders. This allows Scougall to do his normal work load and often appears to make him more available... I wonder why? How much more dangerous did we look in the second half against Swindon with Reed and Scougs playing in the middle? Funnily enough we scored both our goals with those two playing in the midfield instead of Wallace. Wallace had a poor game on Saturday, his lack of harrying and chasing left Reed to do the majority of that to support Higo/Murphy in closing down once they breached the halfway line.

It's quite easy to see that if any one of the two advanced players is not coupled with another hard working player we play shit. This is because the game is completely bypassed in that vital section of the midfield. Clough's formation relies on 2 hard working midfielders who harry and chase down the opposition CM's/Cb's and support the striker with forward runs. Anything that gets past these 2 is then picked up by Doyle due to the pressure put on by the two in front.The same with support for the striker, it's the overload method from center midfield which creates and breaks up play with more options than the opposition has. By playing a less mobile player in this position it completely nullifies our attacking,defensive, and counter options.

Baxter has the ability to do something special with the ball at any point, problem is.... he does that 1-2/10 games, if lucky. Simply, at the minute we have better options which allow Scougall to play his correct role and the team to play the correct method they are set out to play.

- So there you go, Scougall is not playing crap, it's those around him who negate what he is suppose to be doing.

Great to see posts like this from the likes of you & Bergen who actually understand what is happening on the pitch. Criticism of players is fine when it is justified by an objective analysis, but some of the stuff on here at times is just laughable.

 

[judge]

Getting fed up of people knocking Scougs on here... those who do quite simply must be either blind or just have a poor understanding of the game.

Simple answer which is unbelievably easy to see if people open their eyes is here:
http://www.s24su.com/forum/index.php?threads/baxter-and-doyle-in-central-midfield.38213/

The midfield is incredibly immobile with Baxter and Doyle in it. Scougall at the moment is doing twice the work harrying down to cover for Baxters inability to get anywhere near the ball defensively. Doyle I appreciate if stuck in his correct and limited position as a ball winner is fine. However, the midfield is made shockingly worse by the likes of another slow player who cannot get back in time to defend.

One of the big differences from this year and last year for Scougall? - Coady. A highly mobile and hard working player who gets back defensively and makes positive forward runs into space. The lad was box to box last year giving Scougall more freedom to run into the space provided and nick balls of slow opposition players in advanced areas. Instead, playing along Baxter who does not make these runs leaves a man free for the opposition to double up on Scougs.

Are you honestly telling me you cannot see the running and closing down Scougs has to do to cover that entire upper section of the midfield 3? Simply because Baxter sits back to 'playmake' in the position which Doyle should be sitting in? Reed makes a difference when he comes on with his intelligent balls but also his harrying of defenders. This allows Scougall to do his normal work load and often appears to make him more available... I wonder why? How much more dangerous did we look in the second half against Swindon with Reed and Scougs playing in the middle? Funnily enough we scored both our goals with those two playing in the midfield instead of Wallace. Wallace had a poor game on Saturday, his lack of harrying and chasing left Reed to do the majority of that to support Higo/Murphy in closing down once they breached the halfway line.

It's quite easy to see that if any one of the two advanced players is not coupled with another hard working player we play shit. This is because the game is completely bypassed in that vital section of the midfield. Clough's formation relies on 2 hard working midfielders who harry and chase down the opposition CM's/Cb's and support the striker with forward runs. Anything that gets past these 2 is then picked up by Doyle due to the pressure put on by the two in front.The same with support for the striker, it's the overload method from center midfield which creates and breaks up play with more options than the opposition has. By playing a less mobile player in this position it completely nullifies our attacking,defensive, and counter options.

Baxter has the ability to do something special with the ball at any point, problem is.... he does that 1-2/10 games, if lucky. Simply, at the minute we have better options which allow Scougall to play his correct role and the team to play the correct method they are set out to play.

- So there you go, Scougall is not playing crap, it's those around him who negate what he is suppose to be doing.

He looked like a jack russel on a driving range

 

[Revolution]

Getting fed up of people knocking Scougs on here... those who do quite simply must be either blind or just have a poor understanding of the game.

Simple answer which is unbelievably easy to see if people open their eyes is here:
http://www.s24su.com/forum/index.php?threads/baxter-and-doyle-in-central-midfield.38213/

The midfield is incredibly immobile with Baxter and Doyle in it. Scougall at the moment is doing twice the work harrying down to cover for Baxters inability to get anywhere near the ball defensively. Doyle I appreciate if stuck in his correct and limited position as a ball winner is fine. However, the midfield is made shockingly worse by the likes of another slow player who cannot get back in time to defend.

One of the big differences from this year and last year for Scougall? - Coady. A highly mobile and hard working player who gets back defensively and makes positive forward runs into space. The lad was box to box last year giving Scougall more freedom to run into the space provided and nick balls of slow opposition players in advanced areas. Instead, playing along Baxter who does not make these runs leaves a man free for the opposition to double up on Scougs.

Are you honestly telling me you cannot see the running and closing down Scougs has to do to cover that entire upper section of the midfield 3? Simply because Baxter sits back to 'playmake' in the position which Doyle should be sitting in? Reed makes a difference when he comes on with his intelligent balls but also his harrying of defenders. This allows Scougall to do his normal work load and often appears to make him more available... I wonder why? How much more dangerous did we look in the second half against Swindon with Reed and Scougs playing in the middle? Funnily enough we scored both our goals with those two playing in the midfield instead of Wallace. Wallace had a poor game on Saturday, his lack of harrying and chasing left Reed to do the majority of that to support Higo/Murphy in closing down once they breached the halfway line.

It's quite easy to see that if any one of the two advanced players is not coupled with another hard working player we play shit. This is because the game is completely bypassed in that vital section of the midfield. Clough's formation relies on 2 hard working midfielders who harry and chase down the opposition CM's/Cb's and support the striker with forward runs. Anything that gets past these 2 is then picked up by Doyle due to the pressure put on by the two in front.The same with support for the striker, it's the overload method from center midfield which creates and breaks up play with more options than the opposition has. By playing a less mobile player in this position it completely nullifies our attacking,defensive, and counter options.

Baxter has the ability to do something special with the ball at any point, problem is.... he does that 1-2/10 games, if lucky. Simply, at the minute we have better options which allow Scougall to play his correct role and the team to play the correct method they are set out to play.

- So there you go, Scougall is not playing crap, it's those around him who negate what he is suppose to be doing.

This is a really interesting post, but I disagree with few points:

- the midfield has a similar creative problem if Reed is next to Scougall, and had it when Basham was in it. The problem is that none of these players are doing enough as a group to compensate for the fact that we only have one man up front

- this sounds a lot like when people used to tell me that Monty was not the problem, but it was those around him

- I haven't checked it recently, and there are other factors at play, but over the first 15 or so games our record with Scougs in the side was markedly worse than when he was out.

- I don't think Scougall is supporting the forwards at all. He has scored one goal. He rarely gets in a shot and on the odd occasion he has done so his finishing has been poor to sat the least. This is partly Clough's fault. If you play 2 "harriers", why is Doyle also needed to break up play? It doesn't make sense.

- the inclusion of Reed and Scougall in midfield together is really hurting us on occasion. It has not proved difficult to knock Scougall off the ball this season.

Quite frankly, I think we could do with seeing less of him as a starter for a while.

 

[Woodwardfan]

They can't back up his runs with the ball, because he doesn't - other than into empty safe space. He gathers the ball, runs really quickly into space, looks up and passes to a winger. Everyone is sat so deep that the ball then goes back into the middle until we catch up. In the 2nd half, we are allowed to get into their half and it works better. Repeat and rinse. It's so predictable it's unbelievable.

Surely we now have a midfielder or two prepared to take responsibility and go through the middle. Preferably one with a gut smaller than mine.

UTB

Exactly.

 

[Bergen Blade]

This is a really interesting post, but I disagree with few points:

- the midfield has a similar creative problem if Reed is next to Scougall, and had it when Basham was in it. The problem is that none of these players are doing enough as a group to compensate for the fact that we only have one man up front

- this sounds a lot like when people used to tell me that Monty was not the problem, but it was those around him

- I haven't checked it recently, and there are other factors at play, but over the first 15 or so games our record with Scougs in the side was markedly worse than when he was out.

- I don't think Scougall is supporting the forwards at all. He has scored one goal. He rarely gets in a shot and on the odd occasion he has done so his finishing has been poor to sat the least. This is partly Clough's fault. If you play 2 "harriers", why is Doyle also needed to break up play? It doesn't make sense.

- the inclusion of Reed and Scougall in midfield together is really hurting us on occasion. It has not proved difficult to knock Scougall off the ball this season.

Quite frankly, I think we could do with seeing less of him as a starter for a while.

I think the mobility of the two players flanking the holding midfielder is key for the team's balance. "Harriers" is a decent term, as the role is very demanding fitness-wise, but they have to contribute offensively as well, not least off the ball, getting into the box. As Kempy said Coady did well last season and has been missed. This season I think Reed, Cuvelier and Scougall fits the requirement, and our recent performances with these combinations are decent:

• Southampton 1-0 (Doyle, flanked by Cuvelier and Reed)
• Port Vale 1-2 (Doyle, flanked by Reed and Cuvelier) We were bullied, but played ok and ought to have lead first half. Cuvelier went off at h/t.
• QPR 3-0 (Doyle, flanked by Reed and Scougall)
• Tottenham 0-1 (Doyle, flanked by Reed and Scougall)
• Tottenham 2-3 last 30 mins (Baxter, flanked by Reed and Scougall) (suddenly started creating and scored twice)
• Swindon 2-0 last 30 mins (Coutts, flanked by Reed and Scougall) (played well, after struggling a bit first half)

When has these role combinations seen us fail?

 

[GRUMPY BLADE]

I think the mobility of the two players flanking the holding midfielder is key for the team's balance. "Harriers" is a decent term, as the role is very demanding fitness-wise, but they have to contribute offensively as well, not least off the ball, getting into the box. As Kempy said Coady did well last season and has been missed. This season I think Reed, Cuvelier and Scougall fits the requirement, and our recent performances with these combinations are decent:

• Southampton 1-0 (Doyle, flanked by Cuvelier and Reed)
• Port Vale 1-2 (Doyle, flanked by Reed and Cuvelier) We were bullied, but played ok and ought to have lead first half. Cuvelier went off at h/t.
• QPR 3-0 (Doyle, flanked by Reed and Scougall)
• Tottenham 0-1 (Doyle, flanked by Reed and Scougall)
• Tottenham 2-3 last 30 mins (Baxter, flanked by Reed and Scougall) (suddenly started creating and scored twice)
• Swindon 2-0 last 30 mins (Coutts, flanked by Reed and Scougall) (played well, after struggling a bit first half)

When has these role combinations seen us fail?

Big problem is that if those results were the next six league games we'd have dropped nine points, more than 50% of what we can afford to drop out of 30% of the 21 games left.

 

[Woodwardfan]

Big problem is that if those results were the next six league games we'd have dropped nine points, more than 50% of what we can afford to drop out of 30% of the 21 games left.

From now on we are playing in League 1, mostly against teams who are not prepared to push players upfield thereby allowing us space to attack. Examples against Prem teams are not that pertinent. Even Vale and Swindon played more forward than we are used to.

It's about breaking down the banks of four and five where we need solutions. Our promotion chances are all about creating more chances, more so than worrying about the opposition who mostly are happy to get a 0-0 or steal the odd goal.

 

[OllyBlade]

I think the mobility of the two players flanking the holding midfielder is key for the team's balance. "Harriers" is a decent term, as the role is very demanding fitness-wise, but they have to contribute offensively as well, not least off the ball, getting into the box. As Kempy said Coady did well last season and has been missed. This season I think Reed, Cuvelier and Scougall fits the requirement, and our recent performances with these combinations are decent:

• Southampton 1-0 (Doyle, flanked by Cuvelier and Reed)
• Port Vale 1-2 (Doyle, flanked by Reed and Cuvelier) We were bullied, but played ok and ought to have lead first half. Cuvelier went off at h/t.
• QPR 3-0 (Doyle, flanked by Reed and Scougall)
• Tottenham 0-1 (Doyle, flanked by Reed and Scougall)
• Tottenham 2-3 last 30 mins (Baxter, flanked by Reed and Scougall) (suddenly started creating and scored twice)
• Swindon 2-0 last 30 mins (Coutts, flanked by Reed and Scougall) (played well, after struggling a bit first half)

When has these role combinations seen us fail?

Noticing a common theme in those line ups. It rhymes with 'bead'. Get him in the team keep him in the team I don't care if he's 17 he's the future. Doyle + Reed + another based on opponent for me.

 

[GRUMPY BLADE]

From now on we are playing in League 1, mostly against teams who are not prepared to push players upfield thereby allowing us space to attack. Examples against Prem teams are not that pertinent. Even Vale and Swindon played more forward than we are used to.

It's about breaking down the banks of four and five where we need solutions. Our promotion chances are all about creating more chances, more so than worrying about the opposition who mostly are happy to get a 0-0 or steal the odd goal.

Totally agree with point of view, I was just trying to point out that if replicated the WLD of those six games we'd only be able to drop about 4 points in the last 15 games to demonstrate how high that mountain is we are climbing.

Being happy with a 0-0 and stealing the odd goal leaves you about 6th with less than 40 points at the start of Febuary I'd guess?

 

[Bergen Blade]

Big problem is that if those results were the next six league games we'd have dropped nine points, more than 50% of what we can afford to drop out of 30% of the 21 games left.

Four of those six matches were against Premiership opposition though. I think we've messed up in the some of the following league games by including Baxter in a role that requires attributes he doesn't possess.

 

[GRUMPY BLADE]

Four of those six matches were against Premiership opposition though. I think we've messed up in the some of the following league games by including Baxter in a role that requires attributes he doesn't possess.

See post #23

I was just trying to point out that if replicated the WLD of those six games we'd only be able to drop about 4 points in the last 15 games to demonstrate how high that mountain is we are climbing.

 

[Woodwardfan]

Totally agree with point of view, I was just trying to point out that if replicated the WLD of those six games we'd only be able to drop about 4 points in the last 15 games to demonstrate how high that mountain is we are climbing.

Being happy with a 0-0 and stealing the odd goal leaves you about 6th with less than 40 points at the start of Febuary I'd guess?

Sorry Grumpy, my comments were referring to Bergen's list of fixtures on his post, different ball game from hereon in. We are in agreement, I pressed the wrong "reply"button!

 

[Kempy]

This is a really interesting post, but I disagree with few points:

- the midfield has a similar creative problem if Reed is next to Scougall, and had it when Basham was in it. The problem is that none of these players are doing enough as a group to compensate for the fact that we only have one man up front

- this sounds a lot like when people used to tell me that Monty was not the problem, but it was those around him

- I haven't checked it recently, and there are other factors at play, but over the first 15 or so games our record with Scougs in the side was markedly worse than when he was out.

- I don't think Scougall is supporting the forwards at all. He has scored one goal. He rarely gets in a shot and on the odd occasion he has done so his finishing has been poor to sat the least. This is partly Clough's fault. If you play 2 "harriers", why is Doyle also needed to break up play? It doesn't make sense.

- the inclusion of Reed and Scougall in midfield together is really hurting us on occasion. It has not proved difficult to knock Scougall off the ball this season.

Quite frankly, I think we could do with seeing less of him as a starter for a while.

Sorry Rev, I just can't agree with above, everyone is allowed their point of view though!

1. I don't think the midfield has any creative issues playing Reed and Scougs. I think you'll find Reed is actually one of our most creative players on the pitch, some of the through balls he plays are extremely impressive for someone of his age cutting 2-3 opposition players out of the game. Scougall is not meant to be a 'creative' player as such. He is meant to be a harrier/someone who can take the ball and blitz past people. At the moment he is being doubled up on as the opposition simply does not bother marking Baxter (he's too deep for the opposition midfield to worry about/one of the strikers can close him down as he is so fecking deep). This gives them the flexibility to mark scougall and double up in the areas he runs into. Now what I can agree with is they aren't doing enough to support the front man. However, this is easily answered with the Baxter problem. Baxter is never within a 5m radius of whoever is upfront. This as I have pointed out leaves Scougall the only one to try and get near him... doubling his work load and making it extremely easy to negate any attack we have.

2. Can't address that point mate, maybe your opinion but a completely (i resit the urge to be a knob and put that in capitals) different scenario to Monty. Different formation, completely different style of player.... the list goes on.

3. Can't see where you are getting that from mate? I still also pursue the point that, that is down to the other partner Scougall is put up with. (i.e. see previous pints/post).

4.'Scougall support' see previous point on this due to immobile midfield partner not allowing him to play his full game. I don't think you can single out Scougall for poor finishing in a squad which in its entirety is lacking goals. I would have expected more from a lot of players whose supposed finishing could easily be rated higher than that of Scougall. Again... if he isn't allowed the space freed up by another hard working midfielder then he won't be able to get in the position to shoot. (2nd point) - Just to clear up, I don't see the advanced two midfield positions as 'harriers'. That is part of their game, a vital part which if not done correctly completely negates our formations intentions completely. They are however also suppose to be supporting the striker, that means both of them. If one of them doesn't then the other appears to be playing shit -i.e. Scougall. This due to when they get the ball/make a run, they are doubled up on due to the other midfield partner not making a run/dragging a defender/midfielder away. Doyle is there to pick up the pieces when we screw up. When we attack as we should with both advanced midfield roles and it doesn't end in the net / we keep hold of possession, then the opposition counters,,, que Doyle taking them out. He is also there to mop up any loose balls created by the two advanced midfielders harrying the opposition. He then 8/10 plays the ball wide and we have another crack.

5. Honestly, you're entitled to your own opinion... but it's not. The problem is the player playing along side Scougall. Yes Scougs will have the one or two off games but the formation is perfect for him, if played with another midfielder who can do the role (preferably a more creative player who can knock a good through ball... see Reed, Wallace - who we are missing big style, etc). We do not have powerhouses in the midfield, we have small nippy players. It would seem that this would be an issue with knocking them off the ball easy? I would have thought so too but what I have been surprised with is how many freekicks we get for it instead. You watch Socugall when he receives the ball, excellent first touch which pushes the ball past the player. 7/10 if any player actually gets near Scougall... they foul him. It seems not to be as much of an issue, take QPR for example, they're all fecking giants, yet they couldn't get near our lads as they were too quick. Would I prefer a stronger option in midfield?... Yes, do we have one?... no. I tell you what though, if Baxter keeps playing in the midfield role where Reed or another should play alongside Scougall, we will drop a lot more points.

 

[Sothall_Blade]

what does the guy offer this season?
Last season , burst into space, give and go, retain possession, quick feet around the box.
This season, just runs into blind alleys and loses possession, I would replace him, baxter and doyle in the centre, where we need physical presence but God knows where we find it.

Coutts had to play and then we need two more, possibly Flo but we are crying out for someone who is a presence both physically and mentally, someone who gets at players and imposes himself.

I think it might be worth trying Ben Davies in Central Midfield as he's a better all-rounder than most we have.
He's not tall but he's strong and has got more physical presence than Reed, Scougall or Baxter.
Strong in the tackle. Good workrate. Decent passer of the ball. Comfortable in wide positions if he finds himself there.
Knows how to find the target (4 goals from 10 league starts).
Also handy to have him on the pitch to try and create more from our free kicks and corners.

He and Coutts could potentially form a solid two man midfield allowing us to play 4-4-2 with traditional, attacking wingers:-

JCR Davies Coutts Adams
Murphy Done

 

[HolmesfieldBlade]

what does the guy offer this season?
Last season , burst into space, give and go, retain possession, quick feet around the box.
This season, just runs into blind alleys and loses possession, I would replace him, baxter and doyle in the centre, where we need physical presence but God knows where we find it.

Coutts had to play and then we need two more, possibly Flo but we are crying out for someone who is a presence both physically and mentally, someone who gets at players and imposes himself.

A mental presence you say? Could that be... THE BEARD?

Brayford plays against Swindon and we keep it tight and score 2 goals... Brayford is cup tied against Preston and we loose 1-3, coincidence? I think not. We have very little leaders on the pitch and I think that is our problem at times.

In regards to Scougs; I do think we would benefit from a player like Gallagher who we saw last night in that position. On his day and against LESS physical opponents he's a top player.

 

[alcoblade]

Great to see posts like this from the likes of you & Bergen who actually understand what is happening on the pitch. Criticism of players is fine when it is justified by an objective analysis, but some of the stuff on here at times is just laughable.

I like the analysis too. But being wrapped up in 5000 words doesn't necessarily make it correct.

Scougall is very good off the ball. He's quite poor ( call it "takes the easy option all too often") on it. Both criticism and praise there.

For me, it's just obvious stuff

Looking at it another way, I'd question if this level of performance was conducive with us getting out if the third division. Multiply by 11 and we're threatening payoffs at best. I consider that wholly unacceptable, but I worry Clough (and some others) see it differently.

UTB