Safe Standing and Atmosphere

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BladeByChoice

BladeByChoice

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I’m noticing safe standing/rail seating comments cropping up on various threads, maybe we’re all expecting the new owners to invest in the ground.

But one thing has always baffled me about how this equates to better atmosphere, I may be being thick and have missed something obvious but:

1. We all admit the atmosphere is not what it used to be.

2. We all know how to improve this, get the fans who want to stand and sing together.

So how will safe standing fix this, won’t we just be allocated a place to stand instead of a place to sit? Won’t we all be in the same place but stood up instead of sat down. Won’t non ST holders still have to buy match tickets that aren’t together / standing with mates.

Unless I’m totally wrong, the answer has to be standing blocks not individual places, blocks of about 250 places where you can buy an ST/MDT in a block, then if a group of ST holders have a mate who wants to attend a single match, they can buy a ticket in that block and all stand together.

I’ve read
https://www.standunited.uk/

And most of the articles here
https://thefsa.org.uk/?s=safe+standing

And can see the benefits to safe standing (I’m in KB4 and stand anyway) but I can’t see how it helps the atmosphere if the atmosphere generating fans are still fragmented.
 

Re: point 1, personally the atmosphere around where I sit ( back of gangway C on the Kop) is much better than I ever remember it. Singing all game. Great support for the team. One from t’other day « we’re gangway C, we’ll sing on our own »
 
BladeByChoice said:
I’m noticing safe standing/rail seating comments cropping up on various threads, maybe we’re all expecting the new owners to invest in the ground.

But one thing has always baffled me about how this equates to better atmosphere, I may be being thick and have missed something obvious but:

1. We all admit the atmosphere is not what it used to be.

2. We all know how to improve this, get the fans who want to stand and sing together.

So how will safe standing fix this, won’t we just be allocated a place to stand instead of a place to sit? Won’t we all be in the same place but stood up instead of sat down. Won’t non ST holders still have to buy match tickets that aren’t together / standing with mates.

Unless I’m totally wrong, the answer has to be standing blocks not individual places, blocks of about 250 places where you can buy an ST/MDT in a block, then if a group of ST holders have a mate who wants to attend a single match, they can buy a ticket in that block and all stand together.

I’ve read
https://www.standunited.uk/

And most of the articles here
https://thefsa.org.uk/?s=safe+standing

And can see the benefits to safe standing (I’m in KB4 and stand anyway) but I can’t see how it helps the atmosphere if the atmosphere generating fans are still fragmented.
Click to expand...

I think the fact that a significant block of people are standing is a benefit in itself - people are much more likely to sing, and sing more loudly, when standing than when sitting.

In relation to the point about people being able to stand close together - I wonder what happens in practice? My experience is that when people are standing - even in seated areas - there’s much more fluidity about exactly where everyone is than when people are seated. Often at away games it’s possible to get a group of people together, even when there is allocated seating, on the basis that everyone’s standing anyway and people care less whether they’re in their allocated place. I suspect the same applies in ‘safe standing’ areas that - to a much greater degree - people stand in their groups and accommodate each other.

It’s something we’d probably have to ask fans who have ‘safe standing’ in their grounds, regarding how it works in reality. However, one way or the other, it certainly seems to improve the atmosphere.
 
As I explained to my neice and nephew on Saturday. The main benefit of tarreacing was that you could invite anyone and all go to and be together at the match. Not we can get you tickets near us..etc. groups of pals, friends and families.

Simply being able to stand instead of sitting might help a little, but if the status quo remains, in that you have to stand in a space allocated like a seat, is there much point?
 
Going back to the Norwich game, the atmosphere was quite flat at first but it soon picked up after the first goal, especially after Hamer's chip.
 
WorkingtonBlade said:
there’s much more fluidity about exactly where everyone is than when people are seated. Often at away games it’s possible to get a group of people together, even when there is allocated seating, on the basis that everyone’s standing anyway and people care less whether they’re in their allocated place. I suspect the same applies in ‘safe standing’ areas that - to a much greater degree - people stand in their groups and accommodate each other.
Click to expand...
^^This.

So in the end it would depend on how heavily allocated seating was policed.

At away games, where everyone stands, it's much more prevalent for fans to move places and congregate.
 
cahill said:
Re: point 1, personally the atmosphere around where I sit ( back of gangway C on the Kop) is much better than I ever remember it. Singing all game. Great support for the team. One from t’other day « we’re gangway C, we’ll sing on our own »
Click to expand...
Well that's a bit selfish. No wonder the atmosphere's flat then if that's your attitude. Surely it would be more beneficial to invite the other gangways to join in with you?
 
Safe standing is the right way forward. I miss the old days but it was bedlem at times on the terraces.

Some things have changed, the football is sometimes (but not always) duller these days with more emphasis on not losing. Also, mobile phones are a modern distraction.
 
Let's hope the arrival of BBD and TC add some much-needed spice to the atmosphere this evening. So important to win as it's a Friday, so that Sunderland feel some pressure tomorrow. They're playing Plymouth, so unlikely they'll slip up, but one never knows.
 
Interesting one this: As I understood the minutes, Bettis says they want safe standing in place for next season. I'm in favour of that (on the Kop) but surprised it could be done so quickly!
 
relish said:
Interesting one this: As I understood the minutes, Bettis says they want safe standing in place for next season. I'm in favour of that (on the Kop) but surprised it could be done so quickly!
Click to expand...
Money talks eh! If the club is forking out 3k a game, according to the minutes, on extra stewarding to cope with persistent standing, it makes complete sense to repurpose that cashflow into creating a safe space for people to do so. It's brilliant to see it happening, but I'm not so sure it would have been done if not for the financial burden influencing the decision, but never look a gift horse in the mouth and all that.

I agree it seems a rather quick turnaround to implement it, but it could be a good opportunity to bring about a bit of positive change in the stands ahead of another long Championship season. The boards comments surrounding the play-off games/atmosphere clearly points towards them wanting plenty more of that wonderful volume. Curious how it will play-out with ST holders already purchasing/renewing seats in the selected area, but I'm sure there'll be options to relocate and vice versa for ST holders who'd like to swap to the standing area once built.

Positive progress and it's brilliant to see so short into their ownership.
 

MojoMuffin said:
Curious how it will play-out with ST holders already purchasing/renewing seats in the selected area, but I'm sure there'll be options to relocate and vice versa for ST holders who'd like to swap to the standing area once built.

Positive progress and it's brilliant to see so short into their ownership.
Click to expand...
It says they will liaise with affected supporters, so I expected people who have season tickets in the affected area(s) will be given the chance to move.
That said, I imagine they will put it in the back corner of the Kop where most people are (persistently) standing anyway, so I doubt there are too many season ticket holders in that area who insist on sitting.
 
Well done to the owners

But let's make sure we do it right

Make it more like 20 rows than 10, and all across the Kop

It won't transform anything but it should help
 
It will not be in place for next season as you will have to move season ticket holders who don't want to stand. Any safe standing will have to be at the back of the kop nowhere else is there really. I'd welcome some safe standing but I would imagine a lot will be moaning if they have to move seats they have been in for years.
 
metalblade said:
It will not be in place for next season as you will have to move season ticket holders who don't want to stand.
Click to expand...

How long do you really think it will take to filter the customer database down to the back x rows of the Kop, pull all the email addresses, then bcc the lot of them saying "your seat is becoming safe standing. If you are happy with this, do nothing, if you are not happy with this contact the club to arrange an alternative seat"?
 
jt64 said:
How long do you really think it will take to filter the customer database down to the back x rows of the Kop, pull all the email addresses, then bcc the lot of them saying "your seat is becoming safe standing. If you are happy with this, do nothing, if you are not happy with this contact the club to arrange an alternative seat"?
Click to expand...
Every individual email has to go to SAG to be approved first :D
 
metalblade said:
It will not be in place for next season as you will have to move season ticket holders who don't want to stand. Any safe standing will have to be at the back of the kop nowhere else is there really. I'd welcome some safe standing but I would imagine a lot will be moaning if they have to move seats they have been in for years.
Click to expand...

There were far more challenges than that to implementing on the Kop when it was previously looked at.
 
Oh I just came on here to announce I heard this! Glad I checked first.

Being able to stand on the kop again would make me so happy.
 
I was in the safe standing area at Wembley.

There's still a seat. It was the same as any other seat at Wembley, but with a bar, or rail in front of me, that was just about under head height, for me, if I was sat down. It was a handy height to lean on, when stood up.

I can't imagine anyone sat on the back 20 rows of the kop, would rather stand up and sit down over and over, get shoved over the seat in front etc, than be able to stand comfortably and watch the game for 90 mins

In fact I'm not finished here.

It's ridiculous that we can't just go and stand and watch football on the kop.

It's a legacy of the hillsborough disaster and the thatcherite oppression of football fans that put us in cages, the ultimate underlying cause.
 
Last edited:

Foxy said:
There were far more challenges than that to implementing on the Kop when it was previously looked at.
Click to expand...
I'll be delighted if we get safe standing on the Kop, but it does seem a bit odd. The communication we received previously (I thought) was that the hurdles were huge, and that it was unlikely ever to be viable with the current stand.
 
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